1268: 5 Ways to Adapt to Remote Selling & Sales Management w/ Carson Conant

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.919 --> 00:00:09.109 Welcome back to be tob growth. I'm logan miles with sweet fish media. 2 00:00:09.269 --> 00:00:13.630 Today I'm joined by Carson Conan. He is the founder and CEO over and 3 00:00:13.830 --> 00:00:16.230 media fly. Carson, welcome to the show. How's it going today, 4 00:00:16.230 --> 00:00:18.629 sir, it's going great. Thanks, Logan. Awesome. We're going to 5 00:00:18.670 --> 00:00:24.579 be talking about some specific ways to address remote selling and sales management challenges that 6 00:00:24.820 --> 00:00:27.940 pretty much everybody is dealing with these days. Before we get into that, 7 00:00:28.019 --> 00:00:31.059 give us a little bit of context for the conversation, Carson. So it's 8 00:00:31.059 --> 00:00:33.780 a little bit about yourself and what you and the media fly team er up 9 00:00:33.820 --> 00:00:36.770 to. Men. Yeah, this is great. Thanks. So. So 10 00:00:36.890 --> 00:00:40.210 we find ourselves an interest interesting spot right now. So we're a sales namement 11 00:00:40.250 --> 00:00:45.049 platform which which has been a critical solution for a lot of progressive companies, 12 00:00:45.090 --> 00:00:48.049 but it became a must have in the last about, you know, eight 13 00:00:48.090 --> 00:00:51.799 to twelve weeks here. So essentially a we're a platform that allows companies to 14 00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:55.000 manage all their sales clatteral one place, push it out to all their sales 15 00:00:55.039 --> 00:00:58.759 teams to present either through a remote presentation, you know, sort of like 16 00:00:58.920 --> 00:01:03.119 this, or in place in person presentation. And one of the most important 17 00:01:03.159 --> 00:01:06.189 things is allows you to track what's actually working, which is one of the 18 00:01:06.230 --> 00:01:07.790 things that a lot of companies struggle with, which is that they create, 19 00:01:08.230 --> 00:01:11.469 you know, mountains of sales clatteral and they they burn about half of that 20 00:01:11.790 --> 00:01:15.269 spend on content that's never used, is not effective the promise. They don't 21 00:01:15.269 --> 00:01:19.299 know which half is not effective. So we actually help them track that. 22 00:01:19.379 --> 00:01:22.620 were kind of Google analytics for sales presentations. So it's kind of funny the 23 00:01:22.819 --> 00:01:26.700 kind of debt the ends, which is this this analytics Kip Aulity, understanding 24 00:01:26.739 --> 00:01:29.700 what contest driving revene, which Nott is really, I think, what people 25 00:01:30.219 --> 00:01:34.170 buy, and in the means to that is this kind of sexy sales application 26 00:01:34.329 --> 00:01:38.730 that the sales ups actually find and present from absolutely if it's if it's not 27 00:01:40.329 --> 00:01:44.170 immediately adopted by sales reps and doesn't matter how good it is on the back 28 00:01:44.209 --> 00:01:46.689 end. So I like what you said there and I love the way you 29 00:01:46.849 --> 00:01:49.359 describe that of not knowing what sales collaterals working. It's kind of like that 30 00:01:49.400 --> 00:01:53.760 age old saying half my marketing is working, I just don't know which half. 31 00:01:53.280 --> 00:01:57.120 And you know, the same is now true as you look at it 32 00:01:57.239 --> 00:02:00.709 as sales enablement has now been a thing for a while and so addressing that, 33 00:02:00.829 --> 00:02:06.069 I think is is very key, especially as I mean remote selling was 34 00:02:06.829 --> 00:02:10.389 for me. I made that shift about two years ago and I just absolutely 35 00:02:10.430 --> 00:02:14.430 love it. There are other folks that it's been just a few weeks and 36 00:02:14.509 --> 00:02:17.500 it's a brand new normal for them. So let's dive into some of the 37 00:02:17.659 --> 00:02:23.740 things that are different when it comes to managing a presentation. So for sellers 38 00:02:23.780 --> 00:02:28.500 out there who are used to being in front facetoface, one on one or 39 00:02:28.819 --> 00:02:32.169 in a in a conference room, what are some of the challenges you guys 40 00:02:32.169 --> 00:02:38.210 are seeing and you're recommending for sellers to address a different sort of presentation environment 41 00:02:38.370 --> 00:02:44.129 that now they have to accommodate for their buyers? Yeah, that's a great 42 00:02:44.129 --> 00:02:46.319 question. So if you think about what what things were like, you know, 43 00:02:46.560 --> 00:02:51.719 just even six months ago, you know a big presentation might have been 44 00:02:52.159 --> 00:02:53.840 you know you you come in, you've got a big carpeted board room and 45 00:02:53.919 --> 00:02:57.680 you're going to spend some time presenting, but a lot of the time is 46 00:02:57.719 --> 00:03:00.710 actually looking at the people, reading body language. A lot of it's what 47 00:03:00.830 --> 00:03:02.110 happened on the way end of the room, what happens on the way out 48 00:03:04.310 --> 00:03:06.750 and and then you spend a lot of time on the white board and that 49 00:03:06.789 --> 00:03:08.270 kind of stuff. It's a very different stale experience, right. And so 50 00:03:08.389 --> 00:03:13.219 sales and movement was already well adopted in that in that area, but people 51 00:03:13.259 --> 00:03:16.939 were still relying heavily on that in person experience. Now that everything's gone virtual, 52 00:03:17.020 --> 00:03:20.379 I think it's going to stay this way long term, probably not to 53 00:03:20.500 --> 00:03:23.860 this extreme, but it's definitely change behavior. Right. So what's interesting now 54 00:03:24.020 --> 00:03:28.490 is you have to be that much more compelling when you're not in the big 55 00:03:28.569 --> 00:03:30.330 room together, right, and things that you normally would have done, like 56 00:03:30.409 --> 00:03:34.090 going up on the white boarder much harder in this scenario. Right. So 57 00:03:34.169 --> 00:03:38.050 so it puts a lot more emphasis on good sale, sales collatter. Right. 58 00:03:38.050 --> 00:03:42.639 The ability to actually bring up something that visually is, you know, 59 00:03:42.800 --> 00:03:46.159 engaging, allows kind of to deliver some of that experience that you would have 60 00:03:46.240 --> 00:03:49.400 had in the same room together. Right. And so what we're finding is 61 00:03:49.439 --> 00:03:53.479 that kind of the static, boring, powerful presentation is not going to cut 62 00:03:53.479 --> 00:03:54.949 it anymore. Right. It's not going to cut it for you to send 63 00:03:54.990 --> 00:04:00.069 to somebody that they're going to look through before the meeting afterwards and it's definitely 64 00:04:00.110 --> 00:04:01.150 going to cut it as something that you're going to present in the meeting, 65 00:04:01.189 --> 00:04:04.669 because if somebody asks you a question, you know, first of all, 66 00:04:04.789 --> 00:04:08.430 you know it comes from a if you're a big presenting a lot of people, 67 00:04:08.430 --> 00:04:11.060 might be one of a million little tiles of faces. You are right. 68 00:04:11.099 --> 00:04:13.699 So you didn't pick up on that on the experience. Right. So 69 00:04:13.819 --> 00:04:15.660 you have to have the ability to pivot in the meeting and go go into 70 00:04:15.660 --> 00:04:20.699 these different topics. So we call it interactive selling or interactive presentations, but 71 00:04:20.740 --> 00:04:24.730 we're seeing a big switch towards that, and I just as an example that 72 00:04:25.170 --> 00:04:28.089 we've been. There's a many. We have a lot of manufacturing customers. 73 00:04:28.089 --> 00:04:30.529 We've got one that we've been trying to go after for a long time, 74 00:04:30.170 --> 00:04:33.329 and these this is a very successful company, and a lot of those folks 75 00:04:33.370 --> 00:04:36.009 have flip bones and a clipboard. Right. They still do not sell off 76 00:04:36.129 --> 00:04:39.600 power point, they do not sell off light, you know, laptops, 77 00:04:39.600 --> 00:04:43.519 and I've had instantly. This company's now going back to a saying we really 78 00:04:43.560 --> 00:04:46.079 need this now because you know, as soon as we're done teaching about how 79 00:04:46.120 --> 00:04:47.439 to use zoom, the next thing we need to teach them how to use 80 00:04:47.480 --> 00:04:50.399 media fly right, and so that's a good example to me of how this 81 00:04:50.519 --> 00:04:55.870 new world, you know this, the interactive presentation, is not a nice 82 00:04:55.910 --> 00:04:58.829 to have anymore. This is critical to kind of the one of the kind 83 00:04:58.870 --> 00:05:01.389 of four or five things you have to adopt right now. Yeah, absolutely. 84 00:05:01.430 --> 00:05:06.139 I posted on Linkedin a couple of weeks ago just something that I've picked 85 00:05:06.180 --> 00:05:11.459 up in being on zoom calls over the last two years. I take zoom 86 00:05:11.500 --> 00:05:15.259 off of the maximize view, take it off a full screen, put it 87 00:05:15.339 --> 00:05:19.060 on gallery view and adjust so that if I if it's a one to one 88 00:05:19.100 --> 00:05:24.129 meeting or one to two something like that, whoever I'm talking to is closer 89 00:05:24.290 --> 00:05:28.370 to the top of my physical monitor, so it's closer to eye contact. 90 00:05:28.490 --> 00:05:30.050 So I'm looking at them, I can read them, but it also looks 91 00:05:30.089 --> 00:05:34.050 like eye contact. Anything else your team is kind of picked up in nuances 92 00:05:34.089 --> 00:05:39.120 of either zoom or just the way that they set up their surroundings or present 93 00:05:39.199 --> 00:05:42.800 themselves virtually like them. So yeah, good questions. So definitely the gallery 94 00:05:42.839 --> 00:05:45.120 view is critical, right, and you see actually a lot of the you 95 00:05:45.199 --> 00:05:47.040 know, zoom did a good job at the gallery. You you've already seen. 96 00:05:47.439 --> 00:05:49.910 I think what'Sapp just came out with their own version and so did, 97 00:05:49.949 --> 00:05:54.470 I think, Google cool hangouts right. So people are scrambling because they recognize 98 00:05:54.550 --> 00:05:57.629 that that's that is the new Molo. You can't just do the one where 99 00:05:57.709 --> 00:06:00.829 you only see the persons talking right to your point, because you got to 100 00:06:00.910 --> 00:06:01.990 try and be able to kind of read the room to some degree. So 101 00:06:02.069 --> 00:06:04.540 that's definitely one that we picked up on. There's kind of three of the 102 00:06:04.620 --> 00:06:08.980 things that I think you know, less zoom specific, but more just kind 103 00:06:09.019 --> 00:06:12.540 of in this environment that I've always been, I think, tenants of selling. 104 00:06:12.660 --> 00:06:15.579 But there they've all of a sudden gone from you know, I think 105 00:06:15.980 --> 00:06:17.730 you know there were always certain sales people that can get by without some of 106 00:06:17.769 --> 00:06:21.209 these things just because they were so magnetic. We all we've all met these 107 00:06:21.209 --> 00:06:24.050 kind of sales people. We are like, I don't know what you're selling, 108 00:06:24.050 --> 00:06:26.689 but I'll buy from right you just you know, you're charismatic, you're 109 00:06:26.689 --> 00:06:30.050 handsome, you're pretty, whatever it is, you're talented. Everybody that. 110 00:06:30.129 --> 00:06:32.319 I feel like the the the playing field is leveled, you know I mean, 111 00:06:32.720 --> 00:06:36.639 and now it's so much more about what you're actually selling. Then then 112 00:06:36.759 --> 00:06:40.720 you, more than I think, ever and so so I think so some 113 00:06:40.800 --> 00:06:44.600 of the things we've seen now is in additionally interactive selling, but definitely the 114 00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:47.069 value base selling, right. I mean we've found that we acquired a company 115 00:06:47.069 --> 00:06:49.269 a couple of years ago that was kind of the leader in value selling. 116 00:06:49.350 --> 00:06:53.550 So that was pretty timely for us. But essentially you have to build a 117 00:06:53.670 --> 00:06:57.189 justify the spend, you know, because you know I can't, I can't 118 00:06:57.189 --> 00:07:00.110 get you over the line with with kind of an emotional connection as much, 119 00:07:00.470 --> 00:07:03.620 but also that you know the with Covid the budgets are are frozen, right 120 00:07:03.660 --> 00:07:06.019 we you know, we keep hearing people saying our budgets are frozen and then 121 00:07:06.060 --> 00:07:09.819 you talk to him a little bit more. They're spending money on some stuff. 122 00:07:09.899 --> 00:07:11.819 The question is, what are they spending money on? Right? So 123 00:07:11.980 --> 00:07:14.259 how do you get your thing to be the thing they spend money on? 124 00:07:14.379 --> 00:07:16.810 One of the one of the key things we found is in our own use, 125 00:07:17.009 --> 00:07:21.290 but also when we're what we should customers do is just hard Urli total 126 00:07:21.329 --> 00:07:25.970 cross of ownership value metrics. Right. So how do you actually quantify that 127 00:07:26.410 --> 00:07:29.970 in real time, personalized to that company, and then be able to provide 128 00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:32.360 them back something afterwards that says this is what we talked about. You're going 129 00:07:32.360 --> 00:07:34.959 to save this much money, you're going to make this much money, because 130 00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:39.040 this is, you know, you have to stand out at versus everything else 131 00:07:39.079 --> 00:07:42.560 in the Sea of need that that CFO is looking at. And Ninety nine 132 00:07:42.600 --> 00:07:45.910 percent of other companies are coming saying I need this thing. Why do you 133 00:07:45.949 --> 00:07:47.069 need it? Well, I just need it right. But if you're the 134 00:07:47.110 --> 00:07:50.110 one that can say, well, here's a here's a graph showing the you 135 00:07:50.189 --> 00:07:53.470 know, the value that we're going to get in the Roy we're going to 136 00:07:53.550 --> 00:07:56.029 get, you stand out right and so that, I guess, it's which 137 00:07:56.069 --> 00:07:59.420 one of those things where where it's always been the case but it's really the 138 00:07:59.500 --> 00:08:03.019 case right now. Yeah, absolutely, that's interesting. I had not seen 139 00:08:03.540 --> 00:08:07.540 Google hangouts new gallery view. Is actually what we were kind of divided here 140 00:08:07.579 --> 00:08:11.930 is sweetfish between Google hangouts lovers and zoom lovers, and I was like every 141 00:08:13.009 --> 00:08:16.610 time we had an all hands or a larger group meeting on Google hang out, 142 00:08:16.649 --> 00:08:18.449 so I was like, I just can't do this, guys, this 143 00:08:18.649 --> 00:08:22.370 this doesn't make sense. You make a really good point about the value based 144 00:08:22.370 --> 00:08:26.810 selling, because I can't tell you, of Carson, how many sales calls 145 00:08:26.970 --> 00:08:30.680 I've had recently where it's I just had an hour long call with finance. 146 00:08:30.839 --> 00:08:33.799 I'm going to talk to the CFO right after this, and that doesn't really 147 00:08:33.960 --> 00:08:37.960 like. If you're selling to marketing, like I am, that's that's true. 148 00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:39.159 If you're selling to HR, if you're selling the IT, if you're 149 00:08:39.159 --> 00:08:43.710 selling to sales, sales opposite, it doesn't matter. Right. They are 150 00:08:43.870 --> 00:08:48.070 having a lot of conversations with their CFO and their finance department right now, 151 00:08:48.389 --> 00:08:54.590 and so thinking about that one. Can you get finance involved in in some 152 00:08:54.830 --> 00:09:00.419 way? Can you find out the different levers that that finance is looking at, 153 00:09:00.460 --> 00:09:03.139 because not every organization is the same. Sometimes it is. Well, 154 00:09:03.340 --> 00:09:09.419 length of commitment is really important or Yep, know the total commitments. Okay, 155 00:09:09.620 --> 00:09:11.809 as long as we can pay monthly or quarterly, those sorts of things. 156 00:09:13.330 --> 00:09:18.649 So I think one giving your stakeholder, giving your buyer the Ammo, 157 00:09:18.730 --> 00:09:22.250 if you will, to go back to finance and know what questions they're going 158 00:09:22.289 --> 00:09:26.960 to ask and be ready for those. But that takes some questions right and 159 00:09:26.360 --> 00:09:31.279 asking those questions, like, Hey, Carson, most of our customers are 160 00:09:31.320 --> 00:09:33.759 really concerned about the total commitment right now. What if we broke this into 161 00:09:35.279 --> 00:09:37.750 for shorter term commitments with a renewal, you know, at the end of 162 00:09:37.830 --> 00:09:41.669 each quarter or something like that. Would that help you with the conversation with 163 00:09:41.830 --> 00:09:45.590 finance? Oh yeah, it actually would, right, and that that little 164 00:09:45.669 --> 00:09:50.710 change might accelerate your deal tremendously so, and I think with the solutions you 165 00:09:50.789 --> 00:09:54.580 guys have and others, can really enable that as well, because it's about 166 00:09:54.580 --> 00:09:58.340 the questions and the conversations they're going to have internally. But then how did 167 00:09:58.379 --> 00:10:01.940 they present it? Are you giving them an easy way to translate what you've 168 00:10:01.980 --> 00:10:07.059 said? Are you guys seeing some of that in some of your customers, 169 00:10:07.139 --> 00:10:11.090 kind of arming them for those internal conversations to definitely, and I think you 170 00:10:11.250 --> 00:10:15.210 know what, I think you said it perfectly. I think those are exactly 171 00:10:15.330 --> 00:10:18.649 what the conversations are happening internally. What I think it's interesting is it's kind 172 00:10:18.649 --> 00:10:22.360 of like that dumb and dumber in the DU human dumb or Dun where he's 173 00:10:22.440 --> 00:10:24.000 like, you know, it's, you know, only one in a million, 174 00:10:24.039 --> 00:10:26.600 or you know, I'm not in a million years, and he's like 175 00:10:26.639 --> 00:10:28.080 so you're saying, I got a chance, you know, and I feel 176 00:10:28.120 --> 00:10:31.440 like that's what we what what we hear, or I think what anybody hears 177 00:10:31.480 --> 00:10:35.360 when they're trying to sell right now, is budgets are frozen. All right, 178 00:10:35.110 --> 00:10:37.909 you know. So look, you know, digging it a little bit 179 00:10:37.909 --> 00:10:39.429 more and they're like, well, budgets are frozen, we can't spend any 180 00:10:39.470 --> 00:10:43.669 money for the next thirty days. Okay, so what you're saying is it's 181 00:10:43.669 --> 00:10:46.710 a it's a cash issue over the next thirty days. So let me figure 182 00:10:46.710 --> 00:10:50.500 out how we can, how we can structure that. But would you sign 183 00:10:50.500 --> 00:10:52.019 it like you're saying? Would you sign a three year deal where we don't 184 00:10:52.019 --> 00:10:56.220 charge any cash until a little bit later? And we're seeing a lot of 185 00:10:56.259 --> 00:10:58.820 people now, we're spont of that, saying yeah, absolutely, we would 186 00:10:58.820 --> 00:11:01.539 do that, which the interesting thing is we wouldn't have afore. But I 187 00:11:01.620 --> 00:11:05.809 feel like a lot of people internally have gotten educated really fast on what what 188 00:11:05.970 --> 00:11:07.450 it takes to actually get something purchased, because they know how hard it is 189 00:11:07.690 --> 00:11:11.889 where's I think in the old days we might spend two or three months in 190 00:11:11.970 --> 00:11:16.289 a conversation with somebody and then then they go to purchasing and then find out 191 00:11:16.409 --> 00:11:20.159 about there some issue. Right now I feel like everybody is already aware of 192 00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:22.240 this. So we actually come in up front saying you're probably going to run 193 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:24.480 into this. Let me tell you how we can help get around this. 194 00:11:24.919 --> 00:11:28.080 And then, to your point, quantifying that act seen providing something. I 195 00:11:28.159 --> 00:11:31.440 mean we you know, in these calculators, where we did this for one 196 00:11:31.559 --> 00:11:35.230 cuss recently that they actually wanted, they're using me to fly tremendously where. 197 00:11:35.230 --> 00:11:37.269 They came back saying, we've been asked to cut, cut our class back 198 00:11:37.269 --> 00:11:39.389 by, you know, twenty, five, fifty percent, and so we 199 00:11:39.429 --> 00:11:41.870 said, okay, well, that's interesting. You know, is it long 200 00:11:41.909 --> 00:11:43.990 term? Not a long term? We Love You guys? Great, well, 201 00:11:45.070 --> 00:11:46.620 this do a four year deal. We actually increase because they also want 202 00:11:46.620 --> 00:11:48.700 to increase their usage. Right. So they got like, I want to 203 00:11:48.740 --> 00:11:52.500 grow with you guys, but the same time I'm being told to cut costs. 204 00:11:52.779 --> 00:11:54.419 So we came back saying, well, let's say, what we'll do 205 00:11:54.419 --> 00:11:56.539 is we're going to reduce the amount we charge you for the next year and 206 00:11:56.580 --> 00:11:58.419 then we're going to but we're going to give you access to all these new 207 00:11:58.460 --> 00:12:01.090 users you want and then we're going to step up the payments. So actually, 208 00:12:01.129 --> 00:12:05.809 over the total contract value, we actually increase our revenue, and so 209 00:12:05.889 --> 00:12:09.289 we see it as an expansion. They see it as a savings. But 210 00:12:09.330 --> 00:12:11.570 if we hadn't quantified that, in visualized it for something, they could, 211 00:12:11.970 --> 00:12:15.610 you know, they could compantly take back this CFO. They never want to 212 00:12:15.690 --> 00:12:20.919 work. Hey, everybody logan with sweet fish here. You probably already know 213 00:12:22.120 --> 00:12:24.600 that we think you should start a podcast if you haven't already. But what 214 00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:28.480 if you have and you're asking these kinds of questions? How much has our 215 00:12:28.519 --> 00:12:35.389 podcast impacted revenue this year? How's our sales team actually leveraging the PODCAST content? 216 00:12:35.710 --> 00:12:39.750 If you can't answer these questions, you're actually not alone. This is 217 00:12:39.830 --> 00:12:43.860 why I cast it created the very first content marketing platform made specifically for be 218 00:12:45.019 --> 00:12:50.820 Tobe podcasting. Now you can more easily search and share your audio content while 219 00:12:50.940 --> 00:12:56.139 getting greater visibility into the impact of your guest. The marketing teams at drift 220 00:12:56.500 --> 00:13:01.409 terminus and here at sweet fish have started using casted to get more value out 221 00:13:01.409 --> 00:13:05.129 of our podcasts, and you probably can to. You can check out the 222 00:13:05.169 --> 00:13:13.320 product in action and casted dot US growth. That's sea steed dot US growth. 223 00:13:13.759 --> 00:13:20.799 All right, let's get back to the show. Yeah, absolutely, 224 00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:26.360 and you're not going to realize how to creatively structure those deals unless you ask 225 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:31.389 those questions and it to your point, if you're not learning from the deals 226 00:13:31.429 --> 00:13:33.830 that you're working, if you're just going in and saying, well, what's 227 00:13:33.830 --> 00:13:37.990 important to finance? Right, right, you've got to lead your buyer and 228 00:13:37.070 --> 00:13:41.539 say, Hey, the last conversation I was having very similar to this. 229 00:13:41.740 --> 00:13:45.980 They got to finance and they got hit with these three obstacles. Do you 230 00:13:46.059 --> 00:13:50.100 know about? You know finances position on these three things? Well, no, 231 00:13:50.299 --> 00:13:52.500 number one is a little bit different for us to they kind of view 232 00:13:52.580 --> 00:13:56.490 this differently. Three, I don't know. I'll have to find that out 233 00:13:56.529 --> 00:13:58.610 and get back to you. And then you you know, you have a 234 00:13:58.690 --> 00:14:01.970 little give to get checklist right. Okay, well, if you can get 235 00:14:01.009 --> 00:14:05.009 that from finance, I can get this to you by next week. Those 236 00:14:05.090 --> 00:14:09.850 sorts of things I love. They get to give checklist that John Barrows talks 237 00:14:09.889 --> 00:14:11.879 about a ton and I think that comes into play here quite a bit. 238 00:14:13.000 --> 00:14:15.399 Yeah, just wanted to I want to edit at which I think is really 239 00:14:15.399 --> 00:14:16.919 interesting. I did. I just occurred to me, which is that you 240 00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:20.320 know, historically there was a lot of that let that end sale, where 241 00:14:20.519 --> 00:14:24.120 somebody had to go into somebody's office and try and get them over the line 242 00:14:24.159 --> 00:14:26.429 right. And so there's always been this element of you're trying to arm that 243 00:14:26.509 --> 00:14:30.629 person for that conversation right, because you know that they can't speak, they 244 00:14:30.710 --> 00:14:33.470 can't speak about your product as well as you can, they can't quantify the 245 00:14:33.549 --> 00:14:35.309 value as well as you can. And so this is why I think, 246 00:14:35.669 --> 00:14:37.350 you know, value selling is always value, because if that person going to 247 00:14:37.389 --> 00:14:41.539 walk in and say here's the rlie graph, which not everybody is a you 248 00:14:41.620 --> 00:14:43.139 know, is a you know as a quant you know Jock, so they 249 00:14:43.179 --> 00:14:48.299 can't all build these models, but also giving them a presentation that they can 250 00:14:48.539 --> 00:14:52.620 show to that person, you know, that has animation, that has the 251 00:14:52.700 --> 00:14:56.210 kind of builds a story. So, you know, a boring powerpoint presentation 252 00:14:56.330 --> 00:14:58.210 that has a graph is so different, for instance, when it shows like 253 00:14:58.370 --> 00:15:01.769 okay, let me, let me layer in one and the member pointed to 254 00:15:01.850 --> 00:15:03.970 something. So I mean, I'm gonna Blay in the next one point something. 255 00:15:03.090 --> 00:15:07.360 So that's what we can we talk about animation and kind of animated presentations. 256 00:15:07.879 --> 00:15:09.559 That, to me, is one of the critical things because it does 257 00:15:09.600 --> 00:15:11.200 allow you to build a story. I can kind of, you know, 258 00:15:11.279 --> 00:15:15.480 our marketing folks can build it or whoever our customers are. Then they can 259 00:15:15.480 --> 00:15:16.679 put in the hands of people that are going to do an internal sale. 260 00:15:16.679 --> 00:15:20.360 Right, that we have a lot more confidence that they can do that internal 261 00:15:20.399 --> 00:15:24.190 sale when they when they're using something with animation, something with quantified value. 262 00:15:24.350 --> 00:15:28.549 Right. And last piece that is tracking. Right. This comes back into 263 00:15:28.590 --> 00:15:31.470 Google and lugs piece, which is, you know, we also understand when 264 00:15:31.509 --> 00:15:35.190 it was actually presented. Right, so we know when they shared it. 265 00:15:35.350 --> 00:15:37.220 You know, we shed it to somebody, so they we then see in 266 00:15:37.259 --> 00:15:39.980 our in our system, and attracts back to crm. You know, I 267 00:15:41.100 --> 00:15:43.899 send it to Joe, Joe sent it to Bob. Bob Looked at it 268 00:15:43.940 --> 00:15:46.539 for thirty seconds and we spent two minutes on these different pages. So I'm 269 00:15:46.539 --> 00:15:48.059 going to call Joe and say, Hey, I'm not sure if you know, 270 00:15:48.139 --> 00:15:50.330 but your cfo spent time on these different pages. This is what I 271 00:15:50.370 --> 00:15:54.610 think we should re unfortunate them. You know, that sort of tracking and 272 00:15:54.649 --> 00:15:58.690 understanding. Is this critical right now? Yeah, for anybody listening right now, 273 00:15:58.809 --> 00:16:02.169 hit the fifteen or thirty second back button real quick, because what you 274 00:16:02.289 --> 00:16:04.080 said they are, Carson, just really quickly at the end, was super 275 00:16:04.159 --> 00:16:08.679 tactical. You know, there are proposal tools. There are sales enablement platforms 276 00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:12.120 that give you tracking and who clicks and who views and we kind of just 277 00:16:12.279 --> 00:16:17.080 like Oh, yeah, that's good information to have, but not necessarily doing 278 00:16:17.159 --> 00:16:21.230 something with it. And just an example there of seeing a forward looking at 279 00:16:21.309 --> 00:16:23.990 the time spent by someone you've never spoken to, maybe higher up or in 280 00:16:25.029 --> 00:16:30.429 a different department like finance, and going back to your sponsor or your your 281 00:16:30.509 --> 00:16:36.860 stakeholder that you're working with primarily and giving them that information. It just reinforces 282 00:16:36.940 --> 00:16:40.340 that, Hey, this is a partnership. I'm trying to help you, 283 00:16:40.700 --> 00:16:42.539 not just win the sale myself, and I'm not gonna, you know, 284 00:16:42.659 --> 00:16:45.740 follow up with the CFO and say, Hey, would you think of page 285 00:16:45.860 --> 00:16:49.409 one or whatever, because you don't have a relationship over there. So I 286 00:16:49.529 --> 00:16:52.769 thought that was that was very useful. Carson, I want to spend a 287 00:16:53.129 --> 00:16:57.330 couple minutes just speaking to sales managers a little bit. We've talked a lot 288 00:16:57.409 --> 00:17:03.119 about remote selling strategies in this new normal. We've talked recently with others about, 289 00:17:03.279 --> 00:17:08.039 you know, the challenges for sales managers with remote coaching. There you 290 00:17:08.119 --> 00:17:11.240 know, a number of tools that help with this, like Corus and gone 291 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:15.519 right now I don't know what I would do without. Course, do ai, 292 00:17:15.990 --> 00:17:18.589 but it goes beyond just having a tool to be able to see what 293 00:17:18.670 --> 00:17:22.390 your reps are doing and then provide coaching. What are some of the things 294 00:17:22.430 --> 00:17:29.269 that you have found our of even more importance for sales managers right now in 295 00:17:29.390 --> 00:17:33.019 this remote selling environment? Yeah, it's a great question. So I definitely 296 00:17:33.019 --> 00:17:36.299 think course and going that category is one of the most important right. So, 297 00:17:36.460 --> 00:17:40.740 actually understanding what people are saying in real time is pretty pretty helpful and 298 00:17:40.779 --> 00:17:44.099 I think in this environment, you know, access to a lot more conversations 299 00:17:44.140 --> 00:17:47.250 than we used to write, because it used to be you'd miss out on 300 00:17:47.289 --> 00:17:48.930 all the stuff that was done over coffee, right, you know, you 301 00:17:49.009 --> 00:17:52.369 know having those presentations anymore. So so those solutions are much more critical. 302 00:17:52.769 --> 00:17:56.049 You know. I would say adding to that in terms of training, you 303 00:17:56.130 --> 00:18:00.079 know this whole concept of micro training, I think is is really interesting and 304 00:18:00.480 --> 00:18:03.559 you know, if you think about the old lms style or the old kind 305 00:18:03.559 --> 00:18:07.880 of training model where you bring everybody into a room and try and teach them 306 00:18:07.920 --> 00:18:10.400 and you do this once a month or once a quarter or whatever, and 307 00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:14.069 you know, when you've got tens of thousands of people. It's you know, 308 00:18:14.150 --> 00:18:17.309 it's an it's an audacious task to try and train all these people on 309 00:18:17.390 --> 00:18:18.670 how to sell, right, even if you've got hundreds of people. So 310 00:18:19.309 --> 00:18:22.430 there's been these lma solutions for a long time, but there are a lot 311 00:18:22.430 --> 00:18:26.869 of times are heavy. They're designed for compliance, right. They're designing for 312 00:18:26.069 --> 00:18:29.500 like, you know, such a harassment, that kind of stuff. Right, 313 00:18:29.539 --> 00:18:32.819 they're not designed for breaking. You know, a new capability came out 314 00:18:32.859 --> 00:18:34.859 of new feature, new product came out. How does how do hundreds or 315 00:18:34.900 --> 00:18:37.940 thousands of people learn about about that and, to your point, how to 316 00:18:38.019 --> 00:18:41.259 meet? How do I, as a sales manager? How am I confident 317 00:18:41.259 --> 00:18:42.289 that they've learned about it? Right? So, so I think, you 318 00:18:42.369 --> 00:18:45.690 know, if I kind of think about the life cycle here, it's, 319 00:18:45.009 --> 00:18:48.809 you know, it's something new comes out when we think about its. You 320 00:18:48.890 --> 00:18:52.450 create this micro training and then you create a some some interactive sales collateral. 321 00:18:52.529 --> 00:18:56.440 That's it's modul right, we call vignettes. So rather than the old model 322 00:18:56.640 --> 00:18:57.519 was, you know, if you think back to kind of what the big 323 00:18:57.559 --> 00:19:00.160 tech companies should have, what they called Level One, level zero decks, 324 00:19:00.160 --> 00:19:04.000 right, would be this this thirty page powerpoint presentation which would be level zero, 325 00:19:04.319 --> 00:19:07.839 then you have like a hundred page one to be level one, and 326 00:19:07.920 --> 00:19:10.789 your job is to chop out all the pieces that you're going to need for 327 00:19:10.869 --> 00:19:14.069 the next meeting. You know, we think everything comes down to vignettes or 328 00:19:14.109 --> 00:19:18.190 small pieces, and so you're training is micro, your sales collateral is micro 329 00:19:18.349 --> 00:19:21.549 and then you use an application like medi fly to to navigate to what you 330 00:19:21.589 --> 00:19:25.059 want to present that in real time or you can do it at a time. 331 00:19:25.259 --> 00:19:27.019 And then when you're actually presenting, you know you've got kind of a 332 00:19:27.059 --> 00:19:33.019 combination of chorus and going where you're actually recording the conversation right, what's actually 333 00:19:33.019 --> 00:19:36.660 happening real time, but you're also recording what is actually presented. So because 334 00:19:36.700 --> 00:19:38.289 you get two different get two different perspectives there. Right, this is what 335 00:19:38.529 --> 00:19:41.690 I actually you know, they showed and this is what was then recorded. 336 00:19:41.730 --> 00:19:45.930 Then ultimately all that stuffest at and up back in crm. And I think 337 00:19:45.970 --> 00:19:48.089 one of the big things that's missing in a lot of cases for sales managers 338 00:19:48.329 --> 00:19:52.000 is it's not there's no magic piece of content, there's no magic phrase you're 339 00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:55.799 going to use to win a deal. So it's all about kind of statistics 340 00:19:55.839 --> 00:20:00.079 across like what is that. What are my sales teams doing across everybody? 341 00:20:00.119 --> 00:20:03.400 That's working right, like what? Like what? What contents being used or 342 00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:06.359 what? You know that that is working, is driving revenue, is tied 343 00:20:06.359 --> 00:20:08.029 back to crm and which things aren't right. And so I think, I 344 00:20:08.430 --> 00:20:12.069 think that sort of you know, kind of collection is one thing that's really 345 00:20:12.069 --> 00:20:15.029 missing in a lot of solutions and you kind of got to bring it all 346 00:20:15.190 --> 00:20:18.269 back to back to Crm, but that to work. And that's where I 347 00:20:18.309 --> 00:20:21.230 think, you know, although we all love going on out listen to the 348 00:20:21.349 --> 00:20:23.380 you know, listen to what happened on a certain thing, what's what I 349 00:20:23.460 --> 00:20:29.299 think is more interesting is is how many of my sales people use talked about 350 00:20:29.339 --> 00:20:32.700 this brand new thing in the last thirty days, right across everybody? Okay, 351 00:20:32.980 --> 00:20:34.299 now the ones that did, did they do better or worse than the 352 00:20:34.339 --> 00:20:37.930 ones that didn't? So that sort of analysis or the ones that presented using 353 00:20:37.970 --> 00:20:41.690 this interactive value, you know, value selling tool, that they outperform the 354 00:20:41.730 --> 00:20:45.769 ones that didn't use it, satistically speaking, if they did. Now let's 355 00:20:45.769 --> 00:20:48.009 do more microtraining, let's do more pushing on that. You know I mean. 356 00:20:48.210 --> 00:20:52.160 And so I think it has to be this close loop back to crm. 357 00:20:52.640 --> 00:20:56.160 Absolutely, I love what you're talking about their Carson. Just to kind 358 00:20:56.200 --> 00:21:00.720 of recount for folks, we've touched on a number of things in the remote 359 00:21:00.799 --> 00:21:04.869 selling environment. One turn on gallery view. Just do it, don't don't 360 00:21:04.950 --> 00:21:11.230 skip that. You've got to lean into justification in your selling process. So 361 00:21:11.710 --> 00:21:14.509 you might have to revisit some things over the next week or so, but 362 00:21:14.549 --> 00:21:18.779 if you spend some time thinking about where am I providing justification and how am 363 00:21:18.819 --> 00:21:22.500 I telling that story, it's going to be time well spent to set you 364 00:21:22.539 --> 00:21:26.420 up for the rest of this quarter, the rest of this year, the 365 00:21:26.539 --> 00:21:30.500 rest of this new normal. Right. And then I really liked what we 366 00:21:30.660 --> 00:21:34.609 kind of rift on their Carson, talking about enabling your sponsor with with not 367 00:21:34.809 --> 00:21:40.450 only data but visual elements. For anybody that kind of wants to dig into 368 00:21:40.450 --> 00:21:44.490 that, we did a previous episode with Nancy Duarte. The one mistake to 369 00:21:44.569 --> 00:21:48.519 avoid when telling your brand story. We were talking about her book data story 370 00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:53.720 a lot about how marketers as well as salespeople can tell data in a visually 371 00:21:53.920 --> 00:21:56.960 compelling way. So if that's, you know, something that you're leaning into, 372 00:21:57.039 --> 00:22:00.710 definitely check out that previous episode and then what you said it here, 373 00:22:00.869 --> 00:22:06.309 Carson. To wrap it up, for sales leaders, focus on micro learning 374 00:22:06.509 --> 00:22:08.750 and really the way I kind of summarize what you were saying there is look 375 00:22:08.950 --> 00:22:12.269 for themes. It might not be as simple as, you know, searching 376 00:22:12.349 --> 00:22:18.180 your call recording tool for a keyword. It might be thinking about, okay, 377 00:22:18.460 --> 00:22:23.539 taking some of that quantitative and mixing it with your own qualitative thought process 378 00:22:23.579 --> 00:22:30.089 about how do we kind of slicendise what's going on to to have those themes 379 00:22:30.130 --> 00:22:33.890 emerge and then we can adjust our training and coaching around that. So, 380 00:22:34.650 --> 00:22:40.170 Carson, if you want listeners to take one thing away from this episode, 381 00:22:40.170 --> 00:22:44.880 I mean we're facing a lot of challenges right now, just anxiety levels or 382 00:22:44.960 --> 00:22:47.960 up budgets or being cut, as we talked about, all that sort of 383 00:22:48.000 --> 00:22:52.119 stuff. So for salespeople, sales leaders and everybody out there, there's a 384 00:22:52.160 --> 00:22:56.519 lot of challenges. Any parting words you want to share with listeners, given 385 00:22:56.559 --> 00:22:59.349 the current state of things? Yeah, so just one thing I want to 386 00:22:59.390 --> 00:23:00.390 share, which is, and this is not about not about me to fly, 387 00:23:00.509 --> 00:23:03.670 which is that there was this great quote that I love, which is 388 00:23:03.829 --> 00:23:07.829 that Andy Grove, one of the CEOS of Intel, said during one of 389 00:23:07.869 --> 00:23:11.980 the former crisis. These bad companies are destroyed by crisis. Good companies survive 390 00:23:12.059 --> 00:23:15.779 them, great companies are improved by them, and I just think this is 391 00:23:15.819 --> 00:23:18.900 such a neat concept, and I know that I dusted this off when we 392 00:23:18.980 --> 00:23:22.299 were going through our kind of covid reaction, but I'm in a unique position. 393 00:23:22.339 --> 00:23:25.259 I get to work with hundreds of companies and I get to see companies 394 00:23:25.299 --> 00:23:29.490 from the same industry behaving so differently right where some of them are saying they're 395 00:23:29.490 --> 00:23:33.849 hunkering down and they're just getting into like paralysis of analysis mode, and then 396 00:23:33.890 --> 00:23:37.450 you see this another company that exact same industry saying this is our chance, 397 00:23:37.569 --> 00:23:41.089 this is our chance to do to beat our competition, do better. Right. 398 00:23:41.130 --> 00:23:42.279 So I guess my last thing I would say is just, you know, 399 00:23:42.400 --> 00:23:45.839 this is not the time that's to freeze. This is a time to 400 00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:49.279 reinvent, because somebody in your industry is going to write and if it is 401 00:23:49.400 --> 00:23:52.319 you, it you know there's a good chance not every all your other competitors 402 00:23:52.359 --> 00:23:56.430 are right. And so so that's that's the last piece I would add is 403 00:23:56.509 --> 00:23:59.630 just, you know, don't stop. This is a chance to reinvent. 404 00:23:59.869 --> 00:24:03.589 Never waste a crisis, right, do something with this. This time we're 405 00:24:03.589 --> 00:24:06.710 going to fade up. Never stop believing right now. Yeah, exactly, 406 00:24:07.069 --> 00:24:11.700 close this out. I love the encouragement you're ending it with, Derek Carson. 407 00:24:11.779 --> 00:24:15.259 I've I've seen the same things talking to marketing teams that's save our budgets 408 00:24:15.299 --> 00:24:18.420 are being cut where, you know, not investing in growth right now, 409 00:24:18.460 --> 00:24:22.099 and others that have said, hey, we have this of then budget, 410 00:24:22.140 --> 00:24:25.609 we're going to shift it over to podcasting, because if we are adding valuable 411 00:24:26.009 --> 00:24:30.809 thought leadership content to our space, whether we serve manufacturers or SASS companies, 412 00:24:32.329 --> 00:24:37.130 we want to be seen as adding value right now, even if our customers 413 00:24:37.130 --> 00:24:38.559 aren't buying, because we're going to come out the other side stronger. So 414 00:24:38.640 --> 00:24:42.279 I'm right there with you. I've been working with teams that are kind of 415 00:24:42.599 --> 00:24:47.559 facing it or tackling it one way or the other. There is a huge 416 00:24:47.559 --> 00:24:52.230 opportunity to here, Carson. If anybody listening to this has now you've popped 417 00:24:52.230 --> 00:24:55.789 up on their radar, they want to follow up with you on anything that 418 00:24:55.869 --> 00:24:57.750 you've shared or just stay connected with you in the media flight team. What's 419 00:24:57.750 --> 00:25:00.230 the best way for them to do that? Yeah, like linked. It 420 00:25:00.349 --> 00:25:03.869 is the best. I live on Linkedin. Awesome, make it nice and 421 00:25:03.950 --> 00:25:07.900 easy. Carson's linkedin profiles in the show notes as usual, so check that 422 00:25:07.019 --> 00:25:11.220 out, shoot him a connection request and let him know you heard him rank 423 00:25:11.259 --> 00:25:12.740 here on BB growth. All Right, Carson, thank you so much for 424 00:25:12.859 --> 00:25:15.259 being on the show today. Man, this is great. I appreciate it. 425 00:25:18.779 --> 00:25:22.970 I hate it when podcasts incessantly ask their listeners for reviews, but I 426 00:25:22.049 --> 00:25:26.730 get why they do it, because reviews are enormously helpful when you're trying to 427 00:25:26.730 --> 00:25:30.369 grow podcast audience. So here's what we decided to do. If you leave 428 00:25:30.410 --> 00:25:33.250 a review for be to be growth and apple podcasts and email me a screenshot 429 00:25:33.369 --> 00:25:37.319 of the review to James at Sweet Fish Mediacom, I'll send you a signed 430 00:25:37.400 --> 00:25:41.079 copy of my new book, content based networking, how to instantly connect with 431 00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:45.279 anyone you want to know. We get a review, you get a free 432 00:25:45.319 --> 00:25:45.559 book. We both win.