April 4, 2022

The Vital Relationship Between Product and Growth Marketing with Arta Shita

In this episode, Benji talks to Arta Shita, Head of Growth Marketing at Testlio.

Often we discuss the importance of alignment between sales and marketing, but today Arta shines a spotlight on a relationship easily overlooked. The connection between Growth and Product marketing if done well may just unlock a new level of momentum for your organization.

Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:08.160 --> 00:00:13.279 Conversations from the front lines and marketing. This is be to be growth. 2 00:00:16.320 --> 00:00:19.960 Welcome into be to be growth. I'm your host, Benjie Block, and 3 00:00:20.039 --> 00:00:25.719 today I am joined by Arta Sheeta. She is the head of growth marketing 4 00:00:25.760 --> 00:00:29.879 at Teslio. Arta, thank you for joining us here. Thank you, 5 00:00:29.879 --> 00:00:33.399 Benji's so happy to be here. So here is what people should know. 6 00:00:33.439 --> 00:00:37.920 Maybe up top. You have been involved in three startups in six years, 7 00:00:37.960 --> 00:00:42.399 which gives you a really interesting vantage point that I think our audience is going 8 00:00:42.439 --> 00:00:46.280 to be able to learn from and Glean from today. Rattle off those companies 9 00:00:46.280 --> 00:00:51.399 for me real quick. So I started off my first startup job was at 10 00:00:51.439 --> 00:00:55.479 cognitive scale, and Ai Software Startup based out of Austin, Texas. So 11 00:00:55.600 --> 00:00:59.159 was there for a couple of years doing demanjon and mark cops, and then 12 00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:04.359 I moved on to quality. Up until recently they do devops farm situation, 13 00:01:04.640 --> 00:01:08.959 and then I'm now at Teslio. It's almost my two months here and I'm 14 00:01:08.959 --> 00:01:14.000 super excited to be here. Congrat thank you. That is wonderful. Okay, 15 00:01:14.079 --> 00:01:19.560 so in all three really of those experiences over the last six or so 16 00:01:19.680 --> 00:01:25.120 years, you've noticed a relationship that you would say is absolutely vital and should 17 00:01:25.120 --> 00:01:29.760 be strengthened if at all possible. Talk to me about what you've noticed there. 18 00:01:30.159 --> 00:01:33.519 Oh Yeah, now I'm actually seeing a lot more people talk about this, 19 00:01:33.680 --> 00:01:40.040 but one of the most crucial relationships, other than sales obviously for growth 20 00:01:40.079 --> 00:01:45.239 marketing, is that with product marketing. It's like literally Yin and Yang. 21 00:01:45.799 --> 00:01:49.200 So that for sure has been a relationship that I really love to foster. 22 00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:53.959 So let's go rewind real quick. Before this epiphany kind of hits you and 23 00:01:55.000 --> 00:01:59.719 you're like seeing it firsthand, you're going on product and growth. What were 24 00:01:59.799 --> 00:02:04.760 you seeing? I guess that cause the epiphany. What were you operating with? 25 00:02:04.959 --> 00:02:07.920 Like, what was the assumption there before this kind was like, oh, 26 00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:12.120 I need to strengthen this. Yeah, so you know, Hashtag start 27 00:02:12.159 --> 00:02:15.919 up life is a little bit tough because you have very limited resources a lot 28 00:02:15.960 --> 00:02:20.199 of the time. Sometimes start ups are really lucky, but you know, 29 00:02:20.319 --> 00:02:25.080 small teams you have to hit the ground running with a small budget, a 30 00:02:25.159 --> 00:02:30.439 small understanding of what's going on, because you don't have enough budget to really 31 00:02:30.520 --> 00:02:35.520 run sort of marketing experiments. So it was really a forcing function because I 32 00:02:35.520 --> 00:02:40.000 really needed to understand what's our ICP? What do they care about what's our 33 00:02:40.000 --> 00:02:45.680 bar's journey? HMM. We even have content that we can map and all 34 00:02:45.719 --> 00:02:50.120 of these things were like kind of the main kind of like the starting package 35 00:02:50.159 --> 00:02:53.039 that I needed in order to figure out what kind of activities I can, 36 00:02:53.080 --> 00:02:57.560 I can move forward with with my teeny tiny little budget, and that was 37 00:02:57.599 --> 00:03:01.919 crucial because you don't want to waste funny and grow good resources into the wrong 38 00:03:01.960 --> 00:03:07.319 audience. And who knows the right audience product marketing. So what's interesting there 39 00:03:07.400 --> 00:03:12.280 is in startup culture, I can see how it is a forcing function. 40 00:03:12.280 --> 00:03:16.280 You're just going to naturally almost take for granted that relationship because you have to 41 00:03:16.319 --> 00:03:21.960 have it right, like we have things that are but then as you scale 42 00:03:22.000 --> 00:03:23.599 people, I mean in the same way, you're really busy and start up, 43 00:03:23.800 --> 00:03:28.240 you're really busy as you scale to and then it's not that anyone's dropping 44 00:03:28.240 --> 00:03:32.439 the ball, but people just start to get more and more siloed by nature, 45 00:03:32.479 --> 00:03:36.680 I would say, and that's where you started to see this room for 46 00:03:36.719 --> 00:03:40.039 improvement or maybe optimization in the space right. Oh yeah, what were some 47 00:03:40.120 --> 00:03:46.319 of the maybe key benefits that you saw? When that relationship is super tight, 48 00:03:47.080 --> 00:03:53.120 the key benefits are having a partner that can help you and you're testing 49 00:03:53.120 --> 00:03:57.360 and validating. Obviously, you know, product marketing comes with the wealth of 50 00:03:57.400 --> 00:04:00.400 knowledge. They're the ones that are like really out there trying to figure out, 51 00:04:00.520 --> 00:04:03.159 like, what is my target audience? What do they care about? 52 00:04:03.199 --> 00:04:08.000 What are their pain points? What kinds of things are they like reading up 53 00:04:08.039 --> 00:04:12.159 on? What kind of analysts are they going to and things like this. 54 00:04:12.199 --> 00:04:16.800 And if you take that information and you apply it, you also have to 55 00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:21.800 test it over time, and that's where product marketing needs to continue to stay 56 00:04:21.959 --> 00:04:27.279 a sort of like a gut check and you just continue like testing and validating 57 00:04:27.279 --> 00:04:33.519 and optimizing based on what you both are contributing to these campaigns. Hmm, 58 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:38.279 any examples that you can give us, like to just make it drive this 59 00:04:38.319 --> 00:04:43.040 home and make it real practical. Yeah, so I'm actually doing this right 60 00:04:43.079 --> 00:04:49.120 now at test. So we are really trying to figure out our ICP and 61 00:04:49.120 --> 00:04:53.759 we're really trying to figure out like their real pain points, what do they 62 00:04:53.759 --> 00:04:58.720 really care about? And we have a brand new marketing team. It's had 63 00:04:58.759 --> 00:05:01.920 a very big growth in the last few months. It was like a super 64 00:05:01.920 --> 00:05:06.439 small shop and they were doing incredible things like getting as much content out there, 65 00:05:06.639 --> 00:05:12.879 but it was not exactly the right content for the audience. That okay, 66 00:05:12.879 --> 00:05:15.160 we are looking out for. So, instead of, you know, 67 00:05:15.279 --> 00:05:20.680 to keep it sort of like general, instead of creating content for the decision 68 00:05:20.759 --> 00:05:27.160 maker, we were creating content for the practitioner, and that's just a waste 69 00:05:27.199 --> 00:05:30.199 of time and resources right, kind of like what I mentioned earlier. So 70 00:05:30.600 --> 00:05:34.199 right now the growth team is collaborating with a product marketing team and we're trying 71 00:05:34.199 --> 00:05:39.319 to figure out, okay, who are what's our ICP? I keep saying 72 00:05:39.360 --> 00:05:44.079 that, but it's like that's the most important like what do they care about? 73 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:46.360 What are the pain points? How do we provide the solution? What 74 00:05:46.480 --> 00:05:51.040 is the value we provide? And then you also take that one step further 75 00:05:51.079 --> 00:05:54.560 and you try to figure out, like, okay, what language do they 76 00:05:54.639 --> 00:05:59.199 speak in? If you have two campaigns and one is for, let's say, 77 00:05:59.240 --> 00:06:02.240 a VP of and naring and the other is for head of QA, 78 00:06:02.639 --> 00:06:10.000 they could go toward totally different vibes. Maybe they're they have different pain points 79 00:06:10.040 --> 00:06:14.800 they like. Maybe one of them doesn't care if they keep an eye on 80 00:06:14.879 --> 00:06:17.800 cost. Maybe one of them only cares how efficient their team is. So 81 00:06:17.879 --> 00:06:23.000 you have to make sure that you're addressing them correctly, and that's again we're 82 00:06:23.040 --> 00:06:27.639 product marketing comes in. They're like the constant gut check along the way. 83 00:06:27.720 --> 00:06:32.920 So a really like practical example. Right now we are totally restructing our ads. 84 00:06:33.040 --> 00:06:36.319 We're trying to figure out, you know, what kind of copies should 85 00:06:36.319 --> 00:06:41.560 go to, what kind of persona, what kind of then asset should be 86 00:06:41.600 --> 00:06:46.199 aligned to which campaign and which persona, and we do that alongside product marketing. 87 00:06:46.199 --> 00:06:48.000 They are the ones that are creating these assets. They're the ones who 88 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:54.240 best know who the audience is for these assets and who will really get something 89 00:06:54.240 --> 00:06:57.240 out of it. And if it wasn't for that, we would just be 90 00:06:57.519 --> 00:07:03.839 doing ads blindly and very likely bringing the wrong asset to the wrong audience. 91 00:07:04.920 --> 00:07:08.879 Yeah, never good to go like fingers crossed. I hope this works, 92 00:07:08.879 --> 00:07:13.480 and that's why product marketing is so valuable. And Yeah, okay, you 93 00:07:13.519 --> 00:07:16.879 are a good example of this, not just because, I mean, you 94 00:07:16.920 --> 00:07:23.040 present fifty percent of this equation right. The other fifty percent is Jeff, 95 00:07:23.279 --> 00:07:29.199 someone else on your team who has really helped highlight the importance of this relationship, 96 00:07:29.240 --> 00:07:32.879 and you guys being on the same page has again brought this to light 97 00:07:32.959 --> 00:07:35.959 in a fresh way for you which is what got us talking about in the 98 00:07:35.959 --> 00:07:42.120 first place. Talk to me a bit about how that relationship works and I 99 00:07:42.120 --> 00:07:45.959 think we'll be able to glean some things from that specifically. Yeah, totally 100 00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:49.079 so. Jeff is my right hand man. He's the director of product marketing 101 00:07:49.079 --> 00:07:55.759 here at Teslio and we actually work together at quality and internally we were known 102 00:07:55.800 --> 00:08:00.839 as jarktuck because we were just, like I'm telling you, constantly unlock step. 103 00:08:01.560 --> 00:08:05.680 So when it comes to working with Jeff, that's where I really learned 104 00:08:07.439 --> 00:08:11.120 what we can learn from each other. So I mentioned a lot of things 105 00:08:11.160 --> 00:08:16.120 that I got from him. He has, so would gain from our relationship 106 00:08:16.160 --> 00:08:18.680 to I mean, how terrible would it be if I was like the only 107 00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:24.519 one profiting from this partner's a taker, just a taker, but from us 108 00:08:24.600 --> 00:08:28.759 and from our experimenting on what's working and what's not working? He also gets 109 00:08:28.839 --> 00:08:33.639 to understand, like what message is resonating well, what channels are getting the 110 00:08:33.679 --> 00:08:39.240 highest conversions? Are the audiences actually going to these channels? Like, what 111 00:08:39.360 --> 00:08:43.440 does this persona care about versus this persona? Product Marketing isn't as data driven 112 00:08:43.440 --> 00:08:48.039 as growth, right, so he like leans on me to make those analytical 113 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:52.840 decisions. To get to the right audiences and also to like back him up 114 00:08:52.879 --> 00:08:56.279 whenever we spend too much energy on the wrong platforms. I think that's like 115 00:08:56.480 --> 00:09:00.559 huge, because he can say something based on, you know, his own 116 00:09:00.600 --> 00:09:03.559 research and stuff, but if I come in with the data to back that 117 00:09:03.639 --> 00:09:07.120 up, that's like, oh, okay, yeah, you guys are right, 118 00:09:07.120 --> 00:09:11.960 we are spending is in the wrong channel or whatever. And then of 119 00:09:11.960 --> 00:09:16.320 course that testing invalidation. Not only do I gain from that, but he 120 00:09:16.360 --> 00:09:22.840 gains from it because he gets to see data driven sort of like analytics on 121 00:09:22.879 --> 00:09:26.639 what's working, what's not working, what keywords are great, what's resonating, 122 00:09:26.679 --> 00:09:31.240 and that's really important for his team, if I say so myself. If 123 00:09:31.279 --> 00:09:35.960 I say so myself, quoting Jeff, kind of okay, talk me through. 124 00:09:37.039 --> 00:09:39.039 You've had two projects that you've worked on together that I think highlight this 125 00:09:39.159 --> 00:09:43.679 well, in e Book and a Web series. Let spend some time on 126 00:09:43.679 --> 00:09:48.840 each. Will start with the the ebook first. Yeah, so that both 127 00:09:48.879 --> 00:09:54.000 were actually nominated for awards, which was like super exciting. But the Ebox, 128 00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:58.960 I mean that's yeah, that's mainly that's like literally ninety nine point nine 129 00:10:00.000 --> 00:10:05.039 Percent Jeff. He wrote it all. He sort of had like this technical 130 00:10:05.120 --> 00:10:09.919 understanding that I don't have. But how it came to fruition was he and 131 00:10:09.960 --> 00:10:15.039 I were looking over our campaigns together and one one exercise that I love to 132 00:10:15.080 --> 00:10:20.480 do alongside with product marketing, is mapping out of buyers journey and then also 133 00:10:20.559 --> 00:10:26.720 doing content mapping and doing like a content journey and figuring out where our current 134 00:10:26.759 --> 00:10:31.000 existing content pieces lie within that journey. Me that funnel. But it also 135 00:10:31.039 --> 00:10:37.200 helps you figure out what's missing. So within our debops campaign at quality, 136 00:10:37.519 --> 00:10:43.200 this beautiful ebook was missing and we were like if only we had this Ebook, 137 00:10:43.279 --> 00:10:46.720 and Jeff wrote it for us and it was great and it was like 138 00:10:46.879 --> 00:10:54.519 the highest highest converting asset ever literally the history of quality, and it was 139 00:10:54.799 --> 00:10:58.440 a really, really great effort. And then I ended up getting now made 140 00:10:58.519 --> 00:11:03.240 for a word. So it was really cool. That was a great thing 141 00:11:03.279 --> 00:11:09.960 and Jeff wouldn't have created that if it wasn't for us very consciously and thoughtfully 142 00:11:09.960 --> 00:11:13.919 mapping out our needs to support growth. Talk to me a little bit about 143 00:11:15.000 --> 00:11:18.559 that. The meeting the the meeting of the mind where you are mapping out 144 00:11:18.600 --> 00:11:24.240 what's needed and coming to that thought of like that's the ebook. You have 145 00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:28.480 the expertise like what's all involved? People are going to understand content mapping or 146 00:11:28.519 --> 00:11:33.679 a buyer's journey, but it's a little bit different or unique depending on the 147 00:11:33.679 --> 00:11:35.080 company you're in. So talk to me a little bit about that, that 148 00:11:35.159 --> 00:11:41.240 meeting and what's involved in that mapping. Yeah, so it's really important to 149 00:11:41.279 --> 00:11:46.639 go into that meeting prepared on both ends. If you go into that meeting 150 00:11:46.840 --> 00:11:50.639 like not having an understanding of what assets already exists, then you're failing because 151 00:11:50.759 --> 00:11:54.919 that is a huge part. And so, you know, put together a 152 00:11:54.960 --> 00:12:01.360 repository of what assets are there, figure out what assets are good to go 153 00:12:01.440 --> 00:12:05.960 as is, then figure out which assets need like a very light refreshing, 154 00:12:07.120 --> 00:12:11.720 then figure out which assets need a full refresh or get rid of them all 155 00:12:11.759 --> 00:12:16.240 together. So that's step one. Step two is figuring out, okay, 156 00:12:16.279 --> 00:12:22.919 what are our campaigns, what are our personas within these campaigns, and how 157 00:12:22.960 --> 00:12:28.720 do we address these personas right what do they care about? So then that's 158 00:12:28.919 --> 00:12:31.879 you know, it's a lot of mapping involved, a lot of Whiteboarding, 159 00:12:31.960 --> 00:12:37.639 and then you go into okay, this is our persona, what does their 160 00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:41.600 journey look like? How do they hear from us? Are they actively researching 161 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:45.759 or are they sort of waiting for something to fall on their lamb, beautifully 162 00:12:45.759 --> 00:12:50.679 packaged, and then we sort of you, we map out what content pieces 163 00:12:50.759 --> 00:12:56.480 already exist to support the content within that campaign, and that's where you see 164 00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:00.000 like, okay, we have a whole lot of top of the funnel stuff 165 00:13:00.039 --> 00:13:03.480 and we have, weirdly, a lot of bottom of the funnel stuff. 166 00:13:03.480 --> 00:13:09.639 We need something good midfunnel, you know, something that like somebody like of 167 00:13:09.879 --> 00:13:13.200 director would really enjoy reading. And then that's where this book came in. 168 00:13:13.279 --> 00:13:20.200 It was like the missing slot. And so it this was going back to 169 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:24.159 the first step that you were discussing, like you aren't taking okay, we 170 00:13:24.200 --> 00:13:28.720 have all this stuff and we're going to repackage it into an ebook. We're 171 00:13:28.879 --> 00:13:33.399 instead, it's like we of a missing piece and we need something for that. 172 00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:37.519 Yeah, in that case it was definitely a missing piece, and other 173 00:13:37.600 --> 00:13:41.519 cases it was like, okay, we have this really beautiful white paper. 174 00:13:41.559 --> 00:13:43.159 How do we repurpose it? How do we chunk it up? Are there 175 00:13:43.240 --> 00:13:46.440 some blogs we can write about it? Can we make a short little explain 176 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:50.360 or video about it? Can we do a video series episode I'm going to 177 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:54.080 talk about later about it? All of these things that so many people do 178 00:13:54.279 --> 00:14:00.399 very well. Now, I think repurposing content is like a big duh nowadays, 179 00:14:00.399 --> 00:14:03.519 where it really wasn't a few years ago, it's. I'm glad it 180 00:14:03.600 --> 00:14:07.480 is now, right. I've had a couple episodes recently. It does make 181 00:14:07.519 --> 00:14:11.759 sense and I think, yeah, we went down a road where people kind 182 00:14:11.759 --> 00:14:16.879 of straight away from it, and especially right now and how fast things are 183 00:14:16.919 --> 00:14:20.480 moving, it's nice to reinforce the message, reinforce the time that you spent 184 00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:24.200 on that content, but like reinforce it in the minds of those that are 185 00:14:24.200 --> 00:14:28.720 consuming your content go back to it constantly. So I think that's great and 186 00:14:28.799 --> 00:14:33.200 re in in this case, what I'm even taking away from what you're saying 187 00:14:33.519 --> 00:14:39.440 is not on the that side, but instead, okay, you saw missing 188 00:14:39.480 --> 00:14:43.480 piece and when you're going back through old content you have, you're doing this 189 00:14:43.519 --> 00:14:48.440 together cross functionally. You're able to go, okay, where does this fit 190 00:14:48.440 --> 00:14:52.240 in our strategy? And even if you just did this like once a quarter 191 00:14:52.360 --> 00:14:54.240 or a couple times a year, you would start to see like, okay, 192 00:14:54.320 --> 00:14:58.519 here's these missing spaces, we should make more content for that part of 193 00:14:58.559 --> 00:15:03.399 the fun Ye, or that part of our strategy. Yep, one hundred 194 00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:07.279 percent. Okay. So we have talked about the Ebook side, which really 195 00:15:07.720 --> 00:15:11.440 was jeff and you informing some of that, but then when we go to 196 00:15:11.480 --> 00:15:16.840 the web series side, are to that was more you and then jeff bringing 197 00:15:16.879 --> 00:15:22.440 in some some things that would help it. So tell me about the web 198 00:15:22.480 --> 00:15:26.960 series and some of the origins there. Yeah, so this web series, 199 00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:33.120 I'm so passionate about it. So at cognitive scale, there was a way 200 00:15:33.159 --> 00:15:37.879 back in the day, way back a whole sax years ago, there was, 201 00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:45.840 I heard, dire need for video content, and that's where that's really 202 00:15:45.879 --> 00:15:50.720 about, the time that people were starting to get into things like that. 203 00:15:50.399 --> 00:15:58.759 And one day our like the VP of marketing was on a trip and it 204 00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:03.159 was like the perfect time for me to actually like get time to do something 205 00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:06.960 that I want to do, that it meaning to do, and so my 206 00:16:07.240 --> 00:16:11.759 graphic designer and I we got like a twenty dollar tripod from best buy down 207 00:16:11.799 --> 00:16:18.080 the street and we set up my iphone and we started recording an interview with 208 00:16:18.279 --> 00:16:23.720 a really a genius product manager. Her name is Amanda Delamotte. I think 209 00:16:23.720 --> 00:16:27.720 she's at indeed now, but we thought to have the sort of like talk 210 00:16:27.799 --> 00:16:34.039 show where it's kind of like thought leadership be just an opportunity for us to 211 00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:41.039 learn more about the subject and have our audience sort of like tie us in 212 00:16:41.120 --> 00:16:44.200 with being the thought leaders in the space, and we thought that that was 213 00:16:44.320 --> 00:16:48.000 the best way to do it. And so Amanda and I had this interview 214 00:16:48.039 --> 00:16:52.960 and it turned out great and we put it up on Youtube and we put 215 00:16:52.000 --> 00:16:59.080 it out on social and everyone loved it and then we started interviewing more and 216 00:16:59.120 --> 00:17:06.880 more people and then we started interviewing customers and partners and really big, like 217 00:17:07.160 --> 00:17:11.839 super heavy hitters. I'm talking the CEO of Barclay's wealth UK, the CIO 218 00:17:11.000 --> 00:17:19.279 of Jackson national, like literally crazy people on this show and it really helped 219 00:17:19.359 --> 00:17:25.519 in and it's not something that demand Jen would normally do. It's something that 220 00:17:26.119 --> 00:17:30.240 again, it was like this missing piece of content and it was like the 221 00:17:30.279 --> 00:17:33.839 perfect opportunity for us to be the thought leaders in the space and to have 222 00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:41.200 cognitive skills logo alongside the logo of these giants around the world. Right HMM. 223 00:17:41.440 --> 00:17:48.160 Was Great and I've sort of copy pasted that into my roles. So 224 00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:52.799 at quality, at cognit of scale, was called the AI grind and actually 225 00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:57.240 we made it into a podcast back then and that was like super new. 226 00:17:57.359 --> 00:18:03.119 Yeah, podcast, we're odd thing back then, and that's honestly, that's 227 00:18:03.160 --> 00:18:06.880 I think a big part as to why it was industry recognized is because it 228 00:18:06.920 --> 00:18:11.920 was like what is this podcast, like, what the hell, and super 229 00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:15.079 cool. Then we brought it into or I brought it into quality and we 230 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:19.480 called it qualify, like Quality Fyi, and that's where I again worked with 231 00:18:19.599 --> 00:18:26.119 Jeff on this, because a lot devops is hard, man. It's like 232 00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:32.240 really difficult to understand. You know what it even is like, what the 233 00:18:32.279 --> 00:18:34.960 solutions are, what the pain points are? It's a really hard concept and 234 00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:40.960 I needed Jeff to help me figure out what I need to be asking my 235 00:18:41.000 --> 00:18:44.720 guests. Right. So we were having guests on the show and they were 236 00:18:44.799 --> 00:18:48.359 like very technical people and a lot of the times I would be like, 237 00:18:48.440 --> 00:18:51.720 I'm no clue what to talk to these people about and I don't know how 238 00:18:51.759 --> 00:18:56.680 to make file in a node like those really great point. Yeah, sure, 239 00:18:56.839 --> 00:18:59.960 Dude, but definitely helped me. I mean we like prepped a lot 240 00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:03.799 of the Times beforehand and if you watch an episode, maybe you'd know that 241 00:19:03.839 --> 00:19:07.559 I had no idea what I was talking about, but you probably didn't because 242 00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:12.160 it was it was a collaboration and it was a great, great asset. 243 00:19:12.200 --> 00:19:15.279 I mean it's like one of these things. I encourage everyone to do it. 244 00:19:15.279 --> 00:19:19.519 It's one of these things that's like super easy. It's literally free, 245 00:19:19.599 --> 00:19:25.720 aside from like your time and internal resources, to like video edit, and 246 00:19:26.039 --> 00:19:29.720 it's great because you are establishing yourself as a thought leader in the space, 247 00:19:30.559 --> 00:19:34.759 not you personally, not Artashita, but the company that I'm representing right and 248 00:19:34.839 --> 00:19:38.519 so I'm doing it again at Teslio and we're going to potentially, oh my 249 00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:41.200 gosh, it's not even public yet, you're going to get a sneak peak 250 00:19:41.279 --> 00:19:45.160 everybody. How exciting is that? And Nice thinking of calling it the the 251 00:19:45.279 --> 00:19:52.640 Qa qn day. So since we do vally are at Teslio, what we 252 00:19:52.839 --> 00:19:56.720 it'll be really exciting and I'm super thrilled to work with Jeff again on that. 253 00:19:56.279 --> 00:20:03.039 So what would you say, having these two different projects you've worked on 254 00:20:03.119 --> 00:20:10.799 together, like how has the special projects really then reinforced your relationship with Jeff 255 00:20:10.839 --> 00:20:17.759 and the synergy that you need between departments? They reinforced them because we were 256 00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:22.079 continuously collaborating and we were continuously like leaning on each other and and helping each 257 00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:26.599 other and that's really how you strengthen the relationship. What I'm about to say 258 00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:33.160 is like maybe sort of controversial, but I feel like commiseration is great. 259 00:20:33.839 --> 00:20:37.799 It leads to like joint problem solving and that's really how, like Jeff and 260 00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:41.640 I became bffs, as we were just commiserating on, you know, what 261 00:20:41.720 --> 00:20:45.960 things were going wrong or, you know, how we don't have enough XYZ 262 00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:51.480 or whatever, and that really led us to sort of like wait, why 263 00:20:51.480 --> 00:20:56.680 are we just commiserating? Let's like actually solve these problems together and fill any 264 00:20:56.680 --> 00:21:00.839 sort of gaps together. So I think that's great. And then also one 265 00:21:00.880 --> 00:21:06.839 thing that we both do very well is give each other a credit. My 266 00:21:07.039 --> 00:21:14.160 biggest pet peeve is when people do not publicly appreciate the people that help them 267 00:21:14.200 --> 00:21:18.400 in whatever project they're working on. I think that that's like, honestly, 268 00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:22.119 so underrated and a lot of times people don't realize that they're not doing it 269 00:21:22.200 --> 00:21:26.880 because I don't think it's purposeful a lot of the Times. But it really 270 00:21:26.880 --> 00:21:30.759 goes a long way because if you give, you know, public credit to 271 00:21:30.799 --> 00:21:34.960 somebody of on a great project, they're going to want to continue working with 272 00:21:34.960 --> 00:21:40.200 you because now they're motivated they're seeing like, oh, I was a direct 273 00:21:40.240 --> 00:21:44.160 contributor in the success of this project, I should continue working with this person, 274 00:21:44.279 --> 00:21:48.279 and it's like Duh, make people feel good. Hello. So yeah, 275 00:21:48.319 --> 00:21:52.759 that's what I would say. So, with all this kind of in 276 00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:56.400 mind, what you've learned over the last six years, what would you say 277 00:21:56.559 --> 00:22:00.200 to our audience as to maybe how to go about actually strengthening this relationship? 278 00:22:00.279 --> 00:22:04.440 I think you've talked about these working on these projects together. It's great. 279 00:22:04.480 --> 00:22:08.640 Maybe is there some recurring one on ones that the two of you who have 280 00:22:08.720 --> 00:22:12.359 set up or scheduled or anything they're like? What does it look like to 281 00:22:12.480 --> 00:22:18.400 strengthen that relationship? We do have recurring one on once and we call them 282 00:22:18.519 --> 00:22:25.599 Jarta thinks, and everyone will call them that now, like we do, 283 00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:32.240 and we I mean keep it friendly, like just have real conversations, care 284 00:22:32.359 --> 00:22:36.039 about the person. I think a lot of the Times people forget that, 285 00:22:36.119 --> 00:22:41.279 like we're working with fellow humans man, and right now, working from home 286 00:22:41.359 --> 00:22:45.160 especially, is like kind of hard to connect with people. So if you 287 00:22:45.200 --> 00:22:49.440 make an effort to connect with those that you work with more often, you're 288 00:22:49.480 --> 00:22:53.720 going to build that relationship naturally, and I think that's that's really important and 289 00:22:53.759 --> 00:22:57.200 then just, you know, reinforcing what I said a little bit earlier, 290 00:22:57.319 --> 00:23:00.359 is like lean on each other, but make sure to give each other credit, 291 00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:06.799 and that's that's the key I've I love. There's a Henry Ford quote 292 00:23:07.079 --> 00:23:11.279 says coming together is a beginning, keeping together is progress, working together is 293 00:23:11.319 --> 00:23:18.440 success, and having you and jeff work together at multiple companies, obviously that's 294 00:23:18.440 --> 00:23:25.319 a competitive advantage to you guys because you already have that established relationship, but 295 00:23:25.640 --> 00:23:29.240 to our audience I would just encourage. Yeah, I mean most of us 296 00:23:29.240 --> 00:23:34.000 are working remote. It can feel a little odd at first or mechanical to 297 00:23:34.039 --> 00:23:37.880 get the the momentum moving, but to have some of those recurring meetings with 298 00:23:37.880 --> 00:23:45.960 people cross functionally it adds so much to the organization overall and you never know 299 00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:48.839 what types of projects come out of it, what type of content comes out 300 00:23:48.880 --> 00:23:52.599 of it and even just the ideas that are generated in that space. So 301 00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:56.160 I love just man working together is is where so much of the success is 302 00:23:56.160 --> 00:24:00.519 going to come in our organizations and in our marketing teams are to thank you 303 00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:03.920 so much for spending time with us. Thank you anything you want to say 304 00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:07.240 as we start to wrap this thing up, I just want to say have 305 00:24:07.440 --> 00:24:12.599 fun. You guys like be authentic, have fun and continue to be nice. 306 00:24:12.640 --> 00:24:18.119 I think that's the most important thing tbh. This good any ways that 307 00:24:18.160 --> 00:24:22.559 we can connect with you further. So for our audience, if they're is 308 00:24:22.599 --> 00:24:26.759 it linkedin or how can we do that, and then obviously plug the company 309 00:24:26.799 --> 00:24:30.599 as well and what you guys are doing. Yeah, so you can totally 310 00:24:30.599 --> 00:24:34.759 find me on Linkedin. I'm not the most active anymore. I think I'm 311 00:24:34.759 --> 00:24:40.240 gonna probably read that up again. So it's our Tahta a RTA, Sah 312 00:24:40.319 --> 00:24:45.880 I ta, and I'm working at Teslio. We do test management services it. 313 00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:49.000 I've only been here for a little less than two months and I'm already 314 00:24:49.200 --> 00:24:53.720 so thrilled. There's so much promise in this space and we're doing things that 315 00:24:53.759 --> 00:24:57.920 no one else is doing when it comes to software testing. So I'm super 316 00:24:57.920 --> 00:25:02.519 stoked to be here. Fantastic. It's been a pleasure to have you here 317 00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:06.839 with us, Arta, and feel free to stop by any time. Thank 318 00:25:06.880 --> 00:25:21.960 you so much, Bengee. Talk soon. Be Tob growth is brought to 319 00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:23.680 you by the team at sweet fish media. Here at sweet fish, we 320 00:25:23.720 --> 00:25:27.519 produce podcast for some of the most innovative brands in the world and we help 321 00:25:27.599 --> 00:25:33.720 them turn those podcasts to Microvideos linkedin content, blog posts and more. 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