Transcript
WEBVTT
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It doesn't matter which one you choose. It just matters that you have the
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executive buy in to be inclusive and
be a bridge builder between all experiences to
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make sure they're consistent and holistic,
and that's the new pathway to growth.
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Marketing is no longer about attention.
It's about context, and the implications extend
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far beyond your marketing team or your
marketing function to the entire organization. My
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name is Ethan Butte. I'm the
chief of angelist at bombomb and the host
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of the CX series here on B
Tob Growth. You're about to listen in
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on a great conversation with Matt sweezy
the principle of marketing insights at sales force.
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The work he's been doing over the
past several years calls into questions so
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many foundations of the way we're doing
marketing today. Attention versus context, limited
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media versus infinite media, who in
your company should own customer experience and how
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to take a more human centered approach
to the work that we do every day.
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Here's my conversation with Matt sweezy.
Asking how can we make our marketing
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better is the wrong question. Instead, we need to ask why isn't our
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marketing working? When you ask why, you get much different answers, and
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that question and those answers are at
the heart of the work being done by
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today's guest. He's been at sales
force for seven and a half years,
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initially as an evangelist and presently as
principle of marketing insights. He's the author
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of marketing automation for Dummies and the
context marketing revolution, a new book that
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I've already pre ordered I'm really looking
forward to. He's the producer and host
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of the Electronic Propaganda Society, a
smart, valuable and even fun podcast series
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that rightfully earned a stack of awards. He's a contributing writer for sites like
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Forbes, marketing props and convince and
convert. He's a frequent keynote speaker who
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I finally saw speak and finally met
in person at dreamforce recently. And he's
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the cofounder of a brewery, Matthew
sweezy. Welcome to the customer experience podcast.
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Thank you, than for having me. Yeah, really looking for to
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the conversation. Before we get go
and just tell me a little bit about
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even tide brewing in Atlanta. How
that come together, what's that look like
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at the craft brewery that me and
a few other friends started? We just
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had our we just celebrated our sixth
anniversary beginning of this month and yeah,
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so, I mean it's just kind
of tagline. It is great. Doesn't
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have to be complicated, just a
few friends making good beers and we sell
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all across the state of Georgia.
Awesome. I will look for it when
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I get down to Georgia, which
I'm planning to do the summer. It's
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a separate story. Let's start where
we always start on the podcast, and
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I you have such a unique perspective
on it. No, well, research
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perspective, but we'll start the way
I always ask it, which is your
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thoughts or characteristics or your definition of
customer experience. Yes, there's two ways
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to answer that question. One is
it's not up for me to define.
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It's up for each of our customers
to de find in their own way,
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and I think that's actaid what the
definition is. It's what I is someone
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perceived that they want the experience to
be. I think we understand that.
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And then the flip side is then, how do we, as a brand
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fulfill that? and to me the
experience is always the sum of all parts.
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Right, it's not one thing,
it's the sum of everything that we
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do. We can use the term
across the customer journey, but it's inclusive
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of marketing. It's inclusive but product
experience, product use, support service.
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So to me I would put a
capital ty and a capital e on the
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experience and assume that it's the sum
of all things that we do. Love
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it. It touches on so many
themes that people share. But you capture
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really concise fashion there and you talked
about the entire customer life cycle there.
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And some of the research that you've
done with some folks at sales force shows
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that high performing marketing organizations are seventeen
times better at collaborating across other departments,
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like you mentioned, sales, service, product, etc. Talk a little
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bit about that research and some of
the tips that come out of it for
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folks who are listening. How can
we collaborate better? Whether you're a market
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or not, the collaboration goes both
ways. So give some give a little
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bit more context there and maybe some
tips for people. Yeah, so the
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research. So every year it sales
force, we do a state of marketing
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and over the past five years.
The focus of that effort has really been
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to identify the key trace between high
performing marketing organizations and everyone else, and
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just sord one's clear. These high
performers are radically outperforming there ten times more
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likely to be, significantly being their
direct competition. And then we start looking
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at what are those factors like?
How are they actually able to do that?
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And, as you notice, one
of the larger factors with this idea
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of collaboration. So the number one
key trait of all high performers is executive
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buy into a new idea of marketing
that's very much in line with the definition
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of the experience that we just talked
about. In fact, that new definition
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of marketing is that marketing is the
owner and sustainer of all experiences, not
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just the creator of messages. It's
a once that becomes the foundation. Then
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we start tactically looking at what high
performers are doing, and it takes collaboration
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because, as we talked about,
experience with a Capul t Accapitali has gross
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all touch points and only when you
have collaboration can those things can be consistent
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and holistic and then create the experience
that is required. I when you look
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at very specific use cases of saying
all right, and it's some of these
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things are baffling, like it's not
a radical idea, right, it's not
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like I never thought of that,
like Duh, right, it's one of
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those kind of concepts. But then
when we look at the actual task co
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execution of how well or organizations able
to execute, I mean basic concepts of
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collaboration, like, take a simple
example. Let's not market the people who
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are in the support Q. Pretty
Simple. But what you might be surprised
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there's only one third of all businesses
can actually do that. And it's because
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the way that we've currently been structured
as marketing is a department that sits outside
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sales of Zone, department, support, service, product, that all silod
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departments operating for their own goals.
And I was talking to a company the
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other day and they see I tried
to go over and talk to support and
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said, can I get a list
of all the people and are in the
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supports you so I can suppress them
from this outcoming marketing email, and the
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answer that the support team gave them
was no, that's my data, you
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can't have it. Right. So
when we face it in and that's not
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the only company. A lot of
US face these problems. So to overcome
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these it's a couple of things.
One is your executives have to understand that
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the highest economic output that you can
produce is the experience. Right, eighty
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four percent of consumers say the experience
is just as important as the product or
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service. It is a new product
that we are selling in one might say
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it's the greater of the products because
it is everything and it touches all things,
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where's product usage is only a small
sliver of the total time. And
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those are some basic concepts and ideas, but it, you know, just
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the idea of experience has to go
through it, and that's what high performers
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are doing. They have the executive
buy in and it allows them to have
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that collaboration. Yeah, I mean
you really get to the one of the
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main reasons I started this podcast was
out of partly out of my own interest
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in this. It's like we all
get it. It's super important. Product
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parity is through the roof hyper competition. The experience is more important than ever
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and, to your observation, probably
the most important thing. And yet when
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it comes to executing it's really difficult
because even in a healthy culture we can
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start to feel Silod so I love
that you go to executive buy in there.
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I'll just one more follow up on
that. Talk about the consequences.
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Like let's assume that a company's executive
team is bought in on this idea that
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capital, t capital ev experience is
the most important thing. Talk about the
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effect on like the relationship between CMO, Cro and Cxo, chief experience officer.
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I know that you've read and spoken
a bit on that, like what
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are you seeing around these titles and
in the relationships with team tween these people
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acronyms? You left one off to
that was CGEO, chief growth officer.
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So really, you know, when
we when we start to talk about the
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tactle, the tactical execution of these
ideas, and we start to say if
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marketing and it's old format is no
longer what we are now doing, then
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the old executive no longer is appropriate, right, and so the CMO being
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the old executive. And actually,
you know, it's interesting. If you've
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not been in the marketing field for
a while, you might not know that
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Cmo was a pretty new term.
It came out as digital came out right
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when digital marketing came out the truly
when CMO comes out in the foretpront.
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Before that, I was VP of
sales and marketing for most the organizations,
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of VP of marketing for other organizations. Now that we move forward, right,
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and Cemo took on the roles of
digital branding, advertising, all those
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different aspects, email direct now we
start to say to the experience, right,
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and so there's two ways to look
at experience. One, as you
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can say, we are going to
focus on experience and that is just a
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term. The other flip side of
the same coin is to say that we
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are going to look at growth.
So it's either a chief experience officer or
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cheeth growth officer that we see is
kind of driving a lot of these.
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We also still have the CRO chief
revenue officer, and that also could be
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looking at growth, and just depends
on how they use the definition. What
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really I see one of those three
formats, either chief experience, chief growth
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or cheap revenue officer, really being
the future leader of the marketing organization,
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because they're focused on a holistic goal
and that holistic goal is growth by a
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better experience. And we say growth
at the exact same word is revenue.
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So it doesn't matter if your CROCGEOC
exo. That really is the future.
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But that leader when us be clear
on what that leader must do. That
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job is to create a connected experience. They must be the one who says,
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all right, we increase revenue not
by just selling more product, but
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by creating a better experience across the
entire life cycle. That's just as important
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for us to create a good service
and connect that to marketing and messaging,
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just as much as it is to
put New People into the pipeline and service
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them all the way through. So
yes, I think all three of those
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are accurate and doesn't matter which one
you choose. It just matters that you
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have the executive buy into be inclusive
and be a bridge builder between all experiences
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to make sure they're consistent and holistic. And that's the new pathway to growth.
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Love it. I'm going to I'm
going to give you a couple of
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your own quotes and ask you one
follow up before we get onto the context
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marketing revolution, new book jure Pror
Business Press. Right, I might ask
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about that relationship to because that's fool
publisher. But but before you just a
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couple quotes of yours. Marketing creates
experiences, not messages. Your brand isn't
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what you say, it's to some
of all experiences you create. Right,
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I think you've already touched on some
of these teams already, but talk about
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just because it has been a background
thing as I've been talking with a variety
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of people in a variety of seats
in a conversation like the one we're having
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now. Talk about your view of
brand experience and customer experience. Are they
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synonymous or is it just semantic and
you don't even care? It's not interesting
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to you? I'm more on the
second of it's just semantics, because what
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is brand? Well, brand is
the sum of all experiences, right,
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and if that's what we define as
brand, or so I mean it,
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and then how you tactually execute those
could be different things. Right. Is
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the tactical execution? Is the goal
of the marketing to drive and engagement,
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a move the person forward into a
customer journey? That's much going to be
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much more of a customer Experience Marketing
Initiative. Where is what? If the
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goal is just to make sure people
are aware of us, know who we
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are? That's much more of a
traditional brand ie, just becoming aware of
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who we are and what our mission
and what our ideas are. So to
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me they're both the exact same thing, because I believe brand is the sum
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of all experiences that you that you
create. And the reason I say that
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it's because you can tell the world
all the messages, you can say this
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is who we are, you can
put all the pretty pictures up, you
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can just have the best copy and
best advertising in the world. That's branding.
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But as soon as they interact with
you in any way, shape or
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form, if that's not consistent with
the message or the projection or the expectation
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that you've set, then you're you
don't how a brand right, because the
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sum is they found something radically different
and now they feel load too. Hence
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you now I have a very bad
brand. So to me it's it's a
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lot of some of all experiences,
and they're really the same thing to me.
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Yep, good. And it's not
just it's not just that it can
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go terribly bad. I mean,
did that disconnect just plane create confusion?
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Not even which, of course,
as a negative sentiment as well. So
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the context marketing revolution, how to
motivate buyers in the age of infinite media.
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Full title of the book. That
is you know, this will be
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released, I think, a little
bit before the book more released. Yeah,
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this episode will be a little bit
before it. Before we get into
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some of the themes and topics,
when did you know that this was a
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book that you wanted to write?
Like, why did you? Because you're
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you know, you're studying these things, you're talking about them, you're teaching
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them, etcetera. Like. When
did you say I need to round this
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up and put it in a book? Yeah, so I don't know when
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that was. I think it probably
came down to when I was doing the
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research. And just so I'm always
constantly researching topics and researching things, and
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one of the things I was trying
to research was what is the cost of
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marking going to be in the future? And when I started to look at
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that, that required me to say, all right, if what is the
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cost to break through the noise?
And then that one more step was we
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now need to start measuring the noise. So I started measuring noise fro one
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thosand nine hundred all the way through
and projected to twenty thirty best as I
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could. And then when I started
to find out was how we started to
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think about these things and the environments
that marketing is taking place in a radically
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different from the fundamental level, from
a media theory level, and so once
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I started to realize that and realize
that the iterations that we continue to iterate
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upon we're specific games that were created
for a specific environment and that no longer
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is true, that's really when I
decided that, all right, this is
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this is big. We need to
really think about this and focus on this,
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because this is not an iteration on
old marketing ideas. Right, iterating
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on old ideas will not carry us
forward into the future. Back to the
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quote you opened up with, we
ask how do we be better? We
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simply take the ideas and foundations and
iterate upon them. Well, if the
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foundational ideas are no longer correct,
we're iterating upon something and creating something bad.
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So we have to question those foundations
and I think when I realized and
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did the research on noise, been
found that we entered a new media environment,
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that that's really when I decided that, hey, this is important,
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we should talk about this. Cool, I think, since I have not
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read the book, I think one
way to get at it is through the
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title and we're right on the doorstep
of this one. Talk about what you
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mean by infinite media and what are
its consequences, because that really is the
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crux of a lot of this totally
so infinite media. So if we follow
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media theory, which is really kind
of spearheaded by Marsh mccluhan, harold and
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its Neal Postman, it's essentially a
theory that says human behavior is dictated by
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the media environment that surround them.
Right, and when we think about media
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environment, it's not twitter, social
media, it it's something much greater,
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you know, just like the basic
concepts of how the printing press took the
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world out of the Dark Ages and
into the age of enlightenment. So infinite
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media is in contrast to limited media. And before two thousand and nine,
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based on my mathematics, that was
the limited media environment and that meant three
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specific things. Media was limited in
terms of creation, in terms of distribution
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in terms of total consumption. So
when those three things are limited, that's
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a very specific environment and we play
a very specific game within that environment.
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Right, and if you look at
who had access, you know, to
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overcome any one of those barriers it
required capital. So bright from predominantly noise
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was created by businesses. There was
a monopoly, and then would after two
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thousand and nine what we find is
that the individuals creating their own media,
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right on social media, on email, as well as their devices, they
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now are the largest creators of noise, since noise is very different, and
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also it follows a very different pattern
where they continue to create more and more
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and more and from more players.
So we see an infinite level of noise
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rising. Right, there's no barriers
to creation, there's no barriers to distribution
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and there's an infinite amount of content
available for apt for access. What this
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really means is that consumers now operate
in a different world and they have different
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decisionmaking tools and they have different decisionmaking
processes. So the way that marketing was
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raist and crafted was to say we
are here to motivate individuals given a specific
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set of circumstances of how they make
decisions. What I'm arguing for saying all
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right, consumers now have a radically
different decision making process and the role of
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marketing now is radically different, which
much, much must match that process based
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on the environment. So, along
with the short, infinite media means that
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now consumers are in control and how
we motivate them is not by grant copy
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or single advertising campaigns where we said
something so created we got them to take
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action. Rather, we must understand
that these things now take plays across a
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long series. Everything is a journey
and motivation is done by guiding individuals by
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step by step across that journey,
not by trying to get them to skip
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steps. So it's pretty much the
basis. Yep, it makes perfect sense,
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and that's just to tie it back
for people that that haven't tied it
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back in their own heads already.
That is why this iterative approach is,
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how do we make it better?
Does not apply because it we're just building
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on old blocks. Is Funny.
I remember reading a book. It's called
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scientific advertising. Is like a either
a thin booker really amazing pamphlet that's decades
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and decades old and it's basically so
much when I think about a lot of
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digital advertising right now. In the
iterative approach, you know we can we
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can do a be test faster,
but essentially it's the same thing this guy
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was writing about in direct mail and
magazine adds decades and decades and decades ago.
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So, you know, we feel
like we're so well equipped in the
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pace of things as fast, but
still it's an iterative approach. Nonetheless.
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Let's go to the front side of
the title of the book, the Context
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Marketing Revolution. I think revolution is
already baked in. I think it.
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Anyone that's listening to what you're talking
about in and the consequences of the age
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of infinite media sees that this is
revolutionary. But talk a little bit about
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context marketing. What is context in
this context? Yeah, yeah, so
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the context is once again, it's
in contrast is something. It's in contrast
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to the word attention. So the
foundation of marketing in the limits of media
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era was how do we break through, grab someone's attention and get them to
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do what we want? Right,
that was how we motivated people to Action.
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Now when we see is we motivate
people by context, and that really
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has a couple of factors. One
saying that with infinite media we now have
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an intermediary between brands and individuals.
That intermediary is artificial intelligence. Will Ai
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is only going to let through what
is contextual to that individual for the moment,
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because that's which generates the highest engagement, and you can see. Look
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at any social feed, look at
anything that's mediated by digital by the by
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Ai, and you will see at
the contextual feed, your Google search results,
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you're the results are specific to you
in the context of you in that
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moment. Right. You look at
social media, that feed is the contextual
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feed. That our chronological feed.
You look at your email inbox right in.
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The list goes on and on and
on. And so, for number
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one, for a marketing to break
through, it has to be in context
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of the moment. That's key number
one for context. Key number two is
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that context also means. What does
it mean to the individual? So we
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got on this big kick of content
marking. Right, all we need to
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do is create content. But the
problem is no individual ever said Damn,
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I want content today. So what
they want, if they want something that's
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contextual, to help them solve a
goal, bry, and that's really the
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definition of the tactical execution of context, is how do we help, being
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into the individuals, solve the goal
of the moment and by helping them accomplish
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that goal we build the trust we
need. Right and doesn't matter where it
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is, we break through because we
can help them with that moment we didn't
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build the trust we need, and
then we're able to leverage that moment to
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guide them to the next step and
by doing that we then are able to
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then generate the demand by guiding people, by saying we're going to take this
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and keep you going down this path. But then that's kind of the basic
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concepts. That's really a concept of
context. In the contrast to attention everybody
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logan with sweet fish here, I
had to take just a second today to
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share with you another podcast that's in
my regular listening rotation. The sales engagement
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podcast has some great interviews and you
pick up a lot of best practices from
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revenue leaders that are doing the job
day in and day out. I've picked
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up so much learning from other sales
leaders that are featured on the show.
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One of my favorites is seven things
marketing wish sales knew about nurturing leads.
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So check out the sales engagement podcast
wherever you do, you're listening and by
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the way, if you're not following
Scott Barker on Linkedin, you should do
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that too. All right, let's
get back to the show. For folks
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who are listening normally we'd wait to
the end of the episode, but I'll
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just go ahead and say it for
you. The context marketing revolution is available
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for preorder. You can pre order
on Amazon. That's what I did.
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You know, if you like these
ideas, and I'll transition, there's a
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there's a way you can get a
preview of a lot of these ideas too,
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in a really cool format, but
really quickly. Now. Did you
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build a proposal and shop at to
different publishers? How'd you get connected with
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Harvard Business? Yeah, so I
wrote an outline, roaded draft and then
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pitched it to a bunch of different
publishers. So I had three publishers willing
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to publish it. Then when Harvard's
one of them, Harvard Business, who's
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who doesn't want who has been dream
of being published by Harvard Business, I
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was like sure, let's let's have
you guys publish it. That's how it
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happened. Awesome. Congratulations. For
people who like these ideas and are in
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anticipation of the book itself, I
want to offer that you can go to
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itunes or apple podcast, wherever you
listen to podcast, wherever you listen to
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the customer experience podcast, and go
search electronic Propaganda Society Award winning series,
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incredibly well produced, unlike this one
in so many other podcasts, not interview
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based. You know, it lays
out all of these theories over and ideas
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and research over nine episodes in so
I guess just to open it up on
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on the electronic propaganda society, what
were you trying to deliver in terms of
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experience, like, why the audience
format and why this style of production?
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Maybe? Yeah, a couple of
reasons. One, I'm a creator,
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just I think most of us are, and I wanted to create some Rad
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right, just pure passion project,
no bounds, see how far I can
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push and see how radically creative I
can be with something, and so I've
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created that format. Right. So
it's not a traditional podcast, it's not
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interview based. It's a basic very
much off cereal. So it's a nine
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series episode that tells a single story
and then it's heavily researched, heavily produced,
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just because I wanted to do it
that way and I thought that's would
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make a good experience and make a
really cool make something that people would enjoy.
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You know, it's very different than
anything that's out there and it's why
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I want so many creative awards for
it when it came out. So believe
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I've got five creative awards for it
currently. But yes, that was it
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and and it's super red and it's
something like you've never heard before and that
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was kind of the point. I
agree completely and and it really does tea
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up all the stuff we've been talking
about so far. I love it as
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a compliment to having seen you present
on some of these topics and an anticipation
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of the forthcoming book. I think
they're probably a lot of connections with the
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obviously are a lot of connections between
them. What were some of your inspirations,
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like, are you a podcast listener
or you know, like, what
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were some of your inspirations? Is
You're like trying to create something that was
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awesome for you. So I don't
listen to mini podcast. I think it
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listened to. I think I made
it almost all the way through cereal,
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but I think just just radical formats
of content. Write a great a great
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documentary, a great document series,
and I just figured that it was easier
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to do by a podcast and any
other format. So I did it by
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the PODCAST. For Inspiration, definitely
serial. I researt to a friend of
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mine WHO's a producer at w whatever
the public radio station is in New York,
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about my brain stopped. But read
some books sound reporting. That was
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written by MPR. So kind of
just you know, audio how to do
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those things. But really just listened
to podcast just would then go listen to
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the top rated podcast and been listen
to what I believe made them top rated
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and then just mimics that. So
it wasn't like some you know, crazy
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thing. And then really the theme
was, you know, s and S
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S, Soviet are propaganda that.
So that was kind of like the underlying
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artistic theme for this Hense, you
know, the revolution. That kind of
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was, you know, the visual
format. Yeah, you'll really put down.
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You'll know you found the right podcast
when you see some of that that
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era artwork. It's really the whole
theme is really well developed. Obviously you
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drew in a ton of I mean
one of the to me, one of
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the most impressive things from our production
standpoint was how much original audio you brought
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into eclips and quotes and speeches and
the night rider theme song and historical clips
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and like fun edits stuff. But
you also reference several books that I just
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really love and respect, and I'm
just going to name a handful of them.
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The cluetrain manifesto. You will don
the experience he kind of me by
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finding Gilmore. They have a new
one out recently. The medium is the
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message from a clue and who you're
already reference? Permission Marketing from Seth God,
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which was very fundamental to us at
bombomb as we started getting going,
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and one of my personal favorite books
of all times, small ast beautiful,
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by EF Schumacher. One am I
too. Yeah, how are you like
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a prolific reader? Like how in
any other if I mentioned those books and
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people liked a couple of them?
You know, what are some other favorites
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that you've got? It's so first
off, so I don't know if I
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consider myself prolific. I consider myself
a follower of rabbit holes. So when
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I start going down, when there's
a question in my head, I try
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to then go research and follow that
rabbit hole until it's exhausted, and what
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that really ends up with is me
going down very Arcad Arcane, archaic like
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different paths and finding random authors,
little books or big books that not better
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on that topic. So it's really
kind of how I come across all those
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and then in conversation of Hey,
I read this with a friend. Oh
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well, then, have you read
this through your organic probably find them.
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So I wouldn't conser myself. That's
really prolific. I have read a lot,
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just based on the work I do
and kind of those rabbit holes and
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making sure I and really I think
it comes out of the reason I do
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that. It's not because I'm a
prolific reader. It's more or less because
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I'm insecure, and I think the
insecurity is I never want to be on
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stage and say something and have someone
say that it's wrong because you never read
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this book and in this book he
argues against that point. Right. So
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I wanted to make sure that I
had a theoretical foundation, that you know,
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I knew everything, anything that is
going to come at me, and
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I think that was the reason I
read. So I wouldn't say I'm a
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prolifical I just say I did for
those reasons. The second on the other
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books that people may enjoy, such
a hard question to answer and there's so
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00:26:41.240 --> 00:26:45.519
many books that I read from so
many different things, and it's like do
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you want a historical contact? It's
like, all right, we talked about
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feedback loops, but it's like,
did you ever really read the original book,
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which is Robert? There's original books
by we'd Kinmember I can't pronounce.
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00:26:56.190 --> 00:26:59.630
The last day. You talked about
feedback loops back in the S now.
409
00:26:59.750 --> 00:27:03.140
Is really the foundational aspect of then
telling all those concepts. And you know,
410
00:27:03.220 --> 00:27:06.619
we talked about experience and you know
the experience economy, Josephine, Jim
411
00:27:06.660 --> 00:27:11.339
Gilmore foundational to that theory. Doc
Searles, one of the coouthers of flutrained
412
00:27:11.339 --> 00:27:12.900
meniphists. Those got a bunch of
other books. That film's got a bunch
413
00:27:12.900 --> 00:27:17.730
of other books and there. You
know, it just depends on how nerdy
414
00:27:17.930 --> 00:27:21.490
or how tactical or how practical you
want to be with the book recommendation.
415
00:27:22.009 --> 00:27:25.210
And there's so many good books out
there that's just so hard. But if
416
00:27:25.250 --> 00:27:27.329
I could just take a second to
talk about what you said was your favorite
417
00:27:27.329 --> 00:27:30.880
and my favorite, which is ef
Hu Moncker, smallest putiful. So pretty
418
00:27:30.880 --> 00:27:36.079
much I've seen through the majority of
my favorite books. It's this constant theme
419
00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:40.200
of humanity of ef you mocker talks
about, you know, and there's lots
420
00:27:40.200 --> 00:27:42.839
of quotes I use and one is
that you know, industry is, you
421
00:27:42.920 --> 00:27:47.109
know, so great and it but
it's so inefficient to a degree that we
422
00:27:47.190 --> 00:27:51.269
don't really realize it's an efficiency.
Hence we just let it continue being inefficient.
423
00:27:51.349 --> 00:27:52.230
Right. But if we start to
look at these things and say,
424
00:27:52.230 --> 00:27:56.109
all right, if we put humans
at the center of everything, right,
425
00:27:56.109 --> 00:27:57.470
if we put humans at the center
of our business, right, if you
426
00:27:57.509 --> 00:28:00.460
put humans at the center of what
marketing should be, if we put humans
427
00:28:00.460 --> 00:28:04.500
in the center of Economics, we
see a very different approach and on that
428
00:28:04.579 --> 00:28:07.619
and if you haven't read the book
all that, Autistabsle the island, I
429
00:28:07.660 --> 00:28:11.819
would say make sure you read autosuth
through the island. It's not a marketing
430
00:28:11.859 --> 00:28:14.690
book. It's totally a book about
humanity and about you know what, if
431
00:28:14.690 --> 00:28:17.609
we thought about living in a different
way. But I think that's the my
432
00:28:17.730 --> 00:28:21.369
favorite theme through all those books is
just a challenge and I just can't I
433
00:28:21.410 --> 00:28:25.369
can't say enough about sumchers theories of
you know what, if we thought about
434
00:28:25.410 --> 00:28:30.160
economics not as the highest financial return, which is the highest stakeholder theory return,
435
00:28:30.200 --> 00:28:33.359
which is essentially he talks about way
before stakeholder theory became the same,
436
00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:37.359
and that's then leads you into purpose
driven business, purpose of the marketing.
437
00:28:37.759 --> 00:28:41.829
I do believe purpose is a massive, powerful force and all of our marketing
438
00:28:41.869 --> 00:28:44.950
in the future must have an element
of purpose in it, just because it
439
00:28:45.029 --> 00:28:48.750
focuses us on conversations past our product, I'm sort allows this to have a
440
00:28:48.829 --> 00:28:52.589
more human relationship or more honest relationship, pass just a product with our with
441
00:28:52.670 --> 00:28:55.630
our audience, when our market place. I don't know if I nitswer your
442
00:28:55.670 --> 00:28:57.980
question, man. That was that
was a great, great pass the subtitle
443
00:28:59.099 --> 00:29:03.220
of smalls beautiful as economics, as
if people matter mattered and and I love
444
00:29:03.299 --> 00:29:07.019
the way you see, you capture
and summarize it there, and I agree
445
00:29:07.059 --> 00:29:08.140
with you on purpose. I see
it more and more often. I think
446
00:29:08.140 --> 00:29:11.009
it's you know, one of the
big, you know, consumer package goods
447
00:29:11.609 --> 00:29:15.730
conglomerates, was talking about how they're
going to start folding some of their brands
448
00:29:15.769 --> 00:29:21.650
if they can't identify, I.
A an authentic purpose that transcends like paper
449
00:29:21.769 --> 00:29:26.640
towels or toothbrushes or whatever else they're
selling. You know they're going to start
450
00:29:26.640 --> 00:29:29.160
peeling off some of the brands and, you know, putting them off to
451
00:29:29.240 --> 00:29:33.359
market because purpose matters so much.
I think it does. I'm probably abusing
452
00:29:33.400 --> 00:29:37.720
the word context here, but I
think that purpose gives people some context for
453
00:29:37.759 --> 00:29:41.950
their participation with you and your product
or your service, and I just advocate,
454
00:29:41.990 --> 00:29:45.990
and I'm sure you would too.
Is that that that it is sincere
455
00:29:45.269 --> 00:29:49.109
is a big deal. I think
you know anything about you know a lot
456
00:29:49.190 --> 00:29:55.140
of the shallow surface layer, you
know, flimsy purpose stuff to people just
457
00:29:55.259 --> 00:29:57.380
staple up over the front of the
store or whatever. You know, storefront
458
00:29:57.380 --> 00:30:02.660
or whatever as a as a concept
falls away really quickly. So it needs
459
00:30:02.660 --> 00:30:06.940
to be sincere and authentic to the
core of the business. I think it's
460
00:30:06.980 --> 00:30:10.329
one of the things for us here
at bombomb we were very clear on what
461
00:30:10.410 --> 00:30:11.609
we were trying to do in the
world and the way that we wanted to
462
00:30:11.730 --> 00:30:15.569
operate from the beginning. I don't
know that it I don't know that it
463
00:30:15.089 --> 00:30:18.930
came it has bled through as much
to our customers as much as maybe it
464
00:30:19.009 --> 00:30:22.680
could, should would in the future, but I think having it early and
465
00:30:22.759 --> 00:30:26.920
having it be clear and shared is
a really big deal. Purposes purposes a
466
00:30:27.000 --> 00:30:30.799
thing we could probably do twenty minutes
on purpose, but I'm going to try
467
00:30:30.839 --> 00:30:32.960
to let you get back to your
date or just a little bit. I
468
00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:36.910
got a couple other topics for you. One of them you're kind enough to
469
00:30:37.309 --> 00:30:41.029
to review and say some Nice things
about, a book that I coauthored with
470
00:30:41.109 --> 00:30:44.349
Steve Passinelli, my good friend and
team member here. It's called Rehumanize Your
471
00:30:44.390 --> 00:30:47.670
Business. I think it time it
does what you were talking about, which
472
00:30:47.750 --> 00:30:52.019
we tried to put the human at
the center of of video in particular,
473
00:30:52.180 --> 00:30:53.779
and so I just love for you
to share your thoughts. And you know,
474
00:30:53.819 --> 00:30:57.579
I saw you put up a linkedin
post recently about increased consumption of video
475
00:30:57.619 --> 00:31:03.099
projected into the future. Talk a
little bit about one to one video,
476
00:31:03.299 --> 00:31:06.809
this this human to human video,
as well as just video in general.
477
00:31:06.849 --> 00:31:10.569
Anything you got on video, I'd
love to hear it. Yeah, so,
478
00:31:10.890 --> 00:31:14.490
yeah, posted this morning actually.
So doing my research on my twenty
479
00:31:14.529 --> 00:31:17.809
future of marketing. Two Thousand and
twenty put out a future of every year
480
00:31:17.930 --> 00:31:21.359
about marketing. Then one of the
big things is, you know, just
481
00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:25.200
going out about five years. What
we need to be really cognizant of is
482
00:31:25.759 --> 00:31:29.359
g and more free time. So
one of the things is as five he
483
00:31:29.480 --> 00:31:32.680
comes about and as we start to
offload more things to Iot, we're going
484
00:31:32.680 --> 00:31:36.269
to start to open up more free
time we vote for free time every year.
485
00:31:36.309 --> 00:31:38.109
Since, you know, digitals become
a thing, it's going to come
486
00:31:38.150 --> 00:31:41.750
even greater. So I talked about
you know, if we go five to
487
00:31:41.829 --> 00:31:44.309
ten out we start to get into
this self driving cars. Well, what
488
00:31:44.710 --> 00:31:47.859
do we then do with two hours
of free time every day? Right?
489
00:31:48.059 --> 00:31:51.859
Well, we're going to consume content, and one of the most consumable pieces
490
00:31:51.900 --> 00:31:55.259
of content with five g will be
video, and it's we start looking at,
491
00:31:55.380 --> 00:31:56.859
you know, how they're going to
break down short form, long form,
492
00:31:57.019 --> 00:32:01.289
live video. And then you talk
about one to one. So you
493
00:32:01.329 --> 00:32:04.170
know, one, two, one. To me, and I've gotten some
494
00:32:04.289 --> 00:32:07.890
flak from this, but to me
one to one was an idea of one
495
00:32:07.049 --> 00:32:10.730
brand creating one message for one individual. But I think we need to really
496
00:32:10.769 --> 00:32:14.490
think about is human to human.
How do we can it's one human to
497
00:32:14.529 --> 00:32:17.839
another human and do so at scale? And the definition of personal for me
498
00:32:19.160 --> 00:32:23.920
in the future is it personalized.
It's not how personalized, how customized can
499
00:32:24.000 --> 00:32:28.799
I make a mass experience to an
individual? It's how human cannot deliver that,
500
00:32:28.920 --> 00:32:30.869
how personal cannot deliver that experience.
So you know, if it is
501
00:32:30.990 --> 00:32:35.390
one individual creating a video and setting
it to another, that is one piece
502
00:32:35.509 --> 00:32:38.549
for one individual, that is,
one human talking to another, instantly consumable,
503
00:32:38.670 --> 00:32:42.190
instantly engaging. Yeah, and I
think it's going to be a new
504
00:32:42.269 --> 00:32:45.900
format. It is a new format
already I'm in videos, very engaging.
505
00:32:45.019 --> 00:32:49.420
Me like videos. So you know, yeah, I'm all pro on video.
506
00:32:49.579 --> 00:32:51.700
I have been for a long time
and I think, you know,
507
00:32:51.819 --> 00:32:54.059
as time moves on, we're going
to use video more and more just because
508
00:32:54.099 --> 00:32:58.809
it's easy, you know. Yeah, I love that you drove the distinction
509
00:32:58.970 --> 00:33:04.369
between one to one and human to
human or or you know, this idea
510
00:33:04.450 --> 00:33:07.690
that yeah, it because it speaks
to and I love that use the language
511
00:33:07.690 --> 00:33:09.569
around purse. I the line that
I drew. I wrote a blog post
512
00:33:09.650 --> 00:33:15.480
maybe two or three years ago about
personal versus personalized in the context of video,
513
00:33:15.559 --> 00:33:19.160
and this idea that, to me, personalized is dear first name,
514
00:33:19.599 --> 00:33:23.160
because you addtion with a product name. Yeah, yeah, it's just,
515
00:33:23.400 --> 00:33:28.390
you know, variable stuff versus truly
personal is. Hey, matt, I
516
00:33:28.509 --> 00:33:31.269
just so appreciate your time. You
know, in our conversation today you made
517
00:33:31.269 --> 00:33:35.109
me think about this thing that I
had read about. I'd read your work
518
00:33:35.150 --> 00:33:37.109
on it, I'd heard you speak
about it, but I think about a
519
00:33:37.150 --> 00:33:40.539
completely differently now and just so value
it right. This, this truly personal
520
00:33:42.019 --> 00:33:46.339
experience, is not a variable data
slug. And it's interesting because, you
521
00:33:46.420 --> 00:33:51.619
know, the other background theme on
it is scalable versus unscalable. I think
522
00:33:51.619 --> 00:33:53.099
a lot of people look at it
they say, Oh, this doesn't scale,
523
00:33:53.140 --> 00:33:57.769
and then it just begs this.
It begs your original question. I
524
00:33:58.009 --> 00:34:01.369
like, is it better if we
can make it slightly, slightly, incrementally
525
00:34:01.410 --> 00:34:07.490
better by inserting better variables into these
things? Versus, can you create a
526
00:34:07.569 --> 00:34:10.559
truly personal experience? And what is
the value of that, especially in the
527
00:34:10.679 --> 00:34:15.119
face of all this noise? Yeah, no, and I totally agree in
528
00:34:15.199 --> 00:34:17.519
scale is the big thing and that's
why. So one of the foundational element
529
00:34:17.639 --> 00:34:22.239
is is a technological foundation for context
marking, for all marking in the future.
530
00:34:22.280 --> 00:34:24.269
Without technology, there is no way
to scale these concepts or ideas.
531
00:34:24.389 --> 00:34:28.750
Right. With technology we know exactly
who to talk to, what human connect
532
00:34:28.789 --> 00:34:31.670
with them, whether that's an employee
and advocate, a sales personal marketer.
533
00:34:31.989 --> 00:34:36.389
Well, we we don't exactly who
to connect, what conversation have and then
534
00:34:36.469 --> 00:34:38.380
how to guide them to the next
steps and it becomes a scalable system.
535
00:34:38.780 --> 00:34:42.900
Right, we're marketing is no longer
we're sitting in board rooms coming up with
536
00:34:42.980 --> 00:34:46.500
campaigns to push to the masses.
Rather we create webs of systematic automations than
537
00:34:46.539 --> 00:34:50.900
we manage these automations which are connecting
us right, and that's making the best
538
00:34:50.940 --> 00:34:53.329
use of our time and I think
that's the biggest things. And you know,
539
00:34:53.409 --> 00:34:55.650
we haven't talked about this. One
word of Agile. That's the other
540
00:34:55.690 --> 00:35:00.010
aspect of scale. Right, since
the technological aspect of what does it take
541
00:35:00.010 --> 00:35:02.489
technique, technically to skip, there's
the other of what changes to our processes
542
00:35:02.530 --> 00:35:06.090
have to take on. Well,
we have to take on new building process.
543
00:35:06.489 --> 00:35:07.039
I mean, and I think that, you know, is one of
544
00:35:07.039 --> 00:35:10.000
the things I love to talk about, is the concept of we were all
545
00:35:10.119 --> 00:35:14.920
trained on the assembly line, right, nineteen, with the nineteen eighteen.
546
00:35:14.960 --> 00:35:17.159
Henry Ford comes out with the assembly
line and that's how we think about building,
547
00:35:17.159 --> 00:35:22.389
that's how we structure our organizations and
silent organizations. The building process is
548
00:35:22.469 --> 00:35:25.989
the waterfall process or extrapolation of the
assembly line. But now we have instant
549
00:35:27.070 --> 00:35:30.230
feedback and so we must move to
a new model, which is Agile,
550
00:35:30.269 --> 00:35:32.110
which is rapid testing. Right.
You know, listen to Morgan Brown,
551
00:35:32.349 --> 00:35:35.309
Shawn and Ellis. You know,
growth, hacking, you know, you
552
00:35:35.780 --> 00:35:37.780
it's rapid innovation. This is what
we're talking about, and so I think
553
00:35:37.780 --> 00:35:42.300
that's the other aspect of scale.
It's in those two combinations have to happen
554
00:35:42.340 --> 00:35:45.940
together and then these things become possible. By then we're not looking, we're
555
00:35:45.980 --> 00:35:46.659
no longer saying, all right,
how do we just, you know,
556
00:35:46.739 --> 00:35:50.809
create the right message of the right
person the right time, if you know,
557
00:35:50.889 --> 00:35:53.050
how do we connect the right human
to have the correct experience, produce
558
00:35:53.090 --> 00:35:58.010
a correct experience in contact for that
moment? And I think that's where we
559
00:35:58.050 --> 00:36:01.210
have to go. I love it. It's just bridging it to the truly
560
00:36:01.289 --> 00:36:07.760
personal moments. It's it's using technology
and processes to put people to be in
561
00:36:07.800 --> 00:36:10.320
their best position to be of highest
value doing things that machines can do,
562
00:36:10.760 --> 00:36:15.480
and you let the machines do all
the things that machines do best. Sales
563
00:36:15.559 --> 00:36:17.829
Force, you've been there for quite
a while. How do you like?
564
00:36:17.989 --> 00:36:22.349
You Start as an evangelist, your
principle of marketing insight. It's like,
565
00:36:22.789 --> 00:36:25.989
what is your Daytoday, week till
week, month to month. Relationship to,
566
00:36:27.670 --> 00:36:30.070
you know, the sales force mothership, like, how do you plug
567
00:36:30.150 --> 00:36:32.820
in? Are you just a man
about the world whose work is supported by
568
00:36:32.900 --> 00:36:37.300
sales force. Like, what's the
working relationship there? If for cool job,
569
00:36:37.900 --> 00:36:42.460
some job, by the way.
Yeah, totally, I agree.
570
00:36:42.579 --> 00:36:45.900
Thank you. Yeah, so I
actually started out in sales for a little
571
00:36:45.900 --> 00:36:50.849
start up called part ot and I
was the second salesperson employeed. Thirteen we
572
00:36:50.929 --> 00:36:53.130
grew that company up. We got
a choir back that target then acquired by
573
00:36:53.170 --> 00:36:58.010
sales for side. Transition into the
thought leadership rolled during that process, just
574
00:36:58.090 --> 00:37:01.320
because that's the side I really was
passionate about. So plugging into I really
575
00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:05.199
am mutilize in a couple of different
ways, as a lot of us are
576
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:07.559
utilize. You know, it's customer
meetings, it's going in and talking with
577
00:37:07.599 --> 00:37:10.760
large brands, talking about what their
future looks like, giving a presentation to
578
00:37:10.840 --> 00:37:15.789
them, you know, doing customer
dinners, helping with research, as well
579
00:37:15.829 --> 00:37:19.829
as the third party speaking engagements in
evangelizing the brand on stage all across the
580
00:37:19.869 --> 00:37:22.349
world. Right. So people really
see us as they're not just the technology
581
00:37:22.429 --> 00:37:25.590
provider, they're also someone who is
at the forefront of the field that they're,
582
00:37:25.630 --> 00:37:29.869
you know, up selling to so
that we can produce you know really,
583
00:37:30.260 --> 00:37:34.539
you know far leading future leading thoughts
and help guide businesses forward, not
584
00:37:34.659 --> 00:37:37.579
just by the technology that we create
but also, you know, the theory
585
00:37:37.659 --> 00:37:42.739
that they need to utilize to succeed
with. Yeah, I I was in
586
00:37:42.820 --> 00:37:47.530
a session at dream force with a
couple researchers who were working on essentially future
587
00:37:47.610 --> 00:37:52.170
of work, which may be about
you and like, how many of you
588
00:37:54.090 --> 00:38:00.280
different topic areas are there inside an
organization like sales force? It's hard to
589
00:38:00.400 --> 00:38:04.239
count, you know, when you
start getting into I have a team.
590
00:38:04.280 --> 00:38:06.639
I sit on the market strap,
a G teams. I'm not tides and
591
00:38:06.719 --> 00:38:10.239
actual cloud product. I'm a side, separate entity. But then each products
592
00:38:10.280 --> 00:38:14.030
have their own evangelists, have their
own research, you know. So we
593
00:38:14.110 --> 00:38:16.869
have it very distributed across the organization. But all my team, there's probably
594
00:38:16.869 --> 00:38:21.269
about ten of us, each has
a different role. So we know IOT
595
00:38:21.909 --> 00:38:25.030
future of work. What the customer, sales and marketing? You've got a
596
00:38:25.070 --> 00:38:28.900
bunch of different ones that are rolled
up into that kind and I really focus
597
00:38:29.019 --> 00:38:31.699
on the future of marketing. Awesome
and it shows you're doing a lot of
598
00:38:31.739 --> 00:38:36.860
great work around. It's really fun
and interesting. Last question, another linkedin
599
00:38:36.940 --> 00:38:39.300
post of yours. This is just
interesting to me and highly consequential and it
600
00:38:39.420 --> 00:38:43.929
seems very relevant to people who maybe
haven't noticed. But you know that that
601
00:38:43.969 --> 00:38:46.250
chrome is planning to kill off third
party cookies by two thousand and twenty two.
602
00:38:47.449 --> 00:38:51.690
Yeah, what? What? What
do you think is the motivation and
603
00:38:51.809 --> 00:38:55.320
what are the implications? I mean
the motivation easy, if they don't do
604
00:38:55.519 --> 00:38:59.480
it, there's going to be government
regulation that's going to regulate them to do
605
00:38:59.559 --> 00:39:01.719
it anyways. So I mean it's
they're just trying to get ahead of the
606
00:39:01.760 --> 00:39:05.599
boat, right. So that's why
they're doing it. Right, privacy,
607
00:39:05.679 --> 00:39:09.349
individual privacy, customer privacy. Third
party cookies really aren't great for individual privacy.
608
00:39:09.670 --> 00:39:13.070
Then a lot of the people who
created the Internet believe that they've gone
609
00:39:13.070 --> 00:39:16.230
run. They've run them Mak and
we've used them to really do the consumer
610
00:39:16.309 --> 00:39:20.909
and disservice to the pretty much everyone's
going away with them. So, you
611
00:39:20.989 --> 00:39:22.869
know, five years out we should
really be thinking about a post third party
612
00:39:22.909 --> 00:39:25.619
cookie world. That doesn't mean post
first and second, it means post third.
613
00:39:25.980 --> 00:39:30.099
So we're going to figure out new
ways of attribution, new ways of
614
00:39:30.219 --> 00:39:34.940
reporting, new ways of tracking,
new way of engagement. But the good
615
00:39:35.019 --> 00:39:37.139
news is that it's longest. You
know, a lot of those things were
616
00:39:37.179 --> 00:39:43.889
just for you know, Third Party
advertising, programmatic, advised retargeting and in
617
00:39:43.969 --> 00:39:45.769
the attribution of those things. So, you know, we're just going to
618
00:39:45.769 --> 00:39:49.130
be a new world and I think, you know that's really when, if
619
00:39:49.170 --> 00:39:52.570
you double down on contact in that
notion, right, move past just I
620
00:39:52.610 --> 00:39:54.440
can push button and advertise to anybody. So now we need to really focus
621
00:39:54.519 --> 00:39:59.079
on how do we connect one human
to another human and do so and first
622
00:39:59.119 --> 00:40:01.320
and second party ways. We're really
going to build a much strong and more
623
00:40:01.360 --> 00:40:05.960
durable brand with better data. That's, you know, regulation proof for you
624
00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:08.070
know, zero first and second party
data is regulation proof. You know,
625
00:40:08.150 --> 00:40:12.389
we have permission to use that,
which once again put permission at the forefront.
626
00:40:12.750 --> 00:40:15.190
You know, when we do ask
for permission, we build a different
627
00:40:15.190 --> 00:40:17.469
type of trust. We build a
deeper trust for our individuals and helps us
628
00:40:17.469 --> 00:40:21.659
break through. So yeah, so
you know, it's a PRONOCON right.
629
00:40:21.659 --> 00:40:22.300
So we're not going to be able
to do the same things that used to
630
00:40:22.340 --> 00:40:25.099
do, but I think will be
better for everybody moving forward. Yeah,
631
00:40:25.300 --> 00:40:30.659
so good. I just had a
flash there of how how long ago Seth
632
00:40:30.739 --> 00:40:35.059
Guns Permission Marketing was written, but
how far we have not come in some
633
00:40:35.219 --> 00:40:37.210
ways against it, you know,
just the spirit of it in general,
634
00:40:37.289 --> 00:40:40.530
and so it's interesting, as I
think is I think about good brands and
635
00:40:42.329 --> 00:40:45.690
good product, services and experience.
It really it just a lot of it
636
00:40:45.809 --> 00:40:50.320
comes down to being a great human
being that other people want to be around.
637
00:40:50.320 --> 00:40:52.440
It's like those qualities are the qualities
you want to provide such that you
638
00:40:52.920 --> 00:40:55.559
people are attracted to you and they
feel good around you and they feel good
639
00:40:55.599 --> 00:41:00.599
about themselves. And Yeah, it's
good. Thanks for that passage. Gay
640
00:41:00.599 --> 00:41:02.360
Man, this is been awesome.
I really appreciate the work that you're doing
641
00:41:02.440 --> 00:41:08.230
a enjoy you personally and before we
go, I want to give you the
642
00:41:08.349 --> 00:41:13.989
chance to bring to life one of
our core values here at bombomb, which
643
00:41:13.989 --> 00:41:15.989
is relationships. And so I like
to give you the chance to think or
644
00:41:16.070 --> 00:41:20.659
mentioned someone who's had a positive impact
on your life or career and to give
645
00:41:20.659 --> 00:41:23.300
a nod to a brand or a
company that you really appreciate for the experience
646
00:41:23.300 --> 00:41:28.460
state provide for you as a customer. All right, yeah, so first
647
00:41:28.539 --> 00:41:30.699
I'd like to give a shout out
to DOC searles. You mentioned them earlier,
648
00:41:30.739 --> 00:41:36.250
author Clue Train Manifesto. Doc is
definitely been very helpful. Either reach
649
00:41:36.329 --> 00:41:38.130
out to is definitely helped guide me, helps a lot with the book and
650
00:41:38.170 --> 00:41:42.250
the in terms of, you know, just questions and just someone that's been
651
00:41:42.329 --> 00:41:45.929
great. I love the work that
he produces. He's an awesome human and
652
00:41:45.050 --> 00:41:47.719
he's definitely helped me out a lot. So shout out to doc. And
653
00:41:47.840 --> 00:41:52.920
then a company I highly respect and
I think create a great customer experience for
654
00:41:52.960 --> 00:41:54.599
me as well as others, is
with you. They're probably one of my
655
00:41:54.679 --> 00:42:00.360
favorites. I've known them personally for
going on ten years. I'll always love
656
00:42:00.440 --> 00:42:04.190
the individuals that they hire, the
culture that they put together, the marketing
657
00:42:04.230 --> 00:42:07.550
that they put out, the software
that they create and the experience just in
658
00:42:07.710 --> 00:42:12.550
general of everything that they do.
It's very unique, very specific and it's
659
00:42:12.590 --> 00:42:17.460
a great example of how culture and
how leadership really does create a culture and
660
00:42:17.539 --> 00:42:22.260
if it's not at the executive level, it's very difficult to create such a
661
00:42:22.340 --> 00:42:25.579
positive and unique culture inside of organization
if the executives don't have it. So
662
00:42:25.699 --> 00:42:30.090
that was said, I'll go with
those two awesome and that's a reflection of
663
00:42:30.090 --> 00:42:32.730
another kind of background theme on the
show, which is that a great employee
664
00:42:32.730 --> 00:42:38.289
experience begets or is it necessary precursor
to a great customer experience, and culture
665
00:42:38.369 --> 00:42:42.010
is one of the words that kind
of capture some of that essence. We
666
00:42:42.090 --> 00:42:47.159
already talked about pre ordering the context
marketing revolution on Amazon. I mentioned your
667
00:42:47.440 --> 00:42:52.199
someone great to follow on Linkedin.
How else could someone follow up with you
668
00:42:52.280 --> 00:42:54.599
and your work if you're if people
enjoyed this conversation, they liked the ideas,
669
00:42:54.639 --> 00:42:58.750
they want to go deeper, where
would you send people? Yes,
670
00:42:58.989 --> 00:43:00.389
I mean two things. One,
and make sure either follow me on linked
671
00:43:00.429 --> 00:43:05.030
in or twitter. I published their
on a pretty weekly basis. If you
672
00:43:05.110 --> 00:43:07.750
haven't listened to the podcast and want
to kind of get a jump on with
673
00:43:07.829 --> 00:43:09.230
the book, talks about it.
They make sure you listen to the electronic
674
00:43:09.309 --> 00:43:14.260
propaganda society and it definitely please pre
order the book. I think you'll enjoy
675
00:43:14.260 --> 00:43:19.579
it and really the goal is to
really help marketers. Not necessarily help marketers
676
00:43:19.619 --> 00:43:22.500
as much, but help markers make
the case to their executives of why we
677
00:43:22.539 --> 00:43:24.699
must change you go down this different
path, and that's really the focus of
678
00:43:24.739 --> 00:43:29.650
the book is to help you have
the firepower to make these changes internally in
679
00:43:29.730 --> 00:43:34.570
your organization. Really good, because
it's big, it's scary, it's revolutionary,
680
00:43:35.250 --> 00:43:38.170
and so I think being better informed, better equipped to make these arguments
681
00:43:38.210 --> 00:43:44.800
and to make these observations internally and
even collaborating across teams and building consensus around
682
00:43:44.800 --> 00:43:47.760
some of these ideas. So I
hope the book delivers on your mission,
683
00:43:49.280 --> 00:43:52.599
because I think we'll be enjoying our
lives and businesses a little bit more when
684
00:43:52.639 --> 00:43:55.789
we start moving more in that direction. Thanks so much for your time today
685
00:43:55.789 --> 00:44:00.909
at really really enjoyed it and hope
you have a great week of since like
686
00:44:00.030 --> 00:44:06.110
so much for the chance. I
hope you're thinking a little bit differently about
687
00:44:06.190 --> 00:44:09.300
your go to market strategy after listening
to that conversation with Matt. If you
688
00:44:09.380 --> 00:44:14.059
want to check out some video clips
from the episode and get links to some
689
00:44:14.219 --> 00:44:16.579
of those great books that we talked
about, you can get that in a
690
00:44:16.619 --> 00:44:24.489
whole lot more by visiting bombombcom forward
slash podcast. That's bombombcom slash podcast.
691
00:44:25.010 --> 00:44:30.050
My name is Ethan Butte and thanks
again for listening to the BE TOB growth
692
00:44:30.130 --> 00:44:37.449
show. Hey, everybody, Logan
with sweetfish here. If you're a regular
693
00:44:37.530 --> 00:44:39.880
listener of BB growth, you know
that I'm one of the cohosts of the
694
00:44:39.960 --> 00:44:44.320
show, but you may not know
that I also head up the sales team
695
00:44:44.400 --> 00:44:47.000
here is sweetfish. So for those
of you in sales or sales offs,
696
00:44:47.159 --> 00:44:52.119
I wanted to take a second to
share something that's made us insanely more efficient
697
00:44:52.199 --> 00:44:55.190
lately. Our team has been using
lead Iq for the past few months and
698
00:44:55.349 --> 00:45:00.909
what used to take us four hours
gathering contact data now takes us only one,
699
00:45:00.989 --> 00:45:05.590
or seventy five percent more efficient.
We're able to move faster without bound
700
00:45:05.630 --> 00:45:10.219
prospecting and organizing our campaigns is so
much easier than before. I'd highly suggest
701
00:45:10.300 --> 00:45:14.579
you guys check out lead Iq as
well. You can check them out at
702
00:45:14.619 --> 00:45:19.860
lead iqcom. That's ee ad iqcom.