Differentiation Isn't About Features or Price with Stacy Sherman

WEBVTT 1 00:00:08.199 --> 00:00:13.279 Conversations from the front lines of marketing. This is be to be growth. 2 00:00:17.640 --> 00:00:21.120 Welcome in to be to be growth. Today we are bringing you an episode 3 00:00:21.280 --> 00:00:27.120 from our Archive, a conversation that I wanted to share between Ethan Butt and 4 00:00:27.239 --> 00:00:33.320 Stacy Sherman. Some of you will know Ethan. He was a cohost of 5 00:00:33.359 --> 00:00:38.880 B tob growth for a time and love the work that he's doing over on 6 00:00:38.960 --> 00:00:45.759 the customer experience podcast. He's also the chief evangelist at bomb bomb. He's 7 00:00:45.840 --> 00:00:53.119 interviewing Stacy Sherman in this episode and some context on Stacy. She is really 8 00:00:53.320 --> 00:01:00.799 a bridge builder between employee engagement and customer experience. She does it every day 9 00:01:00.840 --> 00:01:04.959 in her full time role where she is the head of customer experience and employee 10 00:01:04.959 --> 00:01:14.760 engagement at Schindler Elevator, and in addition she has founded doing CX right. 11 00:01:14.799 --> 00:01:19.519 So you can go to doing cx Rightcom if you want to see and hear 12 00:01:19.640 --> 00:01:26.000 more of her work and the things that she's doing daytoday. Loved this conversation. 13 00:01:26.159 --> 00:01:30.519 It's extremely insightful. It's a part of a series we were doing on 14 00:01:30.599 --> 00:01:34.239 CX about nine months ago here at be tob growth, but even as a 15 00:01:34.280 --> 00:01:40.840 standalone episode it's worth sharing and revisiting. We're going to touch on things like 16 00:01:40.920 --> 00:01:47.640 humanizing your business, in differentiating your brand and differentiating far beyond just products, 17 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:51.840 the the products features or just the price. What are some otherwise we can 18 00:01:51.959 --> 00:01:57.280 we can differentiate, and that's the mission that Stacy's on. It's her heart 19 00:01:57.280 --> 00:02:00.159 and she also has a very scientific approach to doing it, and so it's 20 00:02:00.560 --> 00:02:06.760 engaging conversation. Ethans a fantastic host. So I'm going to hand it over 21 00:02:06.840 --> 00:02:13.879 to Ethan and here's his conversation, his interview with Stacy Sherman. Yeah, 22 00:02:13.879 --> 00:02:19.000 I'm really excited about the story because in this conversation because of two things in 23 00:02:19.000 --> 00:02:27.000 particular. One your experience in corporate America with very large organizations, as well 24 00:02:27.039 --> 00:02:30.479 as your passion for doing this and doing some of it at night and on 25 00:02:30.520 --> 00:02:35.360 your own time and things and helping other people in their businesses with it. 26 00:02:35.439 --> 00:02:38.800 So that's one. The other one, of course, is the bridge between 27 00:02:38.800 --> 00:02:42.639 employee experience and customer experience, and I love that that's in your title and 28 00:02:42.800 --> 00:02:45.719 in one of your many roles and hats that you wear these days. So 29 00:02:45.919 --> 00:02:47.719 I'm looking forward to getting into it, but will start where we always start, 30 00:02:47.759 --> 00:02:52.280 which is customer experience. When I say that to you, stacy, 31 00:02:52.400 --> 00:02:55.919 what does it mean? Yeah, so customer experience. Let me first by 32 00:02:57.039 --> 00:03:04.360 saying that customer service is a very long time used word. Customer experience is 33 00:03:04.479 --> 00:03:10.639 rather a new concept, or a methodology, I should say. So customer 34 00:03:10.719 --> 00:03:21.039 experience is looking at the way customers and prospects go through interactions with a brand. 35 00:03:21.080 --> 00:03:23.240 So from the moment that a cut, that a prospect, a person, 36 00:03:23.960 --> 00:03:30.960 learned it becomes aware of your service or product, to the experience of 37 00:03:30.960 --> 00:03:38.039 actually buying it and getting it set up and using and paying and getting help, 38 00:03:38.080 --> 00:03:43.840 and that get help is that customer service, right, calling for help, 39 00:03:43.879 --> 00:03:50.840 and so it's really looking at designing the entire journey, setting those those 40 00:03:50.840 --> 00:03:55.599 experiences, validating them with customers, real customers, to make sure that their 41 00:03:55.599 --> 00:04:01.240 expectations are met with what you designed. And then that's that's the big picture. 42 00:04:01.280 --> 00:04:05.439 But the key is that if the beginning, let's say how they learned 43 00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:11.759 and bought and got set up, was great, seamless easy, but if 44 00:04:11.879 --> 00:04:17.480 getting help when there's an issue is a high level of effort, that customers 45 00:04:17.680 --> 00:04:23.040 very likely going to leave and, even worse, they're going to tell others. 46 00:04:23.199 --> 00:04:26.879 So to your question. It is much more than just customer service, 47 00:04:26.879 --> 00:04:30.480 which is about the get help, an important phase of the journey, but 48 00:04:30.120 --> 00:04:36.439 people have to look at the entire holistic view and that's customer experience. That 49 00:04:36.519 --> 00:04:39.759 was fantastic. There were a couple of things I really, really liked and 50 00:04:39.759 --> 00:04:43.360 I'll mention a couple of them. First, as you talked about expectation management. 51 00:04:43.399 --> 00:04:46.240 It's so important and that's one of the reasons that we need to look 52 00:04:46.240 --> 00:04:49.079 at everything and make sure that it's all consistent, because each touch sets up 53 00:04:49.079 --> 00:04:53.839 an expectation, hopefully a good one, and you need to continue to liver 54 00:04:53.959 --> 00:04:57.279 over and over and over at every one of these touch points. You also 55 00:04:57.279 --> 00:05:00.439 went straight to just like straight out of the gates. I've had definition or 56 00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:02.800 your thoughts on. He went straight to the operationalization of it, which, 57 00:05:02.839 --> 00:05:06.879 you know, a lot of us that are not, as we're not practitioners 58 00:05:06.920 --> 00:05:11.759 the same way that you are. Some of us aren't who are in this 59 00:05:11.800 --> 00:05:15.600 community that I'm trying to build around this, including myself, aren't students of 60 00:05:15.600 --> 00:05:18.319 it and practitioners of it quite the same way that you are, and so 61 00:05:18.360 --> 00:05:23.360 I love that you went straight to the operational aspects of it. Because I 62 00:05:23.360 --> 00:05:27.240 think that's so key and I hope to get into some really practical takeaways for 63 00:05:27.279 --> 00:05:30.480 those of us who are, you know, aware that this is an emerging 64 00:05:30.519 --> 00:05:34.759 discipline, that it is there are nuances to it that is beyond customer service, 65 00:05:34.959 --> 00:05:40.199 customer support, even customer success, which in and of itself is kind 66 00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:44.879 of a practice in some language for some things that have a foot in the 67 00:05:44.920 --> 00:05:47.720 past, but also have a lot of new aspects to it too. so 68 00:05:48.000 --> 00:05:51.959 that's a fantastic go at customer experience. You also do a lot with employee 69 00:05:53.000 --> 00:05:58.079 experience and employee engagement. So a couple things you could do here that would 70 00:05:58.120 --> 00:06:03.240 be really helpful. One is talk about employee engagement versus employee experience and or 71 00:06:03.319 --> 00:06:10.439 build a bridge from customer experience to employee experience. Yes, so, just 72 00:06:10.519 --> 00:06:16.399 like I described the customer journey, there's also a journey for employees. So 73 00:06:16.680 --> 00:06:19.800 right from the moment they learn about your brand and they become you know, 74 00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:28.040 the hiring process and the onboarding experience and then their first ninety days and so 75 00:06:28.120 --> 00:06:34.279 on. So it is the leadership in these companies have to build out what's 76 00:06:34.279 --> 00:06:41.800 the best in class journey for the employees and what's that experienced. Engagement is 77 00:06:41.839 --> 00:06:46.279 what happens when it's a good experience. So if, as a leader, 78 00:06:46.279 --> 00:06:53.519 which I'm very conscientious of, and intentionals to make my team feel that they 79 00:06:53.519 --> 00:07:00.160 are valued, that the that their views matter, that they're empowered to do 80 00:07:00.240 --> 00:07:06.079 what's right for internal and external customers, then they're more likely to be more 81 00:07:06.120 --> 00:07:14.600 engaged. And what I've studied and have begun to approve with data is that 82 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:21.279 when your custom when your employees are really intentional and and they're happy, they 83 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:26.480 then transferred to the customer. The customer sees it and feels it, especially 84 00:07:26.560 --> 00:07:30.439 the frontline do that makes sense? Absolutely. Yeah, they are the ones 85 00:07:30.480 --> 00:07:34.439 who deliver the experience to the customers for the most part, especially the customer 86 00:07:34.480 --> 00:07:39.600 facing rules, obviously, and I like the way you separated employee experience from 87 00:07:39.600 --> 00:07:43.240 play engagement, that the engagement is the outcome of doing it well. Let's 88 00:07:43.279 --> 00:07:46.480 tie kind of the first pass in this last pass together a little bit. 89 00:07:46.480 --> 00:07:48.639 I feel like, just like a lot of people, maybe want to punt 90 00:07:48.639 --> 00:07:56.079 customer experience into a customer successor even customer service organization. My feeling, and 91 00:07:56.079 --> 00:07:58.920 you would know a lot better than I would, my feeling is that a 92 00:07:58.920 --> 00:08:05.680 lot of people want to punt employee experience and employee engagement into hr or talent 93 00:08:05.720 --> 00:08:09.319 management talk. Is that what's happening in is that a mistake? Is that 94 00:08:09.360 --> 00:08:13.680 an okay place to start? Like, what do you think about that? 95 00:08:13.240 --> 00:08:18.639 Yeah, that's a that's a huge topic. I'll share my views, which 96 00:08:18.959 --> 00:08:28.279 is that you do need a customer experience Cxo, a champion at the top. 97 00:08:28.399 --> 00:08:33.759 Right how with that said, there has to be a very close partnership 98 00:08:33.799 --> 00:08:39.600 and collaboration with marketing, with human resources, with operations, finance, with 99 00:08:39.840 --> 00:08:46.200 everybody, and drive that drum beat and the best practices and helping everyone understand 100 00:08:46.440 --> 00:08:50.200 how they own the customer experience. It's not one person or department, it's 101 00:08:50.320 --> 00:08:54.360 everyone. It takes a village, but you do need a champion at the 102 00:08:54.399 --> 00:08:58.840 top. And then, when it comes to the HR topic, they're obvious 103 00:09:00.039 --> 00:09:07.440 slave the first in line to the hiring customer centric people and it's important that 104 00:09:07.519 --> 00:09:13.240 they are mindful to hire people and ask the right questions to make sure you 105 00:09:13.240 --> 00:09:16.720 bring the right people in that support the culture, the customer centric culture. 106 00:09:18.480 --> 00:09:24.080 When it comes to the Voice of employee, I call it Voe, which 107 00:09:24.159 --> 00:09:31.840 is some similar to voice of custom or voc you have to partner whether if 108 00:09:33.200 --> 00:09:37.080 HR owns that element of it, then it's just a close partnership, if 109 00:09:37.080 --> 00:09:41.679 this customer experience team owns that element, I think there's a lot of value 110 00:09:41.759 --> 00:09:45.840 to that, because then you can really marry the voice of customer in the 111 00:09:45.919 --> 00:09:52.200 voice employee when you are deciding new features, new products, new market messaging. 112 00:09:52.240 --> 00:09:56.600 I really believe you need to take both and marry it to come up 113 00:09:56.600 --> 00:10:01.480 with your business strategy. I love it at the at just the outset of 114 00:10:01.480 --> 00:10:05.519 your response there, when you said Ce xos, like okay, this is 115 00:10:05.519 --> 00:10:11.080 good. Wouldn't it makes sense if you were to be in a position to 116 00:10:11.440 --> 00:10:16.120 assign someone to this, whether it's a CEXO or similar title, to marry 117 00:10:16.200 --> 00:10:22.840 the X and CX functions? Yes, my opinion is yes, there are 118 00:10:22.960 --> 00:10:26.799 some companies. I'm learning, I'm actually studying a lot of different corporations. 119 00:10:26.799 --> 00:10:31.639 How are they structured? You know, I believe that HR has certainly a 120 00:10:31.639 --> 00:10:37.840 lot of human elements and benefits and those things that keep you, you know, 121 00:10:37.919 --> 00:10:43.200 retention, but when it comes to employee feedback as it relates to your 122 00:10:43.240 --> 00:10:50.120 business lines, that is a huge responsibility that I do believe ex and Cx 123 00:10:50.159 --> 00:10:54.759 have to come together and if, if that's not how your company is aligned, 124 00:10:56.320 --> 00:10:58.960 you still do it right. You so you the partner with them, 125 00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:03.159 or you do it and you give everybody that feedback, but it's important. 126 00:11:03.360 --> 00:11:07.080 Do you have any we can do this one quickly, because I know this 127 00:11:07.120 --> 00:11:11.120 would be an entire episode on its own, but I just want to double 128 00:11:11.159 --> 00:11:16.360 back into VOC and Voe. I think most people who listen to a show 129 00:11:16.399 --> 00:11:20.200 like this would be familiar with VOC VOE is something they probably haven't heard as 130 00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:22.840 often. Could you just do a quick drive by, if you were to, 131 00:11:24.000 --> 00:11:28.799 if you were to do like a thirty minute consultation with a business leader 132 00:11:28.799 --> 00:11:31.240 who is, you know, is aware of these ideas but not really intentionally 133 00:11:31.279 --> 00:11:37.639 practicing them? What would be you're just like really quick take on a few 134 00:11:37.759 --> 00:11:43.000 key measures around VOC which I think most people would be able to relate to. 135 00:11:43.159 --> 00:11:46.639 In what do you do parallel to kind of capture voe? And I 136 00:11:46.679 --> 00:11:50.919 know that's a huge, huge question. So if you can have as much 137 00:11:50.960 --> 00:11:52.399 time at as at it as you want, but I would hate to miss 138 00:11:52.440 --> 00:11:56.200 the opportunity to get like, you know, what are three or four collection 139 00:11:56.320 --> 00:12:07.519 points or measures or ways to start paying attention to VOC voe. Yes, 140 00:12:07.559 --> 00:12:16.399 so it's really important when a company or department, let's say, is developing 141 00:12:16.399 --> 00:12:20.799 a new let's say a new product, or could be an existing product of 142 00:12:20.879 --> 00:12:28.159 the new feature. So the old way would be you would design it and 143 00:12:28.240 --> 00:12:31.919 you would go to market, throw it out and hope it sticks, hope 144 00:12:31.960 --> 00:12:37.840 the customers want it there. That's all old news, okay, and yes, 145 00:12:37.960 --> 00:12:41.399 and then you can get some customer feedback and surveys, and that's the 146 00:12:41.440 --> 00:12:48.440 old way. The new way that you actually could conturn whatever your new product, 147 00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:58.159 service feature into a differentiator is starting with the customer at the table and 148 00:12:58.919 --> 00:13:03.200 do concept validation. Ask Them Right, you could have literally a piece of 149 00:13:03.200 --> 00:13:09.320 paper, it could be a sketch. What do you think about x? 150 00:13:09.480 --> 00:13:15.600 What's your view on all these value propositions, about x, rank and order? 151 00:13:15.720 --> 00:13:20.159 What really resonates to you? And elaborate on those questions. And, 152 00:13:20.399 --> 00:13:26.320 by the way, if you had these features, what you're willingness to pay? 153 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:31.679 Right, so there's all this prototype testing, con a validation with customers 154 00:13:31.720 --> 00:13:37.080 before you even invested into this new big idea, and then you go through 155 00:13:37.120 --> 00:13:43.879 that agile process of development. And the key is to because I know a 156 00:13:43.879 --> 00:13:48.399 lot of product. Teams have deadlines and this is about quality over speed. 157 00:13:48.039 --> 00:13:54.399 But in that whole phase that I just described, you also, and you 158 00:13:54.440 --> 00:14:01.799 do get customers quantitative and qualitative feedback. You also go to your employees, 159 00:14:01.960 --> 00:14:05.759 to the employees who are going to have to go sell and promote this new 160 00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:13.840 product or feature or service. So you ask them what about this solution makes 161 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:18.480 sense to you and you could actually ask them about maybe some of the training 162 00:14:18.519 --> 00:14:24.240 material that you're putting together, what's missing, what's confusing? So you co 163 00:14:24.519 --> 00:14:30.600 create with all the people all involved. The one caveat, and I can't 164 00:14:30.639 --> 00:14:39.200 say this strong enough, which is never replace the employee feedback instead of going 165 00:14:39.240 --> 00:14:43.919 to customers. And I've seen companies do that where they'll take that shortcut and 166 00:14:45.000 --> 00:14:48.519 say, well, let's just go to the salespeople and ask them instead of 167 00:14:48.559 --> 00:14:52.879 asking the customer. And you really have to do both. You cannot replace 168 00:14:52.879 --> 00:14:58.480 a customer. A customers view so good you have to wait collect it all 169 00:14:58.480 --> 00:15:01.480 way at all and it's interest staying it. It's you know, as I 170 00:15:01.480 --> 00:15:03.840 think about some of the customer feedback that we get, you know there's there's 171 00:15:03.879 --> 00:15:07.279 obviously a balance. I like the way you approach it by the way you 172 00:15:07.279 --> 00:15:09.360 approach it from someplace different that I'm operating in my mind right now, which 173 00:15:09.399 --> 00:15:13.039 is, you know, you get customer feedback in a variety of channels and 174 00:15:13.080 --> 00:15:18.200 a variety of ways, whether it's cancelation feedback or support ticket feedback or survey 175 00:15:18.279 --> 00:15:24.799 responses or, you know, unsolicited offers via email or social media or whatever, 176 00:15:24.879 --> 00:15:28.799 and it you have to weigh, you know, how important is this 177 00:15:28.879 --> 00:15:31.440 voice versus that voice, versus that voice? And I really love your caution 178 00:15:31.559 --> 00:15:39.759 here not to take three employees feedback for proxy for the you know, a 179 00:15:39.759 --> 00:15:43.639 fair proxy for the three hundred people they talked with in the past week, 180 00:15:43.720 --> 00:15:46.879 right, because it's filtered in its processed. I agree with you that the 181 00:15:46.919 --> 00:15:50.919 employee, this the customers voice, is super important. And specifically there's, 182 00:15:52.600 --> 00:15:56.200 let's bring this a little bit into communication, something I've been really excited about 183 00:15:56.320 --> 00:16:00.480 in handling a lot of direct customer feedback, which I choose to do a 184 00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:03.919 lot anytime we do surveys in those types of things. You know, we 185 00:16:03.960 --> 00:16:07.559 have people that are a little bit more hardcore than me from a quantitative view 186 00:16:07.600 --> 00:16:12.360 processing the data, but I always volunteer to take the qualitative feedback and try 187 00:16:12.399 --> 00:16:17.200 to turn it into two, into meaningful things quantified to some degree, because 188 00:16:17.240 --> 00:16:21.799 I love seeing the language people use. It comes with like a weight and 189 00:16:21.879 --> 00:16:25.759 a character and two words that they choose in these types of things. And 190 00:16:25.799 --> 00:16:30.600 so you already mentioned internal communication with employ please, to make sure that they 191 00:16:30.679 --> 00:16:34.279 understand where we're going with the big ideas and all of that, and that's 192 00:16:34.440 --> 00:16:40.519 that's one piece of communication. Where are some other internal and or external communication 193 00:16:40.519 --> 00:16:44.759 tips that you have in terms of making sure that everyone's on the same page 194 00:16:44.759 --> 00:16:47.840 and or that you're collecting the right stuff and some of the themes that you've 195 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:55.320 already spoken to? Yeah, so in terms of customer feedback, it is 196 00:16:55.360 --> 00:17:03.879 really important to definitely ask your customers the right questions and if you don't ask 197 00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:07.000 them the right questions, obviously you're not going to get the actionable feedback. 198 00:17:07.079 --> 00:17:11.319 You need to do something with it. So it's a science in an art 199 00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:15.480 in terms of the questions, but also you have to close the loop and 200 00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:21.200 that means taking that feedback, and we're talking about the structured feedback for this 201 00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:25.839 moment, not not talking about social media and ratings and reviews, because that's 202 00:17:25.920 --> 00:17:30.599 also feedback. That is part of the puzzle. That has to be has 203 00:17:30.720 --> 00:17:33.240 to putting that on a shelf for a moment because it is equally important. 204 00:17:33.319 --> 00:17:40.240 But taking the feedback and getting it into your cells, your branch, your 205 00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:44.599 sales offices, your product teams, you're marketing teams, so that they can 206 00:17:44.759 --> 00:17:49.920 actually understand what the customers saying and then use that to drive their business decisions 207 00:17:49.960 --> 00:17:57.599 and also let the customer know what you're actually doing because of their collective feedback. 208 00:17:57.640 --> 00:18:02.559 And what happens is a lot of times, I know I've given feedback 209 00:18:02.599 --> 00:18:04.720 to companies and then I think it's a sin, like some dark hole, 210 00:18:04.920 --> 00:18:14.240 like it never gets anywhere and in customers need to have trust and belief that 211 00:18:14.279 --> 00:18:18.440 you're going to give feedback so you're going to do something with their feedback. 212 00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:23.039 Otherwise, don't waste their time. They'll actually become a detractor and unhappy because 213 00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:27.240 you wasted their time. Yeah, it's so interesting. I just did a 214 00:18:27.359 --> 00:18:33.200 twenty seven hundred mile road trip with with our teenage son to visit several college 215 00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:37.920 campuses. One of them was actually open for an in person tour, which 216 00:18:37.920 --> 00:18:40.720 I thought was pretty interesting, and they did a nice job of keeping us 217 00:18:40.839 --> 00:18:45.000 safe and distant from one another. But obviously I engage with a variety of 218 00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:49.400 brands and companies and I I took care, just for fun, to fill 219 00:18:49.440 --> 00:18:52.839 out for feedback surveys kind of over the past week or so. Is that 220 00:18:52.960 --> 00:18:57.160 kind of came to me and what you're talking about is something I just immediately 221 00:18:57.200 --> 00:19:00.880 acutely feel. Is like some of them were long and I just like would 222 00:19:00.920 --> 00:19:03.920 honor them. I just walk them out and take the some questions that open 223 00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:07.480 up after you give them like you know, they've hidden questions at all. 224 00:19:07.799 --> 00:19:11.720 So we're asking our customers to do so much and I love your call here 225 00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:15.720 to close that loop and let them know what is happening, because the little 226 00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:18.960 think you screen isn't enough. A five dollar starbucks Gift Card is enough. 227 00:19:19.160 --> 00:19:23.559 Like I'm now somewhat emotionally invested. I would say the same thing for employees. 228 00:19:23.559 --> 00:19:26.880 Would you say the same thing with regard to employees, because something that 229 00:19:26.920 --> 00:19:33.119 we do at bombomb is we do you a twice annual all employee kind of 230 00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:36.599 survey. It's a little bit like an employee and PS at some level, 231 00:19:36.640 --> 00:19:40.079 and there's plenty of open fields and so what we use a leadership teams kind 232 00:19:40.079 --> 00:19:44.480 of round up some of the feedback and then if it's some of the loop 233 00:19:44.519 --> 00:19:48.519 closing is more appropriate to an individual and some of the loop closing is more 234 00:19:48.559 --> 00:19:52.640 appropriate to a department or a team and some of its appropriate to the entire 235 00:19:52.759 --> 00:19:56.319 company. Do you have any thoughts or feedback on closing the loop with employees 236 00:19:56.359 --> 00:20:00.759 as well? Yeah, so. Well, I want to answer this from 237 00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:07.240 bridging the customer and the employee together. So what I see too often over 238 00:20:07.319 --> 00:20:15.359 the years is that we have a tendency to focus on the negative, and 239 00:20:15.519 --> 00:20:19.799 I'm encouraging. We talked about customer engagement employee engagement before. This is how 240 00:20:19.839 --> 00:20:26.640 you do it. When a customer especially calls out a particular name that really 241 00:20:26.680 --> 00:20:32.000 delighted them and that they're grateful because Joe Schmo did you know, went out 242 00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:37.400 of their way, you have to take that feedback and celebrate that person, 243 00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:44.799 thank them. We don't do that enough as human beings and focus on the 244 00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:52.759 wonderful human factors and and just always think about what's wrong, what's where do 245 00:20:52.799 --> 00:20:56.000 we coach to be better? Yes, you need that, but you need 246 00:20:56.160 --> 00:21:03.680 even more substantially to demonstrate what grew rate looks like. So Voice of customer, 247 00:21:03.759 --> 00:21:07.200 they give feedback. I don't care what channel it is, online, 248 00:21:07.279 --> 00:21:14.039 offline. Make sure that the bosses are getting that feedback and they're taking the 249 00:21:14.119 --> 00:21:18.240 time to acknowledge the great employees, because that's going to feed them to do 250 00:21:18.400 --> 00:21:23.079 more excellence. I love it one of these. This brings me right to 251 00:21:23.119 --> 00:21:26.799 something I was it really excited to talk to you about, among a variety 252 00:21:26.799 --> 00:21:30.279 of other topics, which is video, something that we do this all the 253 00:21:30.279 --> 00:21:33.839 time internally and we teach people to do the same, which is you know, 254 00:21:33.880 --> 00:21:37.400 and I've done this many times for myself, if I'm in a leadership 255 00:21:37.440 --> 00:21:41.000 meeting and I hear that a front if I hear a frontline employees name from 256 00:21:41.039 --> 00:21:45.720 a midlevel or a senior manager and it kind of crosses my radar, I 257 00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:49.759 will vary often just make a note in like once a week I'll go through 258 00:21:49.759 --> 00:21:52.680 these little notes that I have of people I want to thank or acknowledge or 259 00:21:52.759 --> 00:21:56.559 check in with or whatever and just hey, just want to let you know, 260 00:21:56.599 --> 00:21:59.799 as in a meeting earlier this week and so and so mentioned your name 261 00:21:59.839 --> 00:22:02.160 and the great work that you did with this thing. I just want to 262 00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:04.240 say I really, really appreciate you and the feedback I get by doing that 263 00:22:04.279 --> 00:22:07.400 with a video is just through the roof. It like it just it's so 264 00:22:07.519 --> 00:22:12.240 much different. What is your interest in video with regard to some of this 265 00:22:12.279 --> 00:22:18.119 customer communication or employee communication? Yeah, I'm a huge, huge proponent of 266 00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:25.279 video. I've been playing with the technology, including bombomb, and I love 267 00:22:25.359 --> 00:22:30.559 it. And the reason is because I know even for myself, my email 268 00:22:30.599 --> 00:22:36.559 inbox is so huge I can't possibly get to all of it. Personal email, 269 00:22:36.599 --> 00:22:41.279 work, email, texts, you know, different communications flying at us 270 00:22:41.319 --> 00:22:45.480 all the time and so and I know people don't really read, but when 271 00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:51.680 you get a video, especially when it says one minute, thirty seconds whatever, 272 00:22:51.720 --> 00:22:55.279 it's like, okay, let me hear what they have to say and 273 00:22:55.599 --> 00:22:59.000 it grabs you right away. And so I've been playing with that and testing 274 00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:03.200 it out and then responses are like even the family members are like, I 275 00:23:03.240 --> 00:23:07.119 was having a bad day. Your video just absolutely brightened me up and I'm 276 00:23:07.160 --> 00:23:11.519 like wow, you know, that was so easy, so quick. The 277 00:23:11.559 --> 00:23:18.880 feedback was phenomenal. So I think that I know that video is here to 278 00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:22.920 stay. It is the future and what people need to do, because I'm 279 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:27.920 speaking from experience, is to not be afraid of the technology. I think 280 00:23:27.920 --> 00:23:37.039 that gets in people's way to do something different. So when companies like bombomb 281 00:23:37.119 --> 00:23:44.359 make it easy to actually use the technology, if that's a low level of 282 00:23:44.400 --> 00:23:48.559 effort, there's a higher chance that people are going to use it and tell 283 00:23:48.559 --> 00:23:52.759 others. Yeah, I really appreciate that. I love that you're using it 284 00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:56.559 for personal effect as well. I mean it's just it's it goes to something 285 00:23:56.559 --> 00:23:59.920 you said earlier and I forget the exact language, but this is kind of 286 00:24:00.319 --> 00:24:03.079 be a bridge to to another topic I want to talk about with you, 287 00:24:03.119 --> 00:24:06.519 about your work and the way that you approach it. But you mentioned something 288 00:24:06.519 --> 00:24:10.200 about, you know, letting someone feel heard or letting someone feel seen, 289 00:24:10.279 --> 00:24:14.680 and and it's that element. There's there's so many moments, whether it's the 290 00:24:14.680 --> 00:24:19.440 the kind of internal leadership and management example I offered or the personal example that 291 00:24:19.480 --> 00:24:22.680 you mentioned, is just this taking this thought that I have, like, 292 00:24:22.720 --> 00:24:26.400 Oh, I need to see how she is or oh my gosh, I 293 00:24:26.480 --> 00:24:29.519 just heard this interesting piece of news about I'm going to reach out and congratulate 294 00:24:29.599 --> 00:24:32.960 and or thank him or whatever, making it into an action, but making 295 00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:36.559 you to do an action that people can feel that like, that that sincerity, 296 00:24:36.680 --> 00:24:41.400 that enthusiasm or that concern or that interest or those softer side elements that 297 00:24:41.400 --> 00:24:45.799 are really difficult just like type out and get through effectively. Yeah, I 298 00:24:45.839 --> 00:24:52.000 mean that's that's the beauty of video, because you can't really convey from the 299 00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:56.359 heart. You could feel it, you could feel the energy went through a 300 00:24:56.440 --> 00:25:03.000 video, and I believe, especially during pandemics like this, that we need 301 00:25:03.160 --> 00:25:10.160 to find these creative ways to keep connection, to keep the feelings and address 302 00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:15.839 the feelings even more sensitively. And that's that's what's going to change, I 303 00:25:15.839 --> 00:25:19.680 believe, the way we communicate, in the way we do business. I 304 00:25:19.720 --> 00:25:23.920 completely agree into the employee engagement side, to the degree that we can equip 305 00:25:23.920 --> 00:25:26.960 and empower our team members to do the same. Like something that has kept 306 00:25:27.000 --> 00:25:30.680 me I will have been a bombomb nine years full. I'm in September, 307 00:25:30.680 --> 00:25:33.920 which is just absolutely insane. It's twice as long as I've been anywhere, 308 00:25:33.920 --> 00:25:38.400 and the thing that always brings me back and brings me to life is connecting 309 00:25:38.440 --> 00:25:44.000 with customers and knowing that we're helping them or that they're getting real impact in 310 00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:47.279 like when they feedback some of the stuff that you're doing in a positive way 311 00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:49.799 and give you these little stories and moments, and so I know that so 312 00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:55.680 many of our team members are highly, highly engaged because they have those same 313 00:25:55.759 --> 00:26:00.559 interactions with customers where they maybe send a video to follow up on a support 314 00:26:00.599 --> 00:26:03.319 ticket and they get this reply back that says, oh my gosh, that's 315 00:26:03.319 --> 00:26:06.799 amazing, and so you start to see more first names showing up in some 316 00:26:06.839 --> 00:26:11.000 of these other feedback loops and feedback channels because they feel some attachment, not 317 00:26:11.079 --> 00:26:15.079 to the company or the brand, but to Jessica right, because I feel 318 00:26:15.079 --> 00:26:18.400 like I know Jessica down and she was so helpful to me anyway. So 319 00:26:18.519 --> 00:26:22.559 you mentioned in your response. They're again. You know, you mentioned art 320 00:26:22.599 --> 00:26:26.359 and science, you mentioned heart, you mentioned feeling a couple of times. 321 00:26:26.440 --> 00:26:30.839 Your approach to CX is a blend of heart and science and I love for 322 00:26:30.880 --> 00:26:33.480 you just to speak to that because just in you know, we connected before 323 00:26:33.519 --> 00:26:37.359 this conversation. I've spent some time on your website and I love that you're 324 00:26:37.400 --> 00:26:41.119 explicit about it and I think it matters and I just be curious to hear 325 00:26:41.160 --> 00:26:45.079 about it in your own words, like making sure to be explicit about heart 326 00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:49.920 and science. Yes, and, by the way, the customer service example 327 00:26:51.039 --> 00:26:55.359 you gave before with that video, the reason why it works is it's so 328 00:26:55.440 --> 00:27:00.839 personalized. Right, there's no cookie cutter approaches anymore to any business. The 329 00:27:00.920 --> 00:27:06.039 more personalize it is, the more that it stands out. So heart and 330 00:27:06.160 --> 00:27:12.400 science to me is about so customer experience. There's definitely a methodology on how 331 00:27:12.400 --> 00:27:18.000 you do it and there's the basics and then there's some really sophisticated techniques and 332 00:27:18.039 --> 00:27:25.799 platforms. So the science of it is a lot of the data that comes 333 00:27:25.960 --> 00:27:32.440 from that methodical approach. And even when you think about the basic level, 334 00:27:32.480 --> 00:27:36.759 if it's one on one customer interviews, if it's focus groups, if it's 335 00:27:36.759 --> 00:27:42.319 surveys, there is the element that you get numeric scores. So becomes the 336 00:27:42.400 --> 00:27:49.880 scores and there's predictable predictability, modeling and future behaviors based on the data you 337 00:27:49.920 --> 00:27:56.039 have. So's a lot of data analysis, data scientists who really are doing 338 00:27:56.079 --> 00:28:02.160 so well in this field because it's needed and we know people are not just 339 00:28:02.160 --> 00:28:07.279 buying on price, they're buying on experiences. So there's a science to it. 340 00:28:07.319 --> 00:28:11.000 But then there's the heart because at the end of the day, a 341 00:28:11.079 --> 00:28:17.759 business is a business. We're buying from people who are in the company and 342 00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:21.160 even some of my friends have said, Oh, my boss like I can't, 343 00:28:21.400 --> 00:28:25.359 I can't be here, and I'm like that's just a person, that's 344 00:28:25.359 --> 00:28:27.400 not the company is bad. It's just happens to be that you have a 345 00:28:27.480 --> 00:28:33.640 disconnect with your boss us. But you know and same thing if you have 346 00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:38.440 a bad experience with an employee, it's not the whole entire company is bad. 347 00:28:38.480 --> 00:28:45.279 But the reality is perception is reality and it does affect the whole image. 348 00:28:45.599 --> 00:28:55.480 So that the heart to it is really diving into the qualitative feedback and 349 00:28:56.200 --> 00:29:03.319 understanding what's said and what's not said, and it does all come back to 350 00:29:03.519 --> 00:29:08.559 the sentiments and the feelings behind the numerics. So that's why they're both really 351 00:29:08.720 --> 00:29:15.079 important. You can't make any judgments calls without both pieces. I love it, 352 00:29:15.119 --> 00:29:18.440 and one colors the other. Right, you can have some of this 353 00:29:18.599 --> 00:29:22.279 qualitative feedback and it might drive some questions that you can get answered through the 354 00:29:22.359 --> 00:29:25.319 data. Likewise, you can sit and pour over the data, but it's 355 00:29:25.319 --> 00:29:30.359 missing this context that even one little story from the qualitative side will completely change 356 00:29:30.400 --> 00:29:36.440 the way this report looks. Yes, absolutely so. Again, I mentioned 357 00:29:36.519 --> 00:29:41.839 this off the top, but you're obviously all in. You are actively studying, 358 00:29:41.880 --> 00:29:45.839 you're doing it by day in a formal corporate role. You're doing it 359 00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:51.480 nights and, I assume, weekends for fun and interest, in passion, 360 00:29:51.640 --> 00:29:56.000 doing some consulting, content development, etc. We're did in. You also 361 00:29:56.039 --> 00:30:00.839 acknowledged in the beginning that that there is something new about customer experience as a 362 00:30:00.839 --> 00:30:04.640 discipline. So this is obviously not something that you were doing, at least 363 00:30:04.720 --> 00:30:08.920 under the label CX, you know, five or ten years ago. What 364 00:30:10.039 --> 00:30:15.279 was the kind of the dawn or spark or catalyst for your obvious passion for 365 00:30:15.359 --> 00:30:19.079 customer experience? Like, where were you in your life or your career where 366 00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:22.599 we're something clicked in, you're just like all in, or was it a 367 00:30:22.599 --> 00:30:29.680 slow build? Yeah, that's a great question. So I kind of have 368 00:30:29.920 --> 00:30:34.319 two answers in my mind. One is back in high school, long time 369 00:30:34.359 --> 00:30:38.920 ago. I won't I won't reveal how long ago. There was no Internet 370 00:30:38.960 --> 00:30:45.720 then and I was I remember I was in a marketing advertising class and we 371 00:30:45.720 --> 00:30:55.519 were studying consumer behaviors and actually was all about subliminal advertising and I was fascinated 372 00:30:55.640 --> 00:30:59.359 by subliminal ads. And again, they were probably magazines at the time. 373 00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:06.319 And what's the message say and what makes people move and and take action and 374 00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:11.799 as fascinated and that pivoted me to go to college and I studied all marketing 375 00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:18.160 and consumer behaviors. So it was clearly in me to go that path as 376 00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:25.119 opposed to accounting or engineering law. And then after college I ended up in 377 00:31:25.160 --> 00:31:32.640 a sales role at ATNT and continued on in to get my masters in marketing. 378 00:31:32.839 --> 00:31:40.160 And when I was finished with my masters that's when Google became Google and 379 00:31:40.480 --> 00:31:44.519 just the beginning of it and the world online. In fact, my thesis 380 00:31:44.680 --> 00:31:49.359 was what's the Internet? It's Hilarious to read it now, but and and 381 00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:52.559 so life goes on. Right. I went in and out of telecom and 382 00:31:52.559 --> 00:32:00.599 different industries and then about five maybe longer, two thousand and thirteen ish, 383 00:32:00.640 --> 00:32:06.160 I was at verizon. I was doing marketing at that time and my boss 384 00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:10.720 said to me you're now going to do customer experience in this BOC thing and 385 00:32:10.759 --> 00:32:15.359 as I as I call it, I threw me a ball and I'm and 386 00:32:15.440 --> 00:32:16.720 I'm like what is this thing? And he's like I don't know, go 387 00:32:16.759 --> 00:32:22.599 figure it out, and so I did and that was really the beginning of 388 00:32:22.640 --> 00:32:28.039 how I start to really understand and that was an e commerce channel. So 389 00:32:28.079 --> 00:32:34.720 really understanding when traffic came, millions of people to verizoncom understanding, well, 390 00:32:34.759 --> 00:32:39.440 what's going to make them actually take out their credit card and pay and making 391 00:32:39.440 --> 00:32:44.720 sure there's no friction along that customer buying journey. And so there was so 392 00:32:44.920 --> 00:32:51.079 much around the online digital experience turned it into Omni channel, the buying online, 393 00:32:51.160 --> 00:32:54.079 pick up a store, and so it evolved. And to the ants 394 00:32:54.160 --> 00:33:00.799 to finalize the story is that when I got an opportunity where I am now 395 00:33:00.839 --> 00:33:07.559 at Hillor Elevator Corporation, I had a decision to make which was do I 396 00:33:07.559 --> 00:33:13.359 want to continue down the path that I knew a long time, which was 397 00:33:13.400 --> 00:33:17.640 sales and digital marketing, or do I want to continue down a career path 398 00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:25.400 really around CX customer experience, because the new role Shin there was very much 399 00:33:25.480 --> 00:33:32.160 elevating the customer centric culture and bring new ideas to the organization as the CX 400 00:33:32.240 --> 00:33:37.920 leader. And so I want that path and the beautiful thing is I we 401 00:33:38.000 --> 00:33:44.559 have a marketing department and and customer experience and we work together. So it's 402 00:33:44.599 --> 00:33:47.880 a collaborative thing. It takes a village and I love this. I will. 403 00:33:47.960 --> 00:33:52.680 I am I think the answer of why I spend so much time on 404 00:33:52.720 --> 00:33:57.640 it is because it doesn't feel like work. So when you do what you 405 00:33:57.680 --> 00:34:00.240 love, and love what you do doesn't feel like work. Yeah, what 406 00:34:00.319 --> 00:34:05.240 a healthy habit in I guess. So many followed questions. I guess I'll 407 00:34:05.279 --> 00:34:09.639 start with what are you doing with doing cx? Right? Yes, so 408 00:34:09.760 --> 00:34:19.280 it started as a blog several years ago and I really encourage people to find 409 00:34:19.320 --> 00:34:22.639 their voice, whatever they're passionate about, and just write just just right, 410 00:34:22.800 --> 00:34:25.679 just get it out there. When I launched this I had no idea if 411 00:34:25.719 --> 00:34:30.199 anyone would ever read anything I had to say. I thought made yeah, 412 00:34:30.199 --> 00:34:35.559 I'd be maybe my family and you're one. You do a lot wrong quickly, 413 00:34:36.599 --> 00:34:40.719 and then your two and three. It started to really take traction and 414 00:34:42.039 --> 00:34:46.000 you, you, you learned so much and now where I am now is 415 00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:55.280 working on my dreams, which is writing books. I Co authored two books, 416 00:34:55.719 --> 00:34:59.760 one's doubt on kindle now and paper back in a few weeks and then 417 00:34:59.760 --> 00:35:06.079 a second book coming in October. And mentoring people, I love, that's 418 00:35:06.119 --> 00:35:08.880 my favorite part, so that I could help people who either want to get 419 00:35:08.920 --> 00:35:13.480 into the field and don't know where to start, or people who are experts 420 00:35:13.480 --> 00:35:16.840 and want to take it to the next level and I want to do some 421 00:35:16.880 --> 00:35:22.400 Ted talks. I want to do I have a lot of a lot of 422 00:35:22.480 --> 00:35:27.880 dreams, so I'm getting them up. But but it's my own train ride 423 00:35:28.000 --> 00:35:31.760 right there's no speed, it's what comes naturally when I have my spare time. 424 00:35:32.800 --> 00:35:37.480 I love it. I love that you're it was just such a healthy 425 00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:42.119 hobby. is so wonderful and it's so naturally occurring. What did? What 426 00:35:42.239 --> 00:35:46.760 an awesome thing to be trusted enough by a supervisor to be thrown that ball. 427 00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:50.400 You know, and here we are years later and it all makes sense 428 00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:53.119 in hindsight. But you would have never seen it coming then. Not only 429 00:35:53.119 --> 00:35:58.679 didn't I see it coming then, but if that literally that ball, that 430 00:35:58.679 --> 00:36:01.599 that that somebaal a ball, if that wasn't thrown to me and it was 431 00:36:01.639 --> 00:36:07.320 thrown to my neighbor, I wouldn't be sitting here today, I wouldn't have 432 00:36:07.400 --> 00:36:10.519 known all the things I know and I wouldn't have gone for the certifications I 433 00:36:10.559 --> 00:36:15.159 did. I wouldn't have I wouldn't be here where I am now. So 434 00:36:15.519 --> 00:36:20.599 everything happens for a reason, I think. I know also that while I 435 00:36:20.639 --> 00:36:24.679 felt really frustrated that that that boss threw me something and couldn't help me because 436 00:36:24.719 --> 00:36:30.519 he didn't know. It made me tougher so that anything that comes my way 437 00:36:30.519 --> 00:36:36.199 now I figure it out. It did then and now I can again. 438 00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:42.159 So it's a good lesson. It's awesome and really that's a nice summary of 439 00:36:42.199 --> 00:36:45.159 life in general. You know, you can either like duck and cover or 440 00:36:45.239 --> 00:36:47.639 just play it safe, or you can just go figure it out when things 441 00:36:47.679 --> 00:36:51.760 come your way, and it's some cases we don't have any other option. 442 00:36:52.519 --> 00:36:54.760 No, and I think the times were living and right now, where nobody 443 00:36:54.800 --> 00:37:00.519 can predict anything. Right like I'm sending my kids back to college in, 444 00:37:00.679 --> 00:37:05.920 you know, she very shortly, in days, and I don't know tomorrow 445 00:37:05.960 --> 00:37:08.920 the call can come no, no school or, you know, total change. 446 00:37:09.119 --> 00:37:13.920 So I think that's our new way of life of not knowing, being 447 00:37:13.960 --> 00:37:17.400 prepared to catch the balls and learning what to do with it. Yeah, 448 00:37:17.440 --> 00:37:21.039 and I hope that we in this. This is guy, I guess, 449 00:37:21.119 --> 00:37:24.000 not really related to the to the topic at hand necessarily, although it is 450 00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:27.440 in some way. This is the heart side of it. I hope that 451 00:37:27.559 --> 00:37:30.960 in light of that, that that we can try us to each other as 452 00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:38.119 team members and a customers and service and products suppliers to just trust that everyone 453 00:37:38.199 --> 00:37:43.320 is doing their best in light of the crazy situation. Give a little bit 454 00:37:43.360 --> 00:37:45.800 of space, give a little bit of patience, give a little bit of 455 00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:50.920 grace and, you know, just do our best together. I love that 456 00:37:50.960 --> 00:37:57.599 you've said that and I want to do a quick recommendation for and there's no 457 00:37:57.719 --> 00:38:00.840 I have no incentive whatsoever to give this recommendation, but you just said like 458 00:38:00.880 --> 00:38:05.760 everyone do their best. There's a book that changed my life called the for 459 00:38:06.039 --> 00:38:12.440 agreements, and the fourth agreement is always do your best. And it sounds 460 00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:16.679 so simple, but each of the agreements don't assume anything, be impeccable with 461 00:38:16.719 --> 00:38:22.239 your words, don't take anything personally and always do your best. And each 462 00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:27.840 one has a lot of meat behind each of those sections. And I had 463 00:38:27.880 --> 00:38:31.280 an epiphany actually a couple weeks ago. I wrote an article, it's in 464 00:38:31.400 --> 00:38:38.360 forbs now, about how this principle applies to business too, and so I 465 00:38:38.440 --> 00:38:43.599 encourage people to read the book and apply to their lives, because then more 466 00:38:43.599 --> 00:38:50.280 people will do their best, they will have more empathy and magic happens. 467 00:38:50.360 --> 00:38:52.800 I love it. They'll be better people and better team members and problem better 468 00:38:52.840 --> 00:38:58.000 customers to that's awesome. I'm so glad I entertained that. I sometimes I 469 00:38:58.000 --> 00:39:00.280 wonder in my own head, like him, I taking this off course. 470 00:39:00.400 --> 00:39:02.239 That's awesome. I'm so glad. So for folks who are listening, we 471 00:39:02.320 --> 00:39:07.400 do short write ups on all of these episodes. We take video clips from 472 00:39:07.440 --> 00:39:09.719 these episodes to kind of so you can meet the guests a little bit differently 473 00:39:09.719 --> 00:39:14.239 than just spending time in your ear buds with her. I also round up 474 00:39:14.280 --> 00:39:17.159 some links, and so of course they'll be access to stacy's linked in profile. 475 00:39:17.440 --> 00:39:22.239 Have doing CX right hooked up. I'll have the for agreements hooked up. 476 00:39:22.400 --> 00:39:25.039 I will I will find that article in forms and Hook that thing up. 477 00:39:25.079 --> 00:39:30.079 And so if you're enjoying this podcast, of course you should subscribe in 478 00:39:30.119 --> 00:39:36.159 your preferred player, but you can go an extra step by visiting Bombombcomas podcast. 479 00:39:36.239 --> 00:39:38.559 In there you of course you can get what I offered there for every 480 00:39:38.639 --> 00:39:42.320 episode. In addition, you can check out other episodes so like, if 481 00:39:42.360 --> 00:39:45.519 you like this one, here are a couple more that I think are on 482 00:39:45.679 --> 00:39:50.880 theme that you'll also enjoy. Episode Seventy three with Christopher Wallace. He runs 483 00:39:50.920 --> 00:39:55.559 a consultancy called interview group. I nnar so obviously it's internally focused and we 484 00:39:55.639 --> 00:40:00.480 called that one marketing to your employees, not just to your customers, which 485 00:40:00.519 --> 00:40:04.599 we did a really nice drive by on earlier. But that's what his entire 486 00:40:04.679 --> 00:40:07.800 business is about. Is like rolling out big initiatives, like in very large 487 00:40:07.800 --> 00:40:12.360 companies, and making sure that all the frontline people that need to execute it 488 00:40:12.400 --> 00:40:15.800 and deliver the experience don't just know what's going on, which I think is 489 00:40:15.840 --> 00:40:20.679 often taken for granted, but also are cognitively and emotionally bought into it so 490 00:40:20.719 --> 00:40:25.119 that it's a delivered with some level of excitement and sincerity. Sets episode seventy 491 00:40:25.159 --> 00:40:30.480 three with Christopher Wallace and then episode eighty with Gil Cohen. We titled that 492 00:40:30.559 --> 00:40:36.800 one employee Experience Design how, why and where to begin, and my conversation 493 00:40:37.000 --> 00:40:39.679 with him is one of the reasons I was so excited to hear you separate 494 00:40:39.719 --> 00:40:45.360 employee engagement from employee experience with that was something that we talked about in that 495 00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:51.039 conversation as well, in designing an employee experience in order to create a higher 496 00:40:51.119 --> 00:40:53.599 level of engagement and then ultimately, of course, deliver a better experience for 497 00:40:53.639 --> 00:40:58.119 your customers as a consequence. So Stacy before I let you go. I 498 00:40:58.119 --> 00:41:00.000 need to ask you a couple more things and I'll give you an opportunity to 499 00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:04.000 send people wherever you would like them to connect with you. But first I 500 00:41:04.400 --> 00:41:07.760 always loved to know and you did a nice shout out to the for agreements, 501 00:41:07.760 --> 00:41:12.199 but is there a person that you would like to mention who's had a 502 00:41:12.239 --> 00:41:16.719 positive impact on your life or your career? So many people, I would 503 00:41:17.000 --> 00:41:24.599 say, as a sort of my career, but as I entered the CX 504 00:41:24.719 --> 00:41:31.320 space, who is I've mentioned him a lot. So if people heard other 505 00:41:31.559 --> 00:41:37.760 shows, they'll they won't be surprised. But it's Chephiken, great dude, 506 00:41:37.880 --> 00:41:43.760 you know. You know challowy o Hey, so and and he's worth reinforcing 507 00:41:43.800 --> 00:41:49.039 again because he, as I said, he's he's famous. You know. 508 00:41:49.280 --> 00:41:52.880 No, no, no question about that. He's famous and he never forgets 509 00:41:52.920 --> 00:41:59.679 where he came from. Any helps people like me when I was first starting 510 00:41:59.719 --> 00:42:02.760 out to now. He's there. He's there for me, he's been a 511 00:42:02.800 --> 00:42:07.880 mentor, he's been so giving of his time. He had me on a 512 00:42:07.000 --> 00:42:14.320 show Eddie. He just gave me a voice and continues to do that. 513 00:42:14.559 --> 00:42:19.320 So that's my answer. I we need more ships in the world. That 514 00:42:19.400 --> 00:42:23.000 is awesome. Chef hike in Hyka and he's hiking on twitter. He I 515 00:42:23.119 --> 00:42:27.760 agree. He's an awesome guy. He has been on this show and you 516 00:42:27.880 --> 00:42:30.039 know, just to hear you say that, that's a person who's obviously going 517 00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:34.239 about his life and his work in a way that is going to leave a 518 00:42:34.519 --> 00:42:38.559 very positive legacy. Mutual friend of ours, Dan Gingis, who I recently 519 00:42:38.639 --> 00:42:42.639 spoke with and who has also been on this show. Referred to him as 520 00:42:42.679 --> 00:42:45.079 the Godfather. Is like, well, of course is the God father love. 521 00:42:45.199 --> 00:42:49.159 Like you know, customer. He's one of those people who did just 522 00:42:49.239 --> 00:42:53.519 a fantastic job of building that bridge from customer service, as is traditionally been 523 00:42:53.599 --> 00:43:00.039 done, and broadening it out to to experience in and which calls back to 524 00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:05.239 your definition of customer experience. Yeah, funny you mentioned Dan getting us because 525 00:43:05.239 --> 00:43:09.679 I was on his show yesterday and another great good, another great guy, 526 00:43:09.840 --> 00:43:15.800 and and the theme right that, the invisible thread between those two guys and 527 00:43:15.920 --> 00:43:20.840 some others is that, and hopefully people will say that about me on other 528 00:43:21.000 --> 00:43:27.360 people's podcast one day, and that is it's about showing up authentically right this 529 00:43:27.719 --> 00:43:31.280 right now. There's no script. It's just coming from the heart and and 530 00:43:31.480 --> 00:43:37.159 that's what those two guys do and and many others women see in Cx as 531 00:43:37.239 --> 00:43:43.239 well. That that's that's how you know, that's how you build trust and 532 00:43:43.440 --> 00:43:46.800 admiration and paying a forward. That's what it's about. I love it. 533 00:43:46.880 --> 00:43:50.960 That's also how you build a community and advance and movement. In this case 534 00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:57.039 it's the movement to make customers experiences better. Speaking of which, can you 535 00:43:57.159 --> 00:44:00.519 think of a company or brand that you really appreciate a respect for the experience 536 00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:06.559 that they deliver for you, Stacy, as a customer? Yes, so 537 00:44:07.119 --> 00:44:12.280 again people are going to know this answer, but that's okay because I feel 538 00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:17.599 good about it. And that is trader Joe's. I love that. From 539 00:44:17.679 --> 00:44:22.840 the minute I walk in the door, people say hello. So basic, 540 00:44:22.079 --> 00:44:27.679 right, but they say hello. They there's a journey right when you walk 541 00:44:27.800 --> 00:44:31.639 into when you leave from the register and then bagging your stuff, but they're 542 00:44:31.679 --> 00:44:36.800 talking to you and they're giving you recommendations about the products. And when you 543 00:44:36.960 --> 00:44:39.679 walked in originally and you didn't know where something is, other markets, the 544 00:44:40.000 --> 00:44:44.519 the you know someone, the staff will just point to an aisle and you're 545 00:44:44.559 --> 00:44:49.000 guessing where is that? Where do they just point trader Joe's. They walk 546 00:44:49.119 --> 00:44:52.800 you to the actual product. They'll open the bag and I'm like no, 547 00:44:52.039 --> 00:44:54.480 no, don't, don't waste it on me and like no, no, 548 00:44:54.559 --> 00:44:57.920 it's okay, we want you to really like it, you know. So 549 00:44:58.119 --> 00:45:00.199 it's just filled with a lot of wow moments. That's that's my point. 550 00:45:00.880 --> 00:45:06.440 Love it. It's people who care and and it seems like the culture itself 551 00:45:06.599 --> 00:45:08.760 is probably pretty fun and I've seen trader Joe's on a number of lists that 552 00:45:09.320 --> 00:45:15.800 specifically treat their employees well, which just is a reinforcement of what you've shared 553 00:45:15.880 --> 00:45:19.559 with all of us here today, which is that a great employee experience be 554 00:45:19.760 --> 00:45:24.519 gets a great customer experience. It's almost impossible to produce a fantastic employee experience 555 00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:30.400 and not have a great customer experience as a consequence. It's true and I 556 00:45:30.559 --> 00:45:35.000 am so excited. I'm going to be writing an article shortly. I interviewed 557 00:45:35.480 --> 00:45:40.760 some people at Trader Joe's and what it's like and and so I obviously we 558 00:45:40.880 --> 00:45:45.480 talked about it as consumers, but I'm going to be writing about it from 559 00:45:45.519 --> 00:45:51.599 the inside. So awesomely fun great teas and if that happens to release before 560 00:45:51.599 --> 00:45:55.280 I release this episode, I'll put that it won't bombombcom slash pocket. Okay, 561 00:45:55.320 --> 00:45:59.960 cool, yeah, yeah, this has been awesome. I really enjoyed 562 00:45:59.960 --> 00:46:01.920 it so much. Again, there are several other places we could have gone, 563 00:46:01.960 --> 00:46:04.960 and so I'll have to have you back. But in the meantime, 564 00:46:05.039 --> 00:46:07.480 if people enjoyed this, where would you send them to follow up and learn 565 00:46:07.559 --> 00:46:10.519 more and connect with you and maybe read some of your articles and that type 566 00:46:10.559 --> 00:46:16.199 of thing? Yes, I welcome that. At doing doianng C X, 567 00:46:16.760 --> 00:46:23.960 right our IGHTCOM, and it's filled with the resources and tools and tips and 568 00:46:24.039 --> 00:46:31.960 white papers on how you can accelerate you our skills and your practice, no 569 00:46:32.039 --> 00:46:36.400 matter where you worked, no matter one industry you're in. I'm happy to 570 00:46:36.480 --> 00:46:38.960 help. B Tob growth is brought to you by the team at sweet fish 571 00:46:39.000 --> 00:46:43.519 media. Here at sweetfish, we produce podcasts for some of the most innovative 572 00:46:43.559 --> 00:46:47.079 brands in the world and we help them turn those podcasts into Microvideos, linkedin 573 00:46:47.239 --> 00:46:52.199 content, blog posts and more. We're on a mission to produce every leader's 574 00:46:52.239 --> 00:46:54.960 favorite show. Want more information, visit Sweet Fish Mediacom