#CX 38: Certifying Your Sales Team To Speak Your Customers' Language w/ Alex Rosemblat

WEBVTT 1 00:00:06.040 --> 00:00:10.390 A relationship with the right referral partner could be a game changer for any BEDB 2 00:00:10.509 --> 00:00:15.150 company. So what if you could reverse engineer these relationships at a moment's notice, 3 00:00:15.189 --> 00:00:20.629 start a podcast, invite potential referral partners to be guests on your show 4 00:00:21.269 --> 00:00:26.940 and grow your referral network faster than ever? Learn more. At sweetphish Mediacom 5 00:00:31.780 --> 00:00:35.929 you're listening to be tob growth, a daily podcast for B TOB leaders. 6 00:00:36.530 --> 00:00:40.369 We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, like Gary vanner truck and Simon Senek, 7 00:00:40.729 --> 00:00:44.729 but you've probably never heard from the majority of our guests. That's because 8 00:00:44.770 --> 00:00:49.210 the bulk of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. Most of our 9 00:00:49.250 --> 00:00:53.600 guests are in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. They're implementing strategy, 10 00:00:53.679 --> 00:00:58.520 they're experimenting with Pactics, they're building the fastest growing BTB companies in the world. 11 00:00:59.159 --> 00:01:00.719 My name is James Carberry. I'm the founder of sweet fish media, 12 00:01:00.960 --> 00:01:04.629 a podcast agency for BB brands, and I'm also one of the CO hosts 13 00:01:04.670 --> 00:01:08.469 of this show. When we're not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, you'll hear 14 00:01:08.590 --> 00:01:12.109 stories from behind the scenes of our own business, will share the ups and 15 00:01:12.230 --> 00:01:17.189 downs of our journey as we attempt to take over the world. Just getting 16 00:01:17.790 --> 00:01:26.659 well, maybe let's get into the show. Building a curriculum to guide your 17 00:01:26.739 --> 00:01:32.890 sales team, training and certifying sales people to speak like your customers in an 18 00:01:32.930 --> 00:01:37.969 effort to create greater marketing and sales alignment and to accelerate revenue. That's something 19 00:01:38.049 --> 00:01:42.409 today's guest has tackled. My name is Ethan Butte and this is a x 20 00:01:42.530 --> 00:01:48.640 episode here on the B Tob Growth Show. It's obviously important to develop ICEPS 21 00:01:48.879 --> 00:01:53.519 and real personas. It's important to understand what's unique in nuanced about the types 22 00:01:53.599 --> 00:01:59.480 of people that we serve. It's critical that the entire business is organized around 23 00:01:59.640 --> 00:02:05.549 empathy for our customers and specificity about them. But in this conversation you'll go 24 00:02:05.590 --> 00:02:10.110 a step deeper to a full training and certification system so that your salespeople can 25 00:02:10.150 --> 00:02:17.819 be more effective connecting and communicating with your customers. Here we go. Hey, 26 00:02:17.939 --> 00:02:22.139 welcome back to the customer experience podcast. If you want to learn a 27 00:02:22.180 --> 00:02:27.300 little bit about training and certifying sales teams to speak the customers language, who 28 00:02:27.300 --> 00:02:30.729 are in the right place. Today's guest brings to the conversation. More than 29 00:02:30.770 --> 00:02:36.449 a decade of enterprise software experience in product marketing and in product management. He 30 00:02:36.569 --> 00:02:39.650 spent time at Semantic, v Colonel and Dell. He earned his MBA at 31 00:02:39.810 --> 00:02:44.800 mit and for the past six years he's been at data dog, a monitoring 32 00:02:44.800 --> 00:02:49.159 and analytics service for modern cloud environments. He serves as their vice president of 33 00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:53.159 marketing. Alex Rosenblatt, welcome to the customer experience podcast. Thank you being 34 00:02:53.199 --> 00:02:57.039 going to be here. Yeah, you know, I'm really excited to get 35 00:02:57.080 --> 00:03:01.750 into this idea and learn how and why you've pursued it around training and certifying 36 00:03:01.789 --> 00:03:07.509 sales teams. Partly my interest is in the relationship between sales and marketing that 37 00:03:07.590 --> 00:03:09.750 permits this to happen. But we'll start where we always start here, which 38 00:03:09.750 --> 00:03:14.099 is, you know, your thoughts are your definition or characteristics you think of 39 00:03:14.259 --> 00:03:17.460 when you think of customer experience? Yeah, you know, I mean I 40 00:03:17.620 --> 00:03:22.219 think that the big thing that I think about with customer experience when you're working 41 00:03:22.259 --> 00:03:24.259 at a company, I think that you get really bogged down and how you're 42 00:03:24.300 --> 00:03:28.689 going to deliver the product of the service set that you're going to be giving, 43 00:03:29.409 --> 00:03:31.449 you know, to to the person that's going to be using whatever it 44 00:03:31.530 --> 00:03:35.569 is that you're offering. But you really have to turn it around and realize 45 00:03:35.610 --> 00:03:38.409 that for the person that is the customer, like they don't know about all 46 00:03:38.449 --> 00:03:42.719 the difficulties are everything that's going on behind the scenes. They only care about 47 00:03:42.879 --> 00:03:46.719 what they're going to receive in terms of a product or service. So well, 48 00:03:46.879 --> 00:03:49.360 we always try to have as a mindset here is what's going to be 49 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:52.840 the perception of the customer and they're actually using our product, you know, 50 00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:55.990 and it's got to be good. I think that most industries nowadays there's a 51 00:03:55.990 --> 00:04:00.870 lot of options, you know, especially in technology, with the advent of 52 00:04:00.909 --> 00:04:03.590 cloud computing, which is the space that we play in. You know, 53 00:04:04.270 --> 00:04:08.430 it's amazing to me that all you need is a credit card. You know, 54 00:04:08.509 --> 00:04:13.419 anybody with a credit card can start a cloud environment up for not very 55 00:04:13.460 --> 00:04:15.300 much money and, if they know what they're doing, can put together a 56 00:04:15.459 --> 00:04:18.980 prototype for an application pretty quick and Bam, you can go out there and 57 00:04:19.139 --> 00:04:21.939 compete with a big company if you want to. So, you know, 58 00:04:21.980 --> 00:04:26.970 going back to customer experience, I think that for a lot of a lot 59 00:04:27.009 --> 00:04:30.370 of companies out there, if you stop really keeping that in mind and you 60 00:04:30.449 --> 00:04:33.490 lose side of the customers or what they are, you know, how they're 61 00:04:33.490 --> 00:04:38.089 interacting with or whatever is that you're offering, someone else is going to come 62 00:04:38.170 --> 00:04:42.360 out there and compete for them and potentially take them. Great breakdown there. 63 00:04:42.399 --> 00:04:44.759 I really like it. I like this idea that we can get caught up 64 00:04:44.759 --> 00:04:47.920 in our own tasks and checklists and things and we lose sight of the customer 65 00:04:48.000 --> 00:04:53.509 pretty often. This idea that there is, you know, functionally approaching infinite 66 00:04:53.509 --> 00:04:57.670 competition, because all these cloud services are built on other cloud services and, 67 00:04:57.750 --> 00:05:00.509 to your point, all it takes is the ability to take a credit card 68 00:05:00.550 --> 00:05:03.629 number, and so this perception piece is critical as well, because that's what 69 00:05:03.709 --> 00:05:06.899 we carry for, that's the feelings that we have, is the stories that 70 00:05:06.939 --> 00:05:10.860 we tell. So love that breakdown there. Hey, for context before we 71 00:05:10.939 --> 00:05:14.339 get into the primary tapic here. Can you share with people a little bit 72 00:05:14.339 --> 00:05:16.139 about your background, Alex, and a little bit about data dog as well? 73 00:05:16.660 --> 00:05:20.850 Sure. For me personally, I started from, you know, Undergrad, 74 00:05:20.930 --> 00:05:25.930 being much more technology focused. My first couple of roles first and enterprise 75 00:05:26.009 --> 00:05:29.850 software and then in online day. To back up, I'm sorry, online 76 00:05:30.170 --> 00:05:32.250 first enterprize howcare software, and then Onlin Day to back up. I was 77 00:05:32.290 --> 00:05:38.079 much more technology focused, basically working with product teams to make sure that the 78 00:05:38.199 --> 00:05:41.720 solutions that we were delivering for our customers with exactly what they expect out in. 79 00:05:41.720 --> 00:05:45.519 A lot of it required custom development, and I actually try to start 80 00:05:45.519 --> 00:05:48.079 a company when I went to Grad School. One of might and I partnered 81 00:05:48.120 --> 00:05:53.189 with with another technologist. We built the prototype for something that was like mind 82 00:05:53.230 --> 00:05:57.350 blowing and I was at to trying to get Beta customers for the prototype that 83 00:05:57.389 --> 00:06:00.670 we had and even though everyone took a look at what we built, they're 84 00:06:00.670 --> 00:06:02.670 like wow, that's awesome, nobody would agree to even try that for free. 85 00:06:03.189 --> 00:06:06.620 And it wasn't until we were meeting with some angel investors that, you 86 00:06:06.699 --> 00:06:10.579 know, one of them said, hey, you know what, you guys 87 00:06:10.579 --> 00:06:13.980 seem really bright. Your product prototype seems really interesting. If I was to 88 00:06:14.100 --> 00:06:15.660 just throw you guys a million dollars just because I can and I have it 89 00:06:15.740 --> 00:06:17.930 in the bank and I think that you guys have a future. But I 90 00:06:17.970 --> 00:06:20.569 said, you could only use it to get customers. What would you do 91 00:06:20.689 --> 00:06:25.129 with it? And we had no idea. So that was kind of my 92 00:06:25.209 --> 00:06:30.250 introduction to the point that I really, you know, hadn't thought about what 93 00:06:30.410 --> 00:06:32.759 it would take to get somebody to part with money and that really started me 94 00:06:32.839 --> 00:06:38.319 down the paths from marketing and I've basically been in marketing ever since. In 95 00:06:38.480 --> 00:06:41.879 Tech, been through a couple of acquisitions. I've seen start up Smith size 96 00:06:41.920 --> 00:06:46.240 companies, really really big fortune by a hundred companies from the inside worked with 97 00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:49.350 customers and, you know, I think that another part of it. I've 98 00:06:49.389 --> 00:06:54.790 been in tech because, having come from being a technologist, I have a 99 00:06:54.829 --> 00:07:00.230 pretty good understanding of what that specific persona is looking for and what they're going 100 00:07:00.269 --> 00:07:02.420 to react to. But again, I think that for any customer they definitely 101 00:07:02.459 --> 00:07:10.259 have their you know, hot buttons and the same lessons apply. So you 102 00:07:10.379 --> 00:07:15.379 know, basically I after that experience I dedicated myself to learning a lot more 103 00:07:15.420 --> 00:07:18.889 about go to market, both sales and marketing, and have really merged, 104 00:07:18.970 --> 00:07:23.689 I think, an engineering methodology. You with what it takes to get out 105 00:07:23.730 --> 00:07:27.850 into the market, present your product to people and get them interested to try 106 00:07:27.850 --> 00:07:33.079 it out. For Data Dog, we are a monitoring platform for modern dynamic 107 00:07:33.319 --> 00:07:39.519 applications. A lot of our customers run their applications on public clouds like Amazon 108 00:07:39.639 --> 00:07:43.959 web services or Microsoft asure Google cloud platform, but we also do have a 109 00:07:44.000 --> 00:07:46.949 lot of customers that are doing some pretty advanced stuff with all premise servers and 110 00:07:47.310 --> 00:07:50.990 you know, once it it's dynamic and work blowths can just shift around based 111 00:07:51.029 --> 00:07:55.470 on the need of the application. Things get a lot more complicated. It's 112 00:07:55.509 --> 00:07:58.860 really good functionality, but it also makes it hard to keep track of everything 113 00:07:58.899 --> 00:08:03.420 that's going on underneath the application, and we've basically built out a whole platform 114 00:08:03.899 --> 00:08:07.860 that gives you a hundred percent visibility into everything that's happening in every part of 115 00:08:07.939 --> 00:08:13.009 that application so that if an issue happens and it's a needle on the haystack, 116 00:08:13.050 --> 00:08:15.970 we're able to group you find it for you. So good I by 117 00:08:16.050 --> 00:08:18.170 the way, before we go further, I have to say that is one 118 00:08:18.170 --> 00:08:22.730 of my favorite marketing origin stories because it's just it's it was such a blunt 119 00:08:22.370 --> 00:08:26.759 moment there, whereas like I don't have any ideas and and theyet the idea 120 00:08:26.800 --> 00:08:31.679 that you've continued to pursue that over the next many years is awesome and in 121 00:08:31.799 --> 00:08:35.120 that that background for you to I'm sure, lends itself really well to being 122 00:08:35.159 --> 00:08:41.190 successful as a as a technology marketer. Let's get into training and certifying sales 123 00:08:41.269 --> 00:08:46.509 teams to speak the customers language and there are several things I love about this 124 00:08:46.669 --> 00:08:50.110 one, especially now with the context of your background. But you know, 125 00:08:50.230 --> 00:08:54.029 the nest a sary relationship between sales and marketing. They have that trust in 126 00:08:54.110 --> 00:08:58.539 rapport that allows this to be done, raising up the customers language as a 127 00:08:58.620 --> 00:09:03.740 really important factor, as well as creating some continuity in the customer experience by 128 00:09:03.820 --> 00:09:07.259 being joined at the hip, at least on this function, if not others. 129 00:09:07.379 --> 00:09:09.529 So let's break that down a little bit and start with, you know, 130 00:09:09.850 --> 00:09:13.289 why does this matter to you? Why did you pursue it? What 131 00:09:13.450 --> 00:09:16.210 was kind of the origin of this, this project or practice for you? 132 00:09:18.250 --> 00:09:20.850 Yeah, I think the big thing. You know, I don't know if 133 00:09:20.850 --> 00:09:24.440 a lot of the listeners out here have seen some of the shows that that 134 00:09:24.600 --> 00:09:28.159 really focus around, like the tech community, Silicon Valley and is a really 135 00:09:28.200 --> 00:09:31.799 popular one. Mr Robots another one, you know, with developers and site 136 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:37.200 reliability engineers, which are the users of our product. You know, there's 137 00:09:37.240 --> 00:09:41.149 a real, I guess, like a set of values, norms, language 138 00:09:41.149 --> 00:09:43.190 and you know, they all they all work on similar challenges, they all 139 00:09:43.269 --> 00:09:46.870 similar passions in terms of the work that they do. They're very passionate and 140 00:09:46.990 --> 00:09:52.309 there's there's a whole kind of community that exists around it, and the thing 141 00:09:52.470 --> 00:09:54.820 is, you know, no, somebody that is not at that community will 142 00:09:54.860 --> 00:09:58.379 never be that you know from that community. But I think it's almost the 143 00:09:58.419 --> 00:10:01.700 equivalent of like, if you're going to, you know, a foreign country 144 00:10:01.700 --> 00:10:03.940 that speaks another language to visit, if you learn some of the basics, 145 00:10:05.340 --> 00:10:09.529 you know, like where's the train station? I'd like a hotel room for, 146 00:10:09.649 --> 00:10:11.129 you know, for one person, for two people, you get really 147 00:10:11.169 --> 00:10:15.970 far and if you know, you go somewhere and there and you don't have 148 00:10:16.090 --> 00:10:18.570 at least those basics, like good luck, you're not going to be able 149 00:10:18.570 --> 00:10:22.159 to communicate with the people that you're talking to. So I mean, I 150 00:10:22.240 --> 00:10:26.679 think that there's a lot of that for someone to have a good conversation just 151 00:10:26.720 --> 00:10:31.200 to start out and interaction with with a company. So it became apparent very 152 00:10:31.240 --> 00:10:33.840 early on, and this isn't just at day to dog, but in my 153 00:10:33.919 --> 00:10:39.990 previous positions and marketing, that you know, you've got people that are that 154 00:10:39.070 --> 00:10:41.470 are doing sales, as that are doing marketing, and they're very good at 155 00:10:41.470 --> 00:10:46.309 the jobs, but they are not technologists. They didn't go and, you 156 00:10:46.389 --> 00:10:48.870 know, tool around with programming when they're in high school or they you know, 157 00:10:48.909 --> 00:10:52.019 they didn't go through a computer science or some other sort of engineering degree 158 00:10:52.019 --> 00:10:56.779 and in Undergrad and you know they don't have the same background, they don't 159 00:10:56.779 --> 00:11:00.299 have the same training, they don't have the same methodology of how they see 160 00:11:00.299 --> 00:11:03.690 the world, and so, you know, you need to educate someone on 161 00:11:03.889 --> 00:11:07.970 what all that is, and just telling them about it isn't enough that you 162 00:11:09.090 --> 00:11:11.570 have to train them enough so that they can actually speak enough the language to 163 00:11:11.649 --> 00:11:16.009 start a conversation off. kind of like the same, you know, equivalent 164 00:11:16.049 --> 00:11:20.240 if you wanted somebody to go to a country with another language. You want 165 00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:22.279 to drill them on the basic so that it's in their head and whenever they're, 166 00:11:22.679 --> 00:11:26.240 you know, they go to a restaurant, they're able to order, 167 00:11:26.279 --> 00:11:28.519 you know, a meal. So they need to know, like you know, 168 00:11:28.840 --> 00:11:31.679 how to order, you know, chicken or vegetables or whatever else, 169 00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:35.830 so that that's really where the impasis for this came from. I love it 170 00:11:35.909 --> 00:11:39.190 because when you can speak in a way that that doesn't create friction. Right, 171 00:11:39.350 --> 00:11:43.870 like they're not using my lingo, they don't understand who I am. 172 00:11:43.990 --> 00:11:48.860 Right there's there's this trust component in the sales brought sess that is immediately greased 173 00:11:48.899 --> 00:11:54.899 or immediately slowed down or you know, there's friction there if you can't speak 174 00:11:54.940 --> 00:11:56.700 that language. So so really, really important. So for you, you 175 00:11:58.299 --> 00:12:00.539 know, as I think about, you know, a listener to this and 176 00:12:00.860 --> 00:12:05.450 maybe outlining a number of potential customers, like different types of customers. For 177 00:12:05.529 --> 00:12:09.250 you, of course, learning what the customers language is is very easy because 178 00:12:09.289 --> 00:12:13.889 it is, you know, you are kin to them based on your background. 179 00:12:13.889 --> 00:12:20.399 But you have any recommendations around like process or documentation, around personas or 180 00:12:20.399 --> 00:12:22.799 ideal customer profiles or anything that? For someone who's listening, where would they 181 00:12:22.840 --> 00:12:28.000 start in terms of trying to capture the customers language so that it can be 182 00:12:28.120 --> 00:12:31.590 taught in certified yeah, I think that the number one thing to do is 183 00:12:31.149 --> 00:12:35.590 to get a microphone, you know, by something that that's easy and portable 184 00:12:37.149 --> 00:12:41.470 and that you can kind of pop down and then try to find people either 185 00:12:41.669 --> 00:12:45.179 from your company, you know, maybe a founder of you're at a startup 186 00:12:45.220 --> 00:12:48.259 or you know, some sort of subject matter expert of you're at a bigger 187 00:12:48.299 --> 00:12:50.860 company, or maybe a customer or maybe someone from your own from your own 188 00:12:50.860 --> 00:12:54.820 network. Find a couple of people and sit down and you know more than 189 00:12:54.899 --> 00:12:58.649 just say just like ask him. I think that a really good place to 190 00:12:58.730 --> 00:13:01.409 start is, why don't you take me through your day in your life for 191 00:13:01.490 --> 00:13:03.610 a week in your month or a month, you know, like what is 192 00:13:03.649 --> 00:13:05.409 kind of a standard unit where you go through all the kinds of things that 193 00:13:05.529 --> 00:13:09.169 you usually do from beginning to end and have you walk them through it. 194 00:13:09.850 --> 00:13:13.279 You know, an example that I often uses like if you were to ask 195 00:13:13.360 --> 00:13:15.759 somebody what they did this morning, they probably be like, Oh, well, 196 00:13:15.759 --> 00:13:18.879 I will got by a sick shower at breakfast and got you know and 197 00:13:18.200 --> 00:13:22.000 made it over to work. But there's so much more that they did. 198 00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:24.679 It's like what do you have for breakfast? Well, I had exagemicum. 199 00:13:24.759 --> 00:13:26.789 Well, I had them scrambled. You know, like just taking kind of 200 00:13:26.830 --> 00:13:30.549 the the bullet points is not enough. You have to get in there into 201 00:13:30.590 --> 00:13:33.750 the rich detail and and understand like okay, when you were making eggs, 202 00:13:33.789 --> 00:13:35.990 that they stick to the pan. Yeah, they did. Kind of. 203 00:13:35.070 --> 00:13:37.789 That was really annoying. You know, maybe if you were selling cooking tools 204 00:13:37.830 --> 00:13:41.220 like that would be the kind of conversation that you have. But I think 205 00:13:41.220 --> 00:13:43.860 a good place to start is just a day in the life or you know, 206 00:13:43.899 --> 00:13:48.500 a week in the month and try to get into that rich color. 207 00:13:48.059 --> 00:13:50.340 You know, it's almost as if you were like a novelist, you know, 208 00:13:50.460 --> 00:13:54.860 like describe you know again, just most novelist don't just say we went 209 00:13:54.940 --> 00:13:56.929 to the beach. It's like the deep blue of the ocean contrasted with the 210 00:13:56.970 --> 00:14:00.210 light blue of the sky. You want to get to that level of color 211 00:14:00.850 --> 00:14:03.210 and I think that we're things start to get really interesting. I call it 212 00:14:03.330 --> 00:14:09.929 the CRINKLE's probably other words for it, when people start pausing in the addiction 213 00:14:09.039 --> 00:14:13.320 and you you can usually hear this really well when you play back the recording. 214 00:14:13.759 --> 00:14:16.600 That's when, all of a sudden you get painter and I think that 215 00:14:16.639 --> 00:14:18.840 they're pausing because they're trying to think about the best way to say it, 216 00:14:20.039 --> 00:14:22.879 or perhaps they're trying to euphamize, like it's something that's really painful or hard 217 00:14:22.879 --> 00:14:26.509 and they're trying to like color over it. Basically, there's they're not speaking 218 00:14:26.509 --> 00:14:31.429 freely and it's because they're thinking about should they cover something up? Should they 219 00:14:31.470 --> 00:14:33.789 change the meaning of it? Would there's maybe a lot more information that they 220 00:14:33.830 --> 00:14:37.309 have to unpack for you and understand what they're saying. And usually when you 221 00:14:37.350 --> 00:14:41.220 start hearing those pauses and a conversation, you start hit pater and you're starting 222 00:14:41.259 --> 00:14:45.259 to like really understand things that are super important that you definitely want to be 223 00:14:45.740 --> 00:14:50.019 documenting and then turning it around into some sort of training for sales people or 224 00:14:50.059 --> 00:14:52.610 f other go to market people, so if they understand these critical things in 225 00:14:52.809 --> 00:14:58.289 someone's day today that caused problems or or pain or other kind of difficulties. 226 00:14:58.889 --> 00:15:01.690 Such a great tip and I and if you happen to catch it in real 227 00:15:01.730 --> 00:15:05.730 time prior to playing back the recording, that might be a great spot to 228 00:15:05.809 --> 00:15:09.080 ask a follow up question as well. So as you organize this capture, 229 00:15:09.240 --> 00:15:13.559 probably documented in some way, start sharing it around. How formal are we 230 00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:16.919 talking here, like what kind of training and certification are you doing? Like 231 00:15:18.440 --> 00:15:22.309 what types of training, and what a certification permit like? or their doors 232 00:15:22.389 --> 00:15:24.789 closed to people who haven't been certified? Like you know, how seriously are 233 00:15:24.830 --> 00:15:30.470 you implementing this? That's a great question. So I think that once you 234 00:15:30.590 --> 00:15:33.429 have your list of everything, so I think that that the building block, 235 00:15:33.629 --> 00:15:37.980 you know, the individual brick if you will, is recordings and, you 236 00:15:37.059 --> 00:15:41.259 know, trying to delve into each thing that's important to know about someone's, 237 00:15:41.379 --> 00:15:43.860 you know, day to day responsibilities, things that are easy, things that 238 00:15:43.860 --> 00:15:48.220 are hard, things that make them successful, things that cause them trouble. 239 00:15:48.779 --> 00:15:52.330 Once you have, as as far as you can tell, the whole list 240 00:15:52.409 --> 00:15:54.730 and you're going to keep on adding to the list as your industry changes or 241 00:15:54.769 --> 00:15:58.570 new technologies come out, are you yourself learn more about what you're working on 242 00:15:58.610 --> 00:16:00.090 and you realize that you missed a lot. But you have to start somewhere. 243 00:16:00.690 --> 00:16:04.080 You have to build out a curriculum and this this can be a pretty 244 00:16:04.360 --> 00:16:07.720 tough one. I think that sometimes you have to have a lot to go 245 00:16:07.919 --> 00:16:11.639 goes at it. I think that one pro tip here is that while you're 246 00:16:11.639 --> 00:16:15.159 building out like the name, you know, the name of the class or 247 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:18.990 the name of the segment, another column to have immediately before it are what 248 00:16:19.110 --> 00:16:22.870 are the prerequisites? So if you're building on knowledge you know, it's like 249 00:16:22.990 --> 00:16:26.629 you can't have, you know, Spanish one or two before. He took 250 00:16:26.629 --> 00:16:30.110 Spanish one on one. So you have to basically start saying what all the 251 00:16:30.149 --> 00:16:33.379 prerequisites are and usually once you write those, all those things down, you 252 00:16:33.539 --> 00:16:37.779 turn it kind of backwards and you start to figure out what the first courses 253 00:16:37.820 --> 00:16:41.500 that you need to have or you start to realize that there's additional courses because 254 00:16:41.500 --> 00:16:45.139 there's some prerequisite knowledge that you hadn't originally put out there, and I think 255 00:16:45.139 --> 00:16:48.009 that with the curriculum that's from chopping it up. I don't you probably shouldn't 256 00:16:48.009 --> 00:16:51.610 have a sessions going to go longer than an hour. If it's longer than 257 00:16:51.649 --> 00:16:53.210 an hour, you should chop it up and make it into multiple sessions. 258 00:16:53.610 --> 00:16:56.570 But then the sequencing of the session, I think, is important. Another 259 00:16:56.649 --> 00:17:02.120 important thing to note is that there's a lot of times that giving somebody some 260 00:17:02.279 --> 00:17:04.599 knowledge without the context about why this is important means that it's going to go 261 00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:08.119 in one ear and out the other and sometimes people have to struggle a little 262 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:11.880 bit. So we have a couple of really basic training things like teaching kind 263 00:17:11.880 --> 00:17:17.710 of history and terminology and just the main things that people do to use our 264 00:17:17.789 --> 00:17:19.829 product, that people get within the first week or two that they're out our 265 00:17:19.869 --> 00:17:25.670 company, and then we've staggered out other more advanced trainings that happen after they've 266 00:17:25.710 --> 00:17:27.750 been at our company for two or three months or six months, and we 267 00:17:27.869 --> 00:17:33.420 don't want them to have the more advanced training because it like they don't they 268 00:17:33.500 --> 00:17:36.539 haven't yet struggled and hit a wallant that Oh my God, I don't know 269 00:17:36.539 --> 00:17:40.180 how to answer this question, and this person's speaking in words that, even 270 00:17:40.220 --> 00:17:41.660 though it's English, I don't understand what they're trying to tell me. Like 271 00:17:41.700 --> 00:17:45.170 they haven't had that struggle and they need to have that struggle a couple of 272 00:17:45.250 --> 00:17:48.250 times. So when you present them the information, the white turns out, 273 00:17:48.250 --> 00:17:51.529 they're like, okay, great, that's what that person was trying to tell 274 00:17:51.529 --> 00:17:55.410 me. And you know, it's tough because you know that it's going to 275 00:17:55.490 --> 00:17:56.970 probably be a couple of weeks to a couple of months that they're not fully 276 00:17:56.970 --> 00:18:02.680 enabled. But again, almost every single roll out there has a certain amount 277 00:18:02.680 --> 00:18:04.960 of onboarding time and you just had, you know, people managers factor in 278 00:18:04.960 --> 00:18:07.480 the fact that their people are going to be fully productive for a couple of 279 00:18:07.519 --> 00:18:11.799 months and that's, I think, part of it. But trying to figure 280 00:18:11.799 --> 00:18:15.029 out how what's the minimum amount of time where somebody has to struggle and not 281 00:18:15.269 --> 00:18:18.910 know something to the point where they're going to be really enthusiastic to learn that 282 00:18:18.990 --> 00:18:22.549 missing piece the kind of I guess in art a little bit that that's a 283 00:18:22.630 --> 00:18:26.150 tough one to call. You know, I think probably the best example of 284 00:18:26.509 --> 00:18:30.940 the model there's when I was in Grad School, to my tea everyone's required 285 00:18:30.019 --> 00:18:33.299 to take this like advanced statistics class and that sounds you know, that doesn't 286 00:18:33.299 --> 00:18:37.900 sound like fun, unless you're statistician. And everyone kind of groans about it 287 00:18:37.420 --> 00:18:41.849 and they give you a real life problem, and I'm not going to say 288 00:18:41.890 --> 00:18:44.210 it because of anybody here's listening. Going to the problem. It's a great 289 00:18:44.250 --> 00:18:47.970 problem, but it's based on all sorts of real life stuff. They give 290 00:18:47.970 --> 00:18:51.569 you all the actual data that that the engineers and business people that were trying 291 00:18:51.569 --> 00:18:55.289 to start out the problem had and then, as a team, use your 292 00:18:55.329 --> 00:18:57.519 first project you need to figure out what the solution is. And you know 293 00:18:57.640 --> 00:19:02.440 it doesn't look that complicated at the beginning, but then almost every single team 294 00:19:02.440 --> 00:19:04.720 spends like Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday and they finally have class on 295 00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:08.160 Tuesday and you sent four days, you know, just basically running against a 296 00:19:08.200 --> 00:19:12.150 brick wall, and then all of a sudden the professor pulls out the like 297 00:19:12.349 --> 00:19:15.190 statistical formula that, if you put all this data in there, was going 298 00:19:15.230 --> 00:19:18.990 to give you the exact answer and you're like begging, you're absolutely just begging 299 00:19:19.029 --> 00:19:22.029 for this knowledge by the time you get it. And you know, when 300 00:19:22.069 --> 00:19:26.420 I took a step back, it made me think if this person just explained 301 00:19:26.460 --> 00:19:29.980 the concept, I would be like, okay, cool, whatever. Totally 302 00:19:30.220 --> 00:19:33.700 you know, you were so desperate because you couldn't figure this problem out and 303 00:19:33.779 --> 00:19:36.980 you've been working on it with your team for a long time that when they 304 00:19:37.019 --> 00:19:38.690 gave it to you, is like, you know, being given water after 305 00:19:38.849 --> 00:19:42.049 having, you know, crawled in the desert for a day. Such a 306 00:19:42.210 --> 00:19:47.730 great analogy. It's kind of fun story too, and it really does make 307 00:19:47.769 --> 00:19:48.609 a lot of sense, I think. If it is like you know, 308 00:19:48.730 --> 00:19:53.960 you need a rack to hang the code on, and so the prior experience 309 00:19:55.079 --> 00:19:59.359 in the struggling, in the successes and the kind of soft questions to start 310 00:19:59.359 --> 00:20:03.680 building in your head that ultimately provide that resolve. You know, at maybe 311 00:20:03.720 --> 00:20:04.960 at it's most dramatic point, is, you know, water after you've been 312 00:20:06.039 --> 00:20:11.710 wandering in the desert. Really great recommendation there. Speak briefly about what type 313 00:20:11.750 --> 00:20:15.630 of relationship, because this is key, as a fundamental premise of this podcast 314 00:20:15.789 --> 00:20:21.150 is, you know, customer experiences built across every team member and every touch 315 00:20:21.309 --> 00:20:25.140 point. And so how do we work together with other you know in some 316 00:20:25.259 --> 00:20:27.779 organizations, depending on the culture, can get very, very silod and even 317 00:20:27.859 --> 00:20:33.299 potentially antagonistic. You know, I hopefully that's not the case in most shops, 318 00:20:33.380 --> 00:20:37.009 but I have seen things like that before. So can you speak a 319 00:20:37.049 --> 00:20:41.289 little bit to it, how to build the trust and relationship with sales people 320 00:20:41.569 --> 00:20:47.369 and sales leaders and sales management in order to build this out and have it 321 00:20:47.569 --> 00:20:52.519 taken seriously, because I think it should be obvious to anyone who's listening the 322 00:20:52.680 --> 00:20:56.240 value of putting together some program like this, even if it's not as formal 323 00:20:56.880 --> 00:21:00.319 and buttoned up as what you've outlined here with some several great tips. But 324 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:06.349 talk about that trust and relationship component between sales and marketing. What did it 325 00:21:06.470 --> 00:21:11.950 take to get there? Yeah, I think that in any organization with people 326 00:21:11.029 --> 00:21:14.869 you're always going to have a bell curve in terms of some people are going 327 00:21:14.869 --> 00:21:18.190 to be super invested in want to keep on learning more and becoming better and 328 00:21:18.269 --> 00:21:19.900 better and better, and some people are there, you know, potentially just 329 00:21:21.220 --> 00:21:23.180 kind of coasting by. You know, at the other end of the spectrum, 330 00:21:23.859 --> 00:21:27.619 what we've usually done whenever you've rolled out a more advanced certification and you 331 00:21:27.700 --> 00:21:30.619 know, we run some things that are pretty, as you said, buttoned 332 00:21:30.619 --> 00:21:33.650 up like not only will you sit down and learn, in some cases you're 333 00:21:33.650 --> 00:21:36.930 going to have to do a fair amount of practicing and then we're going to 334 00:21:36.970 --> 00:21:40.170 put you in front of someone that wasn't involved in the training, two role 335 00:21:40.250 --> 00:21:42.130 player, to do some other kind of certification to make sure that you really 336 00:21:42.170 --> 00:21:45.930 understood the concepts. And you know, it's can be pretty close to like 337 00:21:47.009 --> 00:21:48.599 a real a scenario and if you if you know how to handle that, 338 00:21:48.759 --> 00:21:53.279 then you're you're good, you're certified. What we usually do is that we 339 00:21:53.759 --> 00:21:59.559 find the people that are looking to get a competitive edge, looking to, 340 00:21:59.720 --> 00:22:02.549 you know, to better themselves. You know, we start with a small 341 00:22:02.549 --> 00:22:06.029 subset and usually those people. You know, any time you roule on new 342 00:22:06.069 --> 00:22:08.349 training, there's often times a you know, you don't get it right the 343 00:22:08.390 --> 00:22:11.549 first time, you have to kind of tweak it a little bit to you 344 00:22:11.589 --> 00:22:14.990 in it right sure, and you know those people will also oftentimes give you 345 00:22:15.029 --> 00:22:18.019 the most leeway. And you know, once those people start getting the knowledge, 346 00:22:18.059 --> 00:22:21.819 if you hit it right and it's a missing component that they've been really 347 00:22:21.819 --> 00:22:25.579 frustrate with because they didn't understand, it's making them better. They become your 348 00:22:25.660 --> 00:22:29.099 babycome your marketers. They start saying, Oh, yeah, that problem, 349 00:22:29.140 --> 00:22:30.450 here's how you solved it, and then all their peers are like, how 350 00:22:30.450 --> 00:22:33.329 do you know how to do that? Oh, you know, the marketing 351 00:22:33.410 --> 00:22:36.369 team gave me this training and well, it's Alved it all. Get it, 352 00:22:36.410 --> 00:22:38.170 give me everything that I need to know. So we've always used the 353 00:22:38.210 --> 00:22:42.930 pilot group of people that are that are really enthusiastic and you know, first 354 00:22:42.970 --> 00:22:45.279 of all they help us because they give us a feedback to make it right 355 00:22:45.480 --> 00:22:48.759 for the broader audience, and then secondly, they usually do all the marketing, 356 00:22:49.240 --> 00:22:52.480 and I mean it would oftentimes happens. Is for something new. We're 357 00:22:52.480 --> 00:22:56.319 all we're still doing our our everything we've been doing before. So we offer 358 00:22:56.400 --> 00:23:00.750 something new, we do it and there's just not that. We don't offer 359 00:23:00.789 --> 00:23:03.470 that many classes, if you will, or a sessions for it. And 360 00:23:03.630 --> 00:23:06.710 then all of a sudden we start getting the next tier of people. Maybe 361 00:23:06.750 --> 00:23:10.069 you know that, but are also on that doll occur more, you know, 362 00:23:10.309 --> 00:23:11.980 looking to try to get more knowledge, and then they start saying, 363 00:23:11.980 --> 00:23:14.779 Hey, we're gonna do the next one. Cabby on it. Can you 364 00:23:14.819 --> 00:23:17.779 put me on the weightlist right now? So we keep on working our way 365 00:23:17.779 --> 00:23:19.940 from the people that are the most enthused in the most open to learning new 366 00:23:21.019 --> 00:23:25.940 stuff, and once it gets to a majority and most people have had this 367 00:23:26.019 --> 00:23:29.009 training, then the people that haven't, they start feeling left out and that's 368 00:23:29.009 --> 00:23:32.849 how we usually sweep through everyone. I love it. It's like this idea 369 00:23:32.890 --> 00:23:36.769 that they want to be on a weight list is a testament to the quality 370 00:23:36.809 --> 00:23:40.369 of what you're doing in the value that provides to the salesperson. But it 371 00:23:40.410 --> 00:23:44.599 also makes me think about like Baiting, doing Betas with customers and like those 372 00:23:44.599 --> 00:23:47.680 customers that are just super enthusiastic and they want to know what's going on and 373 00:23:47.680 --> 00:23:51.799 they want to try stuff out. So great practice there in terms of getting 374 00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:56.430 early feedback and adapting and again creating a weight list. That's so excellent. 375 00:23:56.750 --> 00:24:00.390 Hey, this is a really great framework. I love it. It reminds 376 00:24:00.430 --> 00:24:03.150 me of a number of efforts we've done that are have not been as formal 377 00:24:03.190 --> 00:24:07.150 as this. That made that I want to double back on. It makes 378 00:24:07.190 --> 00:24:10.900 me think about a variety of our customer personas here at bombomb that, you 379 00:24:10.980 --> 00:24:14.460 know, a new salesperson needs to understand and unique ways in order to, 380 00:24:15.140 --> 00:24:18.460 you know, build that trust in rapport through common language. So this has 381 00:24:18.500 --> 00:24:22.539 been awesome. Before I let you go, though, Alex, I like 382 00:24:22.700 --> 00:24:26.009 to give you, because relationships are our number one core value, I like 383 00:24:26.130 --> 00:24:29.210 to give you the chance to think or mention someone who's had a positive impact 384 00:24:29.650 --> 00:24:33.970 on your life or career and a chance to mention a company that's doing customer 385 00:24:33.049 --> 00:24:37.009 experience really well that's treated you the right way. Sure you know. I 386 00:24:37.089 --> 00:24:41.039 think someone that I definitely would want to give a call out to is, 387 00:24:41.640 --> 00:24:47.039 or rather a shout out to, is Brian Semple, who was the person 388 00:24:47.160 --> 00:24:49.359 that that taught me, I guess, a lot of the basics of marketing 389 00:24:51.319 --> 00:24:53.990 when I transition. For me more of a technologist. He's the CMO at 390 00:24:55.029 --> 00:24:59.109 a company called Mark forged now that does a lot of three printing stuff, 391 00:24:59.109 --> 00:25:03.069 and you know, he was actually a he's written an interesting book that I'd 392 00:25:03.109 --> 00:25:08.259 recommend to marketers out there about metrics and he's a former submarine officer, so 393 00:25:08.380 --> 00:25:15.460 he's actually compared how running a marketing operation in today's I guess high text set 394 00:25:15.500 --> 00:25:19.140 it from marketing is really similar to controlling the nuclear reactor for for Sup. 395 00:25:19.180 --> 00:25:25.490 So He's a former navy submarine officer and you know he uses technologies. To 396 00:25:25.609 --> 00:25:29.289 you where I was coming from. He sat down and taught me kind of 397 00:25:29.289 --> 00:25:33.009 all all the basics of marketing as I kicked off and transition over. So 398 00:25:33.130 --> 00:25:37.240 He's definitely someone that I'd like to give a shout out to. How do 399 00:25:37.279 --> 00:25:42.240 you spell his last name? And what is his book called? It's semple 400 00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:49.710 Brian Simple and his book is the Digital CMOS guide to marketing measurements. Think 401 00:25:49.789 --> 00:25:55.750 like a submariner for operational success. Awesome. And and how about a company 402 00:25:55.789 --> 00:26:00.589 you respect? I guess I go with a cliche answer, unfortunately. I'd 403 00:26:00.589 --> 00:26:03.750 say, you know Apple. You know, the thing that they do amazing 404 00:26:03.829 --> 00:26:07.900 is going back to customer experience. They really have thought through like what you're 405 00:26:07.900 --> 00:26:11.700 going to feel like when you experience one of their products. I mean every 406 00:26:11.940 --> 00:26:15.259 like something that I don't know if it's been written about a lot, is 407 00:26:15.299 --> 00:26:18.130 whenever you open up one other products, even the packaging in the way that 408 00:26:18.250 --> 00:26:22.849 it's that it's like laid out, is like inviting what you want to open 409 00:26:22.930 --> 00:26:26.049 it up, you know, whether it's a computer or phone. I know 410 00:26:26.130 --> 00:26:29.569 it's Super Cliche, but they do. They just do a really, really 411 00:26:29.609 --> 00:26:33.799 good job of making this thing seem like the super special thing that you're unpacking 412 00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:38.759 for the first time. Another area that that I oftentimes pull people to is 413 00:26:40.240 --> 00:26:44.160 the way that the highlight benefits of a product. I mean, if you 414 00:26:44.160 --> 00:26:47.150 ever go to their website and you looked at like, you know, the 415 00:26:47.390 --> 00:26:51.349 the Apple Watch, I mean it's like it's it's always showing off some piece 416 00:26:51.390 --> 00:26:55.269 of functionality and one picture says you know, says a thousand words. So 417 00:26:55.430 --> 00:26:56.789 they do a really good job also, I think, just in terms of 418 00:26:56.829 --> 00:27:00.230 showing off benefits, and of course I know that there's a lot to say 419 00:27:00.269 --> 00:27:03.299 about apple and is probably Super Cliche, but they really do a very good 420 00:27:03.299 --> 00:27:07.380 job of it. Awesome, great recommendation. I know I could visualize opening 421 00:27:07.420 --> 00:27:11.619 a couple different boxes of theirs and even the way they sequence and stack the 422 00:27:11.700 --> 00:27:15.369 pieces and layer them in and create that little spot for your finger to go 423 00:27:15.529 --> 00:27:19.009 in to pull that next piece out and all of that. It's really really 424 00:27:19.650 --> 00:27:26.049 well well planned in and designed and executed. Alex, again, this has 425 00:27:26.049 --> 00:27:29.410 been awesome. Thank you so much for your time. How can someone connect 426 00:27:29.410 --> 00:27:33.359 with you or with data dog? Yeah, data dog. Just go to 427 00:27:33.359 --> 00:27:38.440 or a website data dogcom. If you are a developer or site reliability engineer 428 00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:42.680 or CTO and you want to get visibility into your application. Sign up free 429 00:27:42.759 --> 00:27:47.589 trial. You can use whole product for as big environment as you want to 430 00:27:47.630 --> 00:27:51.670 try it out. For me in particular, twitter handle is Alex Rosenblatt. 431 00:27:52.230 --> 00:27:56.269 Just Alex. that data dogcom awesome. Thank you again so much. I 432 00:27:56.349 --> 00:28:00.220 hope you have a great afternoon and I need to rethink our internal curriculum. 433 00:28:02.940 --> 00:28:07.819 All right, could hear it? That was Alex Rosenblatt on internal alignment, 434 00:28:08.259 --> 00:28:15.089 engagement and education. I am ethanviewed. I'm the host of the customer experience 435 00:28:15.250 --> 00:28:19.569 podcast and the chief of angelist at bombomb and I'm the CO author of Rehumanize 436 00:28:19.650 --> 00:28:23.130 Your Business. I would love to connect on Linkedin. My last name is 437 00:28:23.210 --> 00:28:29.480 spelled beute. Send a connection request and add a note let me know that 438 00:28:29.519 --> 00:28:33.720 you're enjoying the customer experience podcast or the CX series here on the be tob 439 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:40.240 growth show. Thanks so much. Hey, everybody, Logan with sweetfish here. 440 00:28:40.519 --> 00:28:42.670 If you're a regular listener of B Tob Growth, you know that I'm 441 00:28:42.750 --> 00:28:45.670 one of the cohosts of the show, but you may not know that I 442 00:28:45.829 --> 00:28:49.230 also head up the sales team here at sweetfish. So for those of you 443 00:28:49.470 --> 00:28:52.950 in sales or sales offs. I wanted to take a second to share something 444 00:28:53.069 --> 00:28:57.660 that's made us insanely more efficient lately. Our team has been using lead Iq 445 00:28:57.940 --> 00:29:02.380 for the past few months, and what used to take us four hours gathering 446 00:29:02.539 --> 00:29:07.220 contact data now takes us only one, or seventy five percent more efficient. 447 00:29:07.500 --> 00:29:12.089 We're able to move faster withoutbound prospecting and organizing our campaigns is so much easier 448 00:29:12.130 --> 00:29:17.049 than before. I'd highly suggest you guys check out lead Iq as well. 449 00:29:17.410 --> 00:29:22.730 You can check them out at lead iqcom. That's ee ad iqcom.