The Importance of Brand Awareness in Demand Generation

WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.540 --> 00:00:02.740 Yeah, 2 00:00:04.940 --> 00:00:08.210 what's up everybody welcome back to be, to be growth. My name is Leslie crews 3 00:00:08.210 --> 00:00:11.910 here with Swedish media and we are continuing our deep dive into demand 4 00:00:11.910 --> 00:00:15.130 generation. If you're new here, we've spent the entire month of april 5 00:00:15.130 --> 00:00:18.900 focusing on this one topic trying to define what it is, what it's not where 6 00:00:18.900 --> 00:00:21.920 it's headed in the future and what B two B marketers tend to get wrong in 7 00:00:21.920 --> 00:00:27.540 this space. Um I'm so excited today to be joined by Gabriel Ehrlich, founder 8 00:00:27.540 --> 00:00:30.830 of Re Motion Digital, A link and advertising agency. Gabriel thanks so 9 00:00:30.830 --> 00:00:34.650 much for coming onto the show today. Thank you so much for having me. It's 10 00:00:34.660 --> 00:00:38.980 uh it's exciting. I'm a big fan of the show. Yeah, well it's awesome. I love 11 00:00:38.980 --> 00:00:41.590 what you're doing over a promotion and I'm glad you found me and reached out 12 00:00:41.590 --> 00:00:45.670 to me because I think this is going to be really beneficial to our listeners, 13 00:00:45.670 --> 00:00:49.470 so I'm really excited about it. So the first question I ask everyone whenever 14 00:00:49.470 --> 00:00:53.520 they come onto the show for this deep dive is the same because it has so many 15 00:00:53.520 --> 00:00:56.900 different answers and I'm excited to hear your answer. And that is how do 16 00:00:56.900 --> 00:01:01.520 you, in your own words define demand generation and what it is? I think that 17 00:01:01.520 --> 00:01:04.980 one of the reasons why it's kind of hard to pin down what exactly demand 18 00:01:04.980 --> 00:01:09.270 generation is is going to be different things to different stages that would b 19 00:01:09.270 --> 00:01:14.440 to b companies growth cycle, demand generation. If you ask a 10 person uh 20 00:01:14.450 --> 00:01:18.830 startup, If you ask their VP marketing, what demand generation is? It's gonna 21 00:01:18.830 --> 00:01:23.520 be different than if you go to 1000 or 2000 person company That's been around 22 00:01:23.520 --> 00:01:29.250 for 15 years. But to simplify my answer, I'm going to say demand Jin is your 23 00:01:29.250 --> 00:01:35.270 company's growth machine. Uh and by that your brand, your company has x 24 00:01:35.270 --> 00:01:40.600 amount of demand at any given time and demand generations job is to increase 25 00:01:40.600 --> 00:01:46.810 that, right? So let's say you're not doing anything, you know, you ceo calls 26 00:01:46.810 --> 00:01:51.020 CFO calls and says, hey, you know, we're cutting marketing budget by 100%. 27 00:01:51.020 --> 00:01:56.850 There's no marketing budget and whatever you still get at the end of 28 00:01:56.850 --> 00:02:01.240 that, that's that's your demand. That's like natural what people are looking 29 00:02:01.240 --> 00:02:05.540 for. They're looking for your brand, you what you're doing and that's your 30 00:02:05.550 --> 00:02:10.350 demand at any given moment. And demand generations job is to increase that. 31 00:02:10.360 --> 00:02:15.960 And so you do that with, you know, lead generation S Ceo and inbound marketing, 32 00:02:15.960 --> 00:02:21.570 content social and whatever it is that you're doing to actually bring in new 33 00:02:21.580 --> 00:02:26.890 demand new new people who wouldn't have heard of you otherwise. So getting 34 00:02:26.890 --> 00:02:32.230 those leads into the hands of your SD RGB DRS and then sales and closing 35 00:02:32.230 --> 00:02:37.280 deals that just, you know, if you hadn't done that wouldn't be working 36 00:02:37.280 --> 00:02:42.510 with you and that's just on top of an ecosystem of your website, your social 37 00:02:42.510 --> 00:02:47.030 media accounts, your ads, you know, you have all sorts of people working for 38 00:02:47.030 --> 00:02:53.920 your marketing, operations agencies and Sdrs and be DRS and all of that is you 39 00:02:53.930 --> 00:02:58.150 imagine. And so yeah, at the end of the day, imagine is a growth engine, you 40 00:02:58.150 --> 00:03:01.860 put money, resources time in on one end at the other end, you get paying 41 00:03:01.860 --> 00:03:05.990 customers. Yeah, absolutely. And it can be like you were talking about, I mean 42 00:03:05.990 --> 00:03:08.990 it can be really organic to which I think is really interesting. It's it's 43 00:03:08.990 --> 00:03:11.640 not all just about paid because whenever I started this deep dive I 44 00:03:11.640 --> 00:03:15.140 kind of thought demand generation was all like paid social, paid advertising, 45 00:03:15.140 --> 00:03:18.460 but it's really not. I mean it can be a lot of organic as well, which I think 46 00:03:18.460 --> 00:03:21.480 is interesting and that's why linkedin is so popular today because you can 47 00:03:21.480 --> 00:03:27.760 kind of do both there. Yeah, absolutely. I mean the whole organic versus paid, 48 00:03:27.770 --> 00:03:32.660 you know, dynamic. It's an interesting one, but at the end of the day it's all, 49 00:03:32.670 --> 00:03:36.380 it's all marketing and advertising. And if you can, you know, if you can 50 00:03:36.380 --> 00:03:42.280 combine the organic efforts that you're doing with paid and if if that's what's 51 00:03:42.280 --> 00:03:46.550 working for you, you know, I remember I I started working with a client once a 52 00:03:46.550 --> 00:03:52.550 few years ago that had bootstrap, they haven't raised any money and had grown 53 00:03:53.040 --> 00:03:57.850 to their first I think 100 100 customers entirely through Organic 54 00:03:57.860 --> 00:04:03.060 Search us CEO and mostly just through like some pretty technical articles 55 00:04:03.060 --> 00:04:07.010 that the Ceo is writing. You know, they were really passionate about their 56 00:04:07.020 --> 00:04:10.720 product and what they were doing in their space. And, you know, the Ceo and 57 00:04:10.720 --> 00:04:14.940 CTO occasionally would post on the blog, kind of like there documentation, you 58 00:04:14.940 --> 00:04:17.470 know, here's this problem, this is how we solve it here is that problems that 59 00:04:17.470 --> 00:04:21.760 we saw them, it would get, you know, shared widely on social media and in 60 00:04:21.769 --> 00:04:26.330 their, you know, their their little, you know, corner of twitter and their, 61 00:04:26.340 --> 00:04:31.590 you know, whatever ecosystem that was relevant for their industry and that 62 00:04:31.590 --> 00:04:35.960 was where they would be getting most of their customers and the demand generate. 63 00:04:35.960 --> 00:04:39.500 That was whether they realized it. And at the time that was their demand shin 64 00:04:39.510 --> 00:04:46.150 operation uh and taking them and and kind of putting putting fuel on the 65 00:04:46.150 --> 00:04:50.290 fire, you know, in the form of ads, that was sort of the next step that was 66 00:04:50.290 --> 00:04:55.960 scaling it up. But that first, um, you know, the foundation of their dimension 67 00:04:56.340 --> 00:05:00.450 was organic. Absolutely. And I don't think there's, there's necessarily like 68 00:05:00.450 --> 00:05:04.320 a right or wrong one. You know, you need to figure out what is right for 69 00:05:04.320 --> 00:05:09.110 your industry, what is right for the growth rate that you want to achieve if 70 00:05:09.110 --> 00:05:13.640 you're in an industry that, like, I don't know, and I see this quite often, 71 00:05:13.650 --> 00:05:18.990 that is pretty new, but already pretty competitive and your VCS are breathing 72 00:05:18.990 --> 00:05:23.090 down your neck to be, you know, the number one, whatever it is that you're 73 00:05:23.090 --> 00:05:28.060 doing in your space. Yeah. You're gonna throw everything you can getting 74 00:05:28.740 --> 00:05:32.760 getting growth and and that's usually gonna involve a lot of uh advertising. 75 00:05:33.340 --> 00:05:36.720 Absolutely. And that kind of leads me right into my next question. Um I want 76 00:05:36.720 --> 00:05:39.090 to talk about brand awareness a little bit because I know this is something 77 00:05:39.090 --> 00:05:42.690 that you're really passionate about, um and I want to discuss kind of why it's 78 00:05:42.690 --> 00:05:46.580 so important and the demand gen strategy. Yeah, I mean Brandon, this is 79 00:05:46.580 --> 00:05:54.110 funny. I I used to be kind of a brand awareness nay Sayer or sort of a brand 80 00:05:54.110 --> 00:05:59.170 new virus awareness heretic, you know, as a performance marketing agency. I 81 00:05:59.170 --> 00:06:04.400 tend to shy away from things that I can't measure, right. So like when the 82 00:06:04.400 --> 00:06:07.650 client would come to me and say, hey we really want to run this brand awareness 83 00:06:07.650 --> 00:06:12.510 campaign years, you know, here's some money and go promote this blog post. I 84 00:06:12.510 --> 00:06:17.450 would kind of cringe and say really you want to promote a blog post. You know 85 00:06:17.460 --> 00:06:19.060 some people are going to click on it. But 86 00:06:20.140 --> 00:06:22.950 do we really believe that this is actually going to create brand 87 00:06:22.950 --> 00:06:26.030 awareness to really believe that that's going to create more demand for what 88 00:06:26.030 --> 00:06:33.090 we're doing. And I usually try to talk him out of it, but in the last year, so 89 00:06:33.090 --> 00:06:36.280 Lincoln has has come up with some really, really create tools that I 90 00:06:36.280 --> 00:06:41.800 think are fantastic for brand awareness. And the number one, the one that I like 91 00:06:41.800 --> 00:06:48.100 the most is using the video ads to promote. Like you can promote video ads 92 00:06:48.100 --> 00:06:54.500 now linked into, you know, a new audience. Uh and then we target to to 93 00:06:54.500 --> 00:06:58.950 the individuals, to the users that have seen a certain percentage of that video. 94 00:06:58.960 --> 00:07:02.410 And so now you can go and say, okay, well I want to create brand awareness. 95 00:07:02.410 --> 00:07:06.510 I want I want people to be aware of, you know what it is that I do. Instead 96 00:07:06.510 --> 00:07:10.570 of promoting a blog post, let's just put that information into a video, 97 00:07:10.570 --> 00:07:15.750 let's promote the video. And then we can retarget to people who have seen, 98 00:07:15.760 --> 00:07:20.400 you know, 50 of the video, 75 of video, 97 of the video. We can retarget to 99 00:07:20.400 --> 00:07:26.330 those people. And if our theory is correct that getting that message 100 00:07:26.330 --> 00:07:31.390 across to these people will have created some brand awareness that 101 00:07:31.390 --> 00:07:36.910 should, in theory help us get more leads so that audience should perform 102 00:07:36.910 --> 00:07:40.950 better than a completely cold audience and sometimes it works and sometimes it 103 00:07:40.950 --> 00:07:45.400 doesn't. But now we can kind of measure that and actually start capturing the 104 00:07:45.400 --> 00:07:50.140 effectiveness of that, which allows you to improve and maybe test and try 105 00:07:50.140 --> 00:07:53.520 different things. So it's not just, you know, just throwing out blog posts into 106 00:07:53.520 --> 00:07:56.950 the void and you know, kind of crossing your fingers and hope, okay, I hope 107 00:07:56.950 --> 00:08:00.800 this created from some brand awareness actually you can you can measure it and 108 00:08:00.800 --> 00:08:04.160 you can try to improve on that and that's that's where success comes from. 109 00:08:04.940 --> 00:08:08.240 Absolutely. I think that's really interesting. I think it's cool that 110 00:08:08.250 --> 00:08:11.100 video advertising is a new thing because I feel like a lot of times 111 00:08:11.100 --> 00:08:16.000 people are so much more prone to watching a video. I mean personally I'm 112 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:18.620 more prone to watching a video of something than reading something 113 00:08:18.620 --> 00:08:21.700 lengthy and it is good that you can measure that, that is where that 114 00:08:21.700 --> 00:08:26.020 success comes from. And I think that's really interesting. Yeah, absolutely. 115 00:08:26.030 --> 00:08:30.610 So promotion digital specializes in Lincoln advertising for startups. So do 116 00:08:30.610 --> 00:08:33.000 you mind telling me just a little bit more about kind of like what that looks 117 00:08:33.000 --> 00:08:37.750 like, maybe some specific examples that you've worked with clients on? Yeah, 118 00:08:37.760 --> 00:08:42.960 absolutely. So the motion is the company I founded almost five years ago 119 00:08:43.340 --> 00:08:48.210 started off doing all sorts of digital stuff for all sorts of companies and 120 00:08:48.210 --> 00:08:52.040 its e commerce and facebook's and google's and twitter but really ended 121 00:08:52.040 --> 00:08:58.110 up doubling down on linkedin over the years, mainly because I found that that 122 00:08:58.110 --> 00:09:04.310 was where I was able to provide something unique to an industry that 123 00:09:04.310 --> 00:09:09.070 was struggling with that unique thing. And so you know like Lincoln ads for B 124 00:09:09.070 --> 00:09:13.730 two B uh I've always kind of felt is sort of the holy Grail. And by that I 125 00:09:13.730 --> 00:09:18.160 mean you know if we can crack this thing you then that is you know, it 126 00:09:18.170 --> 00:09:24.180 unlocks all of this growth potential for for a lot of companies because 127 00:09:24.190 --> 00:09:29.020 their audiences on linkedin and they are engaged on link then. Whereas you 128 00:09:29.020 --> 00:09:34.060 know if you're doing enterprise software you can't really target 129 00:09:34.070 --> 00:09:40.270 enterprises in a good way on google and on facebook which is you know, much 130 00:09:40.270 --> 00:09:44.350 bigger platforms in terms of the reach but in terms of reaching the right 131 00:09:44.350 --> 00:09:50.260 people in the right cos it's just uh it's a lot more difficult and and so a 132 00:09:50.260 --> 00:09:54.960 lot of companies start reaching out to me early on once we started the company. 133 00:09:55.140 --> 00:09:58.580 Yeah and say hey you know I heard that you're the guy to talk to about Lincoln 134 00:09:58.580 --> 00:10:02.720 ads were struggling here and that's what gave me the opportunity to work 135 00:10:02.720 --> 00:10:07.330 with some incredible, incredible beauty companies here in Israel and Tell V. 136 00:10:07.330 --> 00:10:11.520 But also worldwide that probably wouldn't have given me the time of day 137 00:10:11.530 --> 00:10:16.170 if I was you know just another BtB agency specializing in google and 138 00:10:16.170 --> 00:10:21.340 facebook and have Spot and marcato and so yeah I got a chance to work with 139 00:10:21.340 --> 00:10:26.400 judy at gone and I worked with the guys that walk me just incredible, 140 00:10:26.400 --> 00:10:30.490 incredible stuff you need to be over the years. I worked with monday dot com, 141 00:10:30.490 --> 00:10:33.790 I've worked with a bunch of cybersecurity companies here in Israel 142 00:10:33.790 --> 00:10:38.630 and kind of some devops companies and just really really incredible marketers 143 00:10:38.630 --> 00:10:44.800 and companies and what I've learned over the last few years is number one, 144 00:10:44.810 --> 00:10:48.980 you have to look at linkedin for what it is. It's paid social, it's not 145 00:10:48.980 --> 00:10:53.490 search. And so you know, the big advantage for through running search 146 00:10:53.490 --> 00:10:58.320 ads is that's where the demand exists. You're actually, if you're talking 147 00:10:58.320 --> 00:11:01.680 about the management, right, tying it back to the original question, you can 148 00:11:01.680 --> 00:11:06.530 tap into demand on google, right? Somebody is searching if you're a cyber 149 00:11:06.530 --> 00:11:12.650 security company that specializes in uh let's say vulnerability assessment 150 00:11:13.140 --> 00:11:17.960 platform. Right? And so you can you can run google search ads for people who 151 00:11:17.960 --> 00:11:21.860 are searching for a vulnerability assessment platform and you can run ads 152 00:11:21.860 --> 00:11:25.700 against your competitors and for your brand you're basically harvesting the 153 00:11:25.700 --> 00:11:30.760 existing demand for the category for your product. But what you can do on 154 00:11:30.760 --> 00:11:34.030 linkedin is you can go after the chief information security officers of 155 00:11:34.030 --> 00:11:38.750 Fortune 500 companies if that's your I. C. P. And you can make sure that you 156 00:11:38.750 --> 00:11:41.670 know you get in front of them which is something that you can't really do 157 00:11:41.670 --> 00:11:46.430 anywhere else. But the problem becomes okay so everybody knows okay great. 158 00:11:46.430 --> 00:11:51.790 That's where that's where our guys are. But it's expensive right? The cost per 159 00:11:51.790 --> 00:11:56.370 click is much more expensive than uh than google or facebook or display ads 160 00:11:56.370 --> 00:12:00.370 or youtube or whatever. It works very differently than google and facebook as 161 00:12:00.370 --> 00:12:05.880 well. Which means that a lot of times companies hire campaign managers. BBC 162 00:12:05.880 --> 00:12:10.110 managers with 10 years of experience in google and facebook whatever. And then 163 00:12:10.110 --> 00:12:16.670 they say okay go to Lincoln ads and you know technically it's a similar setup 164 00:12:16.680 --> 00:12:20.580 but it's just a totally different experience and if you don't really know 165 00:12:20.590 --> 00:12:25.490 how to do it right, you're going to end up wasting a lot of money. And so what 166 00:12:25.500 --> 00:12:28.860 ends up happening is not a lot of people actually going specializing. So 167 00:12:28.860 --> 00:12:33.440 then a lot of companies really, really need help in that. And so when we're 168 00:12:33.440 --> 00:12:37.570 working with the startup and we'll work with start ups that are, you know, not 169 00:12:37.580 --> 00:12:43.380 really early stage, usually, you know, kind of after around a or around around, 170 00:12:43.380 --> 00:12:46.380 around be where they're really starting to scale up where they really want to 171 00:12:46.380 --> 00:12:51.500 start getting more and more paying customers. What usually happens is is 172 00:12:51.500 --> 00:12:54.160 they'll come to us and say, okay, we, you know, 173 00:12:55.240 --> 00:12:57.940 we need to figure out length and we need to crack this thing here is, you 174 00:12:57.940 --> 00:13:02.150 know, who's who we think our audiences and then what we usually do is we spend 175 00:13:02.150 --> 00:13:07.240 at least two weeks researching their audience on linkedin. And that's kind 176 00:13:07.240 --> 00:13:11.880 of the fun thing as well as I love to just dig into the client's crn, look at 177 00:13:11.880 --> 00:13:16.070 who they're, who the leads are, who the customers are, who's who's actually 178 00:13:16.070 --> 00:13:19.770 converting, who's becoming an SQL who's becoming an opportunity and then going 179 00:13:19.770 --> 00:13:24.060 and figuring out how well how would be the best possible way for us to reach 180 00:13:24.060 --> 00:13:27.700 these guys don't like them. And that's kind of the fun part because when we 181 00:13:27.700 --> 00:13:31.590 build up those, you know, those audiences, we set that up and then we 182 00:13:31.590 --> 00:13:34.620 figure out what's the right content for each audience, Start running the 183 00:13:34.620 --> 00:13:40.120 campaign, start getting leads. And then the difficult thing happens when when 184 00:13:40.120 --> 00:13:44.220 we have to actually figure out, okay, what's actually getting the sdrs 185 00:13:44.220 --> 00:13:47.960 meetings? How do we actually get these leads to turn into something of 186 00:13:47.960 --> 00:13:53.060 business value for the company? Because ultimately nobody wants leads, nobody 187 00:13:53.060 --> 00:13:58.830 goes to the banquet leads. Uh and nobody can I. P. O. With leads you need 188 00:13:58.830 --> 00:14:02.080 paying customers. And the only way to get that, at least for, you know, an 189 00:14:02.080 --> 00:14:07.560 enterprise sales motion is through meetings, meetings, demos, calls, 190 00:14:07.560 --> 00:14:12.920 whatever it is that you're doing to kind of move move the lead down the 191 00:14:12.920 --> 00:14:17.200 funnel. And so that has proven to be like one of the most difficult things 192 00:14:17.200 --> 00:14:22.010 about what we do because it's not really in our in our hands as much. 193 00:14:22.010 --> 00:14:25.020 Right? We're running the ads running the campaigns were picking the content 194 00:14:25.020 --> 00:14:30.660 work, we're briefing the creative, but we're not actually yes DRS Right? So, 195 00:14:31.040 --> 00:14:37.190 you know, how do you work with the clients sdrs to get them to follow up 196 00:14:37.200 --> 00:14:41.240 in the right way for each type of content. And so there's a lot of that 197 00:14:41.250 --> 00:14:45.910 involved as well. So it's funny, it's very, very different than what I was 198 00:14:45.910 --> 00:14:50.060 doing when I was running, you know, as for for google for facebook and other 199 00:14:50.060 --> 00:14:54.810 stuff because it's just, it's a completely different ball game. Hey, 200 00:14:54.810 --> 00:14:58.270 everybody Logan with Sweet fish here. If you've been listening to the show 201 00:14:58.270 --> 00:15:01.950 for a while, you know, where big proponents of putting out original 202 00:15:01.960 --> 00:15:05.990 organic content on linked in. But one thing that's always been a struggle for 203 00:15:05.990 --> 00:15:10.660 a team like ours is to easily track the reach of that linked in content. That's 204 00:15:10.660 --> 00:15:13.970 why I was really excited when I heard about Shield the other day from a 205 00:15:13.970 --> 00:15:18.500 connection on, you guessed it linked in since our team started using Shield. 206 00:15:18.510 --> 00:15:22.870 I've loved how it's led us easily track and analyze the performance of 207 00:15:22.870 --> 00:15:27.050 Arlington content without having to manually log it ourselves. It 208 00:15:27.060 --> 00:15:30.430 automatically creates reports and generate some dashboards that are 209 00:15:30.430 --> 00:15:34.690 incredibly useful to see things like what contents been performing the best 210 00:15:34.700 --> 00:15:38.180 and what days of the week are we getting the most engagement and our 211 00:15:38.190 --> 00:15:42.200 average views per post. I'd highly suggest you guys check out this tool if 212 00:15:42.200 --> 00:15:46.140 you're putting out content on linked in and if you're not, you should be, it's 213 00:15:46.140 --> 00:15:51.170 been a game changer for us. If you go to shield app dot Ai and check out the 214 00:15:51.170 --> 00:15:56.900 10 day free trial, you can even use our promo code B two B growth to get a 25% 215 00:15:56.900 --> 00:16:02.800 discount again, that's shield app dot Ai And that promo code is B the number 216 00:16:02.800 --> 00:16:09.600 two. The growth. All one word. All right, let's get back to the show. 217 00:16:09.610 --> 00:16:13.820 Great. I love I love how passionate you are about what you're doing and 218 00:16:13.820 --> 00:16:17.360 something that you and I talked about offline was actually how linkedin kind 219 00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:20.100 of tends to humanize business a little bit. So I don't know if you want to 220 00:16:20.100 --> 00:16:23.460 dive into that, but that's something that I found really, really interesting. 221 00:16:23.940 --> 00:16:27.830 Yeah, I mean, I love that aspect of lengthen. I mean it kind of gets a bad 222 00:16:27.830 --> 00:16:32.390 rap because you know, not everybody is super authentic and there's a lot of 223 00:16:32.390 --> 00:16:37.190 kind of, a lot of jargon and a lot of kind of having one cell phone ones back. 224 00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:42.410 But what I love the most about linkedin is that it really does humanize 225 00:16:42.420 --> 00:16:46.140 business right at the end of the day. Yes, there there are company profiles 226 00:16:46.140 --> 00:16:50.540 and there are company, you know, news feeds, but what people are engaging 227 00:16:50.540 --> 00:16:54.410 with our other people and whether that's the ceo of a company or it's the 228 00:16:54.410 --> 00:16:58.220 VP marketing of the company that you want to work for or you like, you can 229 00:16:58.220 --> 00:17:02.230 approach anybody. They might not answer you, but they might. And I've had all 230 00:17:02.230 --> 00:17:05.810 sorts of opportunities come to me just by reaching out to people that I 231 00:17:05.810 --> 00:17:09.010 thought, you know, I would be interested in talking to, they would be 232 00:17:09.010 --> 00:17:13.490 interested in talking to me. I like following companies whose marketing I 233 00:17:13.490 --> 00:17:17.980 like and I get to see what they're doing. Uh it's pretty it's pretty 234 00:17:17.980 --> 00:17:22.680 incredible in that sense and where I think that, you know, the biggest 235 00:17:22.680 --> 00:17:28.020 opportunity lies. And by the way, not just for B2BI think one of the biggest 236 00:17:28.020 --> 00:17:32.310 biggest missed opportunities right now in marketing in general is just getting 237 00:17:32.310 --> 00:17:36.110 more and more of the organization to use linkedin. Because I mean if you 238 00:17:36.110 --> 00:17:40.790 think about it, you know, think about I don't like a bank, right? A bank's 239 00:17:40.790 --> 00:17:47.030 marketing is typically very, you know, non human. And they're always kind of 240 00:17:47.030 --> 00:17:50.010 struggling if you look at like, you know, financial services commercials, 241 00:17:50.010 --> 00:17:54.410 they're always struggling to like humanize their marketing, right? And I 242 00:17:54.410 --> 00:18:02.220 think that having people, having individuals represent their brand on 243 00:18:02.220 --> 00:18:05.170 lengthen and tell, you know what they're doing, what are they, what are 244 00:18:05.170 --> 00:18:08.850 they up to? How are they changing the world or not, or whatever? Like what 245 00:18:08.850 --> 00:18:12.510 are they, what are they getting up to at work? I think that that does so much 246 00:18:12.510 --> 00:18:16.290 more to humanize the brand and create a connection with the brand that you 247 00:18:16.290 --> 00:18:22.180 could do with, you know, with a commercial or or anything else. And the 248 00:18:22.180 --> 00:18:26.910 fact that you can then reach out to people and make a connection on a on a 249 00:18:26.910 --> 00:18:32.690 person to person basis. That's I think that that is an opportunity that is 250 00:18:32.690 --> 00:18:37.880 vastly underutilized right now. I think, you know, we in the B2B space are all 251 00:18:37.880 --> 00:18:42.190 over that, right? But a I know that, you know, that's mostly in the tech 252 00:18:42.190 --> 00:18:47.560 space. I think that even today, you know, a lot of more traditional 253 00:18:47.570 --> 00:18:52.660 companies, b to B companies as well, they're not using lengthen as well as 254 00:18:52.660 --> 00:18:57.230 they could be. And then just just brands, you know, just big brands or 255 00:18:57.240 --> 00:19:01.900 companies that, that have a lot of employees. That's just a huge, huge, 256 00:19:01.900 --> 00:19:07.680 huge opportunity to connect with your customers, with your vendors, with your 257 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:13.170 ecosystem, with your industry. It's uh, huge opportunity. Absolutely, and not 258 00:19:13.170 --> 00:19:16.320 enough people take advantage of that, I feel. And another thing just kind of 259 00:19:16.320 --> 00:19:20.370 circling back to the manager and I feel like I got off on a robert traylor, but 260 00:19:20.380 --> 00:19:25.290 circling back to demand jin, what do you feel like B two B marketers tend to 261 00:19:25.290 --> 00:19:28.780 kind of get wrong in this space? And I think one of the things that you just 262 00:19:28.780 --> 00:19:32.580 talked about is kind of one of them, you know, not, not utilizing that, not 263 00:19:32.580 --> 00:19:37.320 utilizing linkedin enough is definitely one of them. But as far as like I know 264 00:19:37.320 --> 00:19:40.120 you and I talked off line a little bit about customer experience in that 265 00:19:40.130 --> 00:19:44.320 aspect and kind of also like over investing and specific things that 266 00:19:44.320 --> 00:19:46.820 aren't entirely necessary. So I don't know if you wanna dive into that a 267 00:19:46.820 --> 00:19:53.870 little bit. Yeah. So typically when I do an audit for either a new client or 268 00:19:53.870 --> 00:19:57.300 just, you know, sometimes a company will come and say, hey, you know, we're 269 00:19:57.300 --> 00:20:00.430 not sure we, are we doing this right or not. And I'll kind of peek under the 270 00:20:00.430 --> 00:20:05.090 hood and I'll see what's going on. I tend to see a few common mistakes and 271 00:20:05.090 --> 00:20:09.960 it's, it's interesting that the mistakes kind of repeat themselves and 272 00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:14.620 that kind of leads me to believe that there's some, some pretty major quote 273 00:20:14.620 --> 00:20:20.340 unquote best practices that really should be, you know, put to rest. I 274 00:20:20.340 --> 00:20:26.570 think that the first one that I see probably the most often is around, okay, 275 00:20:26.570 --> 00:20:32.240 well you're investing all this money in promoting content and then you're not 276 00:20:32.240 --> 00:20:35.570 really doing anything with the leads that are coming in, right? And this is 277 00:20:35.570 --> 00:20:41.110 something that I really, I see it so often that the company will will, will 278 00:20:41.110 --> 00:20:47.450 invest, I don't know, $10,000 or $50,000 or $100,000 a month in legion 279 00:20:47.450 --> 00:20:52.420 ads on linked in with content. And they'll get, I don't know tens of leads, 280 00:20:52.420 --> 00:20:57.430 hundreds of leads, thousands of leads and basically feed those leads into 281 00:20:57.430 --> 00:21:02.800 hubspot or marcato and then email the hell out of those guys and be surprised 282 00:21:02.800 --> 00:21:08.460 that nothing happens to them. Right. It's just that is by far probably the 283 00:21:08.470 --> 00:21:13.010 most expensive in state that I see companies doing and that I think it's 284 00:21:13.010 --> 00:21:16.810 wrong. It's just not it's not what people want. It's not what your 285 00:21:16.810 --> 00:21:21.170 customers want, it's not what your marketers want. It's sort of a a 286 00:21:21.170 --> 00:21:26.780 Frankenstein of marketing technology, best practices and and vendors and 287 00:21:26.780 --> 00:21:31.110 agencies that have kind of pushed this on people for, I would say 10, 15 years 288 00:21:31.110 --> 00:21:34.660 and it's just it's not working. I don't know if it ever has. I I assume it must 289 00:21:34.660 --> 00:21:39.910 have at some point, but right now I see very, very few companies that, that is 290 00:21:39.910 --> 00:21:44.550 something that is working for them, at least for paid ads leads. The other 291 00:21:44.550 --> 00:21:48.760 thing. And so that kind of ties into the other thing, which is, okay, well, 292 00:21:48.760 --> 00:21:54.960 what should you be doing and that's working with the Sdrs or the BDR is 293 00:21:54.960 --> 00:22:00.090 however, you do that in your company to work the leads in the right way. And by 294 00:22:00.090 --> 00:22:05.270 that, I mean, well, not every lead is created equal and not every asset is 295 00:22:05.270 --> 00:22:12.220 created equal. And to build a kind of dynamic playbook to reach out to leads 296 00:22:12.220 --> 00:22:16.160 in the right way at the right time over, you know, the right cadences and 297 00:22:16.170 --> 00:22:21.020 everybody says that they do this and then you take a look and they don't a 298 00:22:21.020 --> 00:22:26.000 lot don't, most don't, unfortunately, it's sort of, you know, it's what they 299 00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:28.890 all kind of think they should be doing and they believe they should be doing, 300 00:22:28.890 --> 00:22:32.970 but they don't. And what ends up happening is it kind of becomes this 301 00:22:32.970 --> 00:22:37.450 one size fits all thing, and not all leads are going to work for that. I 302 00:22:37.450 --> 00:22:42.370 think the other thing, a lot of marketers are not getting right is sort 303 00:22:42.370 --> 00:22:49.040 of kind of over investing in one thing or another, whether that be, you know, 304 00:22:49.050 --> 00:22:54.990 spending way too much too soon on ads without investing in sales and that I 305 00:22:54.990 --> 00:22:59.760 think is a huge mistake. So if you're getting a lot of leaves and you're not, 306 00:23:00.340 --> 00:23:03.490 you know, you're not investing in the right people to follow up with those 307 00:23:03.490 --> 00:23:07.220 leads, that's a big mistake. But also, I see a lot of companies kind of over 308 00:23:07.220 --> 00:23:13.150 investing in their tech stack way too early on and get the basic stuff right, 309 00:23:13.150 --> 00:23:17.250 right? Get to the point where you're, you know, you're getting leads and you 310 00:23:17.250 --> 00:23:23.850 know how to properly measure and analyze that the relevancy of those 311 00:23:23.850 --> 00:23:27.690 leads, you know, do we like these leads doing not like these leads and then 312 00:23:27.700 --> 00:23:31.710 figure out the right way to measure where, you know how they're moving down 313 00:23:31.710 --> 00:23:36.960 the funnel, which again, like everybody has the tools, everybody has hubspot or 314 00:23:36.960 --> 00:23:43.480 Marcato or Salesforce, but they're not usually set up right, at least not set 315 00:23:43.480 --> 00:23:48.930 up to work with a at scale the management program. And then when that 316 00:23:48.930 --> 00:23:53.450 starts to scale, you really start to see those those leaks in the funnel and 317 00:23:53.450 --> 00:23:58.750 those leaks in the process. Uh so that I think also like just not having the 318 00:23:58.750 --> 00:24:04.390 right, not having set up the processes in the right way. I think another big 319 00:24:04.390 --> 00:24:10.740 thing is just not not investing in the right stuff like the right content. You 320 00:24:10.740 --> 00:24:15.250 need good content. And, you know, I'm also this is also one of those things 321 00:24:15.250 --> 00:24:18.800 that I've, you know, I'm kind of contradicting something that I've said 322 00:24:18.810 --> 00:24:22.330 to people in the past. But yeah, we can promote any contact, like we can 323 00:24:22.330 --> 00:24:29.120 promote a two page solution paper and make it, you know, convert because we 324 00:24:29.120 --> 00:24:33.520 made a really great ad, but that's not a great experience for your lead, 325 00:24:33.530 --> 00:24:37.180 that's not a great, you know, that's not going to create a great brand 326 00:24:37.180 --> 00:24:41.700 experience. Uh so you need to invest in good content and I think that a lot of 327 00:24:41.700 --> 00:24:45.700 people think that they're investing in your content and they're not, they're 328 00:24:45.700 --> 00:24:51.160 spending a lot of money on writers and designers and they're putting out, you 329 00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:56.440 know, an e book every month or so, but they're not actually creating something 330 00:24:56.450 --> 00:25:00.490 that people would actually want to consume. And you mentioned, you know, 331 00:25:00.490 --> 00:25:04.820 hey, I don't really want to read a book, you know? Exactly. I think of myself, I 332 00:25:04.820 --> 00:25:10.940 think of the amount of e books that I have actually read My career as a 333 00:25:10.940 --> 00:25:16.410 marketer, I think it's maybe two or 3 ever, and I think the first two were 334 00:25:16.410 --> 00:25:19.520 probably really, really early on in my career, I was just kind of trying to 335 00:25:19.520 --> 00:25:22.670 figure stuff out and one that like I knew was going to be really, really 336 00:25:22.670 --> 00:25:26.970 good and it was put out by the guys that need to be instituted linkedin. 337 00:25:26.980 --> 00:25:31.950 They have some incredible content and I I printed it out on paper and I took it 338 00:25:31.950 --> 00:25:36.920 with me on a vacation, I just want to have something to read um with me and I 339 00:25:36.920 --> 00:25:40.920 knew that I wanted to read that. I think so few people actually create 340 00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:45.750 content that their audience would be genuinely interested in printing out 341 00:25:45.750 --> 00:25:52.780 and reading and if it's not that good then don't do it or either try to get 342 00:25:52.780 --> 00:25:57.810 it there or figure out another tactic. And, and that's I think another big 343 00:25:57.810 --> 00:26:02.050 thing as well. You know, people assume, okay, well our competitors are doing, 344 00:26:02.240 --> 00:26:06.330 you know, e books, we have to do e books. No, you don't. You need to do 345 00:26:06.330 --> 00:26:11.720 what is right for you at this stage in terms of what your budget is, what your 346 00:26:11.720 --> 00:26:16.700 resources and what is going to get. You have to think about the process that 347 00:26:16.700 --> 00:26:22.690 will get you, not just no, the right asset that you need right now, but if 348 00:26:22.690 --> 00:26:26.400 that worked and you're going to need another one in a month or two months, 349 00:26:26.410 --> 00:26:29.180 what is the process that you need in order to do that? So maybe it's 350 00:26:29.180 --> 00:26:34.140 webinars, maybe it's e books, maybe it's, you know, uh, surveys, but you 351 00:26:34.140 --> 00:26:38.340 know, try to figure out stuff that, that you can repeat at least, you know, 352 00:26:38.350 --> 00:26:42.040 every so often. Otherwise that's not scalable. You're gonna have to reinvent 353 00:26:42.040 --> 00:26:46.200 the wheel every quarter and every quarter your, your CMO or your ceo or 354 00:26:46.200 --> 00:26:48.640 you see if they're going to come and they're gonna be like, hey, you know 355 00:26:48.640 --> 00:26:53.370 what have you done for me lately? And it's gonna be, you know, you're gonna 356 00:26:53.370 --> 00:26:56.780 be stuck, you're not gonna know what to do this quarter because last quarter 357 00:26:56.780 --> 00:26:59.630 you have that great, you know, webinar in this quarter, you don't really know 358 00:26:59.630 --> 00:27:04.040 what to do or each time you're trying to reinvent the wheel, it's, it's kind 359 00:27:04.040 --> 00:27:09.970 of, you're kind of trying to find a hit when you don't have the formula. So try 360 00:27:09.970 --> 00:27:13.840 to find the formula. I guess it's the biggest thing get real. This has been 361 00:27:13.840 --> 00:27:17.590 so insightful to me and I know that our listeners will benefit so much as well, 362 00:27:17.590 --> 00:27:21.370 so thank you so much for coming on the show and um where can people find you 363 00:27:21.370 --> 00:27:24.490 online if they're listening and they're interested in learning more about you 364 00:27:24.490 --> 00:27:29.840 or promotion? Yeah, I mean, naturally you can find me on linkedin if you 365 00:27:29.840 --> 00:27:36.180 search for Gabriel Ehrlich, which is spelled E H R L I C H, but you can also 366 00:27:36.180 --> 00:27:43.710 check out our website, It's free motion R E M O T I O N dot IO or our emotional 367 00:27:43.710 --> 00:27:46.950 Lincoln. Right, well, thank you so much because it's been so insightful. Thanks 368 00:27:46.950 --> 00:27:50.630 again for coming on GDP Growth. Been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much 369 00:27:50.630 --> 00:27:53.350 for having me. Can't wait to hear it. 370 00:27:54.840 --> 00:27:59.930 Okay. Is your buyer at Bdb marketer? If so, you should think about sponsoring 371 00:27:59.930 --> 00:28:04.230 this podcast. BtB Growth gets downloaded over 130,000 times each 372 00:28:04.230 --> 00:28:07.770 month. And our listeners are marketing decision makers. If it sounds 373 00:28:07.770 --> 00:28:13.260 interesting, send Logan and email Logan at Sweet Fish Media dot com.