Scaling One-to-Few and One-to-One Campaigns

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.140 --> 00:00:08.580 Welcome back to baby Growth. I'm Dan Sanchez with sweet Fish Media. And 2 00:00:08.580 --> 00:00:14.700 today I'm joined by Maria Ed Lifson. Who is the global a bm program manager 3 00:00:14.710 --> 00:00:19.320 at I Value. Uh, Maria, I thought I'd kick it off with a fun question. And 4 00:00:19.320 --> 00:00:22.690 that's what was the highlight of your day So far. I know we have, Ah, 5 00:00:22.700 --> 00:00:25.600 substantial time difference and you're at the end of your day and I'm at the 6 00:00:25.600 --> 00:00:29.020 beginning of my day. So what's the best thing that's happened to you today? It 7 00:00:29.020 --> 00:00:33.040 was probably doing a workout with my daughter. It was it was really fun. We 8 00:00:33.040 --> 00:00:38.450 took a break and we waited a mom daughter workout. So that was a new 9 00:00:38.450 --> 00:00:41.730 thing. We tried together, and it it made us laugh. That's awesome. I 10 00:00:41.740 --> 00:00:44.150 haven't done that with my kids since they were little on. They were so 11 00:00:44.150 --> 00:00:47.850 little that they were the bar bell, you know, now they're too big for that. But 12 00:00:48.240 --> 00:00:53.030 that sounds amazing. As you guys knows, you're listening to this episode, we 13 00:00:53.040 --> 00:00:58.990 are still on our deep dive into account based marketing on I brought Maria onto 14 00:00:58.990 --> 00:01:03.160 the show as a case study is someone who's implementing an A B M campaign, 15 00:01:03.160 --> 00:01:07.370 So I as a still kind of a B two b newbie, I'm still learning all these 16 00:01:07.370 --> 00:01:10.630 different B two B strategies. The first one we're diving into is account based 17 00:01:10.630 --> 00:01:14.290 marketing, and I'm so excited to kind of learn that nuances of this I know 18 00:01:14.290 --> 00:01:17.670 Maria has got some new things we've even talked about in the pre interview. 19 00:01:17.670 --> 00:01:23.040 So I'm excited to jump in to this topic with her today and see how she's 20 00:01:23.040 --> 00:01:28.060 killing it with this b two b marketing strategy. So, Maria, I know you 21 00:01:28.060 --> 00:01:32.660 implemented some a B m at your last company, but tell me like starting with 22 00:01:32.670 --> 00:01:36.710 high value, uh, a Z you enter the company and started seeing the need for 23 00:01:36.710 --> 00:01:39.860 what were some of the signs that, you know you need to get started with this 24 00:01:39.860 --> 00:01:44.780 particular B two B strategy? Well, first of all, I shifted from running 25 00:01:44.780 --> 00:01:49.880 one markets running five markets, so that means that I had target accounts 26 00:01:49.880 --> 00:01:54.450 across five different countries. And of course I'm only one person managing all 27 00:01:54.450 --> 00:01:58.970 of these target accounts, So I needed to find a way where I could find the 28 00:01:58.970 --> 00:02:04.260 high potential accounts and that way, I wouldn't, you know, waste my budget a 29 00:02:04.260 --> 00:02:08.560 waste. My resource is so that was the the beginning of it. So it's 30 00:02:08.560 --> 00:02:11.790 interesting. It's kind of like you had the individual need. You're just like, 31 00:02:11.790 --> 00:02:16.350 Hey, there's only so much ground I can cover myself. Yeah, I just need to 32 00:02:16.350 --> 00:02:21.230 figure out a way to reach the best people faster. Exactly. And I'm also in 33 00:02:21.230 --> 00:02:26.750 the B two b business where we sell software, so we have a narrow target 34 00:02:26.750 --> 00:02:32.120 group, as it is, and we also try to find the best value at as a fit for us. 35 00:02:32.130 --> 00:02:36.070 So that narrows the target group down even further. And it means that there 36 00:02:36.070 --> 00:02:40.970 are a lot of accounts that we simply shouldn't focus our time on. So we have 37 00:02:40.970 --> 00:02:46.570 to find a way to identify the right accounts for us. So how do you get a 38 00:02:46.570 --> 00:02:49.820 list? Where do you go to get the list of the accounts to start with? And then 39 00:02:49.820 --> 00:02:54.540 what attributes air using to kind of like trim it down to a very small size? 40 00:02:54.540 --> 00:02:58.660 And what's that small size? See, that's an interesting thing you're raising, 41 00:02:58.660 --> 00:03:03.320 because I think too few people are actually talking about all of the work 42 00:03:03.320 --> 00:03:07.820 that lies behind in a PM account. Ah, lot of people are talking about, you 43 00:03:07.820 --> 00:03:12.590 know, set up the work cadences, contact people three times a day, set up a 44 00:03:12.590 --> 00:03:19.140 system, have a personalized message, but no one is talking about or not. A 45 00:03:19.140 --> 00:03:24.680 lot of people are talking about the huge work that goes into it. For me. 46 00:03:24.680 --> 00:03:29.970 It's been starting by mapping accounts. It's been the very first exercise was 47 00:03:29.970 --> 00:03:35.680 asking myself if I could have my dream knowledge on my target accounts? What 48 00:03:35.680 --> 00:03:40.580 10 questions? Would I have the answer? And not only that, for them to then be 49 00:03:40.580 --> 00:03:44.180 a potential account with me? What would their answers feed to these 10 50 00:03:44.180 --> 00:03:50.120 questions? So it could be, um, are you thinking that your company will have 51 00:03:50.130 --> 00:03:54.510 transactional growth in the future? If the answer is yes, it could be a 52 00:03:54.520 --> 00:03:59.300 potential account for me if the answer is no non potential, of course. But but 53 00:03:59.300 --> 00:04:03.520 doing that and mapping out the criteria that makes it a value fit for us was 54 00:04:03.520 --> 00:04:07.710 the first exercise that we started doing awesome. Where did you get the 55 00:04:07.710 --> 00:04:11.180 information from? Did you go and buy it from a certain source or is it stuff 56 00:04:11.180 --> 00:04:15.860 you already had in to see a company? CRM you started with? Well, it actually 57 00:04:15.860 --> 00:04:20.399 came down setting up a system. We had knowledge around the account store, 58 00:04:20.410 --> 00:04:25.800 many different places. So the first exercise was trying Thio accumulate all 59 00:04:25.800 --> 00:04:30.360 the knowledge and set it up in a system that would show us very methodically 60 00:04:30.740 --> 00:04:36.360 which accounts were the high potential accounts. Other than that, we started 61 00:04:36.360 --> 00:04:41.800 implementing questionnaires in our campaigns. If we did weapon as we would 62 00:04:41.800 --> 00:04:47.430 include the questions sign up forms, we would include the questions online. We 63 00:04:47.430 --> 00:04:50.950 would ask the questions and then some instances we would have third party 64 00:04:50.950 --> 00:04:56.120 vendors actually ask the questions for us and and then build surveys upon it. 65 00:04:56.130 --> 00:04:59.490 Yeah, that's interesting. So it sounds like it's mostly internal sources kind 66 00:04:59.490 --> 00:05:03.300 of all over the company. You kind of gathering together and then using 67 00:05:03.310 --> 00:05:07.880 gathering more information with surveys in a lot of different places. Yeah, the 68 00:05:07.880 --> 00:05:11.260 one thing I'm wrestling with is a market reason. I'm thinking about how 69 00:05:11.260 --> 00:05:13.700 am I going to do this myself? Because it's something we want to do it. Sweet 70 00:05:13.700 --> 00:05:18.350 fish. We've done it to a large degree with podcasting, but something I'm 71 00:05:18.350 --> 00:05:22.150 looking to scale. One thing I think about is like Okay, well, how is this 72 00:05:22.150 --> 00:05:26.190 repeatable? Because you've gone through this process once. Did you go through 73 00:05:26.190 --> 00:05:29.360 the process and you're like, Okay, now I can do the same thing over again 74 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:35.450 Quarterly? Or is it something where you can automate part of this process and 75 00:05:35.450 --> 00:05:40.630 gathering the information now? Well, I can automate part of the process. I 76 00:05:40.640 --> 00:05:44.560 mean, this was the foundation, so of course, we combine it with third party 77 00:05:44.560 --> 00:05:50.150 data and and one party data, First party data. So we have a system that 78 00:05:50.150 --> 00:05:54.960 then ranks the account the way we make it scalable is we see patterns that 79 00:05:54.960 --> 00:06:00.830 score their accounts, and that means we get a ratio. So maybe we'll have 30 80 00:06:00.840 --> 00:06:05.420 accounts the first year. And then in doing our research around the vertical, 81 00:06:05.420 --> 00:06:09.240 the challenge that they have when we see another account coming up, that's 82 00:06:09.240 --> 00:06:13.070 within the same vertical that's experiencing the same challenge. We 83 00:06:13.070 --> 00:06:17.380 have the framework that we can apply, and we have the USPS that we can apply. 84 00:06:17.390 --> 00:06:21.480 And I mean, everything is a training. So when you have the data and people 85 00:06:21.480 --> 00:06:24.890 start acting on it and you get your little conveyor built from the 86 00:06:24.890 --> 00:06:29.640 processes and the alignments. Then people know which part they play in the 87 00:06:29.640 --> 00:06:34.740 conveyor built, and that means it's available, I think. Okay, so you have a 88 00:06:34.740 --> 00:06:38.920 system set up to do this regularly now, and you have the right accounts in 89 00:06:38.920 --> 00:06:42.380 front of you. How many accounts are usually you trying to go after at a 90 00:06:42.380 --> 00:06:45.860 time? Or you trying to go after a lot programmatically and bring them in as 91 00:06:45.860 --> 00:06:50.400 they show, you know, signals that they're ready to buy. What kind of 92 00:06:50.400 --> 00:06:51.360 route do you go from there? 93 00:06:52.740 --> 00:06:56.600 So we haven't automated approach that looks at the programmatic account, so 94 00:06:56.600 --> 00:07:01.190 they will cast the net wide. And then we'll use the data from there. And then 95 00:07:01.190 --> 00:07:06.520 we filter it down thio smaller and smaller segments of accounts. And from 96 00:07:06.520 --> 00:07:11.250 there it's It's a teamwork between sales marketing. Str to to figure out 97 00:07:11.250 --> 00:07:16.340 which ones do we want to go all in on? We have different scoring, so we have 98 00:07:16.340 --> 00:07:20.260 different place that we run for the different scores. So it could be 99 00:07:20.260 --> 00:07:24.700 everything from a one too few campaign where we target some accounts together, 100 00:07:24.710 --> 00:07:29.950 and then the 1 to 1 environment where we built separate landing pages and 101 00:07:29.950 --> 00:07:34.380 separate flows and send gifts and all of this. So that's kind of an 102 00:07:34.380 --> 00:07:38.500 interesting distinction and something that's new to me. In this particular 103 00:07:38.500 --> 00:07:41.800 interview, I keep learning a little nuances of a B M, and you talked about 104 00:07:41.810 --> 00:07:46.510 like a one to many in a 1 to 1 campaign. Can you, for me and for the audience, 105 00:07:46.520 --> 00:07:49.760 tell us like, What's the difference between one too many? Like, what are 106 00:07:49.760 --> 00:07:53.440 some examples of that? And then one toe, one where you're executing? What's an 107 00:07:53.440 --> 00:07:58.570 example of that? Well, within our system, it could be, um, won. Too many 108 00:07:58.570 --> 00:08:02.730 campaign could be within a vertical that we want to target. It could be 109 00:08:02.730 --> 00:08:06.780 accounts that are picked by us and maybe a partner that wants to target 110 00:08:06.780 --> 00:08:12.360 the same accounts. It would be between fall and eight accounts. Typically, you 111 00:08:12.360 --> 00:08:16.890 can do more, I think, but we do between foreign aid accounts together that we 112 00:08:16.890 --> 00:08:22.740 focus on, and then typically they would have the same challenges or the same 113 00:08:22.740 --> 00:08:28.750 kind of system installed so they would have at least a seven or eight of the 114 00:08:28.750 --> 00:08:32.570 same parameters in common, so we could build the campaign from there and then 115 00:08:32.570 --> 00:08:38.080 do minor personalization on it. And then when you follow up on the campaign, 116 00:08:38.090 --> 00:08:43.390 you then become personalized toe a higher degree. And then we have the 1 117 00:08:43.390 --> 00:08:48.200 to 1 campaigns where we use a lot of time building a campaign for specific 118 00:08:48.200 --> 00:08:53.160 company, addressing their specific pain points and tailoring an entire universe 119 00:08:53.160 --> 00:08:57.270 just to them simply because we believe that we can add a lot of value to their 120 00:08:57.270 --> 00:09:01.640 company and vice versa. Okay, so let me see if I understand this, right? You 121 00:09:01.640 --> 00:09:05.790 know, one too many campaign. If I were targeting, let's say hospitals, I'd be 122 00:09:05.800 --> 00:09:10.660 targeting hospitals. Maybe I narrow it down the biggest hospitals within the 123 00:09:10.660 --> 00:09:14.460 top 10% of hospitals. One too many campaign might look like me doing a 124 00:09:14.460 --> 00:09:18.760 direct mail campaign and maybe gifts, and it might be personalizing it with, 125 00:09:18.760 --> 00:09:22.110 like, their name and hospital name and stuff. But really, it's kind of the 126 00:09:22.110 --> 00:09:26.820 same collateral I'm sending thio. Everybody is much and is personalized. 127 00:09:26.820 --> 00:09:31.030 But the difference in a 1 to 1 campaign, I think out one hospital I know exactly 128 00:09:31.030 --> 00:09:34.260 who that contact is, and I find them on Twitter and I find them on LinkedIn. I 129 00:09:34.260 --> 00:09:39.370 find out they're a fan of a specific sports team, and I'm sending them gifts 130 00:09:39.370 --> 00:09:42.390 about that sports team. Right? That would be a difference between a one to 131 00:09:42.390 --> 00:09:46.460 many, versus a 1 to 1 is I'm customizing it to the fullest degree 132 00:09:46.460 --> 00:09:50.270 that I can for that one individual or maybe multiple individuals within the 133 00:09:50.270 --> 00:09:54.360 one account. Is that is that kind of idea? Yeah, that's that's perfectly 134 00:09:54.360 --> 00:09:58.330 explained. I mean, in the ones. If you, of course, you would also have a 135 00:09:58.330 --> 00:10:02.070 personalized solution to their exact challenge. And that way your research 136 00:10:02.070 --> 00:10:07.460 would be about the challenge itself. It is a with 1 to 18 p. M. But it's also 137 00:10:07.460 --> 00:10:13.370 around the organizational set up of the account. It's about the people who were 138 00:10:13.370 --> 00:10:19.040 there. It's, um, instead of having the 4 to 18 accounts, you have 4 to 18 139 00:10:19.040 --> 00:10:23.300 people. You might be working on that account. That's so good. I often think 140 00:10:23.300 --> 00:10:26.290 about, like, just job hunting, right? We all know, like if you're gonna be a 141 00:10:26.290 --> 00:10:30.870 successful job hunter, it's better to take the approach of the one the one 142 00:10:30.870 --> 00:10:34.660 right 55 companies that you really wanna work for and create essentially 143 00:10:34.660 --> 00:10:37.970 campaigns for each one of those companies knowing that that's gonna 144 00:10:37.970 --> 00:10:42.310 lead the more success than spraying and praying. But, you know, sending out 145 00:10:42.310 --> 00:10:45.660 your resume to a few 100 different companies is just not gonna work well, 146 00:10:45.940 --> 00:10:49.640 so it's kind of like that, But for business here, Yeah, yeah, And in my 147 00:10:49.640 --> 00:10:53.280 opinion, I mean, nobody's I don't I think like the environment is also 148 00:10:53.280 --> 00:10:59.920 changing. So the GDP are restrictions and and Google moving away third party 149 00:10:59.930 --> 00:11:05.330 cookies. It also makes it a lot more difficult to actually do this spray and 150 00:11:05.330 --> 00:11:08.770 pray because you have your email database. What are you going to do when 151 00:11:08.770 --> 00:11:12.360 that grows old and stale? If you don't have new emails, you can buy them. 152 00:11:12.840 --> 00:11:18.440 Quality is, you know, maybe not the best. Always you can. You can be lucky. 153 00:11:18.450 --> 00:11:24.060 I'm not a fan of buying contact, as you can probably tell, but it's beginning 154 00:11:24.060 --> 00:11:29.540 to to get harder and harder. Thio drive other kinds of campaigns and now you 155 00:11:29.540 --> 00:11:33.900 have the option with them companies like siendo, so where you can send 156 00:11:33.900 --> 00:11:38.300 gifts to send the gift you actually collect the GDP are compliant. Home 157 00:11:38.300 --> 00:11:43.620 address. It makes a lot of sense. I'm kind of with you and not buying contact 158 00:11:43.620 --> 00:11:47.760 records in order to spam them, you know, and just mass mail them because that 159 00:11:47.770 --> 00:11:51.100 wouldn't work here. Whatever email provider using is going to kick you out 160 00:11:51.100 --> 00:11:55.370 for that. I'm sure there's some that don't, but I am a fan of buying some 161 00:11:55.370 --> 00:11:59.060 list just to narrow down your target. So you understand what the accounts are 162 00:11:59.440 --> 00:12:02.180 like. Even recently, I discovered crunch base, and I'm sure everybody 163 00:12:02.180 --> 00:12:05.820 listening, like do the crunch bases old days. And I'm like for a B two c market. 164 00:12:05.820 --> 00:12:09.510 And I'm like what? I could go and buy a whole list and then use the parameters 165 00:12:09.510 --> 00:12:13.420 to narrow it down to the top 100. Not that I would go on email them, but I'm 166 00:12:13.420 --> 00:12:18.020 like, Well, I could start following them on LinkedIn and engaging with 167 00:12:18.020 --> 00:12:21.050 their content may be sending them an invite to come be a guest on this 168 00:12:21.050 --> 00:12:26.220 podcast. That's not spammy, but it certainly gives me a head start versus 169 00:12:26.230 --> 00:12:29.850 our database. Probably only 30,000 contacts and like there's probably more 170 00:12:30.340 --> 00:12:34.110 that I'm still trying to figure out how to get new people onto our contact 171 00:12:34.110 --> 00:12:37.890 lists because I don't have the fancy software that shows me buying signals 172 00:12:37.890 --> 00:12:41.250 and indicates what they're searching. I don't know how people do that, but 173 00:12:41.260 --> 00:12:45.230 apparently that's what a terminus and demand base. And what's the other one? 174 00:12:45.230 --> 00:12:48.380 Six cents? They all do that. Do you use one of those, By the way, like one of 175 00:12:48.380 --> 00:12:53.870 those big a BM software packages? Which one we dio? I don't know if I'm allowed 176 00:12:53.870 --> 00:12:57.290 to tell you what you wanted. To be honest, like that's cool. That's cool. 177 00:12:57.300 --> 00:13:01.380 But you use one of them, uh, something You do use that software, and I 178 00:13:01.380 --> 00:13:04.720 understand like there's a big difference in being B to C and P two p. 179 00:13:04.720 --> 00:13:09.300 So narrowing found your field would be much more difficult. B to C. I would 180 00:13:09.300 --> 00:13:13.000 imagine. Yeah, I feel like I struck gold moving from B to C, where you 181 00:13:13.000 --> 00:13:16.030 literally don't know anything about the target audience. That's why we use 182 00:13:16.030 --> 00:13:20.370 personas a lot B to C. But in b two b, I'm like, Oh my gosh, there's so much 183 00:13:20.370 --> 00:13:24.720 more information. This is amazing like I literally confined the name and the 184 00:13:24.720 --> 00:13:28.850 email and maybe the phone number of the exact person that I know needs to make 185 00:13:28.850 --> 00:13:34.160 the decision that just changes the game. But I can give you want you can. If you 186 00:13:34.160 --> 00:13:39.580 don't have the demand base or whatever system you're using, you can sit up in 187 00:13:39.580 --> 00:13:43.760 a PM report on LinkedIn. Now, really, that's cool. I have I have another 188 00:13:43.760 --> 00:13:47.110 interview coming up with LinkedIn so I'll probably dive into deep into that 189 00:13:47.110 --> 00:13:50.750 with her. Yeah, coming up. It will prioritize your accounts for you. So 190 00:13:50.750 --> 00:13:54.570 you will be able to see, like, how many people within one account from all of 191 00:13:54.570 --> 00:13:58.920 the activities you're doing on victim and then it will raise your accounts 192 00:13:58.920 --> 00:14:02.680 for you so you don't have to do that job. That's amazing. We use hub spot, 193 00:14:02.680 --> 00:14:05.390 so I'm like, I know those integrate, So I'm gonna I'm still looking into how 194 00:14:05.390 --> 00:14:08.980 those work Hence the syriza I'm It's a learning Siri's and I'm on a journey to 195 00:14:08.980 --> 00:14:13.990 figure out how this all goes. So you're doing programmatic your trickling down 196 00:14:13.990 --> 00:14:17.910 accounts to try to figure out and where you're working hand in hand with sales 197 00:14:17.910 --> 00:14:22.250 to figure out which ones are worth following up with on the 1 to 1 198 00:14:22.250 --> 00:14:26.700 approach. Okay, so what is the cadence? The exact cadence of these? You 199 00:14:26.700 --> 00:14:29.210 probably have different place for this order. Some of the place for this one. 200 00:14:29.210 --> 00:14:33.210 The one approach and what signifies doing different plays is a different 201 00:14:33.210 --> 00:14:37.520 markets or different ways. That they came, came down the funnel. That 202 00:14:37.520 --> 00:14:41.810 signifies a different play. But we like, of course, the different way they came 203 00:14:41.810 --> 00:14:46.720 down into the funnel. We will score in different ways, so we will find out. Is 204 00:14:46.720 --> 00:14:50.960 it more important for us that somebody has been two hours on our page? Or is 205 00:14:50.960 --> 00:14:54.160 it more important that they've downloaded an asset and then we'll give 206 00:14:54.160 --> 00:15:00.250 them a grade if you want to? And then we have that combined with our final 207 00:15:00.250 --> 00:15:05.630 stages, where you can see Oh, is it a magazine qualified lead that we got in? 208 00:15:05.630 --> 00:15:11.040 Is it a sales qualified lead? How have they been rated? And it's the 209 00:15:11.040 --> 00:15:16.030 combination of those. So if you have a nurture lead, of course, what will step 210 00:15:16.030 --> 00:15:22.020 in would be an account based nurture program on dedications that goes with 211 00:15:22.020 --> 00:15:26.940 that. If It's a marketing qualified lead, but they have very, very high 212 00:15:26.940 --> 00:15:32.420 schools on both first party, third party intent data and the actions that 213 00:15:32.420 --> 00:15:38.190 we see them take recently. Then we'll we'll put them into the pile of people, 214 00:15:38.190 --> 00:15:42.300 will go. Okay, Maybe we have to have a one to many approach on this one. Maybe 215 00:15:42.300 --> 00:15:47.110 we have to have a personalized 1 to 1 and the personalized once one could be 216 00:15:47.110 --> 00:15:51.540 anything from the universe where we have the landing pages is also setting 217 00:15:51.540 --> 00:15:57.710 up a conversational flow with our S Diaz or a ES and me helping them to 218 00:15:57.720 --> 00:16:01.330 design a journey. That's kind of interesting. So essentially, you have 219 00:16:01.330 --> 00:16:04.600 to react to what's coming down. You know, stuff comes down, you're like 220 00:16:04.600 --> 00:16:08.170 Okay, well, we have this group of leads, some of these air oneto one Looks like 221 00:16:08.180 --> 00:16:11.420 we have some trends in this one. Well, that's just gonna have to be a one to 222 00:16:11.420 --> 00:16:15.410 many. So you're essentially your timeto react toe. What's coming from your your 223 00:16:15.410 --> 00:16:19.410 programmatic work? That right? You know, that's why the process and the set up 224 00:16:19.410 --> 00:16:23.600 and the system is so important because everyone needs to know their place If 225 00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:28.120 you have to execute fast. I mean, I could plan ahead from some of the data 226 00:16:28.120 --> 00:16:33.380 that we have that we want to do a 1 to 1 campaign on some, and I will. But if 227 00:16:33.380 --> 00:16:37.270 we have something coming in that shows intent now, then we need to get it 228 00:16:37.280 --> 00:16:42.190 launched. Now that makes a lot of sense. What has been some of the learnings 229 00:16:42.190 --> 00:16:46.110 you've had working with sales? That's some of the hard things, some of the 230 00:16:46.120 --> 00:16:49.720 things you've learned and have overcome that you would want to share with 231 00:16:49.720 --> 00:16:51.150 someone who's just getting into it now. 232 00:16:52.340 --> 00:16:58.650 I mean, the first thing you have to be able to establish is that sales and 233 00:16:58.650 --> 00:17:02.740 marketing are lined, and I know everyone will say this, but it means 234 00:17:02.740 --> 00:17:08.260 that we are equal stakeholders and we are equal participants in conversations, 235 00:17:08.260 --> 00:17:14.440 and we feed in both data but also opinion on an equal basis. Also, the 236 00:17:14.440 --> 00:17:18.910 alignment that we are, in fact shifting from a quantitative approach to a 237 00:17:18.910 --> 00:17:24.329 qualitative approach. Everyone needs to agree on this. E don't agree on this. 238 00:17:24.329 --> 00:17:30.600 It's gonna be the old marketing sales fight like because this is a long, long 239 00:17:30.600 --> 00:17:35.420 game. It's not a short game, and there will be times when your sales guys will 240 00:17:35.420 --> 00:17:41.310 be like the funnel is not big enough. But if it's qualified enough, then it's 241 00:17:41.310 --> 00:17:46.680 good. Yeah, and do you find that there, like, in a word, complaining often that 242 00:17:46.680 --> 00:17:50.170 there's not enough leads to call? Or do you find it's the other way around like 243 00:17:50.170 --> 00:17:54.110 they have too many? Well, it comes in waves. I mean, I'm lucky I have a 244 00:17:54.110 --> 00:18:00.860 fantastic sales team and they open and they are supporting the BM approach. I 245 00:18:00.860 --> 00:18:05.720 mean, during Covert 19, which has been going on as we all know. Of course, 246 00:18:05.720 --> 00:18:11.080 there's been some push out since, um, delays. And and during those sort of 247 00:18:11.080 --> 00:18:16.920 waves, of course, they'll be like we want somewhere to work on, because it's 248 00:18:16.920 --> 00:18:22.530 frustrating. But then all of a sudden cove, it was the thing that we had to 249 00:18:22.530 --> 00:18:29.010 get used to and a huge wave rolled back. So one thing that's always been kind of 250 00:18:29.020 --> 00:18:34.290 a difficulty with marketing, at least for me, is that I never felt like I 251 00:18:34.290 --> 00:18:39.310 could satisfy sales. There was either not enough Lietz even playing the 252 00:18:39.310 --> 00:18:42.870 quantity game. It's like there's not enough fleets. We called them all. 253 00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:46.590 Whether they called them on time or not is a different question, right? Or if I 254 00:18:46.590 --> 00:18:49.560 did provide enough leads, they were just never high enough. Quality leads. 255 00:18:49.570 --> 00:18:52.240 They're drowning in Leeds and they're not converting right because they have 256 00:18:52.240 --> 00:18:57.380 too many weeks now, Would you say the A B M addresses addresses that it fixes 257 00:18:57.380 --> 00:19:01.910 that to some degree? It does because it moves the conversation beyond the 258 00:19:01.910 --> 00:19:07.410 funnel. I mean, all of a sudden when you're allowing marketing to talk about 259 00:19:07.420 --> 00:19:11.940 the strategy in a different way, and you're also allowing them to have 260 00:19:11.940 --> 00:19:18.340 strategic insight into the market into the market coverage addressable market 261 00:19:18.350 --> 00:19:23.590 into the challenges into everything that makes up the challenges we want to 262 00:19:23.590 --> 00:19:28.090 solve this marketeers, it means that we're able to talk about the market in 263 00:19:28.090 --> 00:19:34.490 a different way. And I think ultimately the sales guys don't really care if the 264 00:19:34.490 --> 00:19:38.550 funnel is low. If I understand the market will enough and and can build a 265 00:19:38.550 --> 00:19:42.200 plan to change that, are they more involved with you on making marketing 266 00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:47.660 decisions? As a result of this? They are. They helped me build the campaigns 267 00:19:47.660 --> 00:19:52.220 they helped me establish in partnerships the partners helped me 268 00:19:52.220 --> 00:19:58.580 with my content. They all educate me in their fields of expertise, and it is a 269 00:19:58.580 --> 00:20:03.290 heavy software business that I'm in. And I will admit When I graduated from 270 00:20:03.290 --> 00:20:08.230 my communication and design study, I was not thinking that I should go into 271 00:20:08.230 --> 00:20:13.600 financial software, and I have no idea what the software could do and couldn't 272 00:20:13.600 --> 00:20:19.440 do. But they educate me every day and they help me, and they fully invested 273 00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:24.250 in me becoming a partner that can can leverage their knowledge to build a bit 274 00:20:24.250 --> 00:20:27.800 of pipeline for them. So that's one of my favorite parts about marketing is 275 00:20:27.800 --> 00:20:32.020 you get a chance to learn so many different things, and industries never 276 00:20:32.020 --> 00:20:35.040 really gets born. There's always something new to learn marketing. And 277 00:20:35.050 --> 00:20:37.870 if learning new industries wasn't enough for you, it's kind of like, Well, 278 00:20:37.870 --> 00:20:40.470 the technology is always changing studies. I was always There's always 279 00:20:40.470 --> 00:20:44.250 something new to learn. Another book to read. It is interesting that sales 280 00:20:44.250 --> 00:20:47.350 essentially helps you design the marketing campaigns, and I wonder, Do 281 00:20:47.350 --> 00:20:51.420 you spend a lot of time helping them design their sales campaigns and some 282 00:20:51.420 --> 00:20:55.880 of their scripts to collaborate with them? A lot on the sales process. I do. 283 00:20:55.880 --> 00:21:00.600 I think mostly what I I take care of in that sense is because they're all very 284 00:21:00.600 --> 00:21:05.450 professional. It's have we thought about the flow? Will we gate on gate 285 00:21:05.450 --> 00:21:10.580 the asset? How do we track this? So they have a very good understanding of 286 00:21:10.590 --> 00:21:15.490 what message needs to be served, when and why and how. But I make sure that 287 00:21:15.490 --> 00:21:20.350 all of the framework is in place and that nothing falls through two chairs. 288 00:21:20.350 --> 00:21:26.270 And in that sense, it's also like if I built as my sales guys, can you build a 289 00:21:26.270 --> 00:21:32.700 landing page? They'd be like, Hmm. So me doing all of the data and helping 290 00:21:32.700 --> 00:21:37.590 them with the landing page is helping them to capture the data. That's my 291 00:21:37.590 --> 00:21:42.190 most important job. A fantastic How are you measuring success as you work on 292 00:21:42.190 --> 00:21:45.990 these campaigns like, what is sales looking at? To know that you're 293 00:21:45.990 --> 00:21:49.100 successful, What is what are you looking at? The make sure sales is 294 00:21:49.100 --> 00:21:53.890 successful. It's been a learning curve. I mean, we've had a couple of different 295 00:21:53.890 --> 00:21:58.380 one toe ones campaigns now, and of course, we're looking at the content 296 00:21:58.390 --> 00:22:02.610 build up where we've had contact white space. So if we've needed new context 297 00:22:02.610 --> 00:22:06.590 within an account, then we've looked at the contact build up from this campaign. 298 00:22:06.600 --> 00:22:13.080 It could also be number of new visitors online, people searching for us. And, 299 00:22:13.090 --> 00:22:17.480 of course, in the follow up process, my STRS and A is a heavily involved, so it 300 00:22:17.480 --> 00:22:21.910 will also be responses back. And I think one of the first campaigns we 301 00:22:21.910 --> 00:22:26.390 launched it took six months and then we had the target account in the pipeline. 302 00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:29.870 So that was a huge success, and it shows you that you could do it. But I 303 00:22:29.870 --> 00:22:33.990 think you need Thio. You need to monitor it always and change it up 304 00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:38.940 always. So sometimes it might not be successful, but in this case definitely 305 00:22:38.940 --> 00:22:43.950 was. And one last question I have for you is that as I evaluate account based 306 00:22:43.950 --> 00:22:47.550 marketing and I'm reading books and I'm learning, it sounds like a very 307 00:22:47.560 --> 00:22:53.420 expensive endeavor to get started with, just to get an idea like, how much time 308 00:22:53.420 --> 00:22:57.440 did it take to get to this system that you're in now? And I'm sure it's not 309 00:22:57.440 --> 00:23:00.160 done like there's probably still new phases you're trying to implement, but 310 00:23:00.160 --> 00:23:03.300 to get to where you're at now. Like, how much time would it take to 311 00:23:03.310 --> 00:23:06.660 implement roughly for a company that hasn't done any of this yet, and about 312 00:23:06.660 --> 00:23:10.850 how much money does it cost? Like five figures, six figures. This is a seven 313 00:23:10.850 --> 00:23:14.790 figure like implementation. I'm sure it's very different for different 314 00:23:14.790 --> 00:23:17.940 companies, but I'm just trying to get a feel for like, what? Does this actually 315 00:23:17.940 --> 00:23:23.050 take to pull off? Yeah, I guess it depends on the set up for me. It took 316 00:23:23.840 --> 00:23:28.250 10 months approximately to build up to where we could launch our Thursday PM 317 00:23:28.250 --> 00:23:32.700 campaign. Then from that, of course, making sure that the process and the 318 00:23:32.700 --> 00:23:37.600 campaigns was scalable, I would be able to launch one very personalized like 319 00:23:37.600 --> 00:23:43.330 every month and then do smaller campaigns quite regularly again, 320 00:23:43.340 --> 00:23:47.890 depending on what the dates that would show us. Eso. That's one thing when we 321 00:23:47.890 --> 00:23:52.050 talk about the pricing, it's been difficult because, of course, we had 322 00:23:52.440 --> 00:23:58.370 Cem global tools that were available to US expensive tools as well. But I would 323 00:23:58.370 --> 00:24:03.070 think that you could get started with the A B M report on LinkedIn, and if 324 00:24:03.070 --> 00:24:07.280 you have hot spot, you could build landing pages. So I think your most 325 00:24:07.280 --> 00:24:11.150 valuable asset here is the knowledge of the challenges and how you solve them 326 00:24:11.150 --> 00:24:15.140 with the account. So it wouldn't say that it has to be expensive. It'll so 327 00:24:15.140 --> 00:24:19.770 it doesn't have to be in the six figure realm, and I have started noticing, and 328 00:24:19.780 --> 00:24:23.140 an interview I did yesterday actually was somebody who did it for, I think, 329 00:24:23.140 --> 00:24:26.060 under five grand. And most of that was that spent. I think you just use Excel. 330 00:24:26.060 --> 00:24:29.880 She's tried everything and just picked up the accounts of created some robust, 331 00:24:29.890 --> 00:24:35.830 personalized campaigns for these people. So it is possible. But I'm still trying 332 00:24:35.830 --> 00:24:41.310 to get a scope of what it is for most people. And then again, my kind of my 333 00:24:41.310 --> 00:24:43.940 goal is to learn this. But I'm trying to figure out, like, what is a good 334 00:24:43.940 --> 00:24:47.660 small campaign look like? Medium sized campaign, a big campaign, those air 335 00:24:48.040 --> 00:24:53.350 questions I've yet toe the answer, and I'm still my journey figuring out no, 336 00:24:53.350 --> 00:24:56.630 it makes sense. It also depends If you're doing programmatic, then that's 337 00:24:56.640 --> 00:25:01.950 massively expensive. Eso. If that's where you're starting, then uh, then 338 00:25:01.950 --> 00:25:05.790 that's an expensive journey to undertake off course. social spend can 339 00:25:05.790 --> 00:25:10.000 be what you wanted to be. I think there's a lot of ways to optimize the 340 00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:14.950 way you do a B M on social, especially linked in or the way you sort of do the 341 00:25:14.950 --> 00:25:19.690 retargeting sequences on Facebook you can you can optimize that there are so 342 00:25:19.690 --> 00:25:24.060 many brilliant is and be tools available, a swell that will make life 343 00:25:24.070 --> 00:25:29.200 easier for you. Generate your own white papers and, you know, one click with 344 00:25:29.200 --> 00:25:33.660 the designer things like that. So you do have a lot of resource is I think 345 00:25:33.660 --> 00:25:38.420 the most expensive thing to acquire is, um, the target accounts. The knowledge 346 00:25:38.420 --> 00:25:43.740 around the target accounts for me getting the personalized content that I 347 00:25:43.740 --> 00:25:48.530 need that has been the most expensive post. Yeah, that's what we started to 348 00:25:48.530 --> 00:25:55.010 find out. So I've been talked Thio, the founders of those big companies. Yet 349 00:25:55.010 --> 00:25:59.680 like Terminus and Demand Base, I will. That's part of this Siri's. I'm looking 350 00:25:59.680 --> 00:26:02.380 forward to it because finding out the ins and outs of like, okay, like, what 351 00:26:02.380 --> 00:26:05.140 are we really getting will be purchased software this big, like how much more 352 00:26:05.140 --> 00:26:08.350 effective doesn't make us? I'm sure it's pretty good. I mean and companies 353 00:26:08.350 --> 00:26:11.280 are investing in a pretty heavily. Yeah, And then you have the small hacks that 354 00:26:11.280 --> 00:26:16.510 nobody really tells you about, like generating a tracking link on your own, 355 00:26:16.510 --> 00:26:20.280 and that you can see it in Google analytics. So whenever you something or 356 00:26:20.280 --> 00:26:23.910 you share something and think, then you used to attract link and you can see it 357 00:26:23.910 --> 00:26:27.850 in Google Analytics. Things like that. A small hex. But I don't think that 358 00:26:27.850 --> 00:26:32.690 people actually remember to generate attracting code for Lincoln to see if 359 00:26:32.700 --> 00:26:36.940 people later clicked on the link without responding more. I mean, Google 360 00:26:36.940 --> 00:26:39.750 makes it really hard. It's literally like six form fields you have to fill 361 00:26:39.750 --> 00:26:43.270 out every time you want to create that. You keep tracking parameter right. 362 00:26:43.740 --> 00:26:46.470 Luckily, there's some tools out there. They're making it easier and doing it 363 00:26:46.470 --> 00:26:50.840 automatically like come spot. But it's all technical things. We gotta learn 364 00:26:50.840 --> 00:26:54.680 how to implement and get better at Maria. It has been so fun toe learn 365 00:26:54.680 --> 00:26:59.090 about your A B M journey. Where can people go toe, learn more from you and 366 00:26:59.090 --> 00:27:02.530 connect with you online? If they have follow up questions, well, they can 367 00:27:02.530 --> 00:27:05.840 definitely find me on LinkedIn I'm always answering questions there. And 368 00:27:05.840 --> 00:27:13.100 they can also see some of the posts that ideo. Yep. And if I have it here 369 00:27:13.100 --> 00:27:20.040 in front of me But if you go to Lincoln dot com slash i am and it is slash m a 370 00:27:20.040 --> 00:27:30.680 r i a e l e f s d is her u r l So that's where you can find Maria. I'm so 371 00:27:30.680 --> 00:27:34.300 impressed by the way you say my last name. Fantastic. I'm glad I didn't mess 372 00:27:34.300 --> 00:27:40.630 it up. Thank you again. So much for joining me on the show today. Maria, if 373 00:27:40.630 --> 00:27:43.980 you're getting value from this podcast, you are absolutely going toe love our 374 00:27:43.980 --> 00:27:47.730 weekly newsletter. In each email, I share something that you can do toe 375 00:27:47.730 --> 00:27:52.050 love your team well, toe, hone your craft, the craft of marketing and to 376 00:27:52.050 --> 00:27:55.770 grow your leadership. Plus, there's a super funny video at the top of the 377 00:27:55.770 --> 00:27:59.080 landing page whenever you go to sign up for the newsletter. So go to sweet Fish 378 00:27:59.080 --> 00:28:05.780 media dot com slash newsletter and sign up today. Are you on Lincoln? That's a 379 00:28:05.780 --> 00:28:09.380 stupid question. Of course you're on LinkedIn here. Sweet fish. We've gone 380 00:28:09.390 --> 00:28:13.770 all in on the platform multiple people from our team are creating content 381 00:28:13.770 --> 00:28:18.190 there. Sometimes it's a funny gift. For many other times, it's a micro video or 382 00:28:18.190 --> 00:28:22.490 a slide deck. And sometimes it's just a regular old status update that shares 383 00:28:22.500 --> 00:28:26.620 their unique point of view on B two b marketing leadership or their job 384 00:28:26.620 --> 00:28:30.990 function were posting this content through their personal profile, not our 385 00:28:30.990 --> 00:28:35.240 company page. And it would warm my heart and soul if you connected with 386 00:28:35.250 --> 00:28:39.900 each of our evangelists, will be adding Mawr down the road. But for now, you 387 00:28:39.900 --> 00:28:44.150 should connect with Bill Reed, R C zero Kelsey Montgomery, our creative 388 00:28:44.150 --> 00:28:48.570 director, Dan Sanchez, our director of audience growth. Logan Lyles, our 389 00:28:48.570 --> 00:28:52.710 director of partnerships, and me, James Carberry. We're having a whole lot of 390 00:28:52.710 --> 00:28:56.200 fun on LinkedIn pretty much every single day on. We'd love for you to be 391 00:28:56.200 --> 00:28:56.760 a part of it.