1168: How Agile Improves Workplace Culture w/ Melissa Boggs

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:04.240 A relationship with the right referral partner could be a game changer for any be 2 00:00:04.440 --> 00:00:08.509 to be company. So what if you could reverse engineer these relationships at a 3 00:00:08.630 --> 00:00:14.230 moment's notice, start a podcast, invite potential referral partners to be guests on 4 00:00:14.310 --> 00:00:19.670 your show and grow your referral network faster than ever? Learn more. At 5 00:00:19.750 --> 00:00:29.940 Sweet Fish Mediacom you're listening to be tob growth, a daily podcast for B 6 00:00:30.059 --> 00:00:34.460 TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, like Gary Vander truck 7 00:00:34.539 --> 00:00:38.530 and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard from the majority of our guests. 8 00:00:39.210 --> 00:00:43.329 That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. 9 00:00:43.929 --> 00:00:47.929 Most of our guests are in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. They're 10 00:00:47.929 --> 00:00:53.600 implementing strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're building the fastest growing betb companies 11 00:00:53.600 --> 00:00:56.920 in the world. My name is James Carberry. I'm the founder of sweet 12 00:00:56.920 --> 00:01:00.719 fish media, a podcast agency for BB brands, and I'm also one of 13 00:01:00.759 --> 00:01:03.790 the CO hosts of this show. When we're not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, 14 00:01:04.030 --> 00:01:07.670 you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of our own business, will share 15 00:01:07.709 --> 00:01:11.189 the ups and downs of our journey as we attempt to take over the world. 16 00:01:11.870 --> 00:01:22.620 Just kidding. Well, maybe let's get into the show. Welcome back 17 00:01:22.659 --> 00:01:25.980 to be tob growth. I am your host for today's episode, Nikki the 18 00:01:26.060 --> 00:01:30.500 IB with sweet fish media guys. I've got with me to day Melissa Boggs, 19 00:01:30.659 --> 00:01:34.730 who is chief scrum master at scrum alliance. Melissa, how you doing 20 00:01:34.890 --> 00:01:38.409 today? Hey, nicky, I'm great. Thanks for having me. Good, 21 00:01:38.450 --> 00:01:42.370 good. I'm excited to have this conversation because I haven't talked to anybody 22 00:01:42.409 --> 00:01:46.489 on this show yet who does what you do and I can't wait to dig 23 00:01:46.650 --> 00:01:53.359 into with you this idea of the way that that agile can improve workplace culture 24 00:01:53.560 --> 00:01:57.920 and and help folks become more more customer centric. So excited to get into 25 00:01:57.920 --> 00:02:00.760 that. But before we do, Melissa, I would loved if you would 26 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:02.909 just give us all a little bit of background on yourself and what you and 27 00:02:02.989 --> 00:02:07.469 scrum alliance have been up to these days. Awesome, I see. Happy 28 00:02:07.549 --> 00:02:12.590 to so. As you mentioned, I am chief scrum master for scrum alliance. 29 00:02:12.789 --> 00:02:16.099 In a traditional world you might think of that as co CEO, along 30 00:02:16.139 --> 00:02:20.659 with my partner, Howard Sublett. WHO's the chief product owner and as an 31 00:02:20.699 --> 00:02:27.580 organization, our goal or mission is to transform the world of work. So 32 00:02:27.819 --> 00:02:32.090 very appropriate to your podcast. And you know, we do that by helping 33 00:02:32.250 --> 00:02:38.330 the world understands agile values and principles and specifically how scrum, as one of 34 00:02:38.449 --> 00:02:45.960 those actual frameworks, can help, as you mentioned, customer centricity and just 35 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:51.080 making it a better place to work and more connection to your customers overall. 36 00:02:51.199 --> 00:02:55.520 Just to mention, we are a membership body and a certifying organization. So 37 00:02:55.680 --> 00:03:00.189 with any of your listeners have heard of, say, the Certified Scrub Master 38 00:03:00.629 --> 00:03:06.629 certification or sortified scrum product owner. Those are the certifications that we support and 39 00:03:06.789 --> 00:03:12.150 we certify. Got It. So So, before we really dig into some 40 00:03:12.310 --> 00:03:15.740 of the questions that I had today, how about just give us in and 41 00:03:15.099 --> 00:03:21.419 overview of of what the role? What is this, this role of Agile 42 00:03:21.620 --> 00:03:27.689 in achieving Cumpomersen tricity and, you know, in making, like you said, 43 00:03:27.849 --> 00:03:30.210 the world better played to work. So I'll go back a little bit 44 00:03:30.289 --> 00:03:35.689 further and just start with the Agile Movement in general, which actually started back 45 00:03:35.729 --> 00:03:42.840 in two thousand and one when a number of software developers at the time came 46 00:03:42.919 --> 00:03:50.120 together because they were approaching work in a very different way and essentially they crafted 47 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:54.520 what's called the manifesto for Agile software development, but has now kind of spread 48 00:03:54.639 --> 00:04:00.590 far beyond software. And the idea was that we are not just going to 49 00:04:00.789 --> 00:04:05.430 build software or other products or services for the sake of building them, if 50 00:04:05.469 --> 00:04:11.620 we're not building them for our customers and getting feedback from our customers and really 51 00:04:11.780 --> 00:04:15.300 collaborating and partnering with those customers, and what are we doing it for? 52 00:04:15.259 --> 00:04:19.259 And so they a there were a number of different frameworks that were part of 53 00:04:19.379 --> 00:04:25.810 that. INSTAGRAM was one of them at the time. And so really what 54 00:04:25.930 --> 00:04:32.009 that means is delivering value to customers on a regular basis. In scrum, 55 00:04:32.170 --> 00:04:38.329 it's preference from two to four weeks. So you're building is these incremental pieces 56 00:04:38.370 --> 00:04:43.399 of value and delivering them to your customers and that does two things. One, 57 00:04:44.120 --> 00:04:46.959 you're delivering value that they can use right away, and it may not 58 00:04:47.079 --> 00:04:50.480 be the final product or like the you know, the as I always say, 59 00:04:50.519 --> 00:04:54.589 like the Lamborghini that you're going to deliver at the end, but it 60 00:04:54.670 --> 00:04:58.829 may be something that actually helps them in the interim and then as they're using 61 00:04:58.870 --> 00:05:01.870 it, they're giving you feedback because maybe actually they don't need a Lamborghini. 62 00:05:02.430 --> 00:05:05.990 Maybe they actually need a horse, you know, and so by delivering them 63 00:05:06.110 --> 00:05:12.699 something early and getting their feedback and actually partnering with them rather than saying, 64 00:05:12.779 --> 00:05:15.579 like dope, this is the eighteen month project that we committed to income hell 65 00:05:15.620 --> 00:05:18.860 or high wider, that's what we're going to do, only to find out 66 00:05:18.899 --> 00:05:23.129 at the end of eighteen months that they didn't even want it. That's what 67 00:05:23.449 --> 00:05:28.970 is different about agility. It's the ability to pivot your organization based on customer 68 00:05:29.129 --> 00:05:34.209 need, not based on some three year plan, because the markets changing and 69 00:05:34.329 --> 00:05:40.480 customers to changing and their expectations are constantly changing, and so that partnership is 70 00:05:40.600 --> 00:05:45.720 really important for today's businesses, for sure, or for sure it's like otherwise. 71 00:05:46.839 --> 00:05:49.350 You know, and I know we're talking about making you know, the 72 00:05:49.870 --> 00:05:54.310 moving toward customer centricity. But I'd imagine if, if you're doing the job 73 00:05:54.910 --> 00:05:59.750 and, like you said, all that it's about is building this thing and 74 00:06:00.149 --> 00:06:04.379 your daytoday doesn't allow you or cause you to engage with the purpose of your 75 00:06:04.420 --> 00:06:09.420 work beyond the building of the thing, you know you're not going to attract 76 00:06:09.540 --> 00:06:14.300 this talent that way. You're not going to retain the best talent that way 77 00:06:14.779 --> 00:06:17.810 and you know it's just not going to be the best place to work, 78 00:06:17.850 --> 00:06:21.649 the best way to work. So I love this movement talk. I'm curious 79 00:06:21.970 --> 00:06:26.930 talk a little bit about you know, because you said this started, this 80 00:06:27.009 --> 00:06:30.250 edgeb movement. Are Back in Oh one and we're still having the conversation that 81 00:06:30.329 --> 00:06:33.360 we're having right now. Why? Why do you think it's been so slow 82 00:06:33.439 --> 00:06:38.199 moving? Or has it? Well, it's interesting because in some ways it 83 00:06:38.319 --> 00:06:41.560 has, in some ways that has it. So you're joking about like early, 84 00:06:41.639 --> 00:06:46.279 about people understanding what I do, because he never had anyone on your 85 00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:48.389 show before. You know, I've been in this work for about ten years 86 00:06:48.589 --> 00:06:51.670 and five years ago I could get into a tax they were an uber and 87 00:06:53.430 --> 00:06:56.550 people would ask what I do and it's their eyes with laze over and they 88 00:06:56.550 --> 00:07:01.180 would have no idea. Things as actually it's like people are starting to hear 89 00:07:01.180 --> 00:07:05.500 about it right like Adele was on the cover of HBR, and so it's 90 00:07:05.540 --> 00:07:11.939 certainly becoming more widespread now. I will say it is not easy to do 91 00:07:12.259 --> 00:07:18.209 because it actually requires us to relearn and unlearned habits and relearn and unlearned things 92 00:07:18.250 --> 00:07:24.209 that we were rewarded for in the past and that is really challenging. So 93 00:07:24.649 --> 00:07:29.730 one of the agile principles is self organization. And so when you talk about 94 00:07:29.730 --> 00:07:32.639 self organization, that means that leader has to get out of the way right 95 00:07:32.720 --> 00:07:39.519 and and you can provide guidance and you can provide resources and knowledge, but 96 00:07:39.720 --> 00:07:43.360 most importantly, you provide connection to the customer and then you get out of 97 00:07:43.439 --> 00:07:47.310 the way. And so that's for someone who's even been doing this for ten 98 00:07:47.389 --> 00:07:51.430 years now. I'm in the role that I'm in and it's a daily thing 99 00:07:51.509 --> 00:07:56.110 that I have to remind myself to get out of the way. And we 100 00:07:56.189 --> 00:07:59.860 talk a lot about, you know, things like servent leadership, and I 101 00:07:59.980 --> 00:08:03.579 think in the past we have given a lot of lip service to servant leadership. 102 00:08:05.339 --> 00:08:07.819 But if you truly want your organization to be Agile, and I don't 103 00:08:07.819 --> 00:08:13.170 mean capital a agile I don't mean checking the boxes of some framework, I 104 00:08:13.370 --> 00:08:18.329 literally mean an organization that can really cater to customer needs and pivots to those. 105 00:08:18.170 --> 00:08:22.810 There can't be a four stage approval process for making a change to a 106 00:08:22.930 --> 00:08:28.560 product. So you truly have to be there to serve the team and create 107 00:08:28.680 --> 00:08:33.159 that connection for the team with the customer and get out of the way. 108 00:08:33.960 --> 00:08:39.279 Today's real story is about a brand we all know well, AIRBNB. When 109 00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:43.230 they were trying to maximize growth among work travelers, are B and be new, 110 00:08:43.309 --> 00:08:46.950 they needed to develop and execute a content strategy to reach multiple personas at 111 00:08:48.029 --> 00:08:52.470 different stages of the customer journey. Enter hub and spoke marketing. Hub and 112 00:08:52.509 --> 00:08:58.820 spoke managed creative content development and crafted a custom publishing process that allowed airbnb to 113 00:08:58.899 --> 00:09:03.820 develop more content in less time. The end result a lot of content across 114 00:09:03.940 --> 00:09:09.779 multiple channels, all strategically nurturing leads through to conversion. Within the first six 115 00:09:09.940 --> 00:09:13.809 months, airbnb nearly tripled the number of companies enrolled in their AIRBNB for work 116 00:09:13.889 --> 00:09:18.730 program they also saw huge increases in user adoption, with work travelers booking, 117 00:09:18.850 --> 00:09:24.799 longer stays and more guests for booking. If you're looking for strategic content at 118 00:09:24.799 --> 00:09:28.440 scale, I've got a hunch hub and spoake can help. Head over to 119 00:09:28.519 --> 00:09:33.960 hub spoke dot marketing growth to schedule your consultation with a content specialist today. 120 00:09:35.360 --> 00:09:39.110 That's hub spoke dot marketing growth. All right, let's get back to the 121 00:09:39.149 --> 00:09:43.789 show. Yeah, yeah, so you're right. It is going to requite 122 00:09:43.830 --> 00:09:52.860 a something that does require organizations to think about how they hire leadership in these 123 00:09:52.940 --> 00:09:58.299 areas. Right, who is leading the folks doing the building right and and 124 00:09:58.500 --> 00:10:01.379 and what that person spocus? You be on an and you know agile requires 125 00:10:01.419 --> 00:10:03.659 that. They're part of their focus. Of course it, like you mentioned, 126 00:10:03.779 --> 00:10:07.690 is getting out of the way. I went to this networking event. 127 00:10:07.769 --> 00:10:09.250 It was here and when I first move here to Jackson the coal months ago, 128 00:10:09.850 --> 00:10:13.370 it was just one of those broad things. Just were like people in 129 00:10:13.529 --> 00:10:16.490 tech, right, so you had anywhere from marketer feels people's developers. I'm 130 00:10:16.570 --> 00:10:22.159 still first time, new in town and I found myself hanging out with with 131 00:10:22.360 --> 00:10:26.600 some builders and and what was interesting what we talked about was, in terms 132 00:10:26.600 --> 00:10:31.480 of leadership, what we offer a lot of the time to the folks doing 133 00:10:31.639 --> 00:10:37.230 in the building is less focused on getting out of their way and less focused 134 00:10:37.269 --> 00:10:39.710 on enabling customer centricity than what we see in sales. I think a lot 135 00:10:39.710 --> 00:10:43.629 of the times you're hiring leaders for sale, then it's sort of built in 136 00:10:43.149 --> 00:10:46.429 that you're talking about you know, oh, someone who's been a motive. 137 00:10:46.470 --> 00:10:50.580 They inspire and get this person's way and help them, you know, do 138 00:10:50.659 --> 00:10:54.659 their best and then a lot of time the fakenly. Unfortunately, when you 139 00:10:54.779 --> 00:10:58.740 hire people who like a CETO or folks to lead builders, the focus is 140 00:10:58.820 --> 00:11:01.779 more on, you know, folks who will head down if the like you 141 00:11:01.860 --> 00:11:05.769 said, get the work according to this eight team months road map, without, 142 00:11:07.370 --> 00:11:09.690 you know, recognizing that we all kind of need the same thing. 143 00:11:09.970 --> 00:11:15.250 Went from leaders when it comes to needing that that Servant Leadership in that that 144 00:11:15.450 --> 00:11:18.529 coaching element. Talk a little bit more about that coaching piece for us. 145 00:11:18.200 --> 00:11:20.600 That's exactly where my head went. So I'm glad that you said that, 146 00:11:20.720 --> 00:11:26.399 Nikki, just because that's something that we believe so strongly and in our space, 147 00:11:26.840 --> 00:11:31.440 is the power of coaching. And a coach is not someone who just 148 00:11:31.519 --> 00:11:35.830 walks in and tells you what to do right, specifically with leadership. That's 149 00:11:35.909 --> 00:11:39.070 never effective, but rather a coach is someone who gets gets in there and 150 00:11:39.110 --> 00:11:43.309 gets in the trenches with you and ask you questions so that you can see 151 00:11:43.309 --> 00:11:46.860 yourself right. They hold up a mirror and they help you see your blind 152 00:11:46.899 --> 00:11:52.580 spots or your organization's blind spots. And so we first of all, I 153 00:11:52.700 --> 00:11:56.779 have a coaching background. That's actually what I did before I stepped into this 154 00:11:56.899 --> 00:12:01.289 role. I was one of the Certified Agile Coaches Force from alliance and in 155 00:12:01.970 --> 00:12:05.970 addition to that, we actually have three to four coaches who come and help 156 00:12:07.009 --> 00:12:11.570 us as an organization, because I recognize despite my own coaching background, I 157 00:12:11.730 --> 00:12:16.320 have blind spots. I am here every day, I am in it every 158 00:12:16.360 --> 00:12:20.159 day, and so I become immune to you know, what those problems are 159 00:12:20.960 --> 00:12:24.200 and the ways in which I am getting in the way. And so having 160 00:12:24.240 --> 00:12:31.590 those coaches here who understand our team, who understand me, who can ask 161 00:12:31.629 --> 00:12:35.309 me the right questions and not sometimes, when you were just telling or advising, 162 00:12:35.350 --> 00:12:41.350 especially someone in a leadership role, you can put them into a defensive 163 00:12:41.429 --> 00:12:46.620 posture right and a good coach will not ever put you in that defensive posture. 164 00:12:46.860 --> 00:12:50.299 They'll ask you the right questions that you go oh man, like, 165 00:12:50.460 --> 00:12:54.539 how did I not see that before? You know, and put you in 166 00:12:54.580 --> 00:12:58.500 a place where you can own that solution yourself and go oh, okay, 167 00:12:58.730 --> 00:13:01.129 yeah, I definitely need to back up. And these are the people who 168 00:13:01.129 --> 00:13:07.049 are the closest to the customer. They need to make those choices and you 169 00:13:07.169 --> 00:13:11.490 know, I'm here to inspire and guide and everything that you said. So 170 00:13:11.450 --> 00:13:16.840 yeah, I couldn't believe more. And the power of those coaches. Training 171 00:13:16.000 --> 00:13:22.200 is awesome and we also obviously deeply support training, but coaching is what helps 172 00:13:22.240 --> 00:13:26.230 you become sustainable. So you know, it's not just, you know, 173 00:13:26.389 --> 00:13:31.190 one and done, okay, I did this class, but rather it's helping 174 00:13:31.230 --> 00:13:35.710 you maintain whatever it is that you learned as an organization. Absolutely I thank 175 00:13:35.750 --> 00:13:39.230 you for laying that out for us the way that you did. I want 176 00:13:39.230 --> 00:13:41.779 to make sure we get to this next segment because I'm serious about you. 177 00:13:41.139 --> 00:13:46.019 But move on anything else you want forlks to take away from this conversation with 178 00:13:46.139 --> 00:13:52.259 respect you the role of agile in creating these customer centric environment. You know, 179 00:13:52.379 --> 00:13:56.210 I would just kind of reiterate what you said around purpose. So for 180 00:13:56.370 --> 00:14:01.129 me, with the the shift that we are actually undergoing here, it Scram 181 00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:05.529 aliance. What I have seen is direct connection between the work that we are 182 00:14:05.610 --> 00:14:11.840 doing in the impact we are making on the world and by virtue of this, 183 00:14:11.399 --> 00:14:16.159 you know, incremental value delivery and leaders getting out of the way, 184 00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:20.679 you allow your team to become that much closer to the impact they're making and 185 00:14:20.799 --> 00:14:24.509 that creates purpose all on its own. I love it. Could it be 186 00:14:24.590 --> 00:14:26.990 a better Mussel? Thank you so much for laying it out for us and 187 00:14:28.230 --> 00:14:31.110 now list of that I have specially picked your brain and seem what I could 188 00:14:31.110 --> 00:14:33.429 get out of it. It's time for you to sell us about what you're 189 00:14:33.470 --> 00:14:37.950 putting in it. But fell us tells about a learning resource that you've engaged 190 00:14:37.990 --> 00:14:41.659 with you recently that is inform in your approach. That just got you excited. 191 00:14:41.779 --> 00:14:46.100 You the definitely so. And what we were just discussing about kind of 192 00:14:46.220 --> 00:14:50.980 unlearning and relearning old habits and the things that we've been taught since we were 193 00:14:50.019 --> 00:14:58.370 kids. I have been especially inspired by kind of this movement around vulnerability and 194 00:14:58.490 --> 00:15:01.210 courage, and it takes a lot of courage to go against the grain and 195 00:15:01.450 --> 00:15:07.000 do things that are almost like against what you have been taught. So I 196 00:15:07.200 --> 00:15:13.159 am daily inspired by the work of Brene Brown encourage and vulnerability. I just 197 00:15:13.399 --> 00:15:20.000 recently went to one of her there's her certified are to lead workshops, and 198 00:15:20.120 --> 00:15:24.389 then our organization is actually doing a every other Friday book club on dare to 199 00:15:24.429 --> 00:15:31.629 lead and the conversations that has inspired has been just phenomenal. I Love I 200 00:15:31.710 --> 00:15:35.779 love a book club and you're to lead has been in my audible library. 201 00:15:35.980 --> 00:15:39.139 I haven't done around and I know, I know, it's doing it wrong. 202 00:15:39.299 --> 00:15:43.100 I thank you so much. First hearing that we does. That's just 203 00:15:43.179 --> 00:15:46.899 the kind of inside I like to it to get what I ask that question, 204 00:15:46.340 --> 00:15:50.169 and so I know that everybody's listening, just like me, has become 205 00:15:50.210 --> 00:15:52.370 a fast stand of yours and they're going to learn to know how to keep 206 00:15:52.490 --> 00:15:54.210 up with you, to tell us how booths to connect with you. So 207 00:15:54.330 --> 00:15:58.529 probably the best way is I'm super active on twitter most days, so you 208 00:15:58.610 --> 00:16:03.600 can find me on twitter. I'm going to spell out my handle because it's 209 00:16:03.600 --> 00:16:11.039 along, but it's actually humming bird agility and as hm and G dird agility. 210 00:16:11.519 --> 00:16:15.440 So at humming verd agility you can find me and you can also email 211 00:16:15.480 --> 00:16:19.389 me at m bogs as from the lines dot org. But twitters are probably 212 00:16:19.429 --> 00:16:23.470 the quickest and fastest way to connect. Good stuff going to do it. 213 00:16:23.549 --> 00:16:26.669 The woman knows what you're talking about. Look, I love to have you 214 00:16:26.789 --> 00:16:29.389 on another time. I got a bunch of better questions for about what you 215 00:16:29.429 --> 00:16:33.580 do and all your experience and and things to game with them part to our 216 00:16:33.659 --> 00:16:36.500 listeners, but for now we'll close it out and I just say again thank 217 00:16:36.580 --> 00:16:38.740 you so much taking this time of talk with us to day monk. Thank 218 00:16:38.779 --> 00:16:45.659 you, nicking. Appreciate it. We totally get it. We publish a 219 00:16:45.820 --> 00:16:48.409 ton of content on this podcast and it can be a lot to keep up 220 00:16:48.409 --> 00:16:52.929 with. That's why we've started the BOB growth big three, a no fluff 221 00:16:53.009 --> 00:16:57.570 email that boils down our three biggest takeaways from an entire week of episodes. 222 00:16:59.049 --> 00:17:06.119 Sign up today at sweet fish mediacoma big three. That sweet fish mediacoma Big 223 00:17:06.440 --> Three