You're Not Marketing Products or Services

WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.940 --> 00:00:08.450 you're never selling a product or service. You're always selling 2 00:00:08.450 --> 00:00:13.740 decisions and good feelings about decisions, and that takes place largely 3 00:00:13.740 --> 00:00:19.820 on the unconscious level. Paul Ross is a master hypnotist and master 4 00:00:19.820 --> 00:00:25.400 practitioner of neuro linguistic programming, or NLP. He's also CEO and 5 00:00:25.400 --> 00:00:31.140 head trainer at Subtle Words That Cell. He is our guest on this episode of the 6 00:00:31.140 --> 00:00:36.170 C X series Unbeatable Growth. My name is Ethan Butte, I am your host, and I 7 00:00:36.170 --> 00:00:40.630 was fascinated by so much of what Paul has to teach here about creating a 8 00:00:40.630 --> 00:00:45.390 state of focus with the person we're speaking with what we're actually 9 00:00:45.390 --> 00:00:48.940 selling. Which, by the way, is decisions and good feelings about those 10 00:00:48.940 --> 00:00:55.210 decisions. While using the power of suggestion is not manipulation and the 11 00:00:55.210 --> 00:01:00.110 three magic words to overcome our self limiting beliefs. Enjoy this 12 00:01:00.110 --> 00:01:06.400 conversation with Paul Ross today on the podcast. We're talking about 13 00:01:06.410 --> 00:01:11.500 talking but talking more effectively. Subconscious sales, overcoming 14 00:01:11.500 --> 00:01:16.040 objections, the power of language. In addition to being an author, speaker 15 00:01:16.040 --> 00:01:20.590 and trainer, our guest is a master hypnotist and a master practitioner of 16 00:01:20.590 --> 00:01:25.570 neuro linguistic programming. He's CEO and head trainer at subtle words that 17 00:01:25.570 --> 00:01:30.070 sell helping sales teams abandon the same worn out sales scripts assumed 18 00:01:30.070 --> 00:01:34.530 closes another stale techniques that often insult people's intelligence. So 19 00:01:34.530 --> 00:01:39.610 Paul Ross, welcome to the customer experience podcast. Thank you. And as 20 00:01:39.610 --> 00:01:43.850 your audience is listening to me speak today, I just want to say I don't know 21 00:01:43.850 --> 00:01:47.840 what points they might stop and find themselves growing more and more 22 00:01:47.840 --> 00:01:51.670 fascinated about what we're sharing together. But as that's taking place, I 23 00:01:51.670 --> 00:01:55.940 just feel so honored to be here and to be observed this to everyone who's 24 00:01:55.940 --> 00:02:01.010 listening to me right now. That is very thoughtful introduction, and I guess I 25 00:02:01.010 --> 00:02:06.080 wonder before we get into it is, is any part of your of your teaching and 26 00:02:06.080 --> 00:02:11.140 training doesn't even advocate for something like that for what I just 27 00:02:11.140 --> 00:02:15.800 said, Yeah, yeah, like a sincere welcome in an expression of gratitude. 28 00:02:15.810 --> 00:02:20.570 Well, it was Yes, it does, and I'd layer everything I do. Almost 29 00:02:20.570 --> 00:02:24.320 everything I do is layered with hypnotic suggestion. There are a lot of 30 00:02:24.320 --> 00:02:28.300 suggestions layered into that. If you were one of my train students or a 31 00:02:28.300 --> 00:02:33.010 hypnotist, you would have picked up on what I said and I used some clever 32 00:02:33.010 --> 00:02:38.310 words I said we sharing together. I said I don't know, as we're sharing 33 00:02:38.310 --> 00:02:42.960 this together now we sharing together or what I call implied relationship 34 00:02:42.960 --> 00:02:47.530 words, they imply on the unconscious or subconscious level. You can use those 35 00:02:47.530 --> 00:02:52.940 terms interchangeably. They imply a relationship of trust and even 36 00:02:52.940 --> 00:02:57.250 leadership. Where there's a leader, there must be by implication, a what 37 00:02:57.260 --> 00:03:01.870 starts with the letter F follower. Now, I didn't say that. I didn't say I'm 38 00:03:01.870 --> 00:03:04.890 going to be leading you today. You're going to listen to what I say. You're 39 00:03:04.890 --> 00:03:09.340 gonna follow me and be very suggestible. But those three words we sharing 40 00:03:09.340 --> 00:03:15.680 together, we implies it's we're on the same side of the table share. Do we 41 00:03:15.680 --> 00:03:19.760 share things with people who we don't really trust? The deep things? No, not 42 00:03:19.760 --> 00:03:23.950 things that matter and together indeed implies that we're on the journey 43 00:03:23.950 --> 00:03:30.690 together. So I think these are really important tools to apply anywhere in 44 00:03:30.690 --> 00:03:34.800 the sales process anywhere and everywhere. I even implied them. I want 45 00:03:34.800 --> 00:03:37.980 to create that sense of trust and report right in the beginning through 46 00:03:37.980 --> 00:03:43.900 the use of my language. Well done, I at least even though I didn't follow it at 47 00:03:43.900 --> 00:03:49.260 that level, I just got a sense of like of gratitude and, uh, and service was a 48 00:03:49.260 --> 00:03:53.630 word that really stuck out to me and as well as a call to the listener. But I 49 00:03:53.630 --> 00:03:56.560 obviously didn't pick up on that level of detail. You're not supposed to be 50 00:03:56.570 --> 00:04:00.960 glad I asked. You're not supposed to. It's supposed to go in unconsciously 51 00:04:01.140 --> 00:04:05.330 because you had that response. It tells me that it worked on the conscious 52 00:04:05.330 --> 00:04:09.910 level. You can't catch it unless you are very well trained. Awesome. So we 53 00:04:09.910 --> 00:04:13.210 will be getting into some of that. But before we do, we're gonna start where I 54 00:04:13.210 --> 00:04:16.959 start with everybody from a wide variety of disciplines. And I believe 55 00:04:16.959 --> 00:04:22.410 you're the first hypnotist on the show. So So there. There are a number of 56 00:04:22.410 --> 00:04:25.990 things unique about you, as there are of every guest. But one thing in common 57 00:04:25.990 --> 00:04:28.940 is that everyone kind of shares thoughts or characteristics or 58 00:04:28.940 --> 00:04:32.730 definition of customer experience. When I say that to you, Paul, what does it 59 00:04:32.730 --> 00:04:37.130 mean? Well, as far as serving my customers, I don't think of them as 60 00:04:37.130 --> 00:04:41.820 customers. First and foremost, I think of them as my students whether they're 61 00:04:41.820 --> 00:04:46.260 aware of that or not, because there's a different relationship. When I someone 62 00:04:46.260 --> 00:04:51.240 is my student, I have a higher level of responsibility. I have a to do, sure, a 63 00:04:51.240 --> 00:04:56.310 duty to them as my student, to be the best possible teacher that I can be now 64 00:04:56.310 --> 00:05:00.120 when you're I used to do insurance claims out of college. It was one of 65 00:05:00.120 --> 00:05:03.900 the most difficult, challenging jobs you can imagine because I used to tell 66 00:05:03.900 --> 00:05:09.400 people their car was uncovered, other house wasn't covered, and my job was 67 00:05:09.400 --> 00:05:13.990 the first and foremost sell myself on the idea that not to take it personally, 68 00:05:13.990 --> 00:05:18.880 that's not about me. And the second one was to convey that I'm there not to 69 00:05:18.880 --> 00:05:23.890 make them wrong or make me right, but to be of service to them. I didn't have 70 00:05:23.890 --> 00:05:29.940 the tools I have at the time, So for me it's about leadership that's created 71 00:05:29.940 --> 00:05:35.970 through service and suggestion customer experience. Good customer experience is 72 00:05:35.970 --> 00:05:41.980 about leadership and service that's created through the power of suggestion 73 00:05:41.980 --> 00:05:47.200 and sincerely wanted to wanting to help. If your staff for you does not 74 00:05:47.200 --> 00:05:51.260 sincerely want sincerely want to help and or they take things personally, I 75 00:05:51.260 --> 00:05:56.250 don't care how technically good your script is or how good your training is 76 00:05:56.250 --> 00:05:59.920 you're leaving out the most essential elements. May I add one more thing, 77 00:05:59.930 --> 00:06:05.530 please. No matter what your company or corporation or you individually as an 78 00:06:05.530 --> 00:06:10.410 entrepreneur thinks you're selling, you're not. You're never selling a 79 00:06:10.410 --> 00:06:14.430 product or service. You're always selling decisions and good feelings 80 00:06:14.430 --> 00:06:19.000 about decisions, and that takes place largely on the unconscious level. So 81 00:06:19.000 --> 00:06:23.510 remember, in addition to being in service to your customer, you're also 82 00:06:23.510 --> 00:06:28.320 in service of a good decision. That's really, really important to get. And 83 00:06:28.320 --> 00:06:32.520 you can't do that unless you first turn control of your state and know not to 84 00:06:32.520 --> 00:06:37.040 take it personally. So much good stuff there. I want to unpack a little bit of 85 00:06:37.040 --> 00:06:41.590 it first. I really appreciate your call for sincerity. I completely agree. You 86 00:06:41.590 --> 00:06:44.600 know what we do at Bom Bom is make it easy to record and send video messages 87 00:06:44.600 --> 00:06:47.490 and one of my cautions and people generally take it as a joke even though 88 00:06:47.490 --> 00:06:50.900 it's it is offered as such. But it's also real. It's like one of the best 89 00:06:50.900 --> 00:06:54.470 things you can do if you're sincere about your message and your 90 00:06:54.470 --> 00:06:57.640 relationship with the other person or the product the service. The decision 91 00:06:57.640 --> 00:07:00.980 is a new language. For me, video is one of the best things you can do because 92 00:07:00.980 --> 00:07:03.820 it's it's so much more rich, and you can convey it in a way that people will 93 00:07:03.820 --> 00:07:07.800 feel they'll feel that sincerity in a way that they won't through your plane 94 00:07:07.800 --> 00:07:11.150 type out text. And the caution, of course, is if your instance here and 95 00:07:11.150 --> 00:07:14.130 transactional reminded you don't actually care that they're do video 96 00:07:14.130 --> 00:07:18.460 because people can sense that discrepancy between the two. Another 97 00:07:18.470 --> 00:07:22.660 really good thing that you did there is, um, is again later in this decision 98 00:07:22.660 --> 00:07:26.200 thing. I actually think there's so much about custom. I think some of the 99 00:07:26.200 --> 00:07:29.870 language that we're using today around customer experience really is about 100 00:07:29.880 --> 00:07:34.590 peeling off that product or service, which most people say there's too much 101 00:07:34.590 --> 00:07:40.230 competition in product parody, etcetera. Not to recognize that most businesses 102 00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:45.810 are in a trajectory toward commodification. Exactly. Experience is 103 00:07:45.810 --> 00:07:49.960 what is the differentiator, and I think you peel off the product or service and 104 00:07:49.960 --> 00:07:53.850 get to this decision and having people feel good about their decisions, their 105 00:07:53.850 --> 00:07:56.720 decision to engage with you their decision to commit to you their 106 00:07:56.720 --> 00:08:00.990 decision to take the meeting, to take the appointment, to reply to the email 107 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:04.040 to type in the credit card number. Whatever the case may be, it's really 108 00:08:04.040 --> 00:08:11.450 good. Now I'm gonna say something very controversial and a very how can I put 109 00:08:11.450 --> 00:08:15.780 this counterintuitive? I tend to be a disrupter, so I'm gonna be a little 110 00:08:15.780 --> 00:08:21.210 disruptor here. Being in service is great and what I want to add into that 111 00:08:21.210 --> 00:08:28.530 not but and suggestion along with service. If you're simply observe Isse, 112 00:08:28.540 --> 00:08:31.730 that's great. But don't assume that your client or customer knows how to 113 00:08:31.730 --> 00:08:36.510 make a good decision because we're living. Yes, we're living in a time 114 00:08:36.510 --> 00:08:41.299 when products and services are commoditized, you're absolutely right. 115 00:08:41.299 --> 00:08:46.080 But it's equally true that there's market saturation and it's equally true 116 00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:49.680 that people don't have the focus that they used to have, and they don't trust 117 00:08:49.680 --> 00:08:54.470 their own decisions anymore for good reasons. So I would say that yes, being 118 00:08:54.470 --> 00:09:02.140 sincere is great, but you can be crafty in the service of being sincere, so 119 00:09:02.150 --> 00:09:06.640 being crafty, being able to structure your message, to reach them to the 120 00:09:06.640 --> 00:09:11.270 unconscious level and being sincere, they may appear to be an opposition, 121 00:09:11.270 --> 00:09:15.800 but they actually work together. I invite anyone watching this to put 122 00:09:15.800 --> 00:09:19.990 their thumb and forefinger together. They work in opposition to yet in 123 00:09:19.990 --> 00:09:23.910 cooperation with each other. That's what enabled us to rise above every 124 00:09:23.910 --> 00:09:29.260 other species and be the dominant species on the planet. So what I teach 125 00:09:29.840 --> 00:09:35.150 seems to be paradoxical. But what I'll offer to people is in paradox. There is 126 00:09:35.150 --> 00:09:41.070 power. When you see a power paradox, it means the old paradigm is shattering or 127 00:09:41.070 --> 00:09:46.880 falling away. And it's time for a new paradigm. And that's when I'm as crazy 128 00:09:46.880 --> 00:09:51.660 as bat bleep. I won't curse on your show. Crazy as that appears to be, I'm 129 00:09:51.660 --> 00:09:56.980 saying that's possible. You can be both crafty and sincere at the same time, 130 00:09:56.990 --> 00:10:00.910 even though they appear to be contradictory, they're not. So let's 131 00:10:00.910 --> 00:10:04.020 get into that a little bit because one of the areas I wanted to go into, and 132 00:10:04.020 --> 00:10:08.150 it's not that I hold this position, but I'm asking kind of out of a genuine 133 00:10:08.150 --> 00:10:11.940 curiosity and on behalf of people that might be wondering such a thing. You 134 00:10:11.940 --> 00:10:15.660 know, when they hear hypnotism when they hear subconscious sales, You know, 135 00:10:15.670 --> 00:10:19.590 I really love that you already addressed this, uh, and I like the use 136 00:10:19.590 --> 00:10:22.860 of the opposable thumb. By the way, if you are listening to this and not 137 00:10:22.860 --> 00:10:26.690 watching, you can always go to bomb bomb dot com slash podcast. We do short 138 00:10:26.690 --> 00:10:30.460 write ups on all of these episodes. We pull some video clips from because we 139 00:10:30.460 --> 00:10:33.550 recorded with Zoom. So I dropped some video clips in there. Some highlights 140 00:10:33.550 --> 00:10:36.380 of the show and, of course, links to some of the stuff that we talked about. 141 00:10:36.380 --> 00:10:39.170 So you can always find that stuff at bob bob dot com slash podcasts. I'll be 142 00:10:39.170 --> 00:10:43.450 sure to include that clip, Paul, so that people can follow along with the 143 00:10:43.460 --> 00:10:47.380 with the point you were making about about the two working together and 144 00:10:47.380 --> 00:10:51.470 again, it was somewhere I wanted to go like this. This line between persuasion 145 00:10:51.470 --> 00:10:55.660 and coercion, right? So I think I think what some people, depending on, maybe 146 00:10:55.660 --> 00:10:57.920 the time of day they're listening, or something that happened to them 147 00:10:57.920 --> 00:11:01.390 personally in their lives, or maybe a long held beliefs about how things 148 00:11:01.390 --> 00:11:05.420 could should would be done, you know, talk about that tension between the 149 00:11:05.420 --> 00:11:10.440 idea of suggestion and hypnotism and subconscious sales strategies and 150 00:11:10.440 --> 00:11:16.720 approaches from a persuasion. Coercion. I will, I will. And as I'm addressing 151 00:11:16.720 --> 00:11:22.570 that, what I'd like to speak into is that whether you wanted to or not, most 152 00:11:22.570 --> 00:11:26.890 decisions are going to be made subconsciously or unconsciously. This 153 00:11:26.890 --> 00:11:32.080 is a pretty trite metaphor, but if you imagine an iceberg as a metaphor for 154 00:11:32.080 --> 00:11:36.610 human consciousness, we know only 15% or so of the iceberg is showing above 155 00:11:36.610 --> 00:11:40.450 the surface. The rest of it is taking place on the unconscious level. So 156 00:11:40.450 --> 00:11:43.290 whether you know it or not, you're going to be addressing the unconscious 157 00:11:43.290 --> 00:11:47.290 anyway. You may as well structured in a way that helps the other person. I have 158 00:11:47.290 --> 00:11:52.010 a radically different definition of selling to me. Selling is not about 159 00:11:52.010 --> 00:11:55.560 necessarily getting your ideas and the other person's mind. It's about 160 00:11:55.560 --> 00:11:59.970 expanding their mind to include choices they didn't know were there and getting 161 00:11:59.970 --> 00:12:03.380 them off of their autopilot. First response. Their autopilot. First 162 00:12:03.380 --> 00:12:09.000 response to being angry or feeling self righteous. Now, more directly address 163 00:12:09.000 --> 00:12:14.450 your question. Here's my distinction between Well, let me back up or go to 164 00:12:14.450 --> 00:12:18.640 the side a little bit hypnosis. If your view of hypnosis is about controlling 165 00:12:18.640 --> 00:12:22.670 other people making them bark like a dog or do things against their will. 166 00:12:22.680 --> 00:12:27.320 That's not what I'm talking about, that stage tricks. I've never done that. 167 00:12:27.330 --> 00:12:32.650 I've used it for influence and for healing. What's not in my biography 168 00:12:32.650 --> 00:12:38.230 that I think you got? As I've done a lot of healing work for men who are 169 00:12:38.240 --> 00:12:43.210 very scared of relationships, I've done a lot of healing work. So to me 170 00:12:43.220 --> 00:12:47.280 coercion and manipulation, which is not what I do, involves a few of the 171 00:12:47.280 --> 00:12:55.010 following things. Number one lying about facts saying the car does 60 MPG 172 00:12:55.010 --> 00:12:59.880 when it only does 30 concealing material facts saying that your company 173 00:12:59.890 --> 00:13:06.090 is really doing well. But in fact your stock is dropping like a lead falcon 174 00:13:06.090 --> 00:13:12.250 trying to fly, pushing down on people's pain. But their shame, their guilt, 175 00:13:12.250 --> 00:13:17.220 their fear and finally, coercion. Do it or I'm going to harm you in some way. 176 00:13:17.230 --> 00:13:21.620 That, to me, is not any. What influenced persuasion about influenced 177 00:13:21.620 --> 00:13:28.100 persuasion is simply about that process of selling someone on a decision that 178 00:13:28.100 --> 00:13:32.800 serves them and what I want to point out again. And this is said with 179 00:13:32.800 --> 00:13:38.050 respect, most of your prospects just don't know how to make a good decision 180 00:13:38.060 --> 00:13:42.300 or they're extremely conflicted around it. People do not come to you with a 181 00:13:42.300 --> 00:13:46.790 blank slate. People did not come to you certainly in the super positive state, 182 00:13:46.790 --> 00:13:52.200 sure themselves, knowing that they deserve what you have to offer. And 183 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:56.680 also, this is the biggest challenge. People are just not focused anymore. We 184 00:13:56.680 --> 00:14:03.030 live in the age, uh, instant messaging this thing. I'm holding up my iPhone. 185 00:14:03.030 --> 00:14:09.180 For those of you who are listening, there's instagram LinkedIn tender. Not 186 00:14:09.180 --> 00:14:13.950 that I know anything about tender, you understand, So people are distracted 187 00:14:13.960 --> 00:14:17.680 and they just don't have the focus. So you need to learn to create those 188 00:14:17.680 --> 00:14:22.650 states to focus very quickly. Yeah. I also like you're just harkening back a 189 00:14:22.660 --> 00:14:27.040 few minutes there to the idea of opening up someone's perspective and 190 00:14:27.040 --> 00:14:30.260 allowing them to know that there are choices and decisions that maybe even 191 00:14:30.260 --> 00:14:33.720 went on the table before. I really like the way you broke that down. I think 192 00:14:33.720 --> 00:14:38.180 your definition of of manipulation is one that anyone should be able to 193 00:14:38.180 --> 00:14:41.980 relate to and respect. I think it's fantastic. Give me a quick go on this 194 00:14:41.980 --> 00:14:45.150 one. You know, we are talking in a sales context. We're talking about 195 00:14:45.150 --> 00:14:51.380 subtle words that sell. Of course, um, if you were to be a subscriber to Dan, 196 00:14:51.380 --> 00:14:56.160 Pink's idea of sales is that everyone is in sales that we all need to 197 00:14:56.170 --> 00:15:00.580 influence and persuade words that you just used. We all need to influence and 198 00:15:00.580 --> 00:15:04.490 persuade open up people's minds two choices and decisions, whether they're 199 00:15:04.500 --> 00:15:08.640 transactional, buying decisions or whether there are other decisions to be 200 00:15:08.640 --> 00:15:12.490 made. I just wanted to broaden this conversation a minute and share with me 201 00:15:12.490 --> 00:15:16.630 your thoughts on talking about, you know, prospects, customers, sales 202 00:15:16.630 --> 00:15:20.160 versus sales as persuasion and influence. 203 00:15:21.340 --> 00:15:26.140 I don't think they're contradictory. They're not at all. I don't see them as 204 00:15:26.150 --> 00:15:30.810 because you used the word with respect. You use the word versus I don't think 205 00:15:30.810 --> 00:15:34.500 they're in any way adverse to one another. They're the same thing. The 206 00:15:34.500 --> 00:15:38.080 question is, are you going to do it in a clumsy way? Are you going to do it in 207 00:15:38.080 --> 00:15:42.710 a high pressure way? Are going to do it in a stale way? Or here's the thing in 208 00:15:42.710 --> 00:15:47.030 a way where your prospects have heard it before. Here's Here's the thing a 209 00:15:47.030 --> 00:15:52.960 tactic identified as a tactic diffuse the tactic that won't work. One of the 210 00:15:52.960 --> 00:15:57.140 reasons why I say in my book. So the words that sell the old, worn out 211 00:15:57.140 --> 00:16:01.600 scripts assume closes, tag questions. It insults your prospects. Intelligence, 212 00:16:01.600 --> 00:16:05.710 because they've heard it before. It's not that I'm saying to you. Look, what 213 00:16:05.710 --> 00:16:09.200 I have will replace everything you have in your sales process. If you have a 214 00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:13.620 sales process that's working for you great. And if you add in what I have to 215 00:16:13.620 --> 00:16:17.080 teach, it'll turbo charge it, and it will allow you to gradually drop the 216 00:16:17.080 --> 00:16:21.510 old stuff. People have heard it before, over and over and over. May I give you 217 00:16:21.510 --> 00:16:27.170 a metaphor? Yes, please. Oh, quite some time ago, I was pulled over by a 218 00:16:27.170 --> 00:16:31.310 motorcycle police officer, and the first thing I said is I did it. I'm 219 00:16:31.310 --> 00:16:35.930 guilty. I went against the light. I'll pay that. Fine. Please, just give me 220 00:16:35.930 --> 00:16:39.930 the ticket. And he gave me a look. He said license. He took my insurance on 221 00:16:39.930 --> 00:16:44.000 my information and he came back and he said, You know what? You didn't be 222 00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:51.050 asked me with a story. I'm gonna give you a break you get it? So when we 223 00:16:51.060 --> 00:16:58.110 don't be s our prospects when we don't bs our customers when we present 224 00:16:58.110 --> 00:17:01.290 something because we're presenting something they've never heard before. 225 00:17:01.290 --> 00:17:06.079 The motorcycle cop here is the same excuses. After two months on the job, 226 00:17:06.089 --> 00:17:10.880 everyone gives them the same excuses. Your customers and prospects have a 227 00:17:10.880 --> 00:17:15.349 unique paradox in them. I kept talking about paradox will keep introducing 228 00:17:15.349 --> 00:17:18.950 this idea. Number one. They're more sophisticated than ever because they're 229 00:17:18.950 --> 00:17:23.020 bombarded with more sales messages and, yeah, right, on the other hand, there 230 00:17:23.020 --> 00:17:28.460 dumbed down and numbed out by TV and overwhelming the rest of it. So you 231 00:17:28.460 --> 00:17:31.710 have to be able to juggle those two things. Is that making sense to 232 00:17:31.710 --> 00:17:38.340 describe it? Was that responsive to your question? Totally. Yeah. So let's, 233 00:17:38.350 --> 00:17:43.070 uh, let's get into subtle words that sell. You've already given us a really 234 00:17:43.070 --> 00:17:48.950 nice pass on we share together. Um, what are some other? From a practical 235 00:17:48.950 --> 00:17:52.760 standpoint, you know, I'm sure people that are with us at this point in the 236 00:17:52.760 --> 00:17:57.140 conversation had some appreciation for we share and together, and they may 237 00:17:57.140 --> 00:18:01.560 want to hear a little bit more. What are a few more kind of key ideas here. 238 00:18:02.040 --> 00:18:06.480 Well, the key idea is first and foremost. Whatever you can get, your 239 00:18:06.480 --> 00:18:10.280 prospect to imagine for themselves would be perceived as being their own 240 00:18:10.280 --> 00:18:16.950 thought, and therefore they will not resist it. So if you can learn to be, 241 00:18:17.040 --> 00:18:20.900 how can I put this? If you can learn to be sufficiently vague in your language 242 00:18:20.900 --> 00:18:24.580 and this is an advanced training, I normally don't give this to my 243 00:18:24.580 --> 00:18:29.830 beginning students. But if I said to you, for example, if I were selling 244 00:18:29.830 --> 00:18:32.990 real estate and remember, I'm not selling real estate, No one is. We're 245 00:18:32.990 --> 00:18:37.050 always selling decisions and good feelings about decisions. If I said 246 00:18:37.640 --> 00:18:41.670 before I go through our marketing plan together, I know that you're really 247 00:18:41.670 --> 00:18:46.340 going to like the homes we've got because there are over 3000 square feet 248 00:18:46.340 --> 00:18:51.310 their value appreciates by 15% a year, and I'm sure that you're going to be 249 00:18:51.310 --> 00:18:56.360 very satisfied with what it is I'm going to present. So let's get going. 250 00:18:56.440 --> 00:19:05.200 Oh, by the way, ask questions if you have them. I want to say something like, 251 00:19:05.210 --> 00:19:10.560 as we're exploring this together today, I'm not sure at which point you might 252 00:19:10.570 --> 00:19:14.650 find yourself growing more and more interested in what it is you're 253 00:19:14.650 --> 00:19:19.230 learning. We're learning together. But as that's taking place, feel free to 254 00:19:19.230 --> 00:19:23.670 ask the questions that naturally arise when a great decisions being made. Now 255 00:19:23.670 --> 00:19:27.100 that's very vague. I didn't say what they're going to get excited about, did 256 00:19:27.100 --> 00:19:31.680 I? Nope. I don't know. We're exploring something together, right? I didn't say 257 00:19:31.680 --> 00:19:35.100 what points. They're going to get excited. I didn't say what getting 258 00:19:35.100 --> 00:19:39.530 excited. Looks like them too. It looks like for them is that they imagine 259 00:19:39.530 --> 00:19:44.010 themselves in the home. I didn't say it. I said something more clever. I used 260 00:19:44.010 --> 00:19:48.890 what I called unconscious communication words or transports. I said, Find 261 00:19:48.890 --> 00:19:53.530 yourself. What does it mean to find yourself doing something? Did you ever 262 00:19:53.530 --> 00:19:57.510 just find yourself reaching for the refrigerator and you don't even 263 00:19:57.510 --> 00:20:00.420 remember walking up to it? And you don't even remember what it was you 264 00:20:00.420 --> 00:20:04.650 wanted? You're just looking your head in. Do you ever just find yourself 265 00:20:04.650 --> 00:20:09.560 falling in love? Yes, you did. You ever find yourself falling out of love and 266 00:20:09.560 --> 00:20:14.710 thinking, What the heck was I thinking? Sure, I'm sure we all have. So those 267 00:20:14.710 --> 00:20:20.540 kind of automatic subconscious behaviors. When you put in those words, 268 00:20:20.550 --> 00:20:25.100 discover yourself. Find yourself. I call them trance phrases or unconscious 269 00:20:25.100 --> 00:20:29.130 communication words, and they imply something. It's going to take place 270 00:20:29.130 --> 00:20:34.080 automatically. You don't have to make any efforts, and you don't need to 271 00:20:34.090 --> 00:20:38.490 resist because it's going to happen in a way where it's of service to you. 272 00:20:38.500 --> 00:20:42.350 These little things, just simple phrases like this can take what you're 273 00:20:42.350 --> 00:20:47.040 already doing. You don't need to drop your existing cells process and turbo 274 00:20:47.040 --> 00:20:53.710 charge it. What are counter examples? I love counter examples, so counter 275 00:20:53.710 --> 00:21:00.490 examples are a example of the broader category of communication called 276 00:21:00.490 --> 00:21:04.960 pattern interrupt. You see people behave, think, feel and predictable 277 00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:09.580 patterns. When you interrupt that pattern, they become temporarily 278 00:21:09.580 --> 00:21:14.140 suggestible and you can lead them. This is something taken from classical 279 00:21:14.150 --> 00:21:19.630 hypnotherapy. The father of modern hypnotherapy, Dr Milton Erickson would 280 00:21:19.630 --> 00:21:24.220 often do. Pattern interrupts on clients, and during that period that windows 281 00:21:24.220 --> 00:21:28.270 suggest ability. He could suggest new behaviors, so counter examples from my 282 00:21:28.270 --> 00:21:32.870 favorites. Let's say someone says, I need to think it over roleplay with me, 283 00:21:32.870 --> 00:21:39.180 so I'm not so sure. Paul, I need to think it over. Great. I understand, is 284 00:21:39.180 --> 00:21:44.660 it okay if I ask you a question? Sure. Have you ever taken a long time to 285 00:21:44.660 --> 00:21:49.270 think something over? And it still turned out to be the wrong decision I 286 00:21:49.270 --> 00:21:55.010 have. Maybe it's not about time, but about the clarity you need to recognize. 287 00:21:55.020 --> 00:21:59.650 You really do want to move forward. So, thinking about it like that, why don't 288 00:21:59.650 --> 00:22:03.610 we explore together what it is you really need to recognize? Yes, this is 289 00:22:03.610 --> 00:22:08.280 a good choice. So let's go through it. Share your questions with me or your 290 00:22:08.280 --> 00:22:13.070 concerns so we can clear them up. And you can take that step today. You hear 291 00:22:13.070 --> 00:22:17.360 the suggestions? Take that step today, move forward, make a great decision. 292 00:22:18.040 --> 00:22:22.980 Absolutely. And and to me, the most powerful thing was just taking time off 293 00:22:22.980 --> 00:22:28.850 the table. Time is a pat excuse. Exactly, exactly. That's exactly the 294 00:22:28.850 --> 00:22:32.170 advanced training I would give to someone who now decides become my 295 00:22:32.170 --> 00:22:37.980 student. We're reframing it from being about time, which you can't get out of 296 00:22:37.980 --> 00:22:42.480 that into making about clarity. And we're also using the power of 297 00:22:42.480 --> 00:22:46.820 suggestion to logically link once they get the clarity than they will move 298 00:22:46.820 --> 00:22:51.800 forward through the power of suggestion. and oftentimes, by the way, I need more 299 00:22:51.800 --> 00:22:56.140 time. It's a smokescreen because your prospect doesn't want to say I'm too 300 00:22:56.140 --> 00:22:59.790 confused to understand it. That would make them with dump in this world to 301 00:22:59.790 --> 00:23:03.010 themselves, not just to you but to themselves. And they don't want to tell 302 00:23:03.010 --> 00:23:08.890 that story to themselves. Right? So this gives them a way to save face. It 303 00:23:08.900 --> 00:23:13.480 reframes what it's about. And through the clever use of suggestion, it links 304 00:23:13.480 --> 00:23:17.790 getting the clarity to making the decision. I'm telling you, I get I 305 00:23:17.800 --> 00:23:22.320 cannot convey the power of this simply. Do you feel my excitement and my 306 00:23:22.320 --> 00:23:26.910 passion coming through at doing this? Yes. And I see it as well. Yeah, I know. 307 00:23:26.910 --> 00:23:31.360 I love doing this. So I absolutely, transparently to your audience. I I had 308 00:23:31.360 --> 00:23:34.740 a very difficult morning because of things going on with my family. And I 309 00:23:34.740 --> 00:23:39.480 said to you, Don't worry about it. This gives me relief from all of that and 310 00:23:39.480 --> 00:23:43.740 I'll give you a great show. How am I doing so far? Very good. Thank you. 311 00:23:43.750 --> 00:23:47.870 Yeah, I like that call back to the beginning. I can, you know. Yes, it's 312 00:23:47.870 --> 00:23:54.770 great. So neural linguistic programming when I see you know, when I see NLP, I 313 00:23:54.770 --> 00:23:59.400 think of a natural language processing, and I think about computers trying to 314 00:23:59.400 --> 00:24:02.450 understand human language and the subtleties and variants. But of course, 315 00:24:02.460 --> 00:24:07.700 that's not what this is. This is neural linguistic programming, but I don't 316 00:24:07.700 --> 00:24:10.650 know anything about it. Tell me a little bit about it. Cool. Well, 317 00:24:10.650 --> 00:24:15.470 there's an old joke about two rabbis. If you put I'm Jewish, I can say this. 318 00:24:15.470 --> 00:24:19.270 But if you to put two rabbis in the room and ask them a question, you'll 319 00:24:19.270 --> 00:24:24.540 get 50 opinions. So put to an L peers in the room and ask What is NLP? You'll 320 00:24:24.540 --> 00:24:29.760 get 50 opinions. This is only my model, my map having used it for over 32 years 321 00:24:29.760 --> 00:24:35.290 and seeing great results and great results for my clients. NLP is former 322 00:24:35.300 --> 00:24:41.130 foremost about two things. First and foremost, it's a map, a technology for 323 00:24:41.130 --> 00:24:44.750 modeling excellence, for looking at someone who does something, well, 324 00:24:44.760 --> 00:24:48.740 extracting out the different elements of that excellence and then teaching 325 00:24:48.740 --> 00:24:53.830 other people to take it on. The second thing, I believe it is the study of how 326 00:24:53.830 --> 00:24:58.960 language structures, consciousness, shapes, decisions and drives behavior 327 00:24:59.540 --> 00:25:03.960 That's the second thing it's about. And the third thing is, it's a set of 328 00:25:03.970 --> 00:25:08.800 presuppositions about human beings work. It's a map. It's not necessarily true. 329 00:25:08.810 --> 00:25:14.070 For example, one of the pre suppositions of NLP is people do the 330 00:25:14.070 --> 00:25:18.470 best behavior that they have at the time. People always try to do their 331 00:25:18.470 --> 00:25:21.920 best. It's not that there's something wrong with people. Just maybe, their 332 00:25:21.920 --> 00:25:28.370 map of possibilities is off. Or, as I say, they're on autopilot. I have this 333 00:25:28.370 --> 00:25:32.090 teaching that I think is unique to me, that the brain the mind works on 334 00:25:32.090 --> 00:25:37.330 repetition. Familiar, very familiar arid familiarity. Excuse me and 335 00:25:37.330 --> 00:25:42.390 momentum. So when you go to change an area of life that's difficult, your old 336 00:25:42.390 --> 00:25:46.280 patterns are thinking they're going to come up not because you hate yourself 337 00:25:46.280 --> 00:25:50.460 for your this thing called the self sabotage, but simply because they come 338 00:25:50.460 --> 00:25:57.380 up because they have momentum. And so NLP is a recognition of looking at all 339 00:25:57.380 --> 00:26:02.040 these processes and the technology for doing so. And then, finally, there's a 340 00:26:02.040 --> 00:26:06.340 persuasion model of an L. P. How to use these things for influence and 341 00:26:06.340 --> 00:26:12.680 persuasion. And how did you Is this a formal field of study How do you know 342 00:26:12.690 --> 00:26:17.230 how you know? How does this plug into the work that you do? From a practical 343 00:26:17.230 --> 00:26:22.800 standpoint? Well, let me. That's three questions. There's NLP trainings you 344 00:26:22.800 --> 00:26:26.760 can take. I think most of the trainings are pretty much bollocks. My British 345 00:26:26.760 --> 00:26:30.340 friends would say Not that they don't offer useful stuff, but there's what I 346 00:26:30.340 --> 00:26:34.070 call the seminar phenomenon. When someone comes into a seminar, they're 347 00:26:34.070 --> 00:26:37.610 raising their hand and self selecting and saying Yes, yes, I wanted to work 348 00:26:37.610 --> 00:26:42.420 on me. Please let it work on me. I paid my money. I've taken the time out for 349 00:26:42.420 --> 00:26:46.960 travel. I'm getting all the time. This event? Yes, Yes, it's gonna work on me. 350 00:26:46.970 --> 00:26:51.550 But what works in the seminar where people are volunteering and wanted to 351 00:26:51.550 --> 00:26:55.100 work nationally? I mean, it's gonna translate out into the real world 352 00:26:55.110 --> 00:27:00.670 anymore than karate that you practice in a dojo is gonna win a street fight. 353 00:27:01.040 --> 00:27:05.840 So I looked at all of this and I thought, Okay, how can I extract that? 354 00:27:05.840 --> 00:27:11.440 What actually works. So I tested it and tested it in different sales situations, 355 00:27:11.450 --> 00:27:16.460 and I also used to be a dating coach. So I help guys get over their fears, 356 00:27:16.470 --> 00:27:20.170 using it and to communicate in a way that was very attractive. That's not in 357 00:27:20.170 --> 00:27:25.200 my bio, but it's a very unique way, and so that's how I begin to apply it. And 358 00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:30.450 then I began to teach it and found that people from virtually any field at any 359 00:27:30.450 --> 00:27:34.590 point in their sales process, whether they were veterans or newbies or 360 00:27:34.590 --> 00:27:38.160 somewhere in between could really up what they were doing and also make 361 00:27:38.160 --> 00:27:45.910 sales more enjoyable. Look, I think sales can and ought to be joyful. Yeah, 362 00:27:45.910 --> 00:27:49.530 I think when done well, it should be that way. Almost anything that we have 363 00:27:49.530 --> 00:27:54.650 some level of comfort or excitement about, and certainly mastery in general 364 00:27:54.650 --> 00:27:58.610 would give us a little bit of that. And the parallels to dating in sales are 365 00:27:58.610 --> 00:28:03.810 many, I'm sure. Well, you know a date fundamentally as the sale, you've got 366 00:28:03.810 --> 00:28:08.940 to get yourself all ready with confidence. You've got to look for 367 00:28:08.940 --> 00:28:14.310 leads. You've got to set an appointment with the prospect. You've got to get 368 00:28:14.310 --> 00:28:18.980 report, do your process. Forgive me. I don't need to be rude. Close the deal 369 00:28:18.980 --> 00:28:25.190 and then handle objections and handle a lot of notes. Yeah. And discovery and 370 00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:30.430 other decision makers that you may or may not know or even in the sales. Well, 371 00:28:30.430 --> 00:28:33.900 yeah, You just taught me something. Come to think of it. Yes, that's true. 372 00:28:33.910 --> 00:28:38.760 Yeah, right. Well, that her friend is not on board with this idea. You know 373 00:28:38.760 --> 00:28:42.500 that kind of thing? Boy Neural linguistic programming. When you're 374 00:28:42.500 --> 00:28:45.990 working with folks who primarily helping people identify their own 375 00:28:45.990 --> 00:28:53.670 patterns or to recognize them and other people, some of both, both both 376 00:28:53.680 --> 00:28:58.210 absolutely both. I'll do some free coaching here just for the heck of it. 377 00:28:58.210 --> 00:29:01.910 Just to demonstrate my prowess and to brag. One of the things that pretty 378 00:29:01.910 --> 00:29:05.290 much creates instant change and the skin is the power of language. People 379 00:29:05.290 --> 00:29:10.020 come to me and say I just can't close the big money clients. I give them 380 00:29:10.020 --> 00:29:15.660 three magic words to destroy those limiting beliefs. Here they are. You're 381 00:29:15.660 --> 00:29:23.160 ready? Ready out there and podcast land. Up until now, we up until now it was 382 00:29:23.160 --> 00:29:29.190 the case. I didn't have the skills to close the big money clients. It takes 383 00:29:29.200 --> 00:29:33.810 the limitation. It acknowledges that that it was real. So we get report with 384 00:29:33.810 --> 00:29:38.560 the unconscious mind. But it binds it in time. It says it was true up until 385 00:29:38.560 --> 00:29:43.040 this binds it in time, and it also separates it from who you are as a 386 00:29:43.040 --> 00:29:48.060 person. You see, when it comes to changing beliefs, it's relatively easy 387 00:29:48.060 --> 00:29:52.160 to change beliefs about capability, possibility. But changing beliefs about 388 00:29:52.160 --> 00:29:56.200 identity is really difficult, so it's better to just disconnect the whole 389 00:29:56.200 --> 00:30:00.840 thing from your sense of identity in the first place. I love it. It reminds 390 00:30:00.840 --> 00:30:05.340 me of I I I In fact, I just had a nice exchange about this on Linked in. I've 391 00:30:05.340 --> 00:30:09.500 been incorporating into some of the presentations. I give a little passage 392 00:30:09.500 --> 00:30:13.690 on the power of yet because a lot of people, when they come to us again at 393 00:30:13.690 --> 00:30:17.020 Bom Bom will make it easy to record and send video messages. There's something 394 00:30:17.020 --> 00:30:21.530 more challenging for a lot of people to have a recording of the video to send 395 00:30:21.530 --> 00:30:25.000 to someone else or to share to someone else than, say, doing a live back and 396 00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:27.840 forth video like this because they can play it back and judge it and all these 397 00:30:27.840 --> 00:30:32.620 other things. And so I wind up having to do some of this kind of motivational 398 00:30:32.620 --> 00:30:36.680 work that I'm sure you would probably be able to really peel into. But I talk 399 00:30:36.680 --> 00:30:40.840 about the power of yet, and what I'm doing is kin to up until now. But I'm 400 00:30:40.840 --> 00:30:44.090 putting it at the end. It's like, you know, I'm not the kind of person that 401 00:30:44.090 --> 00:30:49.210 records videos and sends them to all of my past clients yet right? Let me 402 00:30:49.210 --> 00:30:55.230 suggest that if you introduce it, if you do your process, but just move it 403 00:30:55.230 --> 00:30:58.810 to the beginning because of them, it reframes the entire conversation rather 404 00:30:58.810 --> 00:31:05.520 than waiting to the end. Correct. It's those little tweaks in an already good 405 00:31:05.520 --> 00:31:10.350 sales process. I mean this I have in my class forward back there, a list of my 406 00:31:10.350 --> 00:31:14.670 ideal clients and one of the things about my ideal clients is they already 407 00:31:14.670 --> 00:31:20.780 have a successful sales process, because I I am the most expensive coach 408 00:31:20.780 --> 00:31:24.710 will ever be glad you worked with. And so I only deal with people who are 409 00:31:24.710 --> 00:31:28.770 already successful, and that means they already have a successful sales process. 410 00:31:28.780 --> 00:31:34.200 But just adding in little tweets like that, you can see you can see how it 411 00:31:34.200 --> 00:31:39.700 makes a profound difference Yeah, Give just give me a little bit of a kind of 412 00:31:39.700 --> 00:31:46.170 Paul Ross at a high level or a historic level. I I can see. Or I get the sense 413 00:31:46.180 --> 00:31:49.850 that you're layering interests and skills on top of one another for 414 00:31:49.850 --> 00:31:53.840 yourself. And then, obviously you've developed skills to teach them to other 415 00:31:53.840 --> 00:31:59.060 people in a in a way that makes sense from coaching people who have issues 416 00:31:59.060 --> 00:32:02.250 that limit them from building relationships with other people to 417 00:32:02.260 --> 00:32:06.050 obviously a sales process, which I would assume probably pays a little bit 418 00:32:06.050 --> 00:32:11.600 more. Maybe because because the R. O I is so much more obvious. Uh, but, you 419 00:32:11.600 --> 00:32:15.020 know, where were you 25 years ago? Like, how did you stack these kinds of 420 00:32:15.020 --> 00:32:18.870 interests? How much of it was personal interest and curiosity? It was much of 421 00:32:18.870 --> 00:32:26.630 it. It was it was both. And here's the funny thing how I first got interested 422 00:32:26.630 --> 00:32:30.470 in applying this to sales. I first started doing this as a dating coach, 423 00:32:30.480 --> 00:32:35.560 and I started to get emails. The people would send me beautiful emails attached, 424 00:32:35.570 --> 00:32:38.990 picturing of their wife or picturing of their first kids and saying, Thank you 425 00:32:38.990 --> 00:32:42.340 so much. You helped me meet the woman of my dreams. I never would have had 426 00:32:42.340 --> 00:32:47.900 the confidence or the communication skills. But then around 2005, I started 427 00:32:47.900 --> 00:32:51.690 to get an email saying, Hey, I'm with my wife, Thank you. She's everything I 428 00:32:51.690 --> 00:32:56.880 ever dreamed of, and I've been using your stuff for selling and it's really 429 00:32:56.880 --> 00:33:01.090 working. So I got I would get these people on the phone, interrogate them 430 00:33:01.100 --> 00:33:05.460 and began to see what they had in comments. So I began to take my first 431 00:33:05.460 --> 00:33:12.480 pops at translating this into into sales, and I get groups of beta testers 432 00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:15.750 together and go out and use this. Go out and use this. Go out and use this 433 00:33:15.750 --> 00:33:21.140 until I began to see really good results for everybody so smart. 434 00:33:21.150 --> 00:33:25.210 Absolutely it does are two things I especially love about it. The first is, 435 00:33:25.220 --> 00:33:30.400 um, that you did customer interviews to to understand more about this trend 436 00:33:30.400 --> 00:33:34.210 that you're identifying, which of course, is the critical to success in 437 00:33:34.210 --> 00:33:37.890 general and specifically to improving the experience you create and deliver 438 00:33:37.890 --> 00:33:41.370 for customers. But then also it harkens back to that question that I asked 439 00:33:41.370 --> 00:33:44.980 awkwardly and apparently used the word versus while I was doing a long set up 440 00:33:44.980 --> 00:33:48.680 to the question of it just validates this idea of to sell as human that 441 00:33:48.680 --> 00:33:52.550 we're all selling and influencing and persuading all of the time. And so I 442 00:33:52.550 --> 00:33:57.530 love that it that you started there and and came into well, believe me. Believe 443 00:33:57.530 --> 00:34:02.890 me, teaching sales is a lot easier than I thought, guys who are 40 years old 444 00:34:02.890 --> 00:34:06.640 and never had a date. So if you think about that, you're really dealing with 445 00:34:06.640 --> 00:34:11.570 some very, very psychological challenges, if not to say Brokenness. 446 00:34:11.580 --> 00:34:16.290 So if I can teach people like that how to reach their dreams, then I can take 447 00:34:16.290 --> 00:34:20.580 people who are already successful. And I already have a good degree of 448 00:34:20.580 --> 00:34:24.260 confidence and really take them to the stratosphere, which is what I love. 449 00:34:24.260 --> 00:34:28.440 It's not that I don't I want to help everyone. I just don't have the time. 450 00:34:28.440 --> 00:34:32.260 It's not financially feasible to help everyone who's anyone can grab the book 451 00:34:32.260 --> 00:34:37.719 subtle words itself. It's 14 bucks 15 bucks on Amazon. Yeah, and then that 452 00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:40.710 speaks a bit to your ideal clients as well. You want to take healthy 453 00:34:40.710 --> 00:34:44.739 situations and make them even better, Better I want to take people who are 454 00:34:44.739 --> 00:34:49.429 stars and make them superstars. It's fantastic. I really appreciate the work 455 00:34:49.429 --> 00:34:52.850 that you're doing. This is really, really interesting. I love it. I want 456 00:34:52.850 --> 00:34:57.139 to go. I want to get at least five more of those 50 definitions of of neural 457 00:34:57.139 --> 00:35:01.460 linguistic programming. Uh, for folks that have enjoyed this conversation, 458 00:35:01.460 --> 00:35:04.780 kind of the some of the themes and topics we've been into. I've got a 459 00:35:04.780 --> 00:35:09.020 couple more episodes of this podcast I know you'll enjoy. Back on Episode 47 460 00:35:09.020 --> 00:35:12.920 with Brian Robinson, who wrote a book called The Selling Formula. We titled 461 00:35:12.920 --> 00:35:16.370 that episode asking better sales questions for greater sales success. 462 00:35:16.370 --> 00:35:22.070 And it was that it wasn't as specifically psychologically oriented, 463 00:35:22.070 --> 00:35:26.460 although certainly his approach to conversation would be kin here. And I 464 00:35:26.460 --> 00:35:30.520 think your your definitions of selling, I think if the two of you connected 465 00:35:30.530 --> 00:35:37.950 would be would be similar as well and episodes. His name's Brian Robinson and, 466 00:35:37.950 --> 00:35:44.080 uh, he he does some teaching, wrote the book selling formula. He also has a VP 467 00:35:44.080 --> 00:35:49.700 of partnerships job at a company called Works Works 24 I think, and then on an 468 00:35:49.710 --> 00:35:54.330 episode 51 Joe Caprio who at the time was VP of sales. Of course, he's now 469 00:35:54.330 --> 00:35:58.520 the co founder of a new software company called Draperies. We call that 470 00:35:58.520 --> 00:36:02.730 how to enable your sales team Practical tips for sales leaders That was more of 471 00:36:02.730 --> 00:36:06.610 a traditional sales enablement conversation. But obviously what we're 472 00:36:06.610 --> 00:36:11.040 talking about here is investing in developing equipping salespeople to be 473 00:36:11.040 --> 00:36:14.640 more effective at what they're trying to do every day. And Paul, I think you 474 00:36:14.640 --> 00:36:19.940 did a very nice job. I love this. I love this. I love this. I wish I could 475 00:36:19.940 --> 00:36:24.930 do this for another couple hours. Cool. Well, OK, just well extended a couple 476 00:36:24.930 --> 00:36:29.850 more minutes. What is something that you you know, something that you wish. 477 00:36:29.850 --> 00:36:33.350 People that are listening at this point there obviously, into the conversation 478 00:36:33.350 --> 00:36:37.200 they're into you and the things that you think and teach because they've 479 00:36:37.200 --> 00:36:40.380 been with us to this point. What is something I haven't asked you that you 480 00:36:40.380 --> 00:36:45.690 generally find that a you enjoy talking about or be people find very helpful or 481 00:36:45.690 --> 00:36:52.220 see people find very provocative any of the a B or C Wow. Something you haven't 482 00:36:52.220 --> 00:36:55.760 shared yet That you would like to. I guess is the is the short take. That's 483 00:36:55.760 --> 00:37:00.660 a really good question. As far as provocative. I am a disruptor. I think 484 00:37:00.660 --> 00:37:10.380 a lot of what I say is provocative. I will example say that if I'm in a group 485 00:37:10.380 --> 00:37:13.600 of people who are pretending about sales and this was back when we could 486 00:37:13.600 --> 00:37:21.460 speak live before the virus hit us all, I would say that it's okay to be very 487 00:37:21.460 --> 00:37:27.110 suggestible and to lead your clients to the decisions that work for them. But I 488 00:37:27.110 --> 00:37:31.370 would really lean on the suggestible part, and I would say to people, If 489 00:37:31.370 --> 00:37:36.400 you're not using suggestion, then you're suggesting that you're not a 490 00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:40.460 good leader, so that kind of confuses people. If you're not using suggestion, 491 00:37:40.460 --> 00:37:44.210 then you're suggesting that you're not a good leader. So I like to confuse 492 00:37:44.210 --> 00:37:47.210 people, and I don't like to confuse people. I like to challenge your way of 493 00:37:47.210 --> 00:37:53.190 thinking by creating paradox again in Paradox series power. When you hear 494 00:37:53.190 --> 00:37:57.230 something that seemingly contradictory, it's a sign that the old paradigm is 495 00:37:57.230 --> 00:38:03.310 falling apart and also you quite diplomatically left out one word that 496 00:38:03.310 --> 00:38:08.110 haven't recovered my plug. And so I like to use Yiddish idiom I was raised 497 00:38:08.120 --> 00:38:12.950 Jewish, and my parents spoke Yiddish at the table, so I often will throw in 498 00:38:12.950 --> 00:38:18.130 colorful metaphors from Yiddish that some people don't want at at their 499 00:38:18.130 --> 00:38:21.890 group trainings or any of the rest of it. I'm not for everybody. I can tell 500 00:38:21.890 --> 00:38:26.990 you that I control my mouth, as you can see. But I would say I'm not for 501 00:38:26.990 --> 00:38:34.440 everybody. Okay, Um, so relationships Paula, our number one core value here. 502 00:38:34.920 --> 00:38:38.860 And so before I let you go and before you tell people where they can connect 503 00:38:38.860 --> 00:38:42.050 with you, learn more about the book. Learn more about subtle words, Excel, 504 00:38:42.050 --> 00:38:45.760 et cetera. I would love to give you the chance to give a thank or mentioned as 505 00:38:45.760 --> 00:38:49.950 someone who's had a positive impact on your life for your career. And were you 506 00:38:49.950 --> 00:38:53.360 to give a mention or a shout out or a nod to a brand or a company that you 507 00:38:53.360 --> 00:38:57.660 really respect or appreciation for the way they deliver for you as a customer? 508 00:38:57.670 --> 00:39:01.120 Well, actually, the person has had the biggest influence on me. I've been very 509 00:39:01.120 --> 00:39:05.130 lucky to have great teachers. Great mentors was my mother. May she rest in 510 00:39:05.130 --> 00:39:08.830 peace. My mother taught me to be an independent thinker, not to be afraid 511 00:39:08.840 --> 00:39:12.830 of offending or disrupting people's other ideas. My mom once said to me 512 00:39:12.920 --> 00:39:16.200 when I was sassing her like eight years old, she shook her finger at me and 513 00:39:16.200 --> 00:39:19.200 said, Listen, kid, if you don't knock it off, you're going to become an 514 00:39:19.200 --> 00:39:23.020 economy class I said, What's that, Mom? He said that someone who goes around 515 00:39:23.020 --> 00:39:26.870 knocking over other people's sacred idols and ideas. I thought, Yes, I want 516 00:39:26.870 --> 00:39:31.360 to be in economy class So my mom had the most. I've had great teachers. I 517 00:39:31.360 --> 00:39:34.540 don't put them down. But my mom really influenced my way of thinking to think 518 00:39:34.540 --> 00:39:39.980 outside the box. What was your second one? A company or a brand that you 519 00:39:39.980 --> 00:39:43.560 really appreciate that you are a customer of, And they do a great job 520 00:39:43.560 --> 00:39:48.410 serving you. I've been using FedEx either as an employee or as an 521 00:39:48.410 --> 00:39:53.790 entrepreneur and business owner. Since 1984 85. FedEx and thousands of 522 00:39:53.790 --> 00:39:57.340 experiences has maybe let me down, and that's when I use one of their 523 00:39:57.340 --> 00:40:02.550 contractors. FedEx Ground FedEx has been absolutely amazing. They still 524 00:40:02.550 --> 00:40:06.230 deliver on their core promise upon which they built their business when it 525 00:40:06.230 --> 00:40:10.040 absolutely, positively has to get there overnight. And they've been great. I 526 00:40:10.040 --> 00:40:15.750 love FedEx. Awesome. I have not heard that one before. And that reliability? 527 00:40:15.760 --> 00:40:19.330 I mean, how many times would you say you've tested the system? Hundreds, 528 00:40:19.330 --> 00:40:22.900 thousands, thousands, thousands. And you? Can you think of one or two 529 00:40:22.900 --> 00:40:27.370 failures in two, maybe three tops? That's that's customer service. Yeah, 530 00:40:27.380 --> 00:40:28.940 and I'm sure they recovered. Well, 531 00:40:30.010 --> 00:40:34.810 I don't recall. I'll tell you the truth. Sure, that's a very, very high success 532 00:40:34.810 --> 00:40:38.180 rate. Paul, this has been awesome. I really enjoyed the conversation very 533 00:40:38.180 --> 00:40:42.440 much. And, uh, and folks are listening at this moment, I know they have as 534 00:40:42.440 --> 00:40:45.680 well. So if they want to take this farther, if they want to connect with 535 00:40:45.680 --> 00:40:49.050 you online or learn more about your work, where would you send people to 536 00:40:49.050 --> 00:40:53.550 follow up? Well, here's what you can do. You can jump if if you already have a 537 00:40:53.550 --> 00:40:57.960 six. And again, I'm just selective. I mean, no disrespect to anybody. If you 538 00:40:57.960 --> 00:41:01.830 already have the successful, like six or even seven for your business, you've 539 00:41:01.830 --> 00:41:05.790 got a sales process that's working. You're already a star. I want to be a 540 00:41:05.790 --> 00:41:09.870 superstar, you can arrange for a discovery call. Here's the thing about 541 00:41:09.870 --> 00:41:13.310 30 to 40% of the time on these calls, I'll just give you one tweak and you 542 00:41:13.310 --> 00:41:17.820 can go off on your merry way. And so I think it has value. Based on that, you 543 00:41:17.820 --> 00:41:23.440 can hear how I'm a good coach just here. So it's easy to do. They run anywhere 544 00:41:23.440 --> 00:41:28.320 from 30 to 45 minutes. Just go to Speaker Paul ross dot com that speaker 545 00:41:28.320 --> 00:41:33.600 Paul ross dot com forward slash discovery Speaker Paul ross dot com 546 00:41:33.600 --> 00:41:37.630 forward slash discovery and we'll jump on and we'll have a look at what you're 547 00:41:37.630 --> 00:41:41.910 doing. And again, oftentimes it's just a couple of tweets and you can be off 548 00:41:41.910 --> 00:41:47.170 on your merry way. Awesome. I will. I will link up your website. I'll link up 549 00:41:47.170 --> 00:41:50.460 the Discovery page for folks who are listening again. We do roundups of 550 00:41:50.460 --> 00:41:54.190 these at bom bom dot com slash podcast. And of course, you can subscribe in 551 00:41:54.190 --> 00:41:57.710 your favorite player. Appreciate you so much for listening. And Paul, I love it 552 00:41:57.720 --> 00:42:01.590 coming and spending some time with us. I love it. Thank you. Thank you. It's 553 00:42:01.590 --> 00:42:05.860 been my great pleasure to be someone who can share together all these things 554 00:42:05.860 --> 00:42:09.970 where you can find yourself making use of them as you move forward today and 555 00:42:09.970 --> 00:42:15.330 into your wonderful future. Up until now, that's something I share with Paul. 556 00:42:15.330 --> 00:42:19.380 Ross had historically done it by tacking the word yet on to the end of a 557 00:42:19.380 --> 00:42:24.450 statement. We need these beliefs in order to stay in a posture of learning 558 00:42:24.450 --> 00:42:28.730 and growth. If you want to learn from more interesting experts like Paul Ross, 559 00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:33.120 check out the customer experience podcast. You can learn more by visiting 560 00:42:33.130 --> 00:42:38.740 bomb bomb dot com slash podcast or by searching the customer experience 561 00:42:38.740 --> 00:42:43.180 podcast in your preferred podcast player. You'll know you've got the 562 00:42:43.180 --> 00:42:48.190 right one when you see the orange tile, the customer experience podcast. My 563 00:42:48.190 --> 00:42:52.300 name is Ethan Butte. I am your host, and I appreciate you so much. Thank you 564 00:42:52.300 --> 00:42:56.430 for listening to the C X Series here on B two b Growth. 565 00:42:57.800 --> 00:43:02.660 Are you on LinkedIn? That's a stupid question. Of course you're on LinkedIn 566 00:43:02.670 --> 00:43:07.160 here. Sweet fish. We've gone all in on the platform. Multiple people from our 567 00:43:07.160 --> 00:43:10.930 team are creating content there. Sometimes it's a funny gift for me 568 00:43:10.940 --> 00:43:15.030 Other times, it's a micro video or a slide deck, and sometimes it's just a 569 00:43:15.030 --> 00:43:19.110 regular old status update that shares their unique point of view on B two B 570 00:43:19.110 --> 00:43:23.330 marketing leadership or their job function. We're posting this content 571 00:43:23.330 --> 00:43:27.630 through their personal profile, not our company page, and it would warm my 572 00:43:27.630 --> 00:43:32.040 heart and soul. If you connected with each of our evangelists, we'll be 573 00:43:32.040 --> 00:43:36.240 adding more down the road. But for now, you should connect with Bill. Read our 574 00:43:36.240 --> 00:43:41.210 CEO, Kelcy Montgomery, our creative director. Dan Sanchez, our director of 575 00:43:41.210 --> 00:43:45.550 audience growth. Logan Lyles, our director of partnerships, and me, James 576 00:43:45.550 --> 00:43:49.150 Carberry. We're having a whole lot of fun on linked in pretty much every 577 00:43:49.150 --> 00:43:54.320 single day, and we'd love for you to be a part of it.