Newsletters Are All The Rage Right Now - Here's What We're Trying

WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.740 --> 00:00:08.360 Welcome back to another episode of B two b Growth Hamdan Sanchez. And today, 2 00:00:08.370 --> 00:00:13.040 today I'm here with James Carberry, the founder of Sweet Fish Media. And we're 3 00:00:13.040 --> 00:00:18.450 gonna be talking about email in newsletters because despite popular 4 00:00:18.450 --> 00:00:24.080 opinion emails not dead it's Zack's dead. Still no amount of slack hype 5 00:00:24.080 --> 00:00:28.350 that we're hearing this week from Salesforce A Queen Slack is gonna kill 6 00:00:28.360 --> 00:00:33.490 email. Yeah, that actually go through itself. Source actually do it or is it 7 00:00:33.490 --> 00:00:38.990 still a rumor? Oh, yeah, No, it's confirmed its happens. That's for $27 8 00:00:38.990 --> 00:00:46.250 billion. Oh my God way! All know that the messaging and all kinds of 9 00:00:46.250 --> 00:00:49.760 communication channels are just exploding everywhere. Messenger 10 00:00:49.770 --> 00:00:53.160 Instagram, social linked in like everyone's got messaging and we're 11 00:00:53.160 --> 00:00:57.580 bombarded with messages more than ever. So it seems like email is becoming less 12 00:00:57.580 --> 00:01:02.010 and less effective. But it's still here. It's still very much a big part of our 13 00:01:02.010 --> 00:01:05.410 lives. What have you noticed about it? And I don't think it's going away, man. 14 00:01:05.420 --> 00:01:09.790 I was just talking to somebody at lunch about this, and I don't know why I like 15 00:01:09.790 --> 00:01:14.050 we were actually pontificating on some predictions that we have in B two b 16 00:01:14.050 --> 00:01:19.290 podcasting. And one of those predictions is that podcast algorithms 17 00:01:19.290 --> 00:01:24.200 are going to start curating episodes mawr, similar to how you see your 18 00:01:24.200 --> 00:01:30.280 social news feed curated. So instead of your podcast, I think this might start 19 00:01:30.280 --> 00:01:34.860 happening in 2021. But like it's already happening like Look at Apple, 20 00:01:35.740 --> 00:01:40.170 the whole the listen Now feature at the top of Apple is curating it for me, not 21 00:01:40.170 --> 00:01:44.340 based on recency but based on what it thinks I'm gonna enjoy next. No, I 22 00:01:44.340 --> 00:01:49.050 think it is based. I think it is recency still, but I think they're 23 00:01:49.050 --> 00:01:54.390 setting it up, so it's not that way. And so all that to say We were talking 24 00:01:54.390 --> 00:01:59.860 about how we think that change is coming with podcasting, but it hasn't 25 00:01:59.870 --> 00:02:06.080 hit email, and for whatever reason, email has been prone to kind of more 26 00:02:06.090 --> 00:02:10.130 algorithmic. I don't know. Is that how you say it? But whenever you get your 27 00:02:10.130 --> 00:02:14.050 your most recent emails show up at the top and I don't know, I like it. I 28 00:02:14.050 --> 00:02:17.460 don't know if it's just cause I'm used to it that way, but I check my email 29 00:02:17.470 --> 00:02:20.830 multiple times a day. I don't check it nearly as much as I used to. But I'm 30 00:02:20.830 --> 00:02:24.780 still in my in box two or three times a day every day, and I I don't know that 31 00:02:24.780 --> 00:02:30.010 that's going to change for a long time. The fact is, we're all working and 32 00:02:30.010 --> 00:02:33.480 using email as much as we were before. We've just added all these other 33 00:02:33.480 --> 00:02:37.310 channels on top of it, and we're still consuming content by email. And if 34 00:02:37.310 --> 00:02:40.340 that's where the content is, that's where we go. And because our attention 35 00:02:40.340 --> 00:02:43.770 is still there, it's still very much a relevant channel, which is why I think 36 00:02:43.770 --> 00:02:48.860 we're seeing a major resurgence of newsletters. What are you reading 37 00:02:48.870 --> 00:02:54.130 lately, like in your inbox? So I'm deleting a lot in my in box because of 38 00:02:54.140 --> 00:02:58.430 Cyber Monday crap and all that stuff. Um, it seems like everybody in their 39 00:02:58.430 --> 00:03:04.360 mom is sending an email this last week. But man, I really like the stuff that 40 00:03:04.360 --> 00:03:08.820 story brand puts out. So Donald Miller, since he's like 3 to 5 minute videos, 41 00:03:08.830 --> 00:03:15.070 I'm really into that. I really like the animals emails that they send. It's 42 00:03:15.070 --> 00:03:19.690 mostly pointing you to their block content, but I like it because they 43 00:03:19.690 --> 00:03:24.490 give you a really solid taste of what the article that they're promoting is 44 00:03:24.490 --> 00:03:27.800 about. So it's not just like a link to an article with the headline there 45 00:03:27.800 --> 00:03:31.730 really like giving you some meat on the bone? So those were two of the emails 46 00:03:31.730 --> 00:03:35.890 that stand out for me. But, man, what? I'm excited about doing this episode 47 00:03:35.900 --> 00:03:40.560 because I think marketers have to think more critically about what they're 48 00:03:40.560 --> 00:03:44.750 actually putting in the emails that they're sending out. You cannot treat 49 00:03:44.760 --> 00:03:49.500 email like this. Check box activity like up. We've got to promote a webinar. 50 00:03:49.510 --> 00:03:53.160 Send it out via email, like you have to think more critically about what is 51 00:03:53.160 --> 00:03:56.190 actually going to engage and make someone want to open your email. 52 00:03:56.200 --> 00:04:02.310 Because when you keep sending crap, people start to ignore you. I know even 53 00:04:02.310 --> 00:04:06.040 if I like, maybe I've unsubscribed from the list and for whatever reason, I 54 00:04:06.040 --> 00:04:10.290 still keep getting the emails. Even if I haven't unsubscribed. I know. Oh, I 55 00:04:10.290 --> 00:04:14.560 see this sender. I see them every morning in my inbox. I've trained my 56 00:04:14.560 --> 00:04:19.070 brain to know to delete that email and you don't want to be the center of 57 00:04:19.070 --> 00:04:22.540 those emails, right? And in order to do that you've got to think more 58 00:04:22.540 --> 00:04:27.650 critically about. How do we actually entertain or educate within this email, 59 00:04:27.660 --> 00:04:32.330 even if they don't click a single thing in it? And I think that's a fundamental 60 00:04:32.330 --> 00:04:38.110 change in how a lot of marketers think about email. E. Hey, everybody, Logan 61 00:04:38.110 --> 00:04:41.290 with sweet fish here if you've been listening to the show for a while, you 62 00:04:41.290 --> 00:04:45.460 know we're big proponents of putting out original organic content on 63 00:04:45.460 --> 00:04:49.620 LinkedIn. But one thing that's always been a struggle for a team like ours is 64 00:04:49.620 --> 00:04:53.310 too easily track the reach of that Lincoln content. That's why I was 65 00:04:53.310 --> 00:04:56.670 really excited when I heard about Shield the other day from a connection 66 00:04:56.670 --> 00:05:01.260 on you guessed it linked in. Since our team started using shield, I've loved 67 00:05:01.260 --> 00:05:05.510 how it's let us easily track and analyzed the performance of are linked 68 00:05:05.510 --> 00:05:09.960 in content without having to manually log it ourselves. It automatically 69 00:05:09.960 --> 00:05:13.800 creates reports and generate some dashboards that are incredibly useful 70 00:05:13.810 --> 00:05:17.600 to see things like what contents been performing the best and what days of 71 00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:21.060 the week are we getting the most engagement and our average views 72 00:05:21.060 --> 00:05:24.820 proposed? I highly suggest you guys check out this tool if you're putting 73 00:05:24.820 --> 00:05:28.830 out content on LinkedIn, and if you're not, you should be. It's been a game 74 00:05:28.830 --> 00:05:34.060 changer for us. If you go to shield app dot ai and check out the 10 day free 75 00:05:34.060 --> 00:05:39.580 trial. You can even use our promo code B two B growth to get a 25% discount. 76 00:05:39.590 --> 00:05:46.020 Again, that's shield app dot ai And that promo code is be the number two Be 77 00:05:46.030 --> 00:05:53.670 growth. All one word. All right, let's get back to the oh, absolutely. I mean, 78 00:05:53.670 --> 00:05:56.150 it's not that you don't want to throw a right hook. I'm all for throwing a 79 00:05:56.150 --> 00:05:59.650 right hook every once in a while on asking for the sale, especially if the 80 00:05:59.650 --> 00:06:02.630 time is right. Like where you probably get a lot of emails from Cyber Monday 81 00:06:02.640 --> 00:06:05.990 happening and black Friday from last week. So there's a lot of emails right 82 00:06:05.990 --> 00:06:09.230 now, but you gotta throw that right hook. But you got to soften up. You got 83 00:06:09.230 --> 00:06:13.220 to send more value first and jab jab, right hook Gary. He's talking about 84 00:06:13.220 --> 00:06:17.810 like two jabs for hook, but honestly think it needs to be like 10 jabs for 85 00:06:17.820 --> 00:06:22.790 Ray hookers. More, you know, every once in a while you go for the ask and then 86 00:06:22.790 --> 00:06:25.890 you had a lot of value. And a newsletter is becoming one of the 87 00:06:25.890 --> 00:06:30.620 popular ways Thio to do that and specifically original newsletter 88 00:06:30.620 --> 00:06:34.720 content, not just a rehash of what you're doing on your blogged or on your 89 00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:40.040 podcast. I know I've been subscribing to the marketing the morning brew. I 90 00:06:40.040 --> 00:06:43.210 don't read them all. Gosh, it's like every day and I just But every once in 91 00:06:43.210 --> 00:06:45.870 a while I'm hoping those up and kind of just browsing through it, kind of 92 00:06:45.870 --> 00:06:49.150 seeing what's going on in the industry in the morning breeze like broad 93 00:06:49.150 --> 00:06:52.250 marketing So it doesn't Most of it doesn't apply to me, but it's kind of 94 00:06:52.250 --> 00:06:55.500 interesting to see, like what people are doing on Madison Avenue. What Oreo. 95 00:06:55.510 --> 00:06:59.770 So what's what Oreo did for a successful campaign, or what shopper 96 00:06:59.770 --> 00:07:03.800 marketing is doing or what e commerce has gotten into and broken through 97 00:07:03.800 --> 00:07:06.180 recently? It's kind of interesting to see what different segments of it. So 98 00:07:06.180 --> 00:07:09.610 I'm reading it. It's it's been a good newsletter for me recently. Yeah, Scott 99 00:07:09.610 --> 00:07:13.710 Barker is one I didn't mention earlier, but Scott Barker has done one that I 100 00:07:13.710 --> 00:07:17.470 think is really good, and I think the positioning of it is really smart the 101 00:07:17.470 --> 00:07:23.370 way he's done it. So he says, it's four salespeople and it's three of 102 00:07:23.370 --> 00:07:28.620 tomorrow's best practices today. And so he basically breaks down because he's 103 00:07:28.620 --> 00:07:31.750 doing a lot of Webinar interviews for sales Hacker, a lot of podcast 104 00:07:31.750 --> 00:07:36.470 interviews for outreaches podcast and through all those conversations he 105 00:07:36.470 --> 00:07:40.610 comes up with, you know, kind of these these thoughts around what he thinks 106 00:07:40.610 --> 00:07:45.130 the best practices of tomorrow are going to be, and he's kind of on the 107 00:07:45.130 --> 00:07:48.960 front end off these best practices before they really become best 108 00:07:48.960 --> 00:07:53.720 practices. And I think that's really important. We talk a lot about premise 109 00:07:53.720 --> 00:07:56.200 development. We're getting more and more into it. We're studying Jake 110 00:07:56.200 --> 00:08:00.790 Kenzo's content around premise development, and I think Scott's done a 111 00:08:00.790 --> 00:08:06.810 really good job of creating a premise for his newsletter that makes people It 112 00:08:06.810 --> 00:08:10.090 makes me be able to tell people what it's about. Hey, if if you're in sales 113 00:08:10.090 --> 00:08:12.780 and you wanna know tomorrow's best practices before they become best 114 00:08:12.780 --> 00:08:17.260 practices, you gotta subscribed to Scott Barker's newsletter. And so I 115 00:08:17.270 --> 00:08:19.570 know that we've been having a lot of conversations around that? What's our 116 00:08:19.570 --> 00:08:23.910 positioning for our newsletter? How how can we make it something that is easily 117 00:08:23.910 --> 00:08:28.170 talked about other B two b marketers? So, yeah. Do you want to dive into what 118 00:08:28.170 --> 00:08:30.610 we're currently doing with our newsletter and then and then talk? 119 00:08:30.610 --> 00:08:33.350 About what? Where we're thinking about going with it. Or like, where do you 120 00:08:33.350 --> 00:08:36.909 wanna go from here? Well, for starters, I'd like to mention that like we're 121 00:08:36.909 --> 00:08:39.559 experimenting with this. We're trying to figure it out. We're doing a 122 00:08:39.559 --> 00:08:43.230 newsletter. We've sent it out multiple weeks in a row. Now, I can't say have 123 00:08:43.240 --> 00:08:46.480 advertised it, but like we've put out links out there, you know, we've talked 124 00:08:46.480 --> 00:08:49.450 about it. We'd have an ad rolling and recording this episode to talk about it 125 00:08:49.450 --> 00:08:52.500 itself. Right now, we kind of have a split into three sections and you've 126 00:08:52.500 --> 00:08:56.260 been writing those sections. The topics have been around like hone your craft. 127 00:08:56.260 --> 00:09:00.040 How you could get better as a marketer, how you can lead your team and love 128 00:09:00.040 --> 00:09:02.810 your people. Well, because those are three things that every b two b market, 129 00:09:02.810 --> 00:09:07.220 especially if you're in like a director VP level place is gonna have to think 130 00:09:07.220 --> 00:09:09.830 about it sometimes. So we're trying to write things that are really relevant 131 00:09:09.830 --> 00:09:13.250 to the audience. But you know what we think is relevant and what people 132 00:09:13.260 --> 00:09:17.120 actually want and think is, and actually what actually is relevant 133 00:09:17.120 --> 00:09:20.380 could be two different things. So we're experimenting a lot. We're also trying 134 00:09:20.380 --> 00:09:23.160 really hard to figure out how to integrate this with the podcast. So 135 00:09:23.160 --> 00:09:25.690 it's not just a B two B growth newsletter, and it totally separate 136 00:09:25.690 --> 00:09:29.080 from the B two B growth show like this one. So even this week, I'm gonna 137 00:09:29.080 --> 00:09:32.210 experiment by throwing some links to the This week's podcast and highlight 138 00:09:32.210 --> 00:09:36.270 the top top one. Just some ways to keep experiment and see what works. What 139 00:09:36.270 --> 00:09:39.820 didn't work. It's gonna be a work in progress. So if you wanna follow along 140 00:09:39.820 --> 00:09:43.800 in that progress, you can learn mawr. Let's make it, but you're all right now. 141 00:09:43.800 --> 00:09:48.470 It's just called Sweet Fish media dot com slash newsletter, and you can 142 00:09:48.480 --> 00:09:52.900 subscribe to the BB Growth newsletter to see what we're talking about and how 143 00:09:52.900 --> 00:09:56.340 we're experimenting with it. We promise we'll keep you updated as updated as we 144 00:09:56.340 --> 00:09:59.770 go. As we find out what works and more importantly, what didn't work? 145 00:09:59.780 --> 00:10:04.230 Something else we did that was fun for this. I created a little short video 146 00:10:04.230 --> 00:10:08.270 and our video team edited up and chopped it up, and it was really funny. 147 00:10:08.270 --> 00:10:11.600 And it's lighthearted. And so when you go to sweet Fish media dot com slash 148 00:10:11.600 --> 00:10:15.580 newsletter, you're going to see a video at the top of the page. We were very 149 00:10:15.580 --> 00:10:19.560 intentional about making sure that the thumbnail for that video was 150 00:10:19.570 --> 00:10:23.730 interesting and intriguing. And then the video itself. You know, I think 151 00:10:23.730 --> 00:10:27.030 it's, I don't know, two or three minutes, but I think it's funny and 152 00:10:27.040 --> 00:10:30.740 lighthearted and gives you an accurate picture of what you're going to get 153 00:10:30.740 --> 00:10:35.260 from the newsletter content. So just giving everyone listening to this, a 154 00:10:35.260 --> 00:10:38.220 peek behind some of the things that we thought about like, Hey, if we're going 155 00:10:38.220 --> 00:10:42.510 to send people to a landing page, how can we make it a no brainer for them to 156 00:10:42.510 --> 00:10:45.930 want to sign up for this email? The thing I'm really struggling with if I'm 157 00:10:45.930 --> 00:10:50.530 just being honest, Dan, whenever I talk about the newsletter, it's hard for me 158 00:10:50.530 --> 00:10:55.670 to articulate the value that people are going to get succinctly like the reason 159 00:10:55.670 --> 00:10:58.750 that we went with, like, the three sections. Love your team. Well, hone 160 00:10:58.750 --> 00:11:02.120 your craft. Grow your leadership was really born out of. That's what I'm 161 00:11:02.120 --> 00:11:06.300 passionate about, like it matches our core values in our business, right? So 162 00:11:06.310 --> 00:11:10.640 loving your people well is our number one core value. So talking to marketers 163 00:11:10.640 --> 00:11:15.290 that air leading teams of 3 to 10 people and sharing tangible practical 164 00:11:15.290 --> 00:11:18.340 ways that they can love their team oil. Well, that's easy for me to talk about 165 00:11:18.340 --> 00:11:21.300 because we're doing that with our team. And so I could just share what we're 166 00:11:21.300 --> 00:11:25.950 doing there, Hone your craft, are our second value is never stop learning so 167 00:11:25.960 --> 00:11:29.190 that when we can share content from me to be growth, we can share other things 168 00:11:29.190 --> 00:11:32.160 that we're doing from a B two B marketing perspective that we think 169 00:11:32.160 --> 00:11:35.950 would be helpful and then grow your leadership as the CEO of this business. 170 00:11:36.440 --> 00:11:40.360 I'm passionate about leadership, and so But when I go to actually try to 171 00:11:40.360 --> 00:11:44.520 articulate that on a landing page or tell someone about it, it's kind of 172 00:11:44.520 --> 00:11:47.900 scattered. It's a little bit all over the place, so we haven't figured out 173 00:11:47.900 --> 00:11:52.430 what that next step is gonna be yet it might be that our newsletter becomes 174 00:11:52.440 --> 00:11:55.810 insights from the original research that we're doing. It might be something 175 00:11:55.810 --> 00:11:58.350 else. Like you said earlier. We're playing with it. We're trying to figure 176 00:11:58.350 --> 00:12:02.400 it out, but that's just how I'm thinking about it right now. Yeah, I 177 00:12:02.400 --> 00:12:06.250 think it'll be really interesting. We kind of solidified and it's It's only 178 00:12:06.250 --> 00:12:09.080 through the trial there. We're gonna figure it out. At the beginning, we 179 00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:11.930 kept pushing off when the launch, this newsletter and I was like, Screw it, 180 00:12:11.930 --> 00:12:15.550 let's just start sending it and see what happens. We have a philosophy that 181 00:12:15.560 --> 00:12:19.440 it's through volume and trialing error, that we're gonna figure out what 182 00:12:19.440 --> 00:12:22.760 actually is relevant. It's how we do it on LinkedIn. It's how we do it on the 183 00:12:22.760 --> 00:12:26.120 podcast. We throw out a bunch of things, and then the things that connect are 184 00:12:26.120 --> 00:12:29.710 the ones we double down on, which is how this show has been able to get to 185 00:12:29.710 --> 00:12:34.920 where it's at today. Ah, 160 K 1000 downloads a month is no joke, and it's 186 00:12:34.920 --> 00:12:39.230 only because we've taken lots of swings and we found out and got better had 187 00:12:39.230 --> 00:12:43.110 taken those swings to get more hits. So if you're if you're listening to this 188 00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:47.380 and you, you might even hopefully our audio engineer doesn't put an ad spot 189 00:12:47.390 --> 00:12:51.940 for the newsletter on this because I'm about to say it right now. But go and 190 00:12:51.940 --> 00:12:57.160 sign up for this newsletter, Sweet Fish media dot com slash newsletter and, uh, 191 00:12:57.170 --> 00:13:00.820 and go check it out for yourself. Look at that little video and and sign up 192 00:13:00.830 --> 00:13:04.730 and see. See what we're putting out there. You can always unsubscribe if 193 00:13:04.730 --> 00:13:08.080 it's not something you're you think you'll get value from. But if you're a 194 00:13:08.080 --> 00:13:12.120 marketing leader, B two b marketing leader leading a team of 3 to 10. Uh, 195 00:13:12.130 --> 00:13:16.860 it's really custom catered for you, and I think you're gonna get a ton of value 196 00:13:16.860 --> 00:13:21.560 from it. So subscribe and, uh, hopefully we'll see you in your inbox. 197 00:13:21.940 --> 00:13:25.820 Is your buyer of UDP Marketer? If so, you should think about sponsoring this 198 00:13:25.820 --> 00:13:30.770 podcast. B two B Growth gets downloaded over 130,000 times each month, and our 199 00:13:30.770 --> 00:13:34.590 listeners are marketing decision makers. If it sounds interesting, send Logan 200 00:13:34.590 --> 00:13:37.360 and email Logan at sweet Fish media dot com.