May 10, 2020

#BehindTheCurtain 24: How We Set & Track Goals at Sweet Fish

In this episode of the #BehindTheCurtain Series, James & Logan talk about how we've customized our goal setting & tracking approach on the leadership team at Sweet Fish.

We share:

1) Why some standard approaches haven't worked for us

2) How we discuss & track ongoing goals on a weekly basis

3) How we've taken a slow approach to rolling out our goal setting framework

If you like this episode, you'll probably also love:

Why You Should Stop Using To-Do Lists (And What To Do Instead)
w/ Kevin Kruse

The Advantage: Why Organizational Health Trumps Everything Else in Business by Patrick Lencioni

At The Table with Patrick Lencioni on Apple Podcast


Sweet Fish is hiring! Click here to learn more.


Want to get your copy of James' book, Content-Based Networking?

It's available on Amazon now: http://bit.ly/content-basednetworking

If you want it in audiobook format, just search Content-Based Networking or James Carbary on Audible.

Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.400 --> 00:00:08.830 Welcome back to be to be growth. I'm Logan lyles with sweet fish media. 2 00:00:08.910 --> 00:00:12.310 I'm joined today, as usual, in our behind the curtain series with 3 00:00:12.429 --> 00:00:15.910 my good buddy, founder and CEO of Sweet Fish, James Carberry. James, 4 00:00:15.910 --> 00:00:18.589 how you doing today, man? I'm fantastic, dude. We're going 5 00:00:18.589 --> 00:00:24.780 to be talking about something that is recently really transformed our leadership team and how 6 00:00:24.859 --> 00:00:28.980 we set goals and how we get things done around here. So it's a 7 00:00:29.059 --> 00:00:34.020 system that we call for by fours and it's honestly been in large part to 8 00:00:34.659 --> 00:00:37.770 one of the cohosts of crafting culture, like Mozars, and one of my 9 00:00:37.850 --> 00:00:42.369 best friends something and I an idea that he introduced. But it's been an 10 00:00:42.369 --> 00:00:47.609 interesting journey in a story of how we kind of have moved from for disciplines 11 00:00:47.649 --> 00:00:52.000 of execution that didn't really work for us. We try it out, okay, 12 00:00:52.119 --> 00:00:56.079 ours, and that really wasn't a perfect fit for us either, and 13 00:00:56.240 --> 00:01:00.200 we've we've kind of turned it into our own thing in conjunction with this for 14 00:01:00.359 --> 00:01:03.600 by four system that Blake is showed me. And so, anyway, it's 15 00:01:03.600 --> 00:01:06.390 going to be a fun episode. Yeah, absolutely, Man. So for 16 00:01:06.549 --> 00:01:10.469 folks, I know a lot of guests on the show talk about using the 17 00:01:10.670 --> 00:01:15.109 Okur methodology for setting goals and tracking progress on their marketing teams. For anybody 18 00:01:15.150 --> 00:01:19.019 listening to this, because you know, as you mentioned, we're kind of 19 00:01:19.019 --> 00:01:23.140 using the okay our methodology, tweaked with this concept of for by four short 20 00:01:23.180 --> 00:01:27.700 term goals. Unpack okay ours just real quick for some context for folks and 21 00:01:27.739 --> 00:01:32.420 then we'll talk a little bit about kind of our journey into kind of what 22 00:01:32.540 --> 00:01:36.609 our goal setting methodology looks like now. Yeah, so okay ours stands for 23 00:01:36.769 --> 00:01:42.329 objectives and key results, and so the idea is that for every person on 24 00:01:42.409 --> 00:01:46.329 your team they would have or for every team, I think it is every 25 00:01:46.450 --> 00:01:52.000 team has a set of objectives and every person on that team, and I 26 00:01:52.079 --> 00:01:56.120 could be botching this, this is partly, partly why we moved away from 27 00:01:56.120 --> 00:02:00.159 it, because it's the methodology can these methodologies can get confusing. But everyone 28 00:02:00.159 --> 00:02:05.150 on the team then has key results. Sometimes they roll up to the objective, 29 00:02:05.310 --> 00:02:08.069 sometimes they don't roll up to the objective. It depends on kind of 30 00:02:08.189 --> 00:02:12.629 how people choose to roll them out. But at the beginning of this year 31 00:02:13.229 --> 00:02:17.340 we rolled out our annual objectives, which are essentially our annual goals, and 32 00:02:19.020 --> 00:02:23.699 those just for example, ours are create fire content, reinforce the rocket ship 33 00:02:24.060 --> 00:02:29.900 and go further faster. And for those folks that are familiar with smart goals, 34 00:02:29.939 --> 00:02:31.650 you hear those and you go those aren't real goals, like had, 35 00:02:31.810 --> 00:02:37.370 those aren't measurable, like they're not specific. How do you know if you're 36 00:02:37.370 --> 00:02:40.930 going to achieve that goal? And so what? That's really where key results 37 00:02:42.050 --> 00:02:46.080 come in in the okay, our system. And so we set those high 38 00:02:46.080 --> 00:02:51.080 level objectives because they're meant to be aspirational, they're meant to be memorable, 39 00:02:51.800 --> 00:02:53.960 and we set these, what four and a half months ago, and I 40 00:02:54.039 --> 00:03:00.389 can still tell you what those three annual goals are because of the way we 41 00:03:00.509 --> 00:03:02.949 named them. And you know Logan. I mean we sat around that room 42 00:03:04.069 --> 00:03:07.990 for probably two or three hours, maybe even longer, coming up with these 43 00:03:07.030 --> 00:03:09.870 names, and it felt like a waste of time, like what the hell 44 00:03:09.909 --> 00:03:15.139 are we doing? Why are we why are we arguing over semantics on how 45 00:03:15.180 --> 00:03:20.060 to name these goals? But it's because we wanted them to be sticky and 46 00:03:20.219 --> 00:03:24.020 we wanted these annual objectives to be something that we remembered throughout the entire year, 47 00:03:24.699 --> 00:03:29.250 which is something we'd struggled with in the past when trying to use, 48 00:03:29.810 --> 00:03:34.009 you know, goal setting, kind of get it done type methodologies, like 49 00:03:34.370 --> 00:03:37.770 for disciplines of execution in the past. So so it worked, but for 50 00:03:37.889 --> 00:03:42.560 it to be effective you actually have to set measurable, specific goals that sit 51 00:03:42.639 --> 00:03:46.319 underneath each of those objectives. So we started down the pathway of okrs. 52 00:03:46.400 --> 00:03:52.080 I learned a lot about it and ultimately we ended up morphing it into into 53 00:03:52.120 --> 00:03:54.949 our own thing. What was your experience, or what has been your experience 54 00:03:54.990 --> 00:03:59.949 all going to with with Ok ours and kind of share your perspective of the 55 00:03:59.990 --> 00:04:02.909 journey? Yeah, one of the things that was interesting for me going from 56 00:04:03.189 --> 00:04:08.870 the four disciplines of execution or DX model was that, you know, the 57 00:04:09.150 --> 00:04:13.259 the way that they approach your highest level goals, which they call your wig, 58 00:04:13.379 --> 00:04:16.860 your wildly important goal, is more in line with that smart or smarter 59 00:04:17.100 --> 00:04:21.300 if you listen to Michael Hyatt goal setting methodology, and it's not that. 60 00:04:21.740 --> 00:04:25.370 You know, okay ours kind of throws that out, but it has a 61 00:04:25.449 --> 00:04:30.050 layer above of thee that object active that is more aspirational than it is kind 62 00:04:30.050 --> 00:04:33.810 of what is the result here? And that's not that the okay our methodology 63 00:04:33.930 --> 00:04:36.810 doesn't have that. It has it at the next level in the in the 64 00:04:36.850 --> 00:04:41.680 key results. So that took me a little while to get my brain around 65 00:04:41.759 --> 00:04:44.480 because, you know, as you said, I had that kind of that 66 00:04:44.720 --> 00:04:47.360 reaction of weight, these aren't these aren't good goals. But so I got 67 00:04:47.480 --> 00:04:53.430 through that. And then the next thing is I started to realize for anybody 68 00:04:53.470 --> 00:04:57.470 who who wants to hear more about kind of wrestling through these words and that 69 00:04:57.629 --> 00:05:00.509 sort of stuff and is it important, I definitely recommend they check out a 70 00:05:00.509 --> 00:05:04.269 previous episode in this series, behind the curtains, where we talked about crafting 71 00:05:04.350 --> 00:05:08.660 our mission and vision statement, which we actually don't call mission and vision and 72 00:05:08.980 --> 00:05:12.220 there's reasons why. But that's previous episode. Will Link to that in the 73 00:05:12.300 --> 00:05:15.100 show notes. But I think the same thing that happened here. You know, 74 00:05:15.180 --> 00:05:18.259 we've talked about that in the past. We've talked about really nailing our 75 00:05:18.379 --> 00:05:25.290 three core values and when you spend time on that language it does become stickier. 76 00:05:25.490 --> 00:05:28.250 We've found that, oh, you know, when we use the rocket 77 00:05:28.290 --> 00:05:31.930 ship Emoji on slack, now we're thinking about how are we reinforcing the rocket 78 00:05:31.970 --> 00:05:36.879 ship or how are we going further, faster and the stickiness of having those 79 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:43.279 high level objectives. I do think has given us that common language to remind 80 00:05:43.319 --> 00:05:46.240 each other where are we going, what are we shooting for? To continue 81 00:05:46.360 --> 00:05:51.509 with the rocket analogy and also informs our decision. Does this really help us 82 00:05:51.550 --> 00:05:56.149 do this? Does this help us go further faster or not? And that 83 00:05:56.430 --> 00:06:00.670 common language I think, just reduces some friction in those conversations. It does 84 00:06:00.829 --> 00:06:04.620 make these aspirations that you're trying to shoot for more memorable and then you have 85 00:06:04.779 --> 00:06:09.660 that shared experience. I think it's really a cultural benefit. The next step 86 00:06:09.740 --> 00:06:13.819 then, is you can't just say hey, I have these aspirations and I 87 00:06:13.899 --> 00:06:15.579 don't know, maybe we'll get there, maybe we won't. You do have 88 00:06:15.699 --> 00:06:20.129 to have a methodology for figuring out, okay, what are the leading indicators 89 00:06:20.329 --> 00:06:23.529 that are going to help us go there, and that's where, in the 90 00:06:23.610 --> 00:06:27.569 okay our methodology, key results come in. We've tweaked that with this for 91 00:06:27.769 --> 00:06:30.410 by four methodology. So let's talk about that, James, a little bit 92 00:06:30.610 --> 00:06:34.600 in how we went through that tweak and how we're kind of implementing the shorter 93 00:06:34.759 --> 00:06:39.519 term for by four goal setting to left to roll up to our big level 94 00:06:39.560 --> 00:06:42.959 objectives. Yeah, so I've got our four by four board up that we're 95 00:06:42.959 --> 00:06:45.720 going to talk about a little bit, but I want to share just what 96 00:06:45.959 --> 00:06:50.550 are the key results or the the specific goals that tie under these annual goals. 97 00:06:50.629 --> 00:06:55.829 So for our for our annual company goals, like I said, they're 98 00:06:55.910 --> 00:07:00.910 create fire content, reinforce the rocket ship and go further faster. So with 99 00:07:00.579 --> 00:07:04.860 in create fire content, are specific, are measurable. Goals have a lot 100 00:07:04.980 --> 00:07:11.819 to do with Seo and ranking our written content on trying to trying to rank 101 00:07:11.860 --> 00:07:15.420 on the first page of Google, because we know that if we can do 102 00:07:15.579 --> 00:07:17.250 that we can drive a lot of we can drive a lot of traffic to 103 00:07:17.290 --> 00:07:21.850 our website and the subsequent results for that are incredible. I mean you grow 104 00:07:21.889 --> 00:07:25.970 your email list, you grow audience, which is a big part of what 105 00:07:26.050 --> 00:07:30.160 we're doing as we transitioned into becoming a media company. So our key results 106 00:07:30.639 --> 00:07:34.720 or specific goals for create fire content or to rank for one hundred keywords in 107 00:07:34.879 --> 00:07:40.360 the first four spots on the first page of Google, very specific, very 108 00:07:40.439 --> 00:07:45.149 measurable. Our second one is published a hundred and twenty five articles by July 109 00:07:45.350 --> 00:07:48.910 onest that are optimized to rank for a specific keyword. Twenty five blog post 110 00:07:49.029 --> 00:07:55.069 per month. So far we're right on track to do that and this specific 111 00:07:55.189 --> 00:08:00.740 and measurable goal has made significant impact on how like on how we've hired writing 112 00:08:00.779 --> 00:08:03.819 teams. We started an intern program because of this. So this is actually 113 00:08:03.939 --> 00:08:09.220 changing the operation of the business and as I have financial conversations with our finance 114 00:08:09.339 --> 00:08:16.050 team, this specific goal is driving a lot of those conversations because we set 115 00:08:16.170 --> 00:08:18.329 this as a priority at the beginning of the year, that this is something 116 00:08:18.370 --> 00:08:22.290 we said we wanted to do. Now we actually have to put our money 117 00:08:22.329 --> 00:08:24.569 where our mouth is. Means we have to we have to hire an extra 118 00:08:24.689 --> 00:08:28.759 full time rider or we have to start an intern program so it's been a 119 00:08:28.839 --> 00:08:33.039 really fun exercise for me to say, Hey, what we said in January 120 00:08:33.080 --> 00:08:37.440 still holds true today, in April, which is not been the story for 121 00:08:37.600 --> 00:08:41.710 me for a long time. I usually you know and very like what's what's 122 00:08:41.789 --> 00:08:45.629 hot now and one am I excited about this second, and so to actually 123 00:08:45.789 --> 00:08:50.309 be able to stay consistent with something that I'm excited about and document it and 124 00:08:50.509 --> 00:08:54.350 actually lead the business toward that direction without a lot of waiver, that's a 125 00:08:54.669 --> 00:08:58.980 new muscle that I'm not used to stretching, but it's been really cool having 126 00:09:00.019 --> 00:09:03.139 this framework to allow us to do it. So that's the example under create 127 00:09:03.220 --> 00:09:07.220 fire content, reinforce rocket ship. We have three specific goals and then go 128 00:09:07.460 --> 00:09:11.210 further faster, we have twelve specific goals. So so we went in and 129 00:09:11.370 --> 00:09:13.330 thought, okay, what is it actually going to look like for us to 130 00:09:13.409 --> 00:09:16.649 accomplish these things? These are the twelve things that need to happen for us 131 00:09:16.649 --> 00:09:20.169 to do this. These are the three things that need to happen for us 132 00:09:20.169 --> 00:09:22.129 to reinforce a rocket ship. These are the two things that need to happen 133 00:09:22.570 --> 00:09:28.720 for us to feel like we've created fire content. So now we translate that 134 00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:35.159 into this for by four system and every month everyone on our leadership team looks 135 00:09:35.320 --> 00:09:41.629 and reviews what those annual goals are and they choose for specific and measurable things 136 00:09:41.870 --> 00:09:46.750 that they're going to work on above and beyond kind of the everyday duties of 137 00:09:48.190 --> 00:09:50.590 what they do day and a day out for their regular job. They pick 138 00:09:50.789 --> 00:09:58.500 four strategic things that ultimately help us get to our annual objectives, are annual 139 00:09:58.620 --> 00:10:05.419 goals, and those four things become what really become their hit list for the 140 00:10:05.500 --> 00:10:09.409 next four weeks. Hence the name four by four. So we found around 141 00:10:09.450 --> 00:10:15.490 here that doing quarterly goals is way too long. Things Change Way too quickly 142 00:10:15.970 --> 00:10:18.529 and honestly, that was, I think, why forty x didn't work for 143 00:10:18.649 --> 00:10:22.399 us. And it seems like the way a lot of people do. Okay, 144 00:10:22.480 --> 00:10:26.279 as I know some people say, you can do them monthly, but 145 00:10:26.399 --> 00:10:28.519 okay, they okay. Our system was still just a little bit too complex 146 00:10:30.080 --> 00:10:33.879 and so we simplified it to where it's you have four things that you're responsible 147 00:10:33.919 --> 00:10:39.950 for doing over the next four weeks. I review those every month to make 148 00:10:39.029 --> 00:10:41.950 sure that I feel like everybody is on the same page and rowing in the 149 00:10:41.990 --> 00:10:46.750 same direction toward the goals that we need to be rowing toward, and then 150 00:10:46.789 --> 00:10:50.379 I'll adjust or I'll work with that particular person on the leadership team to say, 151 00:10:50.419 --> 00:10:54.019 Hey, what if we bounce this one out for this four by four, 152 00:10:54.100 --> 00:10:56.980 because I think this is more of a priority in the short term. 153 00:10:58.419 --> 00:11:03.259 And then we've got we've got it all organized in Trello. So everybody has 154 00:11:03.580 --> 00:11:09.330 a list within Trello and there are the card at the very top of each 155 00:11:09.409 --> 00:11:13.129 person's cellow lists as possible goals, and in that card is where, throughout 156 00:11:13.129 --> 00:11:15.970 the month you're like, oh, man, this would be a really good 157 00:11:16.009 --> 00:11:18.600 thing. For One am I four by fours, and so you can dump 158 00:11:18.639 --> 00:11:22.080 all of your ideas into that possible goals card, which was huge for me, 159 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:26.559 because I'm the king of having two a m ideas and I just want 160 00:11:26.600 --> 00:11:28.080 to go, go, go, I just want to get it done. 161 00:11:28.440 --> 00:11:31.000 But now I can, I can put these in that possible goals card and 162 00:11:31.080 --> 00:11:33.309 then when it comes to the beginning of the month and it's time to set 163 00:11:33.350 --> 00:11:37.509 my new four by fours, I've now got a bank of ideas to choose 164 00:11:37.590 --> 00:11:41.750 from, and so I pray through that and ask God, like what God, 165 00:11:41.789 --> 00:11:43.149 what do you think we should be focusing on this month? What do 166 00:11:43.230 --> 00:11:46.909 you think I should be focusing on this month? And I've got a pool 167 00:11:46.909 --> 00:11:50.259 of ideas to work from and it works like that with everybody on our leadership 168 00:11:50.259 --> 00:11:52.940 team now. And so now I don't feel like if I have an idea 169 00:11:54.059 --> 00:11:56.700 and we don't execute right away, that we're missing an opportunity or we're losing 170 00:11:56.779 --> 00:12:01.610 out. It's just it's not the right time right now. And if you 171 00:12:01.730 --> 00:12:05.289 want people to get things done, you have to let them focus, and 172 00:12:05.490 --> 00:12:09.169 that has been my Achilles heel for really the last half decade and leading this 173 00:12:09.289 --> 00:12:13.049 business and this system has has allowed me to get better at that in a 174 00:12:13.169 --> 00:12:16.759 really significant way. Yeah, absolutely, Man. I mean, for anybody 175 00:12:16.759 --> 00:12:22.639 else listening to this that is in a fast growing company, you probably have 176 00:12:22.840 --> 00:12:26.720 leaders, maybe you yourself are, you know, like you are, James, 177 00:12:26.759 --> 00:12:30.230 where you have a lot of ideas, you see a lot of opportunities, 178 00:12:30.269 --> 00:12:33.190 I mean, and that's part of the reason I think we've continued to 179 00:12:33.269 --> 00:12:35.710 be able to tweak our service and get ahead of of the curve. I 180 00:12:35.789 --> 00:12:39.029 mean, just because we were early in podcasting doesn't mean that, hey, 181 00:12:39.149 --> 00:12:43.549 we're safe here and we're going to continue to grow doing the things that we've 182 00:12:43.590 --> 00:12:46.740 always done. But, like you said, too many ideas. I think 183 00:12:46.779 --> 00:12:50.179 it's a quote from forty x. There always be a surplus of good ideas 184 00:12:50.220 --> 00:12:54.460 and not enough time to execute all of them. What I like about what 185 00:12:54.580 --> 00:12:58.690 we've been doing here is it's combined a few things. It's allowed us to 186 00:12:58.809 --> 00:13:03.450 do goal setting as a leadership team individually, have a common language for that, 187 00:13:03.889 --> 00:13:09.610 have visibility into what everyone else is working on and have a dumping ground 188 00:13:09.690 --> 00:13:13.879 for those ideas, those someday sort of goals, those sorts of things, 189 00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:18.759 where we used to have a separate treloboard that we called our backlog of projects, 190 00:13:18.120 --> 00:13:20.840 and that kind of got stay a little bit after a while. I 191 00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:24.440 think it allowed us to put some things there, but we didn't have a 192 00:13:24.600 --> 00:13:30.149 framework for prioritizing those. And this language of, you know, four goals 193 00:13:30.190 --> 00:13:33.429 over four weeks, four by four, has really added some clarity and some 194 00:13:33.669 --> 00:13:39.470 simplicity. And when you're when you're fast growing, fast moving in your pivoting, 195 00:13:39.870 --> 00:13:43.980 simplicity can just be like, you know, a nice calm breeze or 196 00:13:43.980 --> 00:13:46.539 a little bit of sunshine that hopefully folks are able to get a little bit 197 00:13:46.860 --> 00:13:50.779 these days right now, it can be just a nice reprieve. So a 198 00:13:50.899 --> 00:13:54.259 couple of things I wanted to touch on that we've done as as a leadership 199 00:13:54.340 --> 00:13:58.210 team now, you know, I can remember, you know, almost two 200 00:13:58.250 --> 00:14:03.450 years ago we changed our leadership team. Calls that change. We really implemented 201 00:14:03.529 --> 00:14:07.129 some structured to them with some of the things that Kim Scott mentions in radical 202 00:14:07.210 --> 00:14:11.240 candor, you know, having some time to type out some updates and people 203 00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:15.360 to be able to read those so you don't spend a lot of time just 204 00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:18.679 recapping and everyone else is listening. That sort of stuff, but we started 205 00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:22.000 to realize we didn't really have a structure for this. Is What I did 206 00:14:22.039 --> 00:14:26.509 and what it relates to our goals, so that we have that cadence of 207 00:14:26.549 --> 00:14:31.710 accountability and we also have that structure to keep ourselves on track and again, 208 00:14:31.230 --> 00:14:35.909 focused. So we've actually, you know, every week when we meet as 209 00:14:35.909 --> 00:14:39.740 a leadership team, we have a Google doc where we have our weekly updates. 210 00:14:39.779 --> 00:14:43.500 We've got a spot for our wins from the past week, which I 211 00:14:43.539 --> 00:14:45.820 think is a good thing. We type those out, but we also talked 212 00:14:45.820 --> 00:14:48.379 about them because those are the things that we kind of want to get on 213 00:14:48.460 --> 00:14:52.379 the same page and a connect emotionally as a readership team as well. But 214 00:14:52.539 --> 00:14:56.570 we added a news section that things that we need to talk about that roll 215 00:14:56.649 --> 00:15:00.610 up to those three objectives. And then we also have our weekly commitments, 216 00:15:00.649 --> 00:15:03.730 so, you know, rotating through our our group on a leadership team. 217 00:15:03.769 --> 00:15:07.720 WHO's going to keep track of those so that there's a date and then there's 218 00:15:07.759 --> 00:15:11.879 who is the owner of that next action item, just just good meeting practice 219 00:15:11.960 --> 00:15:16.360 in general, but as the way that it rolls up to our objectives and 220 00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:20.960 our goals, I think has been a structuring that agenda around our annual goals 221 00:15:20.320 --> 00:15:24.230 has been. It's been very helpful for me because it's a subtle way to 222 00:15:24.350 --> 00:15:30.909 reinforce what those three goals are throughout the year. So in before we used 223 00:15:30.950 --> 00:15:35.940 to have our our leadership team agenda structured by person on the leadership team. 224 00:15:35.299 --> 00:15:39.419 So it's like, okay, now it's looking to turn it's my turn outs. 225 00:15:39.460 --> 00:15:41.340 Bills turned outs as bills turned outs, Kelsey's turned outs, Ryans turn 226 00:15:41.820 --> 00:15:46.019 now it's structured around. Okay, now we're going to talk about creating fire 227 00:15:46.139 --> 00:15:50.970 content. What things do we need to talk about related to creating fire content? 228 00:15:50.289 --> 00:15:54.250 Hey, we we need to figure out some sort of a system for, 229 00:15:54.889 --> 00:16:00.330 you know, a checklist on making sure that producers know what fire content 230 00:16:00.490 --> 00:16:03.840 is and running all of our stuff there. Okay, let's let's talk about 231 00:16:03.840 --> 00:16:07.360 this. Do we need an ad hoc meeting? Is just going to take, 232 00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:10.600 you know, an hour or two hours to plush this out and then 233 00:16:10.639 --> 00:16:14.240 we move on to reinforce the rocket ship and then we move on to go 234 00:16:14.399 --> 00:16:18.990 further faster. And so by just in that simple act of categorizing our leadership 235 00:16:18.990 --> 00:16:25.509 team meetings by our annual goals, it subtly reinforces what those goals are for 236 00:16:25.669 --> 00:16:29.350 everyone on our leadership team. Absolutely. Man. Do you want to talk 237 00:16:29.389 --> 00:16:33.500 a little bit about the rollout of this, because we've been talking about okay, 238 00:16:33.539 --> 00:16:40.259 we set these annual objectives, these three high level aspirational goals in objectives 239 00:16:40.299 --> 00:16:44.580 and key results are the okay, our methodology or pretty much really any goal 240 00:16:44.700 --> 00:16:48.370 setting framework. You have them at the company level, you maybe have them 241 00:16:48.409 --> 00:16:51.730 at the team level, then you have them at the individual level. We've 242 00:16:51.769 --> 00:16:55.049 talked a little bit about how we're using this as a leadership team, how 243 00:16:55.169 --> 00:17:00.289 that rolls down to our our monthly goals as individuals on the leadership team. 244 00:17:00.450 --> 00:17:04.000 We haven't talked about really the next steps and that's because we've been very intentional 245 00:17:04.039 --> 00:17:07.400 about that as we've been working on this process for the past couple of months. 246 00:17:07.400 --> 00:17:11.240 So talk a little bit about that, man, so so, being 247 00:17:11.319 --> 00:17:17.390 a fast growing team, we are constantly rolling out new systems, new processes, 248 00:17:17.549 --> 00:17:22.990 new tools and it can be very overwhelming for the folks that are having 249 00:17:22.150 --> 00:17:27.789 to actually put into practice all of the things that we are wanting to make 250 00:17:27.950 --> 00:17:33.539 better in the business. And we've got a couple folks on our leadership team, 251 00:17:33.619 --> 00:17:40.059 Ryan in particular, who is just incredibly empathetic and understands very much so 252 00:17:40.259 --> 00:17:44.690 how important it is for people to not feel overwhelmed and and for people to 253 00:17:44.809 --> 00:17:48.609 feel like they can actually like the things that we're rolling out as a leadership 254 00:17:48.609 --> 00:17:52.250 team aren't just things that are going to go away in two or three months. 255 00:17:52.529 --> 00:17:55.730 These are things that are actually going to stick, and so this year 256 00:17:55.849 --> 00:17:59.240 we've been trying to do a much better job of rolling out things ourselves. 257 00:17:59.680 --> 00:18:03.599 So in January we rolled out harvest time tracking so that we can just know 258 00:18:03.839 --> 00:18:07.160 where all of the hours across our team are going, what projects are they 259 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:11.279 going into, and we rolled that out as a leadership team first for I 260 00:18:11.400 --> 00:18:15.869 think three or four months before we rolled that out to the rest of our 261 00:18:15.950 --> 00:18:19.789 team. We've done the same thing with four by fours and we ultimately decided 262 00:18:19.950 --> 00:18:23.309 not to roll for four by fours out to the rest of our team right 263 00:18:23.349 --> 00:18:27.660 now, just because a lot of folks on our team are already at capacity. 264 00:18:27.980 --> 00:18:32.140 They're already doing kind of random projects on top of their day to day 265 00:18:32.180 --> 00:18:37.019 work, and so to add four more things to that list for them we 266 00:18:37.220 --> 00:18:40.059 just we didn't feel like now is the right time to do that and it 267 00:18:40.099 --> 00:18:42.329 might not ever be the right time to do that honestly. So we're going 268 00:18:42.329 --> 00:18:47.650 to keep for by fours at the leadership level for right now. But one 269 00:18:47.690 --> 00:18:49.410 thing I want to talk about that I think is a critical part of the 270 00:18:49.569 --> 00:18:53.930 success of this system is time blocking. This has been something that we've been 271 00:18:53.970 --> 00:19:00.079 talking about a lot internally, trying to get everyone on our team thinking about 272 00:19:00.200 --> 00:19:04.119 time blocking. We had some folks earlier this month that we're really getting overwhelmed 273 00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:07.640 and feeling like, man, I'm getting I'm getting pulled in a lot of 274 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:10.069 different directions. I don't know what to prioritize, I don't know what to 275 00:19:10.109 --> 00:19:15.069 do. And so by going through this this system that I actually learned from 276 00:19:15.109 --> 00:19:18.470 Kevin Cruz and like an early be to be growth episode, everybody has to 277 00:19:18.549 --> 00:19:22.029 do lists, but the lying and share of those to do list don't actually 278 00:19:22.029 --> 00:19:26.740 get done. It's until you get that to do list into your calendar and 279 00:19:26.900 --> 00:19:30.220 you block a time, a specific time in your calendar to do those tasks, 280 00:19:30.900 --> 00:19:33.339 that's when you're actually going to start to see these things get done. 281 00:19:33.380 --> 00:19:37.859 So when we set our four by fours is a leadership team, the first 282 00:19:37.900 --> 00:19:41.410 week of every month. Everyone on our leadership team then goes and time blocks 283 00:19:42.170 --> 00:19:45.410 what those specific things are throughout the month. So Logan for you, you 284 00:19:45.650 --> 00:19:49.769 know that you need to send a certain number of books to our target accounts. 285 00:19:51.089 --> 00:19:55.039 So you might have two or three one hour time blocks throughout the month, 286 00:19:55.480 --> 00:19:59.079 knowing that each of those time blocks you're going to be sending five or 287 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:03.920 ten books. I have a time block to connect with twenty of our customers 288 00:20:03.920 --> 00:20:07.309 this month and so I've blocked two hours next Wednesday to make sure that I 289 00:20:07.509 --> 00:20:11.789 can reach out and and try to set up phone calls with twenty of our 290 00:20:11.829 --> 00:20:15.589 customers. So those types of things actually make sure that the four by four 291 00:20:15.670 --> 00:20:19.750 that were our team is setting actually get done. Yeah, absolutely, man, 292 00:20:19.829 --> 00:20:23.019 that that's been huge for me. It takes a little bit of a 293 00:20:23.099 --> 00:20:26.579 shift. I mean the first thing is, okay, you got to put 294 00:20:26.619 --> 00:20:30.380 that on your calendar. The next thing is to treat it like a call, 295 00:20:30.579 --> 00:20:33.339 because at times it can be. Those can be the easiest things to 296 00:20:33.900 --> 00:20:37.490 shift around. But as you do that, even if you do, then 297 00:20:37.569 --> 00:20:41.170 you have to look at okay, where do I have time to move this 298 00:20:41.329 --> 00:20:44.450 if I have to, and then your you know that this is a monthly 299 00:20:44.569 --> 00:20:48.009 goal and so hold on, I've only got eight or business days in the 300 00:20:48.089 --> 00:20:52.440 month. I can't necessarily move this and just doing that right right at that 301 00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:56.319 time. That's another episode will have to link to in the show notes, 302 00:20:56.359 --> 00:20:59.000 the one with with Kevin crews. I know you brought that up with with 303 00:20:59.680 --> 00:21:03.240 the team the other days. You were talking about kind of mapping out your 304 00:21:03.559 --> 00:21:07.190 ideal week. I know obviously you listen to a lot of podcasts. You 305 00:21:07.309 --> 00:21:10.670 listen to a lot of books as well. Any other resources that you want 306 00:21:10.670 --> 00:21:14.069 to share with folks that have been key as you've been thinking about this and 307 00:21:14.109 --> 00:21:18.619 leading the team in shifting our goal setting and our approach with this methodology? 308 00:21:18.700 --> 00:21:22.579 Man. Yeah, I think anything Patricklyncioni puts out is worse a leader consuming. 309 00:21:22.740 --> 00:21:27.940 So the book the advantage absolutely changed my life and at the table with 310 00:21:29.059 --> 00:21:33.690 Patricklyncioni, the podcast from Patrick Concioni is phenomenal. And then Craig grow Shell's 311 00:21:33.690 --> 00:21:41.329 leadership podcast is also hugely transformational for me, and that has been something where 312 00:21:41.329 --> 00:21:47.279 it feels like almost every episode I've got some tangible nugget or take away that 313 00:21:47.599 --> 00:21:51.279 that we can try to implement. And so much. Man Says. I'm 314 00:21:51.359 --> 00:21:56.480 just learning like the craft of leadership, because this crap is not easy here 315 00:21:56.000 --> 00:22:03.230 and and doing things intentionally and purposefully. I always prided myself on on being 316 00:22:03.349 --> 00:22:07.069 handsoff and building systems and process so that I wouldn't have to be involved in 317 00:22:07.109 --> 00:22:10.869 the Daytoday, and so we've got great customer facing team, we've got a 318 00:22:10.910 --> 00:22:14.269 great sales team, but I still need to be connected with our customers, 319 00:22:14.349 --> 00:22:18.019 and so that's why one of my four by fours this month is to connect 320 00:22:18.380 --> 00:22:22.460 with our customers directly and start having conversations with customers, because because that's that's 321 00:22:22.460 --> 00:22:26.579 going to create a whole lot of ideas. It in for me and that's 322 00:22:26.619 --> 00:22:30.210 the contribution I add to the team is pushing US forward and constantly innovating and 323 00:22:30.369 --> 00:22:34.849 making us better so that we can ultimately continue to grow. And so understanding 324 00:22:34.890 --> 00:22:41.289 those things about myself come from listening to guys like Patrick Lencione and Greg grow 325 00:22:41.329 --> 00:22:45.319 show. Yeah, absolutely, Man. I so much appreciate the way that 326 00:22:45.400 --> 00:22:48.599 you lean into our one of our three core values in never stop learning. 327 00:22:48.680 --> 00:22:52.880 You just lead the charge there. Sometimes that can, you know, push 328 00:22:52.880 --> 00:22:56.160 you to have so many ideas that we don't have time to implement them. 329 00:22:56.200 --> 00:22:57.750 But that's why we're talking about how to deal with that, because a lot 330 00:22:57.829 --> 00:23:03.269 of founders and CEOS. That is kind of a common if you're just listening 331 00:23:03.309 --> 00:23:06.230 to this, quote unquote. I'm doing air quotes problem, but it is 332 00:23:06.269 --> 00:23:10.349 a good problem to have. To very had to have a smart, forward 333 00:23:10.430 --> 00:23:14.220 thinking, creative founder, you know, like yourself, man, and so 334 00:23:14.660 --> 00:23:18.859 as part of what attracted me to the team way, way back. So 335 00:23:18.380 --> 00:23:22.099 I really appreciate that. Will Link to all of these resources in the show 336 00:23:22.180 --> 00:23:27.569 notes. Hopefully you guys find something valuable there. It's definitely been I can 337 00:23:27.609 --> 00:23:33.490 feel a difference in how we're progressing and how we're feeling about you know, 338 00:23:33.529 --> 00:23:37.210 because there's nothing more demotivating than just setting goals and then kicking the can down 339 00:23:37.250 --> 00:23:41.480 the road for so long, because then you start to feel the weight of 340 00:23:41.559 --> 00:23:44.200 that fail your quote unquote. I don't know why I'm doing so many air 341 00:23:44.200 --> 00:23:47.319 quotes today, but it's just kind of the way I feel and I think 342 00:23:47.400 --> 00:23:49.960 with as much as everyone is dealing with, you might be seeing good and 343 00:23:51.119 --> 00:23:53.400 bad coming out of all of this pandemic. You might be seeing more bad 344 00:23:53.480 --> 00:23:56.750 than good right now. Whatever the case is, you know, you want 345 00:23:56.789 --> 00:24:02.390 to set yourself up for success and not create more things that feel like a 346 00:24:02.589 --> 00:24:06.269 burden and so hopefully some of the things that we've been learning and implementing here 347 00:24:06.349 --> 00:24:11.019 to make goal setting easier and lighter and a little bit more fun and simple 348 00:24:11.180 --> 00:24:14.940 for our team or helpful for folks out there. If you are listening to 349 00:24:15.059 --> 00:24:18.059 this and you're not yet connected with James and I on Linkedin, please reach 350 00:24:18.059 --> 00:24:22.339 out. We would love to connect with you. We love chatting with and 351 00:24:22.420 --> 00:24:26.250 connecting with listeners of the show. James Carbury, see are the aary on 352 00:24:26.410 --> 00:24:32.009 Linkedin. I'm logging Lyles Lylles, as high spell my last name. Feel 353 00:24:32.049 --> 00:24:34.049 free to reach out to us. James, thank you so much for another 354 00:24:34.089 --> 00:24:37.529 great chat and another great episode to do together. Man, hope to do 355 00:24:37.569 --> 00:24:45.160 it a game. Man, I hate it when podcasts incessantly ask their listeners 356 00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:48.880 for reviews, but I get why they do it, because reviews are enormously 357 00:24:48.960 --> 00:24:52.359 helpful when you're trying to grow a podcast audience. So here's what we decided 358 00:24:52.400 --> 00:24:55.150 to do. If you leave a review for me to be growth in apple 359 00:24:55.230 --> 00:25:00.150 podcasts and email me a screenshot of the review to James at Sweet Fish Mediacom, 360 00:25:00.470 --> 00:25:03.230 I'll send you assigned copy of my new book content based networking. How 361 00:25:03.309 --> 00:25:07.460 to instantly connect with anyone you want to know. We get a review, 362 00:25:07.500 --> 00:25:08.660 you get a free book. We both win.