1293: 3 Steps to Tell Better Customer Stories w/ Garret Weigel

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.240 --> 00:00:08.349 Welcome back to beb growth. My name is James Carter and I'm joined today 2 00:00:08.429 --> 00:00:12.910 by Garrett why go. He is the customer content marketing manager at Mendix and 3 00:00:12.990 --> 00:00:16.149 Garrett, before we jump in, I have a very, very important question. 4 00:00:16.309 --> 00:00:21.350 Ask you what was your AOL Instant Messenger screen name when you were growing 5 00:00:21.390 --> 00:00:26.460 up? That's a great question and you know, normally I'm sure some of 6 00:00:26.539 --> 00:00:29.940 the responses might be something silly or fun, but at a young age I 7 00:00:30.699 --> 00:00:35.020 decide to go to professional route and just chose Gt Weigel as my screen name. 8 00:00:35.299 --> 00:00:39.530 So Professional Avan. So I loved. Right at eleven or twelve years 9 00:00:39.570 --> 00:00:44.409 old, you had your career in mind and I don't know that there's many 10 00:00:44.450 --> 00:00:48.689 people. I was sooner fan, five will eleven so and I'Scama, big 11 00:00:48.810 --> 00:00:53.479 sooner fan, and I guess I just I was. I was very simple 12 00:00:53.640 --> 00:00:56.679 in my young age, but not quite as professional as you. So, 13 00:00:56.799 --> 00:01:00.000 Garet, I'm super pumped for this conversation. We had our pre interview a 14 00:01:00.039 --> 00:01:04.750 few weeks ago and we're going to be talking today about a three step framework 15 00:01:06.150 --> 00:01:11.469 to tell better customer stories. Gives a little bit of context. Your at 16 00:01:11.549 --> 00:01:14.989 Mendis now, but give us a little bit of context as to how this 17 00:01:15.150 --> 00:01:19.420 became something that you were pretty passionate about. Sure, so, back in 18 00:01:19.540 --> 00:01:25.500 college I actually studied computer information systems and in doing so I realized that I 19 00:01:25.659 --> 00:01:30.420 didn't want to be a programmer or coder and at some point along my journey 20 00:01:30.459 --> 00:01:34.890 I started to fall in love with marketing. I had an internship with Fentlin 21 00:01:34.969 --> 00:01:42.010 University. I was creating dashboards for the marketing executive leadership team there and it 22 00:01:42.609 --> 00:01:46.290 kind of fell into place from there. After College, I was an seo 23 00:01:46.409 --> 00:01:52.879 analyst for a little bit and I was working at an agency helping, obviously, 24 00:01:52.920 --> 00:01:56.799 our clients with their SEO strategy, and I wanted to move my skill 25 00:01:56.879 --> 00:02:00.359 set in house, so I from there. I went to form labs of 26 00:02:00.430 --> 00:02:06.390 D printing company based out of Somerville, and it was a start up at 27 00:02:06.430 --> 00:02:08.710 the time and, as with any start up, I wore many hats, 28 00:02:09.110 --> 00:02:14.110 and so while I was hired for Seo efforts, I was also working on 29 00:02:14.710 --> 00:02:20.699 writing customer stories, helping our content writers on the blog, making sure that 30 00:02:21.740 --> 00:02:24.780 we were communicating the value that our customers were seeing from our product. So 31 00:02:24.900 --> 00:02:29.819 that was just one of the many things I was doing there. After my 32 00:02:29.979 --> 00:02:36.849 stint there, I became a content manager, where my roles and responsibilities were 33 00:02:36.930 --> 00:02:39.930 buried, but it was all centered around creating be to be content. And 34 00:02:40.930 --> 00:02:46.240 during my time at my previous company I realized that customer stories was my bread 35 00:02:46.280 --> 00:02:52.520 and butter. who was something I loved working on. I love to discover 36 00:02:52.719 --> 00:02:58.590 the value that customers were seeing from products, at high tech companies primarily, 37 00:02:59.110 --> 00:03:04.990 and so once I realize this passion for telling the customer story, that's when 38 00:03:05.030 --> 00:03:09.389 I started looking for roles that were very focused on that aspect of marketing, 39 00:03:09.469 --> 00:03:14.419 and that's how I ended up at index. So gear you've mentioned that phrase 40 00:03:14.860 --> 00:03:19.020 customer story. Is there a difference between a customer story and a case study, 41 00:03:19.020 --> 00:03:23.539 or is it semantics? Sure, I I prefer to call a customer 42 00:03:23.580 --> 00:03:29.289 story because one of the biggest things to keep in mind when communicating the value 43 00:03:29.330 --> 00:03:31.650 that your customers C is that you need to do it in a story. 44 00:03:32.050 --> 00:03:38.330 It seems simple, but it's pretty critical. Marketing these days is, or 45 00:03:38.370 --> 00:03:46.599 I should say successful marketing these days is creating authentic content and you know, 46 00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:49.199 a few years ago, maybe five or ten years ago, a lot of 47 00:03:49.280 --> 00:03:54.360 marketers were creating case studies that were primarily focused on metrics on the specific value 48 00:03:54.479 --> 00:04:00.870 that product is driving for companies customers, and so it's much more important to 49 00:04:00.789 --> 00:04:05.669 create a story out of the value that they're realizing so that you can then 50 00:04:06.189 --> 00:04:13.699 have your prospects relate to that story and be more interested in your product because 51 00:04:13.740 --> 00:04:17.180 they, you know, are hearing from from an authentic source, from another 52 00:04:17.259 --> 00:04:21.500 customer that I can relate with. And you you actually mentioned before we'd started 53 00:04:21.620 --> 00:04:28.089 recording that at Mende's your customer stories, they are actually they have the highest 54 00:04:28.370 --> 00:04:32.930 time on page and the return rate is higher than average between your customer stories 55 00:04:32.970 --> 00:04:35.649 in any other type of content on the MINDIC side. Is that right? 56 00:04:36.209 --> 00:04:40.959 Yes, that's correct. So that's part of the reason why we are starting 57 00:04:41.000 --> 00:04:46.120 to build a team around customer content marketing. I'm just the second higher on 58 00:04:46.240 --> 00:04:49.959 this team, but because of those, those stats that you mentioned, we've 59 00:04:50.000 --> 00:04:55.430 recognized the value of putting more effort behind telling customer stories. It's incredible, 60 00:04:55.470 --> 00:04:59.670 all right. So you've got a three step framework for how to actually tell 61 00:04:59.790 --> 00:05:03.589 better customer stories. The first part of this framework is that you need to 62 00:05:03.709 --> 00:05:09.500 get clear about the value that you're providing to your customer. Can you talk 63 00:05:09.500 --> 00:05:13.899 to us about this? Sure thing so I mentioned this a little bit before, 64 00:05:14.060 --> 00:05:18.540 but prospects don't want ads, right. Ads are not their favorite thing. 65 00:05:18.579 --> 00:05:21.449 They want to if you're going to market to them, you want to 66 00:05:21.529 --> 00:05:26.009 be telling a story that they can relate to. They want to be engaged 67 00:05:26.089 --> 00:05:30.009 when they're reading content or watching a video, and so, as we talked 68 00:05:30.009 --> 00:05:33.889 about before, that's where the story piece comes in. But the main point 69 00:05:34.129 --> 00:05:38.959 of the story should be that value that you're providing to your customer. And 70 00:05:39.079 --> 00:05:45.560 so I'm actually reading crossing the chasm by Jeffrey Moore and in that book they 71 00:05:46.040 --> 00:05:54.110 he talks about the technology adoption life cycle and how important references are for high 72 00:05:54.189 --> 00:05:59.589 tech markets in the buying decision process. And so those references, you know, 73 00:06:00.029 --> 00:06:02.589 word of mouth is the best reference that you can you can have for 74 00:06:02.910 --> 00:06:08.100 convincing prospects to go through product. Second to that would be a customer story. 75 00:06:08.139 --> 00:06:15.139 It would be that relatable narrative of how your customer is realizing value after 76 00:06:15.300 --> 00:06:19.290 purchasing their product. And this is especially true with medb marketing. And so 77 00:06:19.970 --> 00:06:25.449 this concept, I believe, holds true outside of high tech markets. Right, 78 00:06:25.569 --> 00:06:29.769 if you're in a business and you're trying to figure out what solution what 79 00:06:30.089 --> 00:06:35.959 software you need to purchase to, you know, enhance their customer engagement or 80 00:06:38.199 --> 00:06:43.079 provide operational efficiency. You want to hear from customers of the company that you're 81 00:06:43.079 --> 00:06:47.029 buying from to understand how they found value in your product. Yeah, so 82 00:06:47.149 --> 00:06:53.389 if you're really rooting the story more in it's the customer story, right. 83 00:06:53.470 --> 00:06:57.149 It's not. It's not centric around your product. Is that the biggest mistake 84 00:06:57.189 --> 00:07:00.899 you see that most people lean themselves toward is trying to make the customer first 85 00:07:00.899 --> 00:07:09.339 story really just a guysed or a mask for talking about their product. That's 86 00:07:09.379 --> 00:07:12.939 right. There's a time and place to talk about product features, to talk 87 00:07:12.939 --> 00:07:19.889 about specifications, but in the purchase process, when your prospects are consuming your 88 00:07:19.970 --> 00:07:25.290 content, they at the time that they're looking for customer references. They may 89 00:07:25.329 --> 00:07:29.329 not necessarily be looking for that feature list. They want to know at a 90 00:07:29.370 --> 00:07:34.160 high level, why did your customers purchase the product and what are they realizing 91 00:07:34.879 --> 00:07:40.519 now that they have your product installed in their company? I love it all 92 00:07:40.519 --> 00:07:45.110 right, Garrett, this second part of your framework. So you first you 93 00:07:45.470 --> 00:07:48.509 have to figure out the value you're providing to your customer. Next, the 94 00:07:48.550 --> 00:07:54.550 second part is the value that your customer is able to give to their customer 95 00:07:55.029 --> 00:07:57.670 because of your product. So we can get pretty met at here. But 96 00:07:57.949 --> 00:08:03.819 but elaborate on this forst sure. So when you explore the value your customers 97 00:08:03.860 --> 00:08:09.500 are providing their customers, you can start to understand more deeply the why behind 98 00:08:09.779 --> 00:08:16.610 your customers purchased your product. So obviously you you have some relationship with your 99 00:08:16.649 --> 00:08:20.850 customer. You understand why they're they're purchasing your product. But when you start 100 00:08:20.889 --> 00:08:26.209 to dive in the value that they're passing on to their customers, you get 101 00:08:26.250 --> 00:08:31.160 that authentic look as to why they purchase your product in the first place. 102 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:37.559 And I keep coming back to this idea of telling authentic stories. By understanding 103 00:08:37.639 --> 00:08:41.950 your customer and how they care about their customers, you start to build this 104 00:08:41.070 --> 00:08:48.309 narrative around why their story matters. Again going back to that why of why 105 00:08:48.389 --> 00:08:52.429 they purchased your product that you know there's a myriad of reasons why prospect will 106 00:08:52.429 --> 00:08:56.620 come to your company. In many cases it's because they want to enhance the 107 00:08:56.659 --> 00:09:00.580 value that they're providing down the line. And so just simply asking that question 108 00:09:00.820 --> 00:09:03.820 of what value are you providing your customers, you can start to understand those 109 00:09:03.820 --> 00:09:09.370 nuances and it helps to be more authentic, more relatable in your story. 110 00:09:09.809 --> 00:09:15.730 Yeah, I would imagine that it makes your customer want to share that story 111 00:09:15.929 --> 00:09:20.210 because they end up being the hero. You paint the story in such a 112 00:09:20.289 --> 00:09:24.049 way where they deeply care about their customer. So it would make sense that 113 00:09:24.210 --> 00:09:28.320 they would want to share that story all the more because it shows them as 114 00:09:28.679 --> 00:09:33.120 being an advocate for their customers. That's right, and I find that when 115 00:09:33.159 --> 00:09:37.669 we ask our customers this question, you you start to uncover, you know, 116 00:09:37.710 --> 00:09:43.070 little factoids that you may not have realized before. Sometimes your customer, 117 00:09:43.429 --> 00:09:46.950 when they're talking to you, they're not thinking about their customers, they're thinking 118 00:09:46.990 --> 00:09:50.629 about you as a vendor. They're thinking about how your product, looked, 119 00:09:50.190 --> 00:09:54.059 fits into their organization specifically, and sometimes they forget that, you know, 120 00:09:54.179 --> 00:10:01.500 there's this kind of line of succession of how value is passed down to their 121 00:10:01.580 --> 00:10:05.460 customer, and so, you know, by bringing to light the value of 122 00:10:05.580 --> 00:10:09.809 your product, you you helped to outline how your customers, customers, are 123 00:10:09.850 --> 00:10:15.769 benefiting from that product. Hey, everybody logan with sweet fish here. 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It automatically creates reports and generates some dashboards that are incredibly useful to 132 00:10:50.460 --> 00:10:54.139 see things like what content has been performing the best and what days of the 133 00:10:54.220 --> 00:10:58.980 week are we getting the most engagement and our average views proposed. I'd highly 134 00:10:58.100 --> 00:11:01.659 suggest you guys check out this tool if you're putting out content on Linkedin, 135 00:11:01.899 --> 00:11:05.769 and if you're not, you should be. It's been a game changer for 136 00:11:05.929 --> 00:11:09.049 us. If you go to shield APP DOT AI and check out the ten 137 00:11:09.049 --> 00:11:13.970 day free trial, you can even use our promo code be to be growth 138 00:11:13.210 --> 00:11:18.840 to get a twenty five percent discount. Again, that's shield APP DOT AI 139 00:11:18.279 --> 00:11:22.879 and that Promo Code is be the number to be gross all one word. 140 00:11:24.120 --> 00:11:30.440 All right, let's get back to the show. So, Garrett, the 141 00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:35.789 other benefit that I could see from doing this would be that when you make 142 00:11:35.509 --> 00:11:41.870 your story, when you add a component to your story that shows your customer 143 00:11:43.350 --> 00:11:46.110 that they are actually the hero to their customer, it makes your customer want 144 00:11:46.139 --> 00:11:50.500 to share the customer story or the case study even more because of course you 145 00:11:50.580 --> 00:11:54.820 want to share something that makes your company look like you're advocating for your customers, 146 00:11:54.899 --> 00:11:58.700 like Hey, look, we are investing in something that is creating a 147 00:11:58.820 --> 00:12:03.690 better experience for our customers, so talk to us about that. Sure, 148 00:12:03.809 --> 00:12:07.570 saying so, you know, this question we find is key to understanding why 149 00:12:09.289 --> 00:12:15.169 our customers care about our product. So in many cases it's as simple as 150 00:12:15.330 --> 00:12:18.320 asking you know, what is the value that you're passing on to your customers, 151 00:12:18.679 --> 00:12:22.720 and by asking that you you can help to establish again that why of 152 00:12:22.320 --> 00:12:28.639 why we should care that our customers are finding value through our product. You 153 00:12:28.720 --> 00:12:31.509 know, we don't work in isolation. When when my company is selling to 154 00:12:31.549 --> 00:12:37.429 another company, they're having other companies that they're selling to, and understanding that 155 00:12:37.549 --> 00:12:41.309 succession of value you helps to paint that picture in a more authentic way. 156 00:12:41.629 --> 00:12:43.940 I love it. And so when you go to ask that question, is 157 00:12:45.019 --> 00:12:48.460 it as simple as hey, frank, so tell me about the value that 158 00:12:48.980 --> 00:12:54.019 how the value that our product provides you enables you to add more value to 159 00:12:54.179 --> 00:12:58.730 your customer, or is it more in depth than that? It depends. 160 00:12:58.970 --> 00:13:03.850 Sometimes I've asked the question as simple as that and our customers have given great 161 00:13:03.889 --> 00:13:09.929 responses. In other cases I find that it helps to ask that question in 162 00:13:09.009 --> 00:13:13.480 a specific way. So let's say your customers talking about a use case that 163 00:13:13.639 --> 00:13:18.519 they've found value out of your product. If you start to dive into that 164 00:13:18.600 --> 00:13:22.600 use case, okay, how has this use case pass value on to your 165 00:13:22.679 --> 00:13:26.549 customers? Sometimes that gets them talking more and sometimes by asking those follow up 166 00:13:26.549 --> 00:13:33.389 questions it's easier for your customers to to share that value that we're trying to 167 00:13:33.429 --> 00:13:37.070 get out of them from this question. I love it, Garrett. So, 168 00:13:37.350 --> 00:13:39.549 so we've talked about the first step in the framework. You have to 169 00:13:39.669 --> 00:13:43.899 get clear on the value you're providing to the customer. Then we dove into 170 00:13:45.179 --> 00:13:48.419 the value that your customer is able to give to their customer because of your 171 00:13:48.500 --> 00:13:52.860 product. Now this third part of the framework is something we actually touched on 172 00:13:52.899 --> 00:13:54.220 at the very beginning of the interview, but I want to circle back here 173 00:13:54.259 --> 00:13:58.730 because there's a lot to unpack it's actually turning it into a story and not 174 00:13:58.970 --> 00:14:03.929 just a bunch of stats. Talk to us about this one sure things. 175 00:14:03.049 --> 00:14:07.889 So, at the end of the day, in be to be marketing, 176 00:14:07.929 --> 00:14:11.000 even though we're selling to businesses, we're dealing with people, we're dealing with 177 00:14:11.120 --> 00:14:15.200 humans, and it's very important that in marketing materials, you do your best 178 00:14:15.320 --> 00:14:22.559 to have a hero, that's the the protagonist of your story. And so 179 00:14:22.679 --> 00:14:28.110 by focusing on your customer, their journey with their product, how they're finding 180 00:14:28.110 --> 00:14:31.909 value and how they're passing on value to their customers, you start to paint 181 00:14:31.950 --> 00:14:41.019 this narrative around or you start you start to create a story around value drivers. 182 00:14:41.820 --> 00:14:46.779 And so, you know, it's obvious that we as people love stories. 183 00:14:46.860 --> 00:14:50.700 You look at religious texts, you look at Shakespeare, even Netflix. 184 00:14:50.980 --> 00:14:58.129 We use stories to communicate ideas and in order to be effective in today's marketing 185 00:14:58.210 --> 00:15:03.690 world, with tons of content being created every single day, you want to 186 00:15:03.730 --> 00:15:07.440 be able to resonate with your audience, and I mentioned this briefly, but 187 00:15:07.720 --> 00:15:11.360 you need to find the hero of your story and very commonly the hero of 188 00:15:11.399 --> 00:15:16.720 your story is your customer or the end user of your product, and it's 189 00:15:16.759 --> 00:15:22.029 very simple to to identify who that hero is, and it's very simple to 190 00:15:22.029 --> 00:15:26.429 bring their story to light. You just need to describe who your customer is. 191 00:15:28.110 --> 00:15:31.110 You know, at a personal level, what is our job title? 192 00:15:31.190 --> 00:15:33.990 What do they do at the company? And you talk about the problem that 193 00:15:33.070 --> 00:15:37.820 they're trying to solve, and the idea behind this is that the problem they're 194 00:15:37.820 --> 00:15:41.500 trying to solve is not unique to them. It can be found in, 195 00:15:41.220 --> 00:15:45.940 you know, in similar job titles across an industry, across a market, 196 00:15:46.100 --> 00:15:50.970 what have you. And by creating that hero and telling their relatable problem, 197 00:15:50.450 --> 00:15:56.850 your prospects who are reading your content will will be more invested in the story 198 00:15:56.250 --> 00:16:00.169 and be more invested in your product because they're able to relate to the problems 199 00:16:00.210 --> 00:16:04.159 you're describing. What are some things, Garrett? I would imagine that really 200 00:16:04.200 --> 00:16:11.720 the magic of doing these customer stories, it seems like, especially knowing that 201 00:16:11.919 --> 00:16:15.240 they need to be stories and not just a bunch of stats, the magic 202 00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:18.190 really is in the interview itself. Is there anything you've learned over the years 203 00:16:18.269 --> 00:16:23.269 of doing probably lots of these interviews that would be helpful for someone looking at 204 00:16:23.309 --> 00:16:27.230 this going man, we need to start telling better customer stories. How can 205 00:16:27.269 --> 00:16:33.620 they approach interviewing their customer. What are some nuances that that you've learned over 206 00:16:33.659 --> 00:16:38.419 the years? Sure, so telling the story is incredibly important, but that 207 00:16:38.539 --> 00:16:44.059 does not mean that you leave out stats and metrics. Right, every buyer, 208 00:16:44.340 --> 00:16:47.730 every decision maker, wants to understand what will I get out of your 209 00:16:47.730 --> 00:16:52.610 product if I purchase into it? And so what I do going into customer 210 00:16:52.649 --> 00:16:56.330 interviews is I think about at the get go. You know who is our 211 00:16:56.370 --> 00:17:00.330 customers? I said, who is the hero? How are they using our 212 00:17:00.370 --> 00:17:03.639 product? What is their use case? And then what is the value that 213 00:17:03.799 --> 00:17:08.160 they're seeing from our product? It's usually time saved, it's usually money saved. 214 00:17:08.680 --> 00:17:14.200 But you go in with those very simple questions and as the prospect starts 215 00:17:14.279 --> 00:17:15.829 talking to you and as they are, I'm sorry, as a customer, 216 00:17:15.910 --> 00:17:21.789 starts talking to you and answering these questions, you need to start listening for 217 00:17:21.829 --> 00:17:26.910 kind of phrases and keywords that you want to extract from your customer further story. 218 00:17:27.269 --> 00:17:32.140 So a lot of the meat of customer stories come and follow up questions. 219 00:17:32.180 --> 00:17:34.259 Right, so you might start off with how are you using our product? 220 00:17:34.539 --> 00:17:37.579 They describe in a very simple way. You just say, okay, 221 00:17:37.660 --> 00:17:41.980 tell me more about, you know, this specific use case that you talked 222 00:17:41.980 --> 00:17:45.769 about. Then they start telling you about how they're using your product, they 223 00:17:45.769 --> 00:17:49.329 start talking about the problems that they're solving and you just keep going down the 224 00:17:49.609 --> 00:17:55.009 rabbit hole. Getting your customer to talk really, essentially, is all that 225 00:17:55.089 --> 00:18:00.079 it is, and from the initial question of just understanding how they're using your 226 00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:04.079 product and asking those follow up questions, you can then discover really why they 227 00:18:04.119 --> 00:18:08.160 care about your product. It's again you, you you want to lean on 228 00:18:08.240 --> 00:18:12.390 those metrics and stats, but there's so much more to the story than just 229 00:18:12.710 --> 00:18:15.950 time or money saved, and you get that through those follow of questions. 230 00:18:17.029 --> 00:18:19.710 Yeah, so you don't want to ask open ended questions. Your your you 231 00:18:19.829 --> 00:18:22.750 do want to ask open any questions. You don't want to ask a yes 232 00:18:22.829 --> 00:18:27.220 and no questions. You want to get them talking and I would imagine, 233 00:18:29.140 --> 00:18:33.180 I don't know, was there anything about this process in the early days, 234 00:18:33.180 --> 00:18:36.299 as you were first figuring this out, when you still you know you were 235 00:18:36.380 --> 00:18:41.420 nervous. You like, is there anything that helped you kind of get better 236 00:18:41.490 --> 00:18:49.609 at these pretty quickly over time? I realize that customer marketing is relationship building. 237 00:18:51.250 --> 00:18:55.369 You know, you hear very similar things in sales. You want to 238 00:18:55.490 --> 00:18:59.039 create a relationship with your customer and you want to have a candid conversation with 239 00:18:59.160 --> 00:19:03.240 them. So I stopped viewing them, as you know, kind of this 240 00:19:03.440 --> 00:19:07.079 foreign entity that I'm just interviewing and start viewing them as a friend who I 241 00:19:07.079 --> 00:19:11.630 might talk to about their job. And the more friendly you get, the 242 00:19:11.710 --> 00:19:15.549 more conversational you get, that's where you start to discover their story. That's 243 00:19:15.549 --> 00:19:18.109 where you can start painting them as a hero. You can start humanizing them. 244 00:19:18.589 --> 00:19:22.789 You know you can. You can discover what the plot around the story 245 00:19:22.029 --> 00:19:26.099 is. You know, first, first year hero had this problem, then 246 00:19:26.099 --> 00:19:30.500 they purchat, purchased your solution and now their problem is solved. Put Very 247 00:19:30.539 --> 00:19:36.819 simply, that's the plot for your customer story and that's how you you take 248 00:19:36.900 --> 00:19:40.970 all of these components. You know it's kind of disjointed, but by going 249 00:19:41.130 --> 00:19:45.690 through these basic questions, by asking those call up questions to the open ended 250 00:19:47.170 --> 00:19:51.970 initial questions, you can you can create this story, this plot, this 251 00:19:52.130 --> 00:19:56.599 hero that your prospects will relate to. I love that idea. Of I 252 00:19:56.160 --> 00:20:00.000 I say all the time we need to be thinking about friendship more in the 253 00:20:00.079 --> 00:20:04.440 context of business. It just makes business more fun when you start becoming friends 254 00:20:04.440 --> 00:20:10.829 with people that you're working with. But I love also this idea of this 255 00:20:11.069 --> 00:20:15.549 is not a checklist of questions that you can ask and just check the box 256 00:20:15.630 --> 00:20:18.470 and go, okay, I asked my seventeen questions, I'm done. You 257 00:20:18.549 --> 00:20:22.059 actually need to be curious, you need to hear what they're saying and dig 258 00:20:22.339 --> 00:20:26.619 further, based on based on context clues and and the the tonality of their 259 00:20:26.660 --> 00:20:30.740 voice. It's actually being a human when I talked to Joe Klecky about case 260 00:20:30.779 --> 00:20:34.019 studies a few weeks ago, he's started to come to called K study body. 261 00:20:34.140 --> 00:20:40.369 He talked a lot about the the interview itself is human. Don't think 262 00:20:40.490 --> 00:20:44.890 that. Don't this is not something that ai is going to take over over 263 00:20:44.970 --> 00:20:48.609 the next couple of years, because it's more than just asking a standard set 264 00:20:48.650 --> 00:20:53.359 of questions. It's actually understanding what they're saying, empathizing with what they're saying, 265 00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:57.599 going deeper on certain parts of their answers and asking them to elaborate more. 266 00:20:57.720 --> 00:21:03.589 So we obviously love that when podcasting is very similar in that regard, 267 00:21:03.630 --> 00:21:07.670 and so so Garrett. I have gotten a ton of value from this. 268 00:21:07.869 --> 00:21:11.589 I'm really grateful for you jumping on here and sharing this with our listeners. 269 00:21:11.750 --> 00:21:15.509 If there's how can our listeners stay connected with you? What's the best way 270 00:21:15.509 --> 00:21:18.940 for them to stay connected? Going over to my linkedin I would say, 271 00:21:19.059 --> 00:21:22.779 is the best way and it's very simple. It's my AOL screen name. 272 00:21:23.220 --> 00:21:27.700 Believe it's Linkedincom GT IIGLE, but I'm sure there will be a link on 273 00:21:27.740 --> 00:21:30.460 the page or something similar for them. Club out go'll be a link in 274 00:21:30.500 --> 00:21:34.690 the show notes if you're if you're not looking in the show noteses Garrett spells 275 00:21:34.730 --> 00:21:38.769 his name with two hours and one t so, Ga Arr et and then 276 00:21:40.289 --> 00:21:45.130 wigle is Weigel. Make sure to connect with Garrett. Check out mindics and 277 00:21:45.809 --> 00:21:48.440 and Garrett. Again, thank you so much for your time. I really 278 00:21:48.440 --> 00:21:55.359 appreciate it. Yeah, thank you. Had A lot of fun. One 279 00:21:55.400 --> 00:21:59.759 of the things we've learned about podcast audience growth is that word of mouth works. 280 00:21:59.799 --> 00:22:03.430 It works really, really well actually. So if you love this show, 281 00:22:03.470 --> 00:22:06.670 it would be awesome if you texted a friend to tell them about it 282 00:22:07.109 --> 00:22:10.230 and if you send me a text with a screenshot of the text you sent 283 00:22:10.309 --> 00:22:12.470 to your friend, Metta, I know I'll send you a copy of my 284 00:22:12.509 --> 00:22:17.380 book. Content base networking how to instantly connect with anyone. You want to 285 00:22:17.420 --> 00:22:19.900 know my cell phone numbers? Four hundred and seven, four nine hundred, 286 00:22:21.380 --> 00:22:23.420 three and three, two eight. Happy Texting,