#BestOf2019: What is the Role of Rev Ops? (& Why It's Important) w/ Brad Rosen

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.360 --> 00:00:08.310 Hey there, this is James Carberry, founder of sweet fish media and one 2 00:00:08.349 --> 00:00:11.189 of the cohosts of this show. For the last year and a half I've 3 00:00:11.189 --> 00:00:14.990 been working on my very first book. In the book I share the three 4 00:00:15.070 --> 00:00:19.469 part framework we've used as the foundation for our growth here at sweetfish. Now 5 00:00:19.510 --> 00:00:22.620 there are lots of companies that ever he'sed a bunch of money and have grown 6 00:00:22.660 --> 00:00:25.579 insanely fast, and we featured a lot of them here on the show. 7 00:00:26.339 --> 00:00:30.579 We've decided to bootstrap our business, which usually equates to pretty slow growth, 8 00:00:31.140 --> 00:00:34.700 but using the strategy outlined in the book, we are on pace to be 9 00:00:34.859 --> 00:00:38.649 one of inks fastest growing companies in two thousand and twenty. The book is 10 00:00:38.729 --> 00:00:42.729 called content based networking, how to instantly connect with anyone you want to know. 11 00:00:43.289 --> 00:00:45.329 If you're a fan of audio books like me, you can find the 12 00:00:45.369 --> 00:00:48.450 book on audible or if you like physical books, you can also find it 13 00:00:48.570 --> 00:00:54.799 on Amazon. Just search content based networking or James carberry CR BEA ARY in 14 00:00:55.000 --> 00:00:58.920 audible or Amazon and it should pop right up. All right, let's get 15 00:00:58.920 --> 00:01:03.719 into the show. Hey, everybody, logan with sweet fish here. It's 16 00:01:03.719 --> 00:01:07.790 a new year and at do decade and we're celebrating by rounding up the top 17 00:01:07.950 --> 00:01:11.750 twenty episodes as we look back on two thousand and nineteen. Will be sharing 18 00:01:11.829 --> 00:01:15.909 them here throughout the month of January in our Hashtag best of two thousand and 19 00:01:15.909 --> 00:01:21.299 nineteen series. Today's episode is Number Fifteen as we countdown the top twenty episodes 20 00:01:21.299 --> 00:01:25.060 of two thousand and nineteen. It features our conversation with Brad Rosen, the 21 00:01:25.099 --> 00:01:29.019 VP of REV oops over at Gtwo, where we talked about the changing role 22 00:01:29.099 --> 00:01:33.370 of REV OPS and the crucial role that it can play in a scaling BB 23 00:01:33.450 --> 00:01:38.370 business. Welcome back to be tob growth. I'm your host for today's episode. 24 00:01:38.370 --> 00:01:42.090 Book and miles of sweet fish medium. I joined today by Brad Rosen. 25 00:01:42.170 --> 00:01:46.370 He's the VP OF REVENUE OPERATIONS OVER AT G two. Crowd. Brad, 26 00:01:46.450 --> 00:01:49.120 how you doing today? Man? I am doing great. How are 27 00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:52.120 you? I'm doing well, other than getting over a little bit of a 28 00:01:52.200 --> 00:01:55.760 cold, but I'm no worse for wear and really been looking forward to having 29 00:01:55.799 --> 00:01:59.319 this conversation with you. We're going to be talking about the changing role of 30 00:01:59.439 --> 00:02:01.989 revenue operations and I love some of the thoughts you're going to be sharing with 31 00:02:02.109 --> 00:02:06.390 listeners today. For a little bit of context, I would love for you 32 00:02:06.469 --> 00:02:08.830 to share with listeners a little bit about yourself and what you and the team 33 00:02:08.870 --> 00:02:12.990 at g two crowder up to these days. Man, yeah, happy to 34 00:02:13.710 --> 00:02:16.580 glad to be on and looking forward to our conversation. I'm Brad Rosen. 35 00:02:16.740 --> 00:02:21.379 I RUN ROBIN OPERATIONS AT G two. I grew up and I'll give you 36 00:02:21.379 --> 00:02:24.099 a good background. I grew up in Michigan, so I love it there 37 00:02:24.139 --> 00:02:30.090 with the school was constant go badgers and now I've been a g two four 38 00:02:30.210 --> 00:02:32.770 six and a half years, which has been amazing. Ride. Started real 39 00:02:32.849 --> 00:02:37.409 early when we were just collecting reviews and we have this idea of if you 40 00:02:37.490 --> 00:02:38.610 build it, they will come. You know, yelped it it. Why 41 00:02:38.689 --> 00:02:43.370 can't we? And Burns out that if you build it, they will not 42 00:02:43.490 --> 00:02:47.159 come. You have people are much more excited about writing reviews on restaurants that 43 00:02:47.240 --> 00:02:52.560 they are about be tob business software, and so it takes quite a bit 44 00:02:52.639 --> 00:02:57.919 to build up and we're significantly more different differentiated from Yelp, but we've had 45 00:02:57.960 --> 00:03:00.750 a great run so far and I started by building the sales and C s 46 00:03:00.830 --> 00:03:05.990 teams and am now running revenue operations and I think it's it's been a great 47 00:03:06.030 --> 00:03:08.389 ride and really excited to talk about the the role of REV OPS and how 48 00:03:08.430 --> 00:03:13.460 it's changing. Yeah, absolutely, you guys are up to some great things. 49 00:03:13.539 --> 00:03:15.419 have been growing like crazy. We've had, you know, several other 50 00:03:15.539 --> 00:03:22.020 members of the G two team on some great episodes with Adam Goyette and other 51 00:03:22.099 --> 00:03:24.539 members of the team. So excited to for you to bring your perspective and 52 00:03:24.539 --> 00:03:29.810 didn't realize you had been there for that long. I Love Your your story 53 00:03:29.930 --> 00:03:34.689 there and also you know so many marketers we think, or founders in a 54 00:03:34.729 --> 00:03:36.889 lot of ways. You know, if we build it, they will come. 55 00:03:37.569 --> 00:03:39.530 Unfortunately that's not always the case, but at the at the same time 56 00:03:39.650 --> 00:03:44.280 people are coming now and you guys have done some great things. So excited 57 00:03:44.400 --> 00:03:47.560 deep for you to share a little bit of wisdom with listeners today. So, 58 00:03:47.719 --> 00:03:52.599 as we're talking about the changing role of rebops, I think the first 59 00:03:52.639 --> 00:03:54.479 thing we have to do before we talk about some of the tactical things is 60 00:03:54.909 --> 00:03:59.629 is back up and define it. So you're the VP of revenue operations at 61 00:03:59.669 --> 00:04:03.069 GTO. You know, how do you define revenue operations for your organization and 62 00:04:03.189 --> 00:04:05.949 how do you see others to finding it? You know, just broadly in 63 00:04:05.990 --> 00:04:12.259 the space I think revenue operations has a broad definition, as you said, 64 00:04:12.259 --> 00:04:14.379 in the space. I think it means a lot of things to a lot 65 00:04:14.419 --> 00:04:17.620 of different people, and so I'll give you my definition with it my role 66 00:04:17.779 --> 00:04:21.899 within our company, but I think it can change and evolved. And so 67 00:04:23.100 --> 00:04:27.250 from from my perspective it's literally everything that I can do on the back end 68 00:04:27.290 --> 00:04:30.449 of sales. So do everything we can to reduce the friction of our sales 69 00:04:30.529 --> 00:04:34.050 team and our sales leaders so that they can go out and sell, and 70 00:04:34.170 --> 00:04:41.319 so that could mean anything from creating territories to quotas to packages to pricing, 71 00:04:41.600 --> 00:04:46.399 training and enablement, sales force administration, sales operations, sales data analytics. 72 00:04:46.480 --> 00:04:50.560 So it's all of that and that means taking anything that we can so that 73 00:04:50.959 --> 00:04:55.470 when our sales people go out there trained, they're enabled, they have the 74 00:04:55.509 --> 00:05:00.589 right tools and the right processes they to go out and be successful. Yeah, 75 00:05:00.589 --> 00:05:02.269 I love it. So you touched on some different things there. You 76 00:05:02.350 --> 00:05:06.980 know, sales ops, sales enablement. As you look at revenue operations for 77 00:05:08.060 --> 00:05:11.420 you guys or for other organizations that you're talking to, you know, does 78 00:05:11.500 --> 00:05:15.660 that also include marketing ops, like where are some of the blends or you 79 00:05:15.740 --> 00:05:18.699 know what's kind of the structure there? For you guys? Yeah, for 80 00:05:18.740 --> 00:05:21.930 us it does not. You mentioned Adam go yet, who's been on the 81 00:05:21.970 --> 00:05:27.170 show and he's kind of my partner in crime, as you will and then 82 00:05:27.250 --> 00:05:30.209 so we work really closely together, and I think that that's really a key 83 00:05:30.250 --> 00:05:33.850 point, is they all kind of have to be in lock stem and so 84 00:05:33.930 --> 00:05:39.519 whether that's under one person or you're just really tightly aligned and make sure that 85 00:05:39.600 --> 00:05:44.360 you're both striving towards the same thing. That's really the key and so that's 86 00:05:44.360 --> 00:05:47.079 why, when we think of revenue, we don't report up. He reports 87 00:05:47.079 --> 00:05:50.110 to the cml Ry and I report the Cerro Matt, but at the same 88 00:05:50.189 --> 00:05:54.509 time Adam is in every one of our meetings. He's in, you know, 89 00:05:54.670 --> 00:05:58.230 the the weekly meetings, he's in the sales leadership meetings. He understands 90 00:05:58.269 --> 00:06:00.750 what's going on. So we can share all of our initiatives with him and 91 00:06:00.949 --> 00:06:03.620 he could share his with us, so that we can make sure that we're 92 00:06:03.620 --> 00:06:09.060 driving towards the same goals, which ultimately is in the name. It's revenue. 93 00:06:09.100 --> 00:06:13.060 M Yeah, absolutely, I love that. So you know, I 94 00:06:13.459 --> 00:06:15.459 like that dynamic duo, that one two punch. You know, if you 95 00:06:15.500 --> 00:06:18.290 guys are at the dynamic duo behind the scenes, I'll let you guys fight 96 00:06:18.370 --> 00:06:21.649 it out over who's Batman who's Robin. I'll be Batman. So tell us 97 00:06:21.649 --> 00:06:27.209 a little bit about your view on the evolution of this function. You know 98 00:06:27.490 --> 00:06:31.329 you talked about processes, quota assignment, territory assignment. You know there's also 99 00:06:31.449 --> 00:06:35.560 sales enablement and productivity. You know, the tool side of it. Where 100 00:06:35.639 --> 00:06:41.759 have you seen the function of revenue operations really evolved in the last few years? 101 00:06:41.800 --> 00:06:46.750 Brat, I think it's actually started to not just evolved but become something. 102 00:06:46.949 --> 00:06:50.829 I think prior to a few years ago, you know, the quotas 103 00:06:50.870 --> 00:06:56.029 in the territories and all that was probably run by finance, potentially the CEO, 104 00:06:56.350 --> 00:07:00.110 the CFO in that organization, sales had sales leaders who are focused on 105 00:07:00.269 --> 00:07:05.779 selling, and those two there's generally some friction, potentially or at least very 106 00:07:05.819 --> 00:07:11.220 separation of duties. And now I think it's really important, just like I 107 00:07:11.339 --> 00:07:15.500 have a partner in crime on the marketing side, our CFO, ted white 108 00:07:15.540 --> 00:07:17.970 soul. I'm really close with him as well. So we understand budgeting. 109 00:07:18.050 --> 00:07:23.089 We go over that together. We go over an understanding of a are we 110 00:07:23.170 --> 00:07:27.370 going to hit our plan based on the operational side of things. We understand 111 00:07:27.410 --> 00:07:31.040 what packages should look like from a from a revenue standpoint, and so you 112 00:07:31.120 --> 00:07:35.079 have to make sure that you're aligned both ways. But having somebody in place 113 00:07:35.560 --> 00:07:41.639 that's running the operational side of things allows the team to move more quickly as 114 00:07:41.639 --> 00:07:44.629 opposed to having to get buy in from other departments, and so I think 115 00:07:44.629 --> 00:07:48.829 that's why it's actually grown so much over the last few years, is because 116 00:07:48.870 --> 00:07:53.949 people are recognizing that that, especially when you have these high growth companies that 117 00:07:54.029 --> 00:07:59.699 are things are happening very quickly, you really need a central point operationalize everything 118 00:07:59.899 --> 00:08:03.300 and then work with the other departments, whether that be marketing, finance, 119 00:08:03.500 --> 00:08:07.860 product research, to be able to make sure that everybody is working in lock 120 00:08:07.899 --> 00:08:11.740 step. And I do think tools help you in the sense of they can 121 00:08:11.779 --> 00:08:16.250 make you more productive, they can make you more collaborative, especially if you're 122 00:08:16.250 --> 00:08:20.449 working remotely or if you're traveling, but at the same time it also makes 123 00:08:20.490 --> 00:08:24.529 it trickier to make sure that and not buying every tool under the sun and 124 00:08:24.730 --> 00:08:28.560 that the tools all talk to each other and that we have the same accountability 125 00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:33.320 that we used to have, because now we have tools that can do all 126 00:08:33.360 --> 00:08:35.360 these things that we used to have to do ourselves. So to us can 127 00:08:35.440 --> 00:08:39.039 make things really great, but they can also make things more challenging as well. 128 00:08:39.320 --> 00:08:41.669 Yeah, I want to come back to that in a second, because 129 00:08:41.710 --> 00:08:46.149 they're there's something there to be said about you know, we talked about sales 130 00:08:46.190 --> 00:08:50.590 tech and we talk about MARTEC almost in these separate conversations, right, but 131 00:08:52.070 --> 00:08:54.980 you know so much more if there's going to be alignment between those functions, 132 00:08:56.019 --> 00:08:58.779 and like you said, there's important alignment with sales and not just marketing but 133 00:09:00.220 --> 00:09:03.379 product and finance, in these other areas that you know, having someone who 134 00:09:03.379 --> 00:09:07.700 has view or at least connection at the hip with the leaders of these other 135 00:09:09.259 --> 00:09:13.169 functional areas, you know, that becomes really important. I want to ask 136 00:09:13.289 --> 00:09:16.889 here, though, as you talked about your evolution of your role within Gutwo 137 00:09:18.250 --> 00:09:20.169 from the the sales and C s side. You know, it seems like 138 00:09:20.330 --> 00:09:26.080 with smaller organizations or earlier stage startups, you know, revenue operations is just 139 00:09:26.159 --> 00:09:31.519 kind of this shared duty between maybe sales and the operations are finance leader, 140 00:09:31.759 --> 00:09:33.360 you know, in the early day. So where did you guys get to 141 00:09:33.440 --> 00:09:37.519 the tipping point of okay, revenue operations needs to be its own thing, 142 00:09:37.830 --> 00:09:41.669 you know, and as you built out that leadership team structure, I would 143 00:09:41.669 --> 00:09:45.909 love to hear about kind of that internal evolution, what you get, what 144 00:09:46.070 --> 00:09:48.710 you can speak to, because I think as as teams are growing and fast 145 00:09:48.750 --> 00:09:54.539 growing these days, knowing where those tipping points are and how to manage those 146 00:09:54.620 --> 00:09:58.299 changes can be really important. Yeah, the tipping point for us was about 147 00:09:58.299 --> 00:10:01.659 a year and and a half ago when I started in the rolls. So 148 00:10:01.700 --> 00:10:05.659 what had happened is I built the sales team and in the Dr Team and 149 00:10:05.899 --> 00:10:09.889 and of those off tour two amazing leaders, now claim Olivier, and then 150 00:10:09.570 --> 00:10:13.330 built up the CS team and now we have an amazing leader there, Andrew, 151 00:10:13.730 --> 00:10:18.730 and so I actually started working on a lot of partnership stuff, which 152 00:10:18.769 --> 00:10:22.360 I thought was really fun and exciting and we have a lot of opportunities for 153 00:10:22.519 --> 00:10:24.559 that. And our CEO came to me and said, Hey, I want 154 00:10:24.600 --> 00:10:28.320 you to run revenue operations and I said I don't know what that is and 155 00:10:30.399 --> 00:10:33.639 I gave a vague understanding, which, like we're talking about. That's why 156 00:10:33.679 --> 00:10:35.350 you said define it right that. Yep, I said, I'll let me 157 00:10:35.389 --> 00:10:37.549 think about it and he came to me again. I said, well, 158 00:10:37.669 --> 00:10:39.830 I still don't really know what that is, but he's like, you know, 159 00:10:41.029 --> 00:10:43.629 you do everything to make sure that sales run smoothly. It's like, 160 00:10:43.710 --> 00:10:48.750 okay, and get a little more understand logical, but still thanks, but 161 00:10:48.830 --> 00:10:50.539 I'll think about it. And then the third time es I said, okay, 162 00:10:50.580 --> 00:10:54.379 I understand. You know, sometimes you get the hint after time three 163 00:10:54.419 --> 00:11:00.740 of asking and it actually was an amazing opportunity. I do have a finance 164 00:11:00.779 --> 00:11:01.860 background, which I think helps, because I do think you need to have 165 00:11:01.899 --> 00:11:09.009 an analytical understanding of data and being able to build certain models to understand your 166 00:11:09.129 --> 00:11:13.049 cost versus your revenues, understanding quotas, Commission's territories. All has to do 167 00:11:13.169 --> 00:11:16.850 with analytics behind it, but it does help. I do think that the 168 00:11:16.129 --> 00:11:20.279 the modern revobous leader has to have some selling experience or at least an understanding 169 00:11:20.320 --> 00:11:26.840 of the sales process, because I do believe that just running a spreadsheet does 170 00:11:26.919 --> 00:11:33.789 not allow you to actually understand the rules and regulations and rules of engagement that 171 00:11:33.830 --> 00:11:37.110 you're putting into place for a salesperson and a sales leader, because they think 172 00:11:37.230 --> 00:11:41.309 very differently, they think very emotionally, they're not a spreadsheet. They're a 173 00:11:41.389 --> 00:11:45.389 person, they're a human they react differently because they have, you know, 174 00:11:45.509 --> 00:11:50.860 feelings and they have understandings of motivations that everyone's motivated very differently. So being 175 00:11:50.899 --> 00:11:56.139 able to combine those things is really important and in our company that happened around 176 00:11:56.419 --> 00:12:01.340 I'd say, closing in on about two hundred people and probably about fifty reps, 177 00:12:01.809 --> 00:12:07.450 because of the idea that you get to a certain point where training enablement 178 00:12:07.690 --> 00:12:11.169 needs to be ramped up very quickly because you're hiring a lot of people and 179 00:12:11.889 --> 00:12:16.440 you can't just turn around and ask the REP next to you for advice because, 180 00:12:16.559 --> 00:12:18.360 first of all, they may not be next to you because you have 181 00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:22.360 a bigger office or you have satellite offices and different things. And the second 182 00:12:22.360 --> 00:12:24.480 thing is, once you play, as you know, we all grew up 183 00:12:24.480 --> 00:12:26.639 playing the game of telephone, by the time it gets to like the fourth 184 00:12:26.639 --> 00:12:30.950 or fifth person, it's actually not what we originally stated right. It's not 185 00:12:31.070 --> 00:12:35.149 what we wanted the messaging to be, and so you really need strong enablement 186 00:12:35.710 --> 00:12:37.590 and you also need processes. People want to understand. Okay, how am 187 00:12:37.629 --> 00:12:41.389 I getting paid? When am I getting paid? What are the expectations? 188 00:12:41.549 --> 00:12:45.259 I want that you know, and I want to more than just a conversation. 189 00:12:45.419 --> 00:12:48.340 It's got to be really strong and night and then, as the numbers 190 00:12:48.419 --> 00:12:52.980 get bigger, you have the board and management saying okay, well, how 191 00:12:52.980 --> 00:12:56.539 are we tracking towards these things before we say well, I know all the 192 00:12:56.700 --> 00:12:58.690 deals that can kind of put together what my projections are. I have a 193 00:12:58.730 --> 00:13:03.169 spreadsheet and we put it together, run a sales source report. We're good 194 00:13:03.690 --> 00:13:07.850 and you can't just throw the DART at the wall when you get to that 195 00:13:07.049 --> 00:13:13.759 size because you will inevitably miss the target. Yeah, absolutely. So you 196 00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:16.360 touched on something interesting there. I think there's a good mixture to be had 197 00:13:16.440 --> 00:13:22.919 with sales experience and some analytical or finance experience as well. Talk a little 198 00:13:22.919 --> 00:13:26.080 bit about, you know, how you've managed some of those changes in revops 199 00:13:26.120 --> 00:13:30.429 that have rolled out to the team. Maybe some of the lessons learned is 200 00:13:30.710 --> 00:13:33.470 now we can focus on all this stuff, but we need to do it 201 00:13:33.629 --> 00:13:37.470 the right way so it doesn't have some unintended consequences. Right. Yeah, 202 00:13:37.629 --> 00:13:41.230 and I think that that's part of growing and learning as you have a larger 203 00:13:41.350 --> 00:13:46.220 sales team with folks that you may not know as well or maybe, like 204 00:13:46.299 --> 00:13:48.419 I said, are in different states, different countries, all over the place. 205 00:13:48.779 --> 00:13:52.740 You really have to be cognizant of a lot of communication and understanding. 206 00:13:54.340 --> 00:13:58.490 How are people going to take changes, let's say change, especially and say 207 00:13:58.529 --> 00:14:01.730 a complant or quotas or territories, because that's how people make a living. 208 00:14:01.730 --> 00:14:03.610 That's a but they put a roof over their head. And so if you 209 00:14:03.690 --> 00:14:07.929 are going to make those changes, a lot of times those changes actually come 210 00:14:07.090 --> 00:14:13.080 from, obviously a board or executive level decisions to make sure we're understanding what 211 00:14:13.159 --> 00:14:16.600 are our costs. You're looking at lifetime values of customers versus customer acquisition cost 212 00:14:18.159 --> 00:14:20.519 what. You're starting to break it down by segment to understand which segments are 213 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:28.029 profitable or more profitable versus others and trying making hard decisions based on those types 214 00:14:28.070 --> 00:14:33.830 of things. And so there's rationale behind all these changes. Explaining that rationale, 215 00:14:33.909 --> 00:14:39.539 but also gathering feedback from the sales team as a whole and any leadership 216 00:14:39.980 --> 00:14:43.139 before the changes, I think is really important because you want to you want 217 00:14:43.139 --> 00:14:45.220 them to be heard and, frankly, they have a lot of really great 218 00:14:45.299 --> 00:14:48.139 insight that you may not have it when you're sitting at your desk and you're 219 00:14:48.179 --> 00:14:52.179 in a spreadsheet and you're just kind of thinking in your own world. You 220 00:14:52.259 --> 00:14:56.049 need to also understand what's going on in the field and what are the changes 221 00:14:56.129 --> 00:14:58.730 and how can we make sure that we motivate people properly, because a lot 222 00:14:58.769 --> 00:15:03.610 of times it's not just it's not always about dollars and sense. Sometimes it's 223 00:15:03.610 --> 00:15:07.600 about hitting your quota. Sometimes it's about they want to receive little spiffs throughout 224 00:15:07.600 --> 00:15:09.879 the year because that makes get some motivated and pumped up, or they want 225 00:15:09.879 --> 00:15:13.840 to compare themselves to other reps within the role. So getting feedback, I 226 00:15:13.919 --> 00:15:18.440 think, is really important, especially when you're making big changes and then explaining 227 00:15:18.519 --> 00:15:22.789 the rationale behind things and then having a discourse. So having a really good 228 00:15:24.190 --> 00:15:26.750 relationship with the team as a whole is really important. Yeah, I mean 229 00:15:28.309 --> 00:15:33.629 to me it seems like you're able with this revenue operations layer between, you 230 00:15:33.710 --> 00:15:37.299 know, sales leadership and and the executive level and the board. You know, 231 00:15:37.500 --> 00:15:43.779 there's almost more room for thoughtful back and forth. You know sales leadership 232 00:15:43.779 --> 00:15:48.100 is so focused on on hitting the number, on ramping new reps, on 233 00:15:48.179 --> 00:15:52.009 on closing deals. You know with their team that these things that that are 234 00:15:52.129 --> 00:15:56.769 important, they can be big levers and turning points in the motivation of your 235 00:15:56.850 --> 00:16:00.769 team and the efficiency of your team, but you just have more time to 236 00:16:00.889 --> 00:16:03.720 dedicate to these specific elements. Would you say that's really kind of one of 237 00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:11.360 the biggest benefits to having dedicated revenue operations leadership as you build out your organizational 238 00:16:11.440 --> 00:16:15.559 structure? Breath. Absolutely. We don't want our sales leaders or sales people 239 00:16:15.720 --> 00:16:21.789 thinking about, hey, what should the how should we package this this new 240 00:16:21.909 --> 00:16:25.269 feature in, and what should we call it and how much should it price 241 00:16:25.669 --> 00:16:27.830 and how should we implement it into CPQ and what should it look like on 242 00:16:27.950 --> 00:16:30.950 the order form like? Can you imagine if our rests were spending the time 243 00:16:32.070 --> 00:16:34.620 doing that and not picking up the phone and not having phone calls? That 244 00:16:34.740 --> 00:16:40.500 would be terrible. And so that's why we take that on right and so 245 00:16:40.820 --> 00:16:44.740 sometimes it's, I would say, not a glamorous job, but it's really 246 00:16:45.019 --> 00:16:49.169 interesting and I think that understanding the business aspect of what we're doing is really 247 00:16:49.289 --> 00:16:55.049 great, but it definitely takes a certain skill set. But it's also how 248 00:16:55.210 --> 00:16:57.409 do we allow them the delegation of duties, because, you know what, 249 00:16:57.570 --> 00:17:02.159 they're much better sales people than I will ever be. Right and so they 250 00:17:02.240 --> 00:17:06.559 have certain skill sets that I don't necessarily have and they have certain skills that, 251 00:17:06.680 --> 00:17:07.680 you know, the n I have certain skill sets that they don't have. 252 00:17:07.799 --> 00:17:12.640 In so it's a great symbiotic relationship ship from myself to the sales leadership 253 00:17:12.640 --> 00:17:15.230 to be able to say, Hey, you take on the heavy lifting on 254 00:17:15.589 --> 00:17:21.230 the operational side so that we can continue to be in the field and keep 255 00:17:21.230 --> 00:17:23.950 the wheels turning. Yeah, absolutely. I think that's where you get some 256 00:17:25.150 --> 00:17:27.190 friction and you get some burn out. The more that you have, you 257 00:17:27.269 --> 00:17:30.660 know, whether its sales or marketing or any function, really, when you 258 00:17:30.740 --> 00:17:38.180 have people not, you know, operating in their maximum capacity, proficiency and 259 00:17:38.380 --> 00:17:42.380 passion, then you get burnout, especially in a high growth start up. 260 00:17:42.500 --> 00:17:48.769 So the more that you can start to segment these different things between operations and 261 00:17:48.289 --> 00:17:55.210 actual time spent selling and keep people laser focused and in repeating the things that 262 00:17:55.410 --> 00:17:59.079 they do really well, then you're going to have, you know, more 263 00:17:59.240 --> 00:18:02.720 growth because you're not going to have that that friction that slows you down at 264 00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:07.519 times. Absolutely, and I think that's key is to understanding and, like 265 00:18:07.599 --> 00:18:11.000 I said, in our organization we do have a leader who runs marketing APPS. 266 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:15.029 He's really good at marketing APPS and he's really understand the tools and the 267 00:18:15.109 --> 00:18:18.109 people that are needed to succeed in that area, and you know so I 268 00:18:18.190 --> 00:18:21.910 leave that to him and I make sure that I focus on of the things 269 00:18:21.950 --> 00:18:25.509 that I'm really a strong and proficient at, and that's the sales operation set 270 00:18:25.589 --> 00:18:29.180 of things. That's the enablement, that's the partnerships, that's well we're able 271 00:18:29.220 --> 00:18:30.579 to build on our side of the house. Yeah, I love it. 272 00:18:30.660 --> 00:18:34.740 You guys are obviously doing a lot of things right. I love you sharing 273 00:18:34.859 --> 00:18:38.019 a little bit of a peek behind the curtain and a little bit of your 274 00:18:38.059 --> 00:18:45.289 journey, as you guys have built out obviously a very successful revenue organization and 275 00:18:45.809 --> 00:18:48.130 Adam and Ryan and the rest of the marketing team are doing a great thing 276 00:18:48.650 --> 00:18:52.690 on their side, joined at the hip with you guys. So obviously you 277 00:18:52.769 --> 00:18:55.410 guys are doing a lot of things right. Brad, if people listening to 278 00:18:55.529 --> 00:19:00.519 this would like to stay connected with you pick your brain on anything revenue ops, 279 00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:03.880 sales related or anything else, what's the best way for them to stay 280 00:19:03.920 --> 00:19:07.440 connected with you or reach out in the future? Man, yeah, feel 281 00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:11.269 free to reach out on Linkedin. Brad Rosen, I work at you too, 282 00:19:11.430 --> 00:19:15.950 so it's not too hard to find me and I would love to connect 283 00:19:15.950 --> 00:19:18.309 with everybody, whether that be sales, marketing ops, and I do think 284 00:19:18.430 --> 00:19:23.029 that those, all these roles are starting to become interconnected, and so looking 285 00:19:23.069 --> 00:19:26.900 forward to networking with everybody within the industry. I love it. Brad, 286 00:19:26.980 --> 00:19:30.259 thanks so much for joining me on the show today. Man, this has 287 00:19:30.299 --> 00:19:36.859 been fantastic. Thank you. Have a grown on. We totally get it. 288 00:19:37.259 --> 00:19:40.650 We publish a ton of content on this podcast and it can be a 289 00:19:40.769 --> 00:19:44.769 lot to keep up with. That's why we've started the BOB growth big three, 290 00:19:45.210 --> 00:19:48.410 a no fluff email that bools down our three biggest takeaways from an entire 291 00:19:48.529 --> 00:19:53.960 week of episodes. Sign up today at Sweet Fish Mediacom big three. That 292 00:19:55.160 --> 00:19:57.279 sweet PHISH MEDIACOM Big Three