Transcript
WEBVTT
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Conversations from the front lines and marketing. This is be to be growth.
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Welcome into be to be growth.
I'm your host, Benjie Block, and
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today I am joined by Arta Sheeta. She is the head of growth marketing
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at Teslio. Arta, thank you
for joining us here. Thank you,
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Benji's so happy to be here.
So here is what people should know.
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Maybe up top. You have been
involved in three startups in six years,
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which gives you a really interesting vantage
point that I think our audience is going
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to be able to learn from and
Glean from today. Rattle off those companies
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for me real quick. So I
started off my first startup job was at
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cognitive scale, and Ai Software Startup
based out of Austin, Texas. So
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was there for a couple of years
doing demanjon and mark cops, and then
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I moved on to quality. Up
until recently they do devops farm situation,
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and then I'm now at Teslio.
It's almost my two months here and I'm
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super excited to be here. Congrat
thank you. That is wonderful. Okay,
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so in all three really of those
experiences over the last six or so
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years, you've noticed a relationship that
you would say is absolutely vital and should
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be strengthened if at all possible.
Talk to me about what you've noticed there.
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Oh Yeah, now I'm actually seeing
a lot more people talk about this,
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but one of the most crucial relationships, other than sales obviously for growth
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marketing, is that with product marketing. It's like literally Yin and Yang.
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So that for sure has been a
relationship that I really love to foster.
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So let's go rewind real quick.
Before this epiphany kind of hits you and
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you're like seeing it firsthand, you're
going on product and growth. What were
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you seeing? I guess that cause
the epiphany. What were you operating with?
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Like, what was the assumption there
before this kind was like, oh,
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I need to strengthen this. Yeah, so you know, Hashtag start
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up life is a little bit tough
because you have very limited resources a lot
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of the time. Sometimes start ups
are really lucky, but you know,
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small teams you have to hit the
ground running with a small budget, a
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small understanding of what's going on,
because you don't have enough budget to really
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run sort of marketing experiments. So
it was really a forcing function because I
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really needed to understand what's our ICP? What do they care about what's our
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bar's journey? HMM. We even
have content that we can map and all
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of these things were like kind of
the main kind of like the starting package
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that I needed in order to figure
out what kind of activities I can,
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I can move forward with with my
teeny tiny little budget, and that was
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crucial because you don't want to waste
funny and grow good resources into the wrong
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audience. And who knows the right
audience product marketing. So what's interesting there
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is in startup culture, I can
see how it is a forcing function.
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You're just going to naturally almost take
for granted that relationship because you have to
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have it right, like we have
things that are but then as you scale
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people, I mean in the same
way, you're really busy and start up,
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you're really busy as you scale to
and then it's not that anyone's dropping
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the ball, but people just start
to get more and more siloed by nature,
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I would say, and that's where
you started to see this room for
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improvement or maybe optimization in the space
right. Oh yeah, what were some
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of the maybe key benefits that you
saw? When that relationship is super tight,
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the key benefits are having a partner
that can help you and you're testing
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and validating. Obviously, you know, product marketing comes with the wealth of
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knowledge. They're the ones that are
like really out there trying to figure out,
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like, what is my target audience? What do they care about?
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What are their pain points? What
kinds of things are they like reading up
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on? What kind of analysts are
they going to and things like this.
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And if you take that information and
you apply it, you also have to
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test it over time, and that's
where product marketing needs to continue to stay
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a sort of like a gut check
and you just continue like testing and validating
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and optimizing based on what you both
are contributing to these campaigns. Hmm,
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any examples that you can give us, like to just make it drive this
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home and make it real practical.
Yeah, so I'm actually doing this right
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now at test. So we are
really trying to figure out our ICP and
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we're really trying to figure out like
their real pain points, what do they
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really care about? And we have
a brand new marketing team. It's had
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a very big growth in the last
few months. It was like a super
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small shop and they were doing incredible
things like getting as much content out there,
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but it was not exactly the right
content for the audience. That okay,
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we are looking out for. So, instead of, you know,
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to keep it sort of like general, instead of creating content for the decision
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maker, we were creating content for
the practitioner, and that's just a waste
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of time and resources right, kind
of like what I mentioned earlier. So
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right now the growth team is collaborating
with a product marketing team and we're trying
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to figure out, okay, who
are what's our ICP? I keep saying
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that, but it's like that's the
most important like what do they care about?
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What are the pain points? How
do we provide the solution? What
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is the value we provide? And
then you also take that one step further
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and you try to figure out,
like, okay, what language do they
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speak in? If you have two
campaigns and one is for, let's say,
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a VP of and naring and the
other is for head of QA,
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they could go toward totally different vibes. Maybe they're they have different pain points
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they like. Maybe one of them
doesn't care if they keep an eye on
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cost. Maybe one of them only
cares how efficient their team is. So
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you have to make sure that you're
addressing them correctly, and that's again we're
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product marketing comes in. They're like
the constant gut check along the way.
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So a really like practical example.
Right now we are totally restructing our ads.
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We're trying to figure out, you
know, what kind of copies should
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go to, what kind of persona, what kind of then asset should be
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aligned to which campaign and which persona, and we do that alongside product marketing.
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They are the ones that are creating
these assets. They're the ones who
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best know who the audience is for
these assets and who will really get something
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out of it. And if it
wasn't for that, we would just be
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doing ads blindly and very likely bringing
the wrong asset to the wrong audience.
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Yeah, never good to go like
fingers crossed. I hope this works,
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and that's why product marketing is so
valuable. And Yeah, okay, you
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are a good example of this,
not just because, I mean, you
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present fifty percent of this equation right. The other fifty percent is Jeff,
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someone else on your team who has
really helped highlight the importance of this relationship,
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and you guys being on the same
page has again brought this to light
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in a fresh way for you which
is what got us talking about in the
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first place. Talk to me a
bit about how that relationship works and I
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think we'll be able to glean some
things from that specifically. Yeah, totally
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so. Jeff is my right hand
man. He's the director of product marketing
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here at Teslio and we actually work
together at quality and internally we were known
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as jarktuck because we were just,
like I'm telling you, constantly unlock step.
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So when it comes to working with
Jeff, that's where I really learned
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what we can learn from each other. So I mentioned a lot of things
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that I got from him. He
has, so would gain from our relationship
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to I mean, how terrible would
it be if I was like the only
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one profiting from this partner's a taker, just a taker, but from us
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and from our experimenting on what's working
and what's not working? He also gets
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to understand, like what message is
resonating well, what channels are getting the
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highest conversions? Are the audiences actually
going to these channels? Like, what
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does this persona care about versus this
persona? Product Marketing isn't as data driven
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as growth, right, so he
like leans on me to make those analytical
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decisions. To get to the right
audiences and also to like back him up
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whenever we spend too much energy on
the wrong platforms. I think that's like
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huge, because he can say something
based on, you know, his own
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research and stuff, but if I
come in with the data to back that
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up, that's like, oh,
okay, yeah, you guys are right,
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we are spending is in the wrong
channel or whatever. And then of
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course that testing invalidation. Not only
do I gain from that, but he
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gains from it because he gets to
see data driven sort of like analytics on
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what's working, what's not working,
what keywords are great, what's resonating,
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and that's really important for his team, if I say so myself. If
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I say so myself, quoting Jeff, kind of okay, talk me through.
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You've had two projects that you've worked
on together that I think highlight this
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well, in e Book and a
Web series. Let spend some time on
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each. Will start with the the
ebook first. Yeah, so that both
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were actually nominated for awards, which
was like super exciting. But the Ebox,
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I mean that's yeah, that's mainly
that's like literally ninety nine point nine
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Percent Jeff. He wrote it all. He sort of had like this technical
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understanding that I don't have. But
how it came to fruition was he and
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I were looking over our campaigns together
and one one exercise that I love to
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do alongside with product marketing, is
mapping out of buyers journey and then also
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doing content mapping and doing like a
content journey and figuring out where our current
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existing content pieces lie within that journey. Me that funnel. But it also
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helps you figure out what's missing.
So within our debops campaign at quality,
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this beautiful ebook was missing and we
were like if only we had this Ebook,
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and Jeff wrote it for us and
it was great and it was like
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the highest highest converting asset ever literally
the history of quality, and it was
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a really, really great effort.
And then I ended up getting now made
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for a word. So it was
really cool. That was a great thing
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and Jeff wouldn't have created that if
it wasn't for us very consciously and thoughtfully
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mapping out our needs to support growth. Talk to me a little bit about
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that. The meeting the the meeting
of the mind where you are mapping out
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what's needed and coming to that thought
of like that's the ebook. You have
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the expertise like what's all involved?
People are going to understand content mapping or
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a buyer's journey, but it's a
little bit different or unique depending on the
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company you're in. So talk to
me a little bit about that, that
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meeting and what's involved in that mapping. Yeah, so it's really important to
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go into that meeting prepared on both
ends. If you go into that meeting
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like not having an understanding of what
assets already exists, then you're failing because
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that is a huge part. And
so, you know, put together a
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repository of what assets are there,
figure out what assets are good to go
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as is, then figure out which
assets need like a very light refreshing,
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then figure out which assets need a
full refresh or get rid of them all
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together. So that's step one.
Step two is figuring out, okay,
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what are our campaigns, what are
our personas within these campaigns, and how
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do we address these personas right what
do they care about? So then that's
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you know, it's a lot of
mapping involved, a lot of Whiteboarding,
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and then you go into okay,
this is our persona, what does their
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journey look like? How do they
hear from us? Are they actively researching
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or are they sort of waiting for
something to fall on their lamb, beautifully
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packaged, and then we sort of
you, we map out what content pieces
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already exist to support the content within
that campaign, and that's where you see
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like, okay, we have a
whole lot of top of the funnel stuff
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and we have, weirdly, a
lot of bottom of the funnel stuff.
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We need something good midfunnel, you
know, something that like somebody like of
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director would really enjoy reading. And
then that's where this book came in.
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It was like the missing slot.
And so it this was going back to
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the first step that you were discussing, like you aren't taking okay, we
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have all this stuff and we're going
to repackage it into an ebook. We're
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instead, it's like we of a
missing piece and we need something for that.
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Yeah, in that case it was
definitely a missing piece, and other
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cases it was like, okay,
we have this really beautiful white paper.
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How do we repurpose it? How
do we chunk it up? Are there
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some blogs we can write about it? Can we make a short little explain
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or video about it? Can we
do a video series episode I'm going to
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talk about later about it? All
of these things that so many people do
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very well. Now, I think
repurposing content is like a big duh nowadays,
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where it really wasn't a few years
ago, it's. I'm glad it
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is now, right. I've had
a couple episodes recently. It does make
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sense and I think, yeah,
we went down a road where people kind
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of straight away from it, and
especially right now and how fast things are
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moving, it's nice to reinforce the
message, reinforce the time that you spent
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on that content, but like reinforce
it in the minds of those that are
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consuming your content go back to it
constantly. So I think that's great and
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re in in this case, what
I'm even taking away from what you're saying
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is not on the that side,
but instead, okay, you saw missing
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piece and when you're going back through
old content you have, you're doing this
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together cross functionally. You're able to
go, okay, where does this fit
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in our strategy? And even if
you just did this like once a quarter
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or a couple times a year,
you would start to see like, okay,
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here's these missing spaces, we should
make more content for that part of
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the fun Ye, or that part
of our strategy. Yep, one hundred
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percent. Okay. So we have
talked about the Ebook side, which really
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was jeff and you informing some of
that, but then when we go to
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the web series side, are to
that was more you and then jeff bringing
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in some some things that would help
it. So tell me about the web
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series and some of the origins there. Yeah, so this web series,
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I'm so passionate about it. So
at cognitive scale, there was a way
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back in the day, way back
a whole sax years ago, there was,
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I heard, dire need for video
content, and that's where that's really
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about, the time that people were
starting to get into things like that.
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And one day our like the VP
of marketing was on a trip and it
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was like the perfect time for me
to actually like get time to do something
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that I want to do, that
it meaning to do, and so my
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graphic designer and I we got like
a twenty dollar tripod from best buy down
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the street and we set up my
iphone and we started recording an interview with
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a really a genius product manager.
Her name is Amanda Delamotte. I think
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she's at indeed now, but we
thought to have the sort of like talk
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show where it's kind of like thought
leadership be just an opportunity for us to
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learn more about the subject and have
our audience sort of like tie us in
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with being the thought leaders in the
space, and we thought that that was
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the best way to do it.
And so Amanda and I had this interview
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and it turned out great and we
put it up on Youtube and we put
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it out on social and everyone loved
it and then we started interviewing more and
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more people and then we started interviewing
customers and partners and really big, like
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super heavy hitters. I'm talking the
CEO of Barclay's wealth UK, the CIO
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of Jackson national, like literally crazy
people on this show and it really helped
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in and it's not something that demand
Jen would normally do. It's something that
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again, it was like this missing
piece of content and it was like the
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perfect opportunity for us to be the
thought leaders in the space and to have
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cognitive skills logo alongside the logo of
these giants around the world. Right HMM.
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Was Great and I've sort of copy
pasted that into my roles. So
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at quality, at cognit of scale, was called the AI grind and actually
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we made it into a podcast back
then and that was like super new.
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Yeah, podcast, we're odd thing
back then, and that's honestly, that's
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I think a big part as to
why it was industry recognized is because it
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was like what is this podcast,
like, what the hell, and super
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cool. Then we brought it into
or I brought it into quality and we
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called it qualify, like Quality Fyi, and that's where I again worked with
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Jeff on this, because a lot
devops is hard, man. It's like
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really difficult to understand. You know
what it even is like, what the
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solutions are, what the pain points
are? It's a really hard concept and
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I needed Jeff to help me figure
out what I need to be asking my
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guests. Right. So we were
having guests on the show and they were
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like very technical people and a lot
of the times I would be like,
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I'm no clue what to talk to
these people about and I don't know how
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to make file in a node like
those really great point. Yeah, sure,
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Dude, but definitely helped me.
I mean we like prepped a lot
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of the Times beforehand and if you
watch an episode, maybe you'd know that
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I had no idea what I was
talking about, but you probably didn't because
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it was it was a collaboration and
it was a great, great asset.
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I mean it's like one of these
things. I encourage everyone to do it.
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It's one of these things that's like
super easy. It's literally free,
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aside from like your time and internal
resources, to like video edit, and
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it's great because you are establishing yourself
as a thought leader in the space,
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not you personally, not Artashita,
but the company that I'm representing right and
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so I'm doing it again at Teslio
and we're going to potentially, oh my
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gosh, it's not even public yet, you're going to get a sneak peak
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everybody. How exciting is that?
And Nice thinking of calling it the the
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Qa qn day. So since we
do vally are at Teslio, what we
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it'll be really exciting and I'm super
thrilled to work with Jeff again on that.
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So what would you say, having
these two different projects you've worked on
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together, like how has the special
projects really then reinforced your relationship with Jeff
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and the synergy that you need between
departments? They reinforced them because we were
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continuously collaborating and we were continuously like
leaning on each other and and helping each
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other and that's really how you strengthen
the relationship. What I'm about to say
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is like maybe sort of controversial,
but I feel like commiseration is great.
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It leads to like joint problem solving
and that's really how, like Jeff and
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I became bffs, as we were
just commiserating on, you know, what
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things were going wrong or, you
know, how we don't have enough XYZ
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or whatever, and that really led
us to sort of like wait, why
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are we just commiserating? Let's like
actually solve these problems together and fill any
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sort of gaps together. So I
think that's great. And then also one
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thing that we both do very well
is give each other a credit. My
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biggest pet peeve is when people do
not publicly appreciate the people that help them
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in whatever project they're working on.
I think that that's like, honestly,
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so underrated and a lot of times
people don't realize that they're not doing it
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because I don't think it's purposeful a
lot of the Times. But it really
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goes a long way because if you
give, you know, public credit to
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somebody of on a great project,
they're going to want to continue working with
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you because now they're motivated they're seeing
like, oh, I was a direct
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contributor in the success of this project, I should continue working with this person,
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and it's like Duh, make people
feel good. Hello. So yeah,
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that's what I would say. So, with all this kind of in
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mind, what you've learned over the
last six years, what would you say
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to our audience as to maybe how
to go about actually strengthening this relationship?
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I think you've talked about these working
on these projects together. It's great.
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Maybe is there some recurring one on
ones that the two of you who have
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set up or scheduled or anything they're
like? What does it look like to
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strengthen that relationship? We do have
recurring one on once and we call them
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Jarta thinks, and everyone will call
them that now, like we do,
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and we I mean keep it friendly, like just have real conversations, care
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about the person. I think a
lot of the Times people forget that,
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like we're working with fellow humans man, and right now, working from home
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especially, is like kind of hard
to connect with people. So if you
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make an effort to connect with those
that you work with more often, you're
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going to build that relationship naturally,
and I think that's that's really important and
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then just, you know, reinforcing
what I said a little bit earlier,
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is like lean on each other,
but make sure to give each other credit,
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and that's that's the key I've I
love. There's a Henry Ford quote
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says coming together is a beginning,
keeping together is progress, working together is
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success, and having you and jeff
work together at multiple companies, obviously that's
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a competitive advantage to you guys because
you already have that established relationship, but
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to our audience I would just encourage. Yeah, I mean most of us
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are working remote. It can feel
a little odd at first or mechanical to
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get the the momentum moving, but
to have some of those recurring meetings with
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people cross functionally it adds so much
to the organization overall and you never know
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what types of projects come out of
it, what type of content comes out
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of it and even just the ideas
that are generated in that space. So
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I love just man working together is
is where so much of the success is
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going to come in our organizations and
in our marketing teams are to thank you
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so much for spending time with us. Thank you anything you want to say
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as we start to wrap this thing
up, I just want to say have
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fun. You guys like be authentic, have fun and continue to be nice.
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I think that's the most important thing
tbh. This good any ways that
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we can connect with you further.
So for our audience, if they're is
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it linkedin or how can we do
that, and then obviously plug the company
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as well and what you guys are
doing. Yeah, so you can totally
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find me on Linkedin. I'm not
the most active anymore. I think I'm
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gonna probably read that up again.
So it's our Tahta a RTA, Sah
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I ta, and I'm working at
Teslio. We do test management services it.
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I've only been here for a little
less than two months and I'm already
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so thrilled. There's so much promise
in this space and we're doing things that
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no one else is doing when it
comes to software testing. So I'm super
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stoked to be here. Fantastic.
It's been a pleasure to have you here
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with us, Arta, and feel
free to stop by any time. Thank
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you so much, Bengee. Talk
soon. Be Tob growth is brought to
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00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:23.680
you by the team at sweet fish
media. Here at sweet fish, we
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