1219: 6 Ways to Build Your Professional Network w/ David Cairns

WEBVTT 1 00:00:06.240 --> 00:00:10.070 There's a ton of noise out there. So how do you get decision makers 2 00:00:10.150 --> 00:00:15.269 to pay attention to your brand? Start a podcast and invite your ideal clients 3 00:00:15.509 --> 00:00:25.300 to be guests on your show. Learn more at sweetphish MEDIACOM. You're listening 4 00:00:25.379 --> 00:00:30.140 to be tob growth, a daily podcast for B TOB leaders. We've interviewed 5 00:00:30.140 --> 00:00:33.780 names you've probably heard before, like Gary vanner truck and Simon Senek, but 6 00:00:33.899 --> 00:00:38.210 you've probably never heard from the majority of our guests. That's because the bulk 7 00:00:38.250 --> 00:00:42.770 of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. Most of our guests are 8 00:00:42.850 --> 00:00:47.649 in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting 9 00:00:47.729 --> 00:00:52.359 with tactics. They're building the fastest growing BETB companies in the world. My 10 00:00:52.399 --> 00:00:55.759 name is James Carberry. I'm the founder of sweet fish media, a podcast 11 00:00:55.840 --> 00:00:59.359 agency for BB brands, and I'm also one of the cohosts of this show. 12 00:01:00.039 --> 00:01:03.759 When we're not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories from behind 13 00:01:03.799 --> 00:01:07.109 the scenes of our own business. Will share the ups and downs of our 14 00:01:07.150 --> 00:01:11.230 journey as we attempt to take over the world. Just getting well, maybe 15 00:01:11.870 --> 00:01:18.700 let's get into the show. Hey, everybody, Logan with sweetfish here. 16 00:01:18.939 --> 00:01:22.420 Before we jump in today, I want to let you know about another podcast 17 00:01:22.540 --> 00:01:26.019 you might enjoy, full of sales focused episodes. If you're a regular listener 18 00:01:26.140 --> 00:01:30.459 of BB growths, you'll probably enjoy the modern sales podcast with listen with all 19 00:01:30.700 --> 00:01:34.650 check out their episode value based selling done right, you can find modern sales 20 00:01:34.730 --> 00:01:38.650 podcast wherever you do. You're listening. All right, let's get into the 21 00:01:38.689 --> 00:01:42.329 show. Welcome back to be tob growth. I'm Logan lyles with sweet fish 22 00:01:42.370 --> 00:01:47.319 media. Today I'm joined by Dave Karen's. He is the cofounder of CBRE 23 00:01:47.599 --> 00:01:52.079 forward. He's also the svp of office leasing at CBRE Canada. Dave, 24 00:01:52.159 --> 00:01:55.040 how's it going today, man? Yeah, that's good. You are my 25 00:01:55.200 --> 00:01:59.760 last appointment of the day before going out to fund dinner with some clients. 26 00:01:59.840 --> 00:02:02.349 So awesome, man. Well, good stuff. Podcasting dinner with clients. 27 00:02:02.390 --> 00:02:06.349 It sounds like it is a good day, man. Well, we're going 28 00:02:06.390 --> 00:02:10.150 to be talking about the network effect and, both personally and as an organization, 29 00:02:10.349 --> 00:02:15.389 how to effectively build relationships that are going to move your career and your 30 00:02:15.430 --> 00:02:19.379 business forward. Couldn't be a more timely subject. You know with the launch 31 00:02:19.539 --> 00:02:23.139 of our founder James's book, content based networking. That is all about how 32 00:02:23.300 --> 00:02:28.180 you intentionally build relationships. This is just a topic that's so top of mine, 33 00:02:28.259 --> 00:02:31.050 so I'm excited to dig into it with you today. That being said, 34 00:02:31.050 --> 00:02:34.889 let's give people a little bit of context. Man, for folks out 35 00:02:34.889 --> 00:02:38.409 there who aren't as familiar with you and CBUR Canada, give us a little 36 00:02:38.409 --> 00:02:42.129 bit of context background on yourself and what you and your team are up to 37 00:02:42.169 --> 00:02:44.840 these days. Man, sure, but when I got out of university I 38 00:02:44.960 --> 00:02:49.439 played poker professionally for about five years and that was a bit of a nonlinear 39 00:02:49.479 --> 00:02:53.560 path, and we're going to talk about nonlinear paths and sales. And after 40 00:02:53.639 --> 00:02:55.840 that five year period I took a bit of a leap of faith and I 41 00:02:55.960 --> 00:03:00.909 got into commercial real estate brokerage. So I now work for CBRE Canada. 42 00:03:01.189 --> 00:03:07.550 We are part of the broader ebay platform. That's one of it's a fortune 43 00:03:07.590 --> 00:03:13.300 one hundred company in global we cover any type of commercial real estates service that 44 00:03:13.419 --> 00:03:17.060 you could literally think of. We cover the whole investment side of the business 45 00:03:17.099 --> 00:03:22.340 where we help people buy and sell commercial real estate. We help investors, 46 00:03:22.379 --> 00:03:25.580 at least real estate and we also help tenants, least real estate as well, 47 00:03:27.169 --> 00:03:30.610 and then we get involved in project management construction and we also get involved 48 00:03:30.610 --> 00:03:35.729 in workplace strategy where we help companies understand what their future workplace might look like. 49 00:03:35.849 --> 00:03:38.330 So it's quite broad. There's a lot going on. My focus is 50 00:03:38.490 --> 00:03:43.520 on the transaction side, mostly in in a role that we refer to as 51 00:03:43.680 --> 00:03:47.840 pennant rep commercial real estate brokeridge. The most of my business is representing companies 52 00:03:49.280 --> 00:03:53.080 in their pursuit, pursuits to either renew their lease, expand in our city 53 00:03:53.280 --> 00:03:59.110 or across multiple markets, or grow or downside. So any any sort of 54 00:03:59.310 --> 00:04:02.629 trigger of their growth or change in headcount is something that I get involved in 55 00:04:02.669 --> 00:04:05.750 on the real estate side. All that, man, I love to hear 56 00:04:05.830 --> 00:04:12.539 that transition to we're going to circle back to the nonlinear nature of bath sales 57 00:04:13.020 --> 00:04:17.220 careers, marketing careers as well as relationships, and I'm just fascinated. I 58 00:04:17.379 --> 00:04:20.939 am not a good poker player, so I'll just make sure that we never 59 00:04:21.100 --> 00:04:25.490 play cards if we get together anytime in the future, man, but I 60 00:04:25.610 --> 00:04:28.730 love to hear that little bit of backstory. So we're going to be talking 61 00:04:28.769 --> 00:04:32.410 about a few different things and get into some examples about how you've strategically built 62 00:04:32.490 --> 00:04:38.129 relationships for yourself throughout your career and for your organization. The first thing I 63 00:04:38.250 --> 00:04:41.600 know you wanted to talk about is the importance of not just that number of 64 00:04:41.800 --> 00:04:47.199 relationships, but thinking strategically about what are the important relationships and going deep there. 65 00:04:47.439 --> 00:04:49.920 Can you talk to us about the importance of that and some of the 66 00:04:49.959 --> 00:04:54.670 lessons you've learned along in your career so far? Yeah, sure. So, 67 00:04:54.829 --> 00:04:58.990 when I started out in office leasing, it's another way that we define 68 00:04:59.350 --> 00:05:02.670 what we do internally. We help people leaf face, I really felt like 69 00:05:02.750 --> 00:05:06.660 I had a blindfold on and I was trying to throw a bulls eye basically 70 00:05:06.699 --> 00:05:12.100 right like I was sitting in a room cold calling people, trying to talk 71 00:05:12.139 --> 00:05:16.300 to them about it time based need that I could basically guarantee at least four 72 00:05:16.300 --> 00:05:21.850 out of five people did not have one of those critical time related, you 73 00:05:21.930 --> 00:05:27.170 know, triggers to talking to me. So I was going about it the 74 00:05:27.209 --> 00:05:32.050 conventional cold calling way and frankly, I was getting pretty bored, pretty frustrated 75 00:05:32.370 --> 00:05:39.279 and like like not emotionally really doing that well. So I started to just 76 00:05:39.600 --> 00:05:43.560 think like okay, what do I really want to get out of my career 77 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:46.879 and what I what I want it actually is to have deep and meaningful relationships 78 00:05:46.920 --> 00:05:51.550 with the people that I was working with, and I understood from my own 79 00:05:51.629 --> 00:05:58.269 personal life how much time and energy and, you know, depth that you 80 00:05:58.430 --> 00:06:03.300 really need to sort of consider to build a relationship. So I started to 81 00:06:03.339 --> 00:06:08.500 think about things a little bit differently after about one year being in a sort 82 00:06:08.500 --> 00:06:12.860 of business development role, and it was kind of at that time that platforms 83 00:06:12.899 --> 00:06:15.860 like Linkedin were starting to become you know, they were in the early phases 84 00:06:15.899 --> 00:06:21.009 of being relevant and now they've just completely taken off, and I kind of 85 00:06:21.050 --> 00:06:26.930 thought to myself, a way that I can maybe change my path is by 86 00:06:27.009 --> 00:06:31.449 trying to find ways to network organizations, to get involved with places where I 87 00:06:31.490 --> 00:06:34.519 can get in front of people in person and show them that I'm someone that 88 00:06:34.639 --> 00:06:40.439 could be trusted and then I'm someone that cares about other people's interests. So 89 00:06:40.959 --> 00:06:46.509 I started to get involved with an accelerator or an incubator called one hundred and 90 00:06:46.509 --> 00:06:50.350 eleven, which houses some of the best software service companies in Canada. And 91 00:06:50.470 --> 00:06:55.110 through getting involved with that organization, and not only got to meet all of 92 00:06:55.189 --> 00:06:57.910 the companies that were part of this, this umbrella, which you know, 93 00:06:58.470 --> 00:07:00.459 for fifty or so companies that were part of it, but even more that 94 00:07:00.579 --> 00:07:03.779 were part of their broader network. And I also got to know some of 95 00:07:03.819 --> 00:07:08.579 the other key sponsors of one hundred and eleven, one of which was deloit, 96 00:07:09.139 --> 00:07:13.339 who runs a program called the technology fast fifty and in can it actually 97 00:07:13.379 --> 00:07:16.769 rolls into a US platform is called the fast five hundred. So by getting 98 00:07:16.810 --> 00:07:19.329 involved one hundred and eleven, I met a lot of people along the way 99 00:07:19.970 --> 00:07:24.129 and I got the opportunity to start to sort of build a bit of a 100 00:07:24.209 --> 00:07:29.490 network effect and and really ultimately meet a lot of people in person, and 101 00:07:30.319 --> 00:07:35.199 it just kind of fast tracked my ability to start to forge many deeper relig 102 00:07:35.439 --> 00:07:40.600 I's try to say many less than the the cold calling arena, but more 103 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:44.910 deeper relationships. Yeah, absolutely, Man. We've talked a lot on this 104 00:07:45.029 --> 00:07:49.430 show and James Book is all about creating relationships on purpose through content collaboration. 105 00:07:49.870 --> 00:07:54.670 You know, another great thing that you know you pick up from your story 106 00:07:54.750 --> 00:07:58.939 there, is finding the organizations where there's a lot of engagement, finding the 107 00:07:58.980 --> 00:08:03.259 platform where there's a lot of engagement linkedin or the industry organization where your buyers 108 00:08:03.300 --> 00:08:07.339 are hanging out and then I think that I think a lot of people take 109 00:08:07.420 --> 00:08:09.860 that step, as you did, but they don't go with the next step 110 00:08:09.899 --> 00:08:15.689 or the intentionality to build deeper relationships. They just kind of approach that with 111 00:08:15.889 --> 00:08:18.449 the same mentality that they had on cold calling. How many cards can I 112 00:08:18.569 --> 00:08:22.009 collect? How many linkedin connections? And they don't take that follow up step 113 00:08:22.170 --> 00:08:26.050 of deepening the relationship. What are some of the things that you did after 114 00:08:26.160 --> 00:08:31.639 getting plugged into the right place with intentionality to deepen those relationships and what would 115 00:08:31.679 --> 00:08:35.960 you recommend to other folks? Man? So I think it's me. It's 116 00:08:35.279 --> 00:08:39.159 a couple fold. The first is you just have to humanize the interaction right. 117 00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:43.190 Ultimately, when you are not in the tribe, you're out of the 118 00:08:43.309 --> 00:08:48.990 tribe and you're not you're not someone that's trusted and you're not someone that's liked. 119 00:08:48.509 --> 00:08:54.750 So I usually will be very open and honest with people about who I 120 00:08:54.870 --> 00:08:58.860 am, what my intentions are. I'll share a lot of myself at the 121 00:08:58.940 --> 00:09:03.259 beginning of a relationship and it's a tactic or a strategy, but it's one 122 00:09:03.500 --> 00:09:07.460 that has a very benevolent purpose to it. So you know I have a 123 00:09:07.500 --> 00:09:11.009 bit of an interesting background and when I get the opportunity to be in front 124 00:09:11.009 --> 00:09:16.330 of people, I share of that background with them right in the hopes that 125 00:09:16.450 --> 00:09:20.289 they will in turn share something a little bit deeper and more intimate with me. 126 00:09:20.610 --> 00:09:22.330 And when I say intimate, I mean it in the context of just 127 00:09:22.409 --> 00:09:28.080 building a relationship with somebody right. So I very much take the approach of 128 00:09:28.200 --> 00:09:31.600 trying to make my relationships as personal as possible from the beginning, and that 129 00:09:31.759 --> 00:09:37.750 involves a level of vulnerability and a willingness to share. For Today's growth story, 130 00:09:37.870 --> 00:09:43.350 will be talking about clear company, a fast growing talent management platform. 131 00:09:43.789 --> 00:09:46.950 Clear company was acquiring a decent number of users, but they weren't happy with 132 00:09:48.029 --> 00:09:52.860 their organic traffic or conversions. Clear Company turned to directive, the BETOB search 133 00:09:52.940 --> 00:09:58.820 marketing agency to help increase their overall search visibility for core key words in order 134 00:09:58.820 --> 00:10:05.059 to drive more organic traffic and bottom of the funnel leads. After identifying the 135 00:10:05.220 --> 00:10:11.210 core target keyword and analyzing the first page of Google results, directive executed a 136 00:10:11.450 --> 00:10:16.169 content and digital PR strategy to rank clear company number one on the first page 137 00:10:16.210 --> 00:10:20.440 of Google for the high intent keyword. In just five months, that one 138 00:10:20.519 --> 00:10:26.799 piece of content generated twenty seven demo requests and one thousand nine hundred and two 139 00:10:26.200 --> 00:10:31.799 referring domains, and all time high for clear company. If you're looking for 140 00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:35.950 results like this with your search engine marketing, there's a good chance directive can 141 00:10:35.990 --> 00:10:41.549 help. Visit Directive consultingcom and get a free customized proposal. All right, 142 00:10:41.590 --> 00:10:46.389 let's get back to the show. Yeah, absolutely it. I mean it 143 00:10:46.549 --> 00:10:48.990 takes that willingness at also, you know, if you think about it, 144 00:10:50.419 --> 00:10:54.059 you kind of set the stage. If you lead with that vulnerability, then 145 00:10:54.220 --> 00:10:56.779 the law of reciprocity is going to take effect. You know, I'm reading 146 00:10:56.820 --> 00:11:01.259 a book right now called captivate from Vanessa Van Edwards, who heads up the 147 00:11:01.340 --> 00:11:05.529 science of people that does a lot of psychological research. She was a guest 148 00:11:05.610 --> 00:11:11.289 on the customer experience podcast recently with Ethan Beute and they talked about this. 149 00:11:11.649 --> 00:11:13.649 Hey, when you start off a new relationship or a zoom call or a 150 00:11:13.769 --> 00:11:18.399 podcast or a conversation at a conference, how you start that out sets the 151 00:11:18.480 --> 00:11:22.919 tone for that interaction and possibly that relationship. You know, how's Your Day 152 00:11:24.080 --> 00:11:26.960 so far? Day You could have said well, traffic stocked, but you 153 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:30.840 you started it out with Hey, I'm looking forward to dinner tonight, and 154 00:11:30.960 --> 00:11:33.830 so my mind, what I took, what I'm taking from this book and 155 00:11:33.950 --> 00:11:37.029 what I took from that other podcast interview is now my mind is more predisposed 156 00:11:37.070 --> 00:11:39.789 to look for. Okay, what am I looking forward to as well? 157 00:11:39.909 --> 00:11:43.470 And so it's kind of a rabbit trail. But to bring that back to 158 00:11:43.710 --> 00:11:48.100 the the point here of when you lead with being more vulnerable and more open 159 00:11:48.419 --> 00:11:52.620 than people are going to be more open with you. Yeah, totally, 160 00:11:52.659 --> 00:11:56.700 and so I'll add my second point to this, which is that, you 161 00:11:56.779 --> 00:12:00.860 know, especially in the business like mine, as I mentioned earlier, four 162 00:12:00.899 --> 00:12:03.730 out of five or more times one of those time based needs is not being 163 00:12:03.809 --> 00:12:09.210 triggered. So in order to really get deep with people, you have to 164 00:12:09.289 --> 00:12:13.610 show them that you are part of their broader tribe. Right. So the 165 00:12:13.690 --> 00:12:18.799 broader tribe in the context of a lot of my prospects is being someone who 166 00:12:18.039 --> 00:12:24.039 is part of Canada's innovation ecosystem, someone who was the agenda of moving that 167 00:12:24.320 --> 00:12:28.679 needle forward. Right. The part of that I can obviously talk about my 168 00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:33.629 job as a commercial real estate agent, what I do to help companies gale 169 00:12:33.870 --> 00:12:37.990 on that front. But another avenue that we undertook is the creation of a 170 00:12:39.070 --> 00:12:43.299 plaque content platform called C B Ay forward, which has the purpose of showcasing 171 00:12:43.379 --> 00:12:48.539 the stories of Canada's innovation. Because how like using CB arey's fortune one hundred 172 00:12:48.580 --> 00:12:54.179 brand as a platform to talk about the best leaders in Canada and what they 173 00:12:54.179 --> 00:12:58.340 are doing to grow some of the best companies. Right. So the creation 174 00:12:58.460 --> 00:13:01.730 of that platform and pushing that agenda forward, you know, and making sure 175 00:13:01.809 --> 00:13:05.690 that it's clear that it's for benevolent purposes, obviously, along with business development 176 00:13:05.769 --> 00:13:11.169 purposes. That's really allowed me to get a lot deeper with my prospect base, 177 00:13:11.570 --> 00:13:16.519 my clients, industry partners like venture capital or people at Deloy, anyone 178 00:13:16.559 --> 00:13:20.759 who's really part of the ecosystem that I'm trying to pursue. Yeah, absolutely, 179 00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:24.720 Man, and it takes time, right. It takes time to build 180 00:13:24.759 --> 00:13:28.629 out that platform, it takes time to invest to whether it's a podcast or, 181 00:13:28.909 --> 00:13:31.909 you know, a content platform like you're talking about, to invest the 182 00:13:31.029 --> 00:13:35.269 time to have those conversations that are not directly sales related. Right now, 183 00:13:35.549 --> 00:13:39.710 how can we do business? But one of the things I know that you're 184 00:13:39.710 --> 00:13:45.740 passionate about in building your network and creating this network effect around yourself and your 185 00:13:45.779 --> 00:13:50.460 organization is patients. Can you speak a little bit to hell? Maybe you've 186 00:13:50.460 --> 00:13:54.220 seen other people try to try to go this route, try to implement some 187 00:13:54.340 --> 00:13:56.970 of the things that you're talking about, find the right places, but they 188 00:13:56.049 --> 00:14:01.049 don't exude a lot of patients in the process and therefore kind of short change 189 00:14:01.049 --> 00:14:05.529 themselves, right. Yeah, so like not really to go back to poker, 190 00:14:05.610 --> 00:14:07.649 but I think it's relevant that I do. You know, I played 191 00:14:09.049 --> 00:14:15.000 tournament poker for a living and basically the proposition there, statistically speaking, is 192 00:14:15.039 --> 00:14:18.159 that eighty five percent of the time you're guaranteed to lose and only about one 193 00:14:18.240 --> 00:14:20.600 and a half percent of the time where you're going to come in the top 194 00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:26.309 three players in the tournament. So talk about the need for patients, right. 195 00:14:26.629 --> 00:14:31.029 I had a very fortunate kind of path prior to sales that really I 196 00:14:31.110 --> 00:14:37.070 didn't realize until I was three four years into this business how much that background 197 00:14:37.110 --> 00:14:39.899 served me. I think also the fact that I was a little bit older, 198 00:14:39.940 --> 00:14:43.259 I didn't get into sales of like twenty two. That sort of extra 199 00:14:43.580 --> 00:14:48.899 maturation time that I had, combined with my previous experience, set me up 200 00:14:48.259 --> 00:14:54.289 to understand how important patients is. So that's probably the precursor for me. 201 00:14:54.850 --> 00:14:58.490 And then I think it's really the understanding of what you mentioned at the beginning. 202 00:14:58.490 --> 00:15:03.850 You have to have a philosophical understanding that the path's relationship building is a 203 00:15:03.970 --> 00:15:09.519 nonlinear one and you really just don't know how and when a relationship will become, 204 00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:13.159 you know, financially valuable to you in the context of what you do 205 00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:16.279 and what you sell. So I just believe in being a good person and 206 00:15:16.960 --> 00:15:22.509 thinking about other people first and, along the way, reminding people of what 207 00:15:22.629 --> 00:15:26.389 I do with enough frequency that they're constantly thinking about me right, and that's 208 00:15:26.389 --> 00:15:31.549 going to be in every conversation I have, through social media channels, through 209 00:15:31.750 --> 00:15:35.460 doing excellent work for the clients that I have. It's very multi multifaceted. 210 00:15:37.179 --> 00:15:41.179 But just to give you an example, there's two young guys that are starting 211 00:15:41.220 --> 00:15:43.659 out on our team and they're going through some of the trials and tribulations of 212 00:15:43.779 --> 00:15:48.659 building and network right, which is a really challenging and and time consuming exercise. 213 00:15:48.740 --> 00:15:52.649 Guys, that takes a lot of patients, and what I'll do with 214 00:15:52.769 --> 00:15:56.370 these guys when we're sitting in a sales training meeting is I'll actually take an 215 00:15:56.409 --> 00:16:00.450 example of a referral that I've been given. You know, let's now in 216 00:16:00.529 --> 00:16:03.600 my eight year in the business, and I will walk them through the from 217 00:16:03.639 --> 00:16:07.120 the moment that I met that person to the time that they are giving me 218 00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:11.240 a referral, and I'll explain all the junctures along the way of the things 219 00:16:11.279 --> 00:16:15.559 that I did, how long I waited to ask the person for a lunch 220 00:16:15.720 --> 00:16:18.830 because I didn't want to come across, as you know, presumptuous or inappropriate, 221 00:16:19.350 --> 00:16:23.470 you know, like from there the connections that I made for that person, 222 00:16:23.950 --> 00:16:29.389 adding value to them in the context that was completely unrelated to my business, 223 00:16:29.590 --> 00:16:32.470 you know what I mean, and then again along the way, reminding 224 00:16:32.590 --> 00:16:36.259 them of what I do and the types of problems that I solved. And 225 00:16:36.299 --> 00:16:38.019 then, boom, one day you get an email and all of a sudden 226 00:16:38.059 --> 00:16:41.059 you're working on, you know, on my situation at ten thousands. Perfect 227 00:16:41.059 --> 00:16:45.820 least that pays a significant commission, right. But but it can literally be 228 00:16:45.980 --> 00:16:49.649 some cases that you're sevent eight years into a relationship and then boom, all 229 00:16:49.690 --> 00:16:52.929 of a sudden you get something, but you got nothing until that point. 230 00:16:52.929 --> 00:16:56.129 Yeah, yeah, I mean you make some really great points about identifying some 231 00:16:56.330 --> 00:17:00.649 of the parts of your story that set yourself up for success. I love 232 00:17:00.730 --> 00:17:07.079 that you're imparting that to younger salespeople and new salespeople who are just getting into 233 00:17:07.119 --> 00:17:10.559 sales. I can be really tough, right, especially when they've got monthly, 234 00:17:10.599 --> 00:17:15.240 quarterly quotas. And you know, I kind of grew up in sales 235 00:17:15.319 --> 00:17:18.390 for ten years selling office equipment. So that's what people say when you don't 236 00:17:18.430 --> 00:17:22.789 want to say you sell copyer some printers, right, and very much like 237 00:17:22.990 --> 00:17:26.190 you, I hit sales with a here's your territory, make fifty dials a 238 00:17:26.230 --> 00:17:30.180 day, and also a very time base need. Most people lease that equipment 239 00:17:30.259 --> 00:17:33.420 for for or five years, and so I knew I was calling on people 240 00:17:33.500 --> 00:17:37.900 that had a time based need, you know, like you were talking about, 241 00:17:37.220 --> 00:17:41.220 and I just I didn't like it. I thought I had some of 242 00:17:41.259 --> 00:17:44.730 the same angst that you had early on. So I love that you're imparting 243 00:17:44.809 --> 00:17:49.170 that to you where sales people as well. You touched on part of patients. 244 00:17:49.250 --> 00:17:53.329 That, I think is another aspect to effectively growing your network, and 245 00:17:53.450 --> 00:17:56.690 that is giving more than you take. You have kind of a benchmark that 246 00:17:56.769 --> 00:18:00.359 you put in your mind to think about. Okay, this relationship. Tell 247 00:18:00.359 --> 00:18:03.039 us a little bit more about that, man. Yeah, so you're referencing 248 00:18:03.079 --> 00:18:07.160 the benchmark, which I can't take credit for its I believe it's a Gary 249 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:11.519 V benchmark from whatever his book was, Jeb Job Job right hook or whatever 250 00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:15.990 it was, you know, giving fifty one percent or more to the other 251 00:18:17.069 --> 00:18:21.349 side of the relationship. So I you know whether or not you want to 252 00:18:21.789 --> 00:18:23.549 use a metric like fifty one percent or not. I think it's really just 253 00:18:25.230 --> 00:18:30.380 a mindset of thinking of other people before thinking about yourself, and I think 254 00:18:30.539 --> 00:18:33.940 we're human beings. We Are Mammal brain people in a lot of instances, 255 00:18:34.420 --> 00:18:37.779 and I you know, it's not to say that I don't get on a 256 00:18:37.900 --> 00:18:41.690 track of thinking about what the dollar figure might look like for a potential central 257 00:18:41.730 --> 00:18:45.730 customer. I'm a human being. I'm thinking about the money that might be 258 00:18:45.890 --> 00:18:48.609 on the other side of an opportunity. But every time something like that comes 259 00:18:48.650 --> 00:18:53.369 into my brain I remind myself think about the other person. Make sure that 260 00:18:53.529 --> 00:19:00.200 everything that you're doing is all value oriented and that you're coming from a place 261 00:19:00.279 --> 00:19:03.160 of care right, because I think that we fight the uphill battle of sales 262 00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:08.680 people, because everyone's been screwed over by a sales person before that inherently you're 263 00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:14.269 that untrusted person that's outside the tribe and you can you know, it's quickly 264 00:19:14.309 --> 00:19:15.589 as you can get into the tribe, you can be out of the tribe 265 00:19:15.869 --> 00:19:22.150 right so you have to continue to just constantly take that blossophy an approach to 266 00:19:22.309 --> 00:19:26.059 every interaction that you have. Yeah, absolutely, sometimes you can be kicked 267 00:19:26.099 --> 00:19:29.859 out of the tribe even more quickly that then you gained your spot into it. 268 00:19:29.980 --> 00:19:32.779 Man. So that the way. I've kind of taken notes on this 269 00:19:32.859 --> 00:19:37.019 day of or, you know, five specific tips that come out of the 270 00:19:37.180 --> 00:19:41.569 tips that you've been sharing on building your network, sharing yourself and being vulnerable 271 00:19:42.170 --> 00:19:48.329 with the people that you're trying to build relationships with early. How can ident 272 00:19:48.490 --> 00:19:52.690 number to identify how you can become part of the broader tribe. Three, 273 00:19:52.769 --> 00:19:55.640 you've got to exude a lot of patients, you know, slow, play 274 00:19:55.720 --> 00:20:00.200 it right. For another poker terminology throw in there, just just sneak that 275 00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:03.880 one in there. So that's number three. Four, recognized that relationships are 276 00:20:04.240 --> 00:20:08.869 nonlinear. That really kind of ties right off of the the pay's aspect and 277 00:20:10.309 --> 00:20:14.670 allows you to invest in fully. Take on that mindset of number five, 278 00:20:14.710 --> 00:20:17.750 which is give more than you take, because when you do that, and 279 00:20:17.869 --> 00:20:22.259 you realize that not every action, not every relationship, is that immediate return 280 00:20:22.380 --> 00:20:26.940 on investment. But it is the long game, it is the slow play 281 00:20:26.339 --> 00:20:30.700 that is going to pay dividends in the long run. Yes, so I 282 00:20:30.819 --> 00:20:34.140 think the sixth is that you don't want to have too much volume to your 283 00:20:34.220 --> 00:20:38.089 sales practice because you can't go deep if you have too much volume. But 284 00:20:38.210 --> 00:20:42.130 you need to make sure that you have enough volume so that you know you 285 00:20:42.250 --> 00:20:47.210 don't just have one person that might give you a lead seven years later. 286 00:20:47.809 --> 00:20:51.720 Ideally you have quite a few of those people in your network. Right. 287 00:20:52.240 --> 00:20:56.440 So I think that you have to just be constantly in pursuit of new deep 288 00:20:56.519 --> 00:21:02.440 relationships, the pursuit of starting new deep relation yeah, absolutely, man. 289 00:21:02.480 --> 00:21:03.950 I mean I think about that. Just to kind of like bring it down 290 00:21:04.509 --> 00:21:08.390 to boots on the ground, I think about okay, linkedin. I pretty 291 00:21:08.390 --> 00:21:15.190 much accept every linkedin connection requests because that there I that volume. Who knows 292 00:21:15.269 --> 00:21:18.190 what it could lead to and it's not going to cost me much other than 293 00:21:18.470 --> 00:21:22.220 hey, they're going to maybe send me spam right after and which archive the 294 00:21:22.259 --> 00:21:26.859 conversation and whatever. Right, but that's where just an example of where, 295 00:21:26.059 --> 00:21:30.220 okay, I'm going to sew quantity there. But then when I pick out 296 00:21:30.500 --> 00:21:33.289 what events am I going to go to, where am I going to deepen 297 00:21:33.450 --> 00:21:37.849 relationships with the top ten, twenty, thirty people in my network over the 298 00:21:37.970 --> 00:21:41.130 next year? I'm going to put a lot of thought and intention there, 299 00:21:41.170 --> 00:21:45.369 and so figuring out where do you go deep and where do you also balance 300 00:21:45.450 --> 00:21:49.559 quantity with that. I think that's affable for marketing to write. We're talking 301 00:21:49.559 --> 00:21:53.039 about sales and marketing, all sorts of good stuff here today. Man, 302 00:21:53.240 --> 00:21:57.160 Dave, if anybody listening to this is like me and has become a fast 303 00:21:57.160 --> 00:22:00.200 fan of yours, what's the best way for them to reach out stay connected? 304 00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:03.589 Man? Well, thank you for that. The best place, obviously, 305 00:22:03.869 --> 00:22:07.109 to catch up with me is on Linkedin. So, David Cairns, 306 00:22:07.509 --> 00:22:11.630 CE AI RNF, that's my name. You can find me there and then 307 00:22:11.710 --> 00:22:15.059 otherwise it would be great if you went over to cbury forward, TB, 308 00:22:15.099 --> 00:22:21.380 very forwardcom and if you are anyone in Canada that listening and your need of 309 00:22:21.420 --> 00:22:23.740 up space, there is a nifty link on that page that you can click 310 00:22:25.299 --> 00:22:26.980 to connect with our team. I love it. Dave, thank you so 311 00:22:27.099 --> 00:22:30.250 much for joining us on the show today. Man. Yeah, pleasure appreciate 312 00:22:30.289 --> 00:22:37.890 it. We totally get it. We publish a ton of content on this 313 00:22:37.970 --> 00:22:41.369 podcast and it can be a lot to keep up with. That's why we've 314 00:22:41.369 --> 00:22:45.039 started the BETB growth big three, a noe fluff email that boils down our 315 00:22:45.160 --> 00:22:49.880 three biggest takeaways from an entire week of episodes. Sign up today at Sweet 316 00:22:49.880 --> 00:22:56.920 Fish Mediacom big three. That sweet fish Mediacom Big Three