1255: PPC for SaaS Companies: Everything You Need to Know (Part 3 of 3) w/ Dylan Hey

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:02.600 Hey, this is James, the founder of sweet fish media. If you've 2 00:00:02.600 --> 00:00:04.839 listened to BB growth for a while, you probably have an idea of what 3 00:00:04.879 --> 00:00:09.230 we're passionate about. Loving people really well, a constant pursuit of learning and 4 00:00:09.589 --> 00:00:14.230 inspiring people to own their careers. With all the craziness happening with this virus, 5 00:00:14.310 --> 00:00:18.510 we are incredibly fortunate to be in the business of podcasting. So many 6 00:00:18.589 --> 00:00:22.699 BB brands are looking for alternatives to their inperson events that are being canceled, 7 00:00:23.019 --> 00:00:26.980 and our business is growing as a result. Please don't miss hear me on 8 00:00:27.059 --> 00:00:31.179 this, because I'm not saying this to Brag. It is heartbreaking the economic 9 00:00:31.219 --> 00:00:34.979 impact this is having on so many businesses. But being in the business of 10 00:00:35.060 --> 00:00:39.609 podcasting, the demand for what we do has increased and because of that we're 11 00:00:39.649 --> 00:00:43.890 looking to hire really talented people to help us serve that demand. So if 12 00:00:43.929 --> 00:00:46.729 you like what we're all about it sweet fish and you're looking for a great 13 00:00:46.729 --> 00:00:50.079 career opportunity, hit us up. There's a link in the show notes where 14 00:00:50.119 --> 00:00:55.560 you can apply today. I'm really looking forward to meeting you. Welcome back 15 00:00:55.679 --> 00:00:58.439 to be to be growth. My name is Timmy Bower and I'm on the 16 00:00:58.520 --> 00:01:03.479 editorial team at sweetfish. I'm joined today once again, by Dylan Hey, 17 00:01:03.640 --> 00:01:07.030 the CEO of a digital, one of our be tob growth contributors. Today 18 00:01:07.189 --> 00:01:12.189 is part three of our discussion on what'Sass companies need to know about P pc. 19 00:01:12.829 --> 00:01:15.989 If you missed one and two, I highly suggest them. We talked 20 00:01:15.989 --> 00:01:19.739 about ad networks, quality, score keywords, budgets and bidding and a lot 21 00:01:19.819 --> 00:01:23.500 more. I'm excited for today. We're going to dive into things like targeting, 22 00:01:23.659 --> 00:01:26.859 copywriting and measurement. Dylan, how does it go to be back? 23 00:01:27.180 --> 00:01:30.140 Yeah, thank you for having me on for the third part of this like 24 00:01:30.739 --> 00:01:34.569 mini series, if we call it that. I'm super excited about this episode. 25 00:01:34.569 --> 00:01:38.090 I'm keen to just go deep and share as much additional knowledge of people 26 00:01:38.090 --> 00:01:41.810 as I can. So, yeah, ready for it. Awesome. Now, 27 00:01:41.849 --> 00:01:45.689 if I remember correctly, the last thing we talked about was budgets and 28 00:01:45.849 --> 00:01:49.280 bidding and I wanted to get into talking about targeting with you. So could 29 00:01:49.280 --> 00:01:53.400 you tell us about the different types of add targeting and what types of targeting 30 00:01:53.480 --> 00:01:57.560 are most relevant for SASS companies? Yeah, great questions. So the first 31 00:01:57.599 --> 00:02:02.510 thing I'll say to kind of get started on discussing targeting is if anyone listening 32 00:02:02.590 --> 00:02:07.670 to this hasn't listened to the first two parts of this series, they should 33 00:02:07.709 --> 00:02:12.349 listen to those because we talk a lot about how, specifically with SASS companies, 34 00:02:12.389 --> 00:02:15.349 when you're running PPC and paid advertising, you want to make sure that 35 00:02:15.469 --> 00:02:20.740 you're adjusting the experience and the adds that you're serving to people based on I 36 00:02:20.819 --> 00:02:23.539 use the term funnel positioning a lot, so whether someone's kind of top of 37 00:02:23.620 --> 00:02:27.460 funnel, mid funnel, bottom of funnel, you have to make sure everything 38 00:02:27.500 --> 00:02:31.650 is tailored to search as intent, and that really ties into how you target 39 00:02:31.729 --> 00:02:36.490 your acts right because with Google, specially in the PPC, like search outside 40 00:02:36.530 --> 00:02:38.729 of things, we're targeting people based on on what they're searching. So that's 41 00:02:38.770 --> 00:02:43.689 the kind of main component of how we target people. However, what I 42 00:02:43.889 --> 00:02:46.280 can do right now is share a few tips about some other some other bits 43 00:02:46.319 --> 00:02:51.599 and pieces that you can do to implement into your targeting that people sometimes miss 44 00:02:51.680 --> 00:02:54.199 when we're taking a look into adds account specifically for sad and beat to be 45 00:02:54.319 --> 00:02:58.949 technology companies as well. So there's a few things I would recommend. First 46 00:02:58.990 --> 00:03:02.750 of all is if you're running display campaigns, any google display campaigns, these 47 00:03:02.789 --> 00:03:08.789 are very good for top of funnel awareness driven content and ads, and a 48 00:03:08.830 --> 00:03:12.789 lot of SAS companies don't go down this route. For some reason they don't 49 00:03:12.789 --> 00:03:16.300 run display campaign so I'd really recommend setting up display campaigns very cought, very 50 00:03:16.340 --> 00:03:20.979 cheap to get in front of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people. But 51 00:03:21.020 --> 00:03:23.819 the reason most people don't use them as because often the quality can be fairly 52 00:03:23.900 --> 00:03:27.060 low if you're not very stringent with the targeting. So what you can do 53 00:03:27.139 --> 00:03:30.370 a couple of campaigns that we always recommend is you can do similar to on 54 00:03:30.490 --> 00:03:34.449 facebook, where you can create custom audiences. You can kind of do something 55 00:03:34.449 --> 00:03:38.210 similar on Google. So you could plug in, for example, into Google, 56 00:03:38.610 --> 00:03:40.520 you could create a custom intent audience, is what it's called, and 57 00:03:40.639 --> 00:03:46.039 you could give Google a list of the URL's or the domain names of your 58 00:03:46.400 --> 00:03:49.560 like, let's say, top five competitors, or have many competitors that you 59 00:03:49.639 --> 00:03:52.039 have, and you could say to Google, Hey, we want to target 60 00:03:52.080 --> 00:03:54.909 display ads to people who are similar to people who have been on these websites. 61 00:03:55.270 --> 00:03:58.750 And so this is like one quick tip that you can implement. But 62 00:03:58.830 --> 00:04:01.389 whenever you're running display campaigns, you want to make sure that you're as tight 63 00:04:01.430 --> 00:04:05.069 as possible with the targeting. So other things you can do is do some 64 00:04:05.229 --> 00:04:10.340 testing. But you'll probably see a lot of traffic will come from mobile on 65 00:04:10.460 --> 00:04:15.139 display, and often that's not the highest quality because for most ass companies to 66 00:04:15.259 --> 00:04:17.779 make a purchasing decision, often you're not going to do that on your mobile. 67 00:04:17.819 --> 00:04:20.579 So you can run some tests with stopping mobile for a couple of weeks 68 00:04:20.579 --> 00:04:25.970 seeing if that edits things or adjust things. You can also do what's called 69 00:04:26.449 --> 00:04:30.930 in a similar kind of structure, you can actually upload lists to your Google 70 00:04:30.930 --> 00:04:34.370 adds account or you can use your Google analytics data and you could feed in 71 00:04:34.649 --> 00:04:39.800 information to Google, which shows it your let's say current customers. So that 72 00:04:39.879 --> 00:04:43.920 could be anyone that's been in the dashboard of your Sass Platform, for example. 73 00:04:43.959 --> 00:04:45.720 You could give that list to Google and say hey, we want to 74 00:04:45.759 --> 00:04:48.079 target people similar to these with our display campaigns. So those are a couple 75 00:04:48.079 --> 00:04:51.639 of targeting things you can try, and your display campaigns I'm happy to give. 76 00:04:51.680 --> 00:04:55.269 Anyone has questions on that, they can reach out to me or connect 77 00:04:55.269 --> 00:04:57.589 with me however they want to do that. And then the other thing is 78 00:04:57.750 --> 00:05:01.110 with your search campaigns and Google has the thing's been around for a couple of 79 00:05:01.189 --> 00:05:05.589 years now where you can take a look at in market audiences, they call 80 00:05:05.670 --> 00:05:10.819 them. So basically you can layer in different audiences to your ads campaigns and 81 00:05:10.939 --> 00:05:14.579 just observe them, and these are audiences that Google define. So, for 82 00:05:14.660 --> 00:05:16.379 example, Google has so much data and all of us. It knows if 83 00:05:16.459 --> 00:05:21.290 we're in potentially in the market for business software, enterprise software, it knows 84 00:05:21.329 --> 00:05:27.009 if we've been looking at high value retail items, it knows if we're traveling 85 00:05:27.290 --> 00:05:30.009 like it has all of this information and Google puts these people into what it 86 00:05:30.129 --> 00:05:33.490 thinks as the right inmarket audiences. So what we usually do with all of 87 00:05:33.569 --> 00:05:38.600 our customers is will layer in or add in a load of inmarket audiences and 88 00:05:38.680 --> 00:05:41.680 you can just do searching for things and Google suggest them to you as well, 89 00:05:42.000 --> 00:05:45.360 and we'll layer those in and we'll just set them into observation mode to 90 00:05:45.399 --> 00:05:47.600 begin with. So won't adjust any of our campaigns, but Google will break 91 00:05:47.600 --> 00:05:50.230 down the data to for us and say, okay, if, for example, 92 00:05:50.230 --> 00:05:55.470 we're seeing more clicks from people within the enterprise software audience, like you 93 00:05:55.589 --> 00:05:59.430 can see that kind of data and then you can start to add it into 94 00:05:59.470 --> 00:06:01.509 your targeting instead of just observing it. So this is a good way we 95 00:06:01.670 --> 00:06:08.459 found, especially within SASSPACE. Often it's things like people shopping for enterprise software. 96 00:06:08.579 --> 00:06:11.220 The click through rates will be better in the cost will be lower and 97 00:06:11.300 --> 00:06:14.579 if you add that into your targeting, that can also really help. So 98 00:06:14.660 --> 00:06:16.939 those are a few ways that you can be testing with other kind of targeting 99 00:06:17.060 --> 00:06:21.129 methods outside of what we talked about in the previous two episodes dealan. Those 100 00:06:21.170 --> 00:06:25.610 were some awesome suggestions. So switching here is a little bit we know that 101 00:06:25.730 --> 00:06:30.170 copywriting is a critical component of PPC. What's your best advice for SASS companies 102 00:06:30.209 --> 00:06:33.680 as a relates to PBC copywriting, and can you share a few examples of 103 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:38.519 high performing copy that you've seen SAS companies used for their ads? Yeah, 104 00:06:38.639 --> 00:06:42.680 great question. So we touched a little bit earlier on in the previous maybe 105 00:06:42.839 --> 00:06:45.879 episode one, I episode, to a little bit about the importance of copywriting, 106 00:06:46.040 --> 00:06:47.709 as you say, and how now this can really play a big part 107 00:06:47.750 --> 00:06:51.069 into into getting your ads right and getting the best results possible, and I 108 00:06:51.350 --> 00:06:57.629 shared a few tips around making sure that your ad copy is extremely relevant to 109 00:06:57.709 --> 00:07:01.220 the search is intent. So if somebody is searching for something really bottom of 110 00:07:01.300 --> 00:07:06.139 funnel like a buying intent keyword. Maybe they're searching for your name versus a 111 00:07:06.220 --> 00:07:10.620 competitive name, for example. You want to make sure that add copy tailors 112 00:07:10.660 --> 00:07:13.500 to that intent, whereas of someone searching for something very top of funnel, 113 00:07:13.740 --> 00:07:15.649 you have to be aware of that and maybe go down a more EDGUC key 114 00:07:15.769 --> 00:07:19.769 educational kind of route. Now, with that in mind, I can share 115 00:07:19.810 --> 00:07:24.009 a few other tips and tricks that you can use to improve your odd copy. 116 00:07:24.410 --> 00:07:27.810 As a kind of side note to this, we do have a blog 117 00:07:27.889 --> 00:07:30.240 post on our website. So Hey, did it all. If you search 118 00:07:30.319 --> 00:07:32.600 for Hay did ital PPC add copy, it should be the first thing you 119 00:07:32.680 --> 00:07:36.759 find. And there's maybe twelve, fifteen different tips. But just to recap 120 00:07:36.800 --> 00:07:40.879 a couple of these, because I think these are some of the most powerful 121 00:07:40.879 --> 00:07:44.040 ones that are very, very simple to introduce to so one thing I would 122 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:48.149 make sure that you start to include as much social proof or areas of credibilities 123 00:07:48.189 --> 00:07:54.069 you can within your add copies. So consumers trust other consumers more than brands, 124 00:07:54.110 --> 00:07:57.990 right, so they're going to trust other people's reviews testimonials more than you 125 00:07:58.350 --> 00:08:01.980 speaking directly. Of course, it's hard to show exactly somebody else's review within 126 00:08:03.019 --> 00:08:05.939 an add copy. But what you can do is you can use some some 127 00:08:05.139 --> 00:08:07.379 site links, and we'll talk about those later on, to link to your 128 00:08:07.459 --> 00:08:13.009 case studies page or a testimonials page. You can make sure you're using social 129 00:08:13.129 --> 00:08:16.769 copy within the ads itself, like social proof copy within the ADS itself. 130 00:08:16.810 --> 00:08:20.930 So it could be things like our customers earned over a one hundred million dollars 131 00:08:20.970 --> 00:08:26.209 with the help of our software or serving more than tenzero satisfied customers or something 132 00:08:26.290 --> 00:08:30.279 like that. Maybe number one rated software, like these kind of things. 133 00:08:30.279 --> 00:08:33.600 So I would really make sure you include those because, even though it sounds 134 00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:35.600 very simple, those are the kind of things that can often make you stand 135 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:39.039 out from some of the out of that adds that you might see that other 136 00:08:39.080 --> 00:08:43.029 people might be running. Another tip is to really talk to the searcher to 137 00:08:43.509 --> 00:08:46.590 that this ties in a little bit with what we're saying earlier about tailoring your 138 00:08:46.629 --> 00:08:50.190 copy to the searchers intent but actually talking to them like you would do another 139 00:08:50.230 --> 00:08:54.070 human being, rather than trying to structure something like a boring piece of content 140 00:08:54.149 --> 00:08:58.139 or a typical ad that you see everywhere else. Someone that does a really 141 00:08:58.139 --> 00:09:01.779 good example of this is there's a company called optio and that's like a Google 142 00:09:01.820 --> 00:09:07.580 adswork Google ad words management platform. They help you like maybe spot things that 143 00:09:07.620 --> 00:09:11.330 the human I might Miss Sometimes, and I'm actually looking at one of their 144 00:09:11.370 --> 00:09:15.769 ads right now and the headline of the ad is manage adds, manage Google 145 00:09:15.809 --> 00:09:18.450 ads accounts, question marks. It's like ask you, how do you manage 146 00:09:18.490 --> 00:09:22.370 Google ads accounts? And then the second headline is shave hours off your workload. 147 00:09:22.450 --> 00:09:24.679 So things like that. Really talking to the person that you're serving. 148 00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:26.279 The add two is another thing that you can do. But then you can 149 00:09:26.320 --> 00:09:31.600 also start to as you're depending on the kind of size company that you are 150 00:09:31.639 --> 00:09:35.039 listening to this. If you're, let's say, more focus on the enterprise 151 00:09:35.120 --> 00:09:39.190 market, Vince somebody to get onto a sales call with your demo call, 152 00:09:39.269 --> 00:09:41.950 discovery call, however you want to position it, with you and your team. 153 00:09:41.909 --> 00:09:46.549 You want to try your best to qualify out any leads who would be 154 00:09:46.750 --> 00:09:48.789 too small, and it's fairly easy to do that sometimes from the offset. 155 00:09:48.830 --> 00:09:54.340 Like if you're an enterprise system, maybe mentioned enterprise software systems in your headline 156 00:09:54.379 --> 00:09:58.620 or in your ad copy. If you only serve companies with over a hundred 157 00:09:58.659 --> 00:10:03.059 employees, maybe you could say something like best for companies with over a hundred 158 00:10:03.059 --> 00:10:07.169 employees. Things like that. You want to try and qualify out the wrong 159 00:10:07.250 --> 00:10:09.210 kind of leads a prospects if you can, and there's there's a good way 160 00:10:09.210 --> 00:10:13.090 to do that, just by being transparent and you add copy. And then 161 00:10:13.169 --> 00:10:15.769 just one other tip I would use. We talked about this previously, but 162 00:10:16.210 --> 00:10:20.759 really dive deep onto using emotional triggers, so empathizing with your customers in that 163 00:10:20.799 --> 00:10:24.519 add copy, using things like instant gratification. You could say hey, get 164 00:10:24.559 --> 00:10:30.279 the success that you deserve. Loss of versions save ex percent each month, 165 00:10:30.399 --> 00:10:31.919 like these kind of things. So, yeah, those would be a few 166 00:10:31.960 --> 00:10:35.389 tips. I have maybe ten twelve other ones, so make sure you go 167 00:10:35.429 --> 00:10:39.509 ahead and check those out on up blog posts or yet get in contact with 168 00:10:39.549 --> 00:10:41.590 me if you need any support with that kind of stuff. That's awesome. 169 00:10:41.629 --> 00:10:46.870 One of the things I love about their dylan is like they're basically human qualities. 170 00:10:46.190 --> 00:10:50.659 Understanding the consumer, stress o their consumers, talking to the searcher like 171 00:10:50.700 --> 00:10:54.820 they're human, being transparent, empathizing with them. I love to hear that 172 00:10:54.980 --> 00:11:01.580 these human qualities are the the winning strategies. Yeah, but often the problem 173 00:11:01.659 --> 00:11:07.289 is because if you're running hundreds of different ads against hundreds of different or even 174 00:11:07.330 --> 00:11:11.090 thousands of different search terms and you're maybe a small marketing team. You have 175 00:11:11.250 --> 00:11:15.370 one person who's looking after PBC and they're looking after so many other marketing activities. 176 00:11:15.610 --> 00:11:18.409 These are the things that get missed unless you have someone that's able to 177 00:11:18.570 --> 00:11:20.759 dedicate a lot of their time to the adds account and constantly make these kind 178 00:11:20.759 --> 00:11:24.679 of tweaks. And I know it sounds like really simple stuff, but actually 179 00:11:24.679 --> 00:11:28.360 a stuff that, as you said, it's just human nature, right, 180 00:11:28.440 --> 00:11:31.639 but a lot of people miss this when they're creating their add copying, not 181 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:35.389 just add copy, even landing pages and just general blog posts, etc. 182 00:11:35.750 --> 00:11:37.509 Like. Unfortunately, that's one of the problems within the kind of be to 183 00:11:37.549 --> 00:11:41.830 be and SAS software world as that we seem to push things out at volume 184 00:11:41.909 --> 00:11:46.110 rather than just actually being human and using quality, and that's reflective within adds 185 00:11:46.110 --> 00:11:50.419 as well. Yeah, I agree hundred percent. All right, let's talk 186 00:11:50.419 --> 00:11:54.299 about add extensions in add formats. What do SASS companies need to understand about 187 00:11:54.299 --> 00:11:56.899 add extensions and what do they need to understand about ad formats? Yeah, 188 00:11:56.980 --> 00:12:00.580 so this is probably only going to be interesting to people who are actually going 189 00:12:00.620 --> 00:12:03.490 to be hands on managing accounts themselves. So just bear that in mind. 190 00:12:03.529 --> 00:12:07.610 If some people listening to this think this sounds boring, it might be to 191 00:12:07.690 --> 00:12:09.769 you, but it's very important stuff to cover. Basically, Google has a 192 00:12:09.809 --> 00:12:16.639 variety of different add extensions and essentially, add extensions are just ways for you 193 00:12:16.919 --> 00:12:20.879 to help try and drive more like higher click through rates and more awareness for 194 00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:22.960 your brand, because it means if you start to use different add extensions, 195 00:12:24.360 --> 00:12:26.759 your ad will take up more real estate within the Google search if you're to 196 00:12:26.799 --> 00:12:31.669 just use like headline and description and no extensions, like the person that uses 197 00:12:31.710 --> 00:12:35.070 extensions is going to have an extra extra piece in their box in their ad 198 00:12:35.149 --> 00:12:37.190 and they're going to take up more space than you. So Google encourages you 199 00:12:37.230 --> 00:12:41.110 to use these things to drive better click through race improve quality scores, which 200 00:12:41.110 --> 00:12:45.659 we know, if you're like pushing towards all the metrics of Google likes to 201 00:12:45.700 --> 00:12:46.419 see. They think your ads are better, and then you're going to get 202 00:12:46.419 --> 00:12:52.220 lower conversion costs etc. There are lots of different types of extensions, so 203 00:12:52.460 --> 00:12:58.570 everything from cite link extensions to call extensions, message extensions, structured snippet pricing. 204 00:12:58.610 --> 00:13:01.649 There's loads of different ones and if you want to read like what they 205 00:13:01.690 --> 00:13:05.409 will are. You can just search for it and there's a really useful article 206 00:13:05.450 --> 00:13:09.769 on the Google support website that explains all of them. Specifically for SASS companies, 207 00:13:09.809 --> 00:13:13.360 though, the ones that we use most often are actually cite link extensions. 208 00:13:13.600 --> 00:13:18.960 So these these are extensions that are actually clickable and they go through to 209 00:13:18.039 --> 00:13:20.720 a section on your website. So, for example, ones we use most 210 00:13:20.759 --> 00:13:24.759 frequently our cite link extensions to the pricing page. So then it will come 211 00:13:24.799 --> 00:13:28.590 up and say like something about the pricing. They'll be a little mini description 212 00:13:28.629 --> 00:13:31.269 about the pricing. You can click on that button and not take you straight 213 00:13:31.309 --> 00:13:33.669 to the pricing page. You might want to do that for case studies as 214 00:13:33.710 --> 00:13:37.470 well, and maybe even, like if you're focus on demo bookings, you 215 00:13:37.509 --> 00:13:41.659 might want to have it going to the demo booking landing page that you have. 216 00:13:41.820 --> 00:13:46.059 So cite link extensions are super useful because it just gives someone else, 217 00:13:46.220 --> 00:13:48.379 it gives someone another place to click on if they're not just interested in going 218 00:13:48.419 --> 00:13:50.500 to the landing page that have set up on the home page. It gives 219 00:13:50.500 --> 00:13:54.059 them an easy route to get elsewhere. So that's one thing. The other 220 00:13:54.139 --> 00:14:00.690 one that I would say is fairly useful what both of these actually call out 221 00:14:00.769 --> 00:14:05.009 extensions and structured snippit extensions. These are the ones that we use the most 222 00:14:05.330 --> 00:14:09.529 outside of these site links. So basically, with call out extensions, you 223 00:14:09.649 --> 00:14:13.919 can use these to just try and drive a little bit more engagement through to 224 00:14:13.960 --> 00:14:16.919 your site. So it can be things like these aren't clickable, by the 225 00:14:16.960 --> 00:14:20.919 way, but they'll be things like maybe no obligation demo or like free fourteen 226 00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:24.789 day child. They're just like some key terms that are going to drive a 227 00:14:24.870 --> 00:14:28.269 bit more interest in in what you're showing, and I would say that you 228 00:14:28.309 --> 00:14:33.789 should always really be trying to use extensions in most the adds you're running, 229 00:14:33.789 --> 00:14:35.950 because it just takes up more real estate and you want to do that. 230 00:14:35.309 --> 00:14:41.179 But make sure that your call out extensions try and meet the messaging in your 231 00:14:41.259 --> 00:14:45.019 text ad because you don't want to add that's all about. Like free trial 232 00:14:45.500 --> 00:14:48.980 extensions are all about driving demo bookings, for example. That's something that can 233 00:14:48.220 --> 00:14:52.970 often happen and again you want to make sure that experience for the searchers as 234 00:14:52.009 --> 00:14:56.450 smooth as possible. So those would be a few things to look at and 235 00:14:56.490 --> 00:15:00.649 check out. The most kind of popular ones that we use for SASS companies 236 00:15:00.649 --> 00:15:07.049 specifically and you might want to use things like we can use like APP extensions 237 00:15:07.129 --> 00:15:11.080 and message extensions and cool extensions, but really those aren't necessarily the most relevant 238 00:15:11.080 --> 00:15:13.960 to SASS companies. So yeah, those would be the core ones I would 239 00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:18.159 focus on for everyone listening to this at the moment. Awesome. Now we've 240 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:22.629 got to talk about measurement, Dylan, I'm really excited to get into this. 241 00:15:22.950 --> 00:15:28.830 What are key performance indicators that SASS companies should be tracking and for each 242 00:15:28.830 --> 00:15:33.309 of those Kpis, what should task companies be aiming for? Yeah, really 243 00:15:33.350 --> 00:15:37.220 good question. So there's no straight answer for this because there's no straight answer 244 00:15:37.220 --> 00:15:39.980 for what which Kpis should we be aiming for, because everyone is going to 245 00:15:41.019 --> 00:15:45.580 have different things based on their lifetime value of customers, sales cycles, conversion 246 00:15:45.620 --> 00:15:48.539 rates, etc. And but when it comes to set in Kpis across an 247 00:15:48.539 --> 00:15:52.490 ants account what we, as ancient se it hated, saw. All we 248 00:15:52.690 --> 00:15:56.330 really care about is driving additional revenue for their companies that we work with, 249 00:15:56.529 --> 00:16:00.009 and the way that that happens is often through driving extra trial sign ups, 250 00:16:00.370 --> 00:16:06.120 extra demos being booked, and then following those throughout the fun and seeing what 251 00:16:06.200 --> 00:16:10.000 kind of impact that has. Now a lot of people will set kpis around 252 00:16:10.000 --> 00:16:15.039 things like quality scores, click through rates, conversion volume. These things are 253 00:16:15.159 --> 00:16:18.750 important within managing an AD's account, but to see business results, you really 254 00:16:18.789 --> 00:16:22.870 want to be focusing your Kpis on the things that are driving the business forward 255 00:16:22.870 --> 00:16:26.350 and just being honest, yes, click through rates and quality scores are important 256 00:16:26.350 --> 00:16:29.870 for the person managing the ADS account, but they're not important for the CEO 257 00:16:29.950 --> 00:16:33.379 or the CMO of the company that's listening to this. So you always want 258 00:16:33.419 --> 00:16:36.500 to be focusing on the metrics that drive the business forward. So Demo's booked, 259 00:16:36.820 --> 00:16:40.779 trial sign ups, paying customers if that's possible, and those kind of 260 00:16:40.899 --> 00:16:44.580 the core areas that you should be taking a look at now. A couple 261 00:16:44.659 --> 00:16:48.529 things to note that people often miss is that, especially within SASS, so 262 00:16:48.889 --> 00:16:52.809 with the buying cycle not being so smooth, you're not going to search for 263 00:16:52.929 --> 00:16:55.809 something one time and then the first time to see it that you're not going 264 00:16:55.809 --> 00:16:57.649 to search something, click on an ad and then purchase immediately. There will 265 00:16:57.690 --> 00:17:02.320 be some people that do that, but often people need between eight and twelve 266 00:17:02.519 --> 00:17:06.000 different interactions with the brand before they're ready to make a purchasing decision. Or 267 00:17:06.039 --> 00:17:08.799 sign up for a trial. So one thing that you'll see is when you're 268 00:17:08.799 --> 00:17:12.359 running ads, you'll notice often, pretty much we see this with all of 269 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:17.109 our customers. Is it when we're running ads? We see within our customers 270 00:17:17.150 --> 00:17:22.549 Google analytics account there will also be an increase in direct conversions when we're running 271 00:17:22.589 --> 00:17:25.950 out. So this is people that aren't necessarily being attributed as a result of 272 00:17:26.029 --> 00:17:30.619 the ADS. But have we come to the hypothesis that people are seeing our 273 00:17:30.660 --> 00:17:33.619 ads, they remember our name and then they come directly to our website the 274 00:17:33.660 --> 00:17:36.660 next time? We're in the future. There's no one hundred percent solid way 275 00:17:36.700 --> 00:17:38.180 of proving that all the way through, but we see this a lot. 276 00:17:38.220 --> 00:17:41.660 So I did on my own podcast. I interviewed someone recently who said they 277 00:17:42.140 --> 00:17:45.369 they wanted to run a test and they stopped that all of their facebook advertising 278 00:17:45.410 --> 00:17:48.650 for a month to see what kind of impact it would have, and actually 279 00:17:48.650 --> 00:17:52.329 it had a huge impact on their direct conversions. And that makes sense right. 280 00:17:52.490 --> 00:17:56.529 So that's one metric I would look out when you're starting to run adds 281 00:17:56.569 --> 00:18:00.039 as a SASS company is take a look at as you're spending more on ads, 282 00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:03.799 as the testing and ad spend is increasing, you want to make sure 283 00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:07.160 that your direct conversions are increasing as well, because that's really important. If 284 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:11.880 they're not, then probably means you're not doing something right with the ads, 285 00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:15.069 because you want people to re remembering you and coming back directly to the site 286 00:18:15.109 --> 00:18:15.750 in the future. So that would be one thing to note that. I 287 00:18:15.829 --> 00:18:19.069 think a lot of agencies, when working with SASS companies, if they haven't 288 00:18:19.109 --> 00:18:23.069 done so before, they kind of forget about how the buying process is different 289 00:18:23.150 --> 00:18:27.140 within SASS versus let's say, any commerce business, where I might search for 290 00:18:27.180 --> 00:18:30.420 a pair of sneakers and then buy them immediately. This is just very different. 291 00:18:30.579 --> 00:18:34.099 So yeah, those would be the KPIS that I would really be focusing 292 00:18:34.140 --> 00:18:40.500 on for sure. Yeah, you mentioned that there's no real way to measure 293 00:18:40.539 --> 00:18:45.890 strictly the number of people that are going to you just because they have seen 294 00:18:45.930 --> 00:18:49.569 enough of the ads that they're fully aware of you. Is there a way 295 00:18:49.970 --> 00:18:55.130 to really get a good sense of whether or not that's working? Yeah, 296 00:18:55.130 --> 00:18:56.960 so we can. We can measure parts of it. It's just it's difficult 297 00:18:57.000 --> 00:19:02.839 to attribute it directly. So, for example, like it all comes down 298 00:19:02.839 --> 00:19:07.039 to how marketing teams decide on their attribution models as well, because some people 299 00:19:07.039 --> 00:19:11.829 will say, okay, will we'll attribute the conversion, the sign up for 300 00:19:11.869 --> 00:19:15.710 the demo booking to wherever they came from before they booked the demo. But 301 00:19:15.789 --> 00:19:19.190 what if they've been on your website fifteen times? One time was because of 302 00:19:19.230 --> 00:19:23.230 a facebook add one time was because they search or named directly, one time 303 00:19:23.380 --> 00:19:26.539 was a youtube remarketing add that they saw and then the time when they finally 304 00:19:26.579 --> 00:19:30.140 sign up, they came direct to the website. In those cases, like 305 00:19:30.740 --> 00:19:34.019 what, as a marketer, how do you define which channel owns that conversion? 306 00:19:34.180 --> 00:19:37.779 There is no channel that owns it. This is where marketing in general 307 00:19:37.859 --> 00:19:40.130 has to come together and say hey, Leo, this is all of our 308 00:19:40.130 --> 00:19:44.730 channels working together. And people struggle with that and it's like that's a conversation 309 00:19:44.890 --> 00:19:48.049 that we could talk about for a really long time and maybe that could be 310 00:19:48.089 --> 00:19:51.329 another another episode. But there was a tip that I shared on one of 311 00:19:51.410 --> 00:19:56.880 my podcasts. There's a plugin called ga connector and it's a connector plug in 312 00:19:56.920 --> 00:20:02.000 for Google analytics that connects Google analytics with your cm system and that helped one 313 00:20:02.000 --> 00:20:03.759 of the companies I interviewed on my podcast called learn. While it's they were 314 00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:10.950 able to identify up to twenty percent more direct conversions and see that they'd come 315 00:20:10.990 --> 00:20:12.349 from ads in the past. That's maybe one little thing that you can look 316 00:20:12.349 --> 00:20:18.990 at, but unfortunately there isn't like a super simple answer to track absolutely everything 317 00:20:18.990 --> 00:20:22.420 in some use cases when there are multiple touch points involved and at the pends 318 00:20:22.420 --> 00:20:26.220 on how you decide to attribute things across your team as well. Awesome, 319 00:20:26.259 --> 00:20:30.539 I really appreciate your expertise on this still, and with an expert like you, 320 00:20:30.740 --> 00:20:33.339 it would be a mistake to not ask you if you could give our 321 00:20:33.420 --> 00:20:38.089 listeners a rundown of some common mistakes you see stass companies making when it comes 322 00:20:38.089 --> 00:20:42.849 to their PPC efforts, for sure. So I think listening through these three 323 00:20:42.890 --> 00:20:47.089 episodes, I touch on a lot of, I guess, mistakes that people 324 00:20:47.130 --> 00:20:49.200 make. them the care ones that we see a lot of the time are 325 00:20:49.400 --> 00:20:53.519 not tailoring. Not Tailoring your ads to the searchers intent. This is something 326 00:20:53.559 --> 00:20:56.559 that's really, really big and really key. The other thing is like not 327 00:20:56.720 --> 00:21:02.079 segmenting campaigns enough, so people will just create a branded campaign and then a 328 00:21:02.119 --> 00:21:04.750 nonbranded campaign. We talked about that in the first episode. The other things 329 00:21:04.750 --> 00:21:11.390 would be like people running ads but not being specific enough with their targeting. 330 00:21:11.470 --> 00:21:15.390 So they'll set up remarketing ads, but they'll forget that they've left audience expansion 331 00:21:15.549 --> 00:21:18.940 turned on. So actually the ad isn't just remarking. It's then saying to 332 00:21:18.099 --> 00:21:22.500 Google, Hey, we want to cover people similar to these people. So 333 00:21:22.660 --> 00:21:26.180 then it's not truly remarketing. I would say another mistake is not trying to 334 00:21:27.299 --> 00:21:32.140 bring all of the channels together. You have to be aware that Google has 335 00:21:32.140 --> 00:21:34.970 an impact on facebook, facebook has an impact on Google. Organic content has 336 00:21:36.009 --> 00:21:38.289 an impact on that as well. And I guess those would be a few 337 00:21:38.410 --> 00:21:42.730 core things. There's there's there's tons of mistakes I could cover, like segmenting 338 00:21:42.849 --> 00:21:45.529 by country. A lot of people won't do that. See. Yeah, 339 00:21:45.569 --> 00:21:48.960 that there's quite a long list, but I think if someone was to listen 340 00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:51.880 through to the these three episodes they would pick up on on a lot of 341 00:21:52.000 --> 00:21:55.799 those and being a really strong position moving forward. And if anyone has any 342 00:21:55.799 --> 00:21:57.960 specific questions as well, I'm happy for them to reach out to me and 343 00:21:59.359 --> 00:22:02.829 do my best to help out. Awesome. And do you have any recommendations 344 00:22:02.990 --> 00:22:06.589 for Sass marketers that are listening for who they could be following to learn more 345 00:22:06.630 --> 00:22:10.150 about PPC? Yeah, that's a really good question, because I saw that 346 00:22:10.230 --> 00:22:14.190 in our notes before the podcast and I was really trying to think about who 347 00:22:14.309 --> 00:22:15.859 to recommend and, to be honest with you, it's very, very difficult. 348 00:22:15.859 --> 00:22:21.579 There's like there's tons of Sass marketers that I would recommend following, but 349 00:22:21.700 --> 00:22:26.579 there's not really like of course there's agencies focus on Sass marketing and Sass PPC, 350 00:22:26.819 --> 00:22:30.410 like me and my team, but there's really not that many of us 351 00:22:30.410 --> 00:22:33.769 and a lot of the agencies that are focused on Sas they have either never 352 00:22:33.890 --> 00:22:38.089 worked in Sass before or something like that. So that and people aren't necessarily 353 00:22:38.130 --> 00:22:41.130 pushing there like personal brands as much as as I am. So I don't 354 00:22:41.450 --> 00:22:45.000 really have a ton of people that I would recommend to follow. The other 355 00:22:45.119 --> 00:22:49.960 only the only other agency that I know focus specifically on Stas that are actually 356 00:22:49.960 --> 00:22:53.799 really credible and I have no problem sharing sharing them. I know some people 357 00:22:53.799 --> 00:22:56.880 might think is weird, like kind of pointing someone to our competition almost, 358 00:22:56.920 --> 00:23:00.869 but there's an agency called powered by search. I know that they've worked with 359 00:23:00.990 --> 00:23:03.670 some SASS companies as well. They don't just do PPC, though. They 360 00:23:03.710 --> 00:23:08.789 do like full service marketing. So, to be completely honest, I really 361 00:23:08.829 --> 00:23:14.900 do believe that we're one of the few SAS only PPC agencies out there, 362 00:23:14.980 --> 00:23:17.299 and I know there are others, but I don't think can on is as 363 00:23:17.380 --> 00:23:21.180 good as we are. So yeah, it's kind of difficult to share that. 364 00:23:21.220 --> 00:23:22.740 I would say, though, General Sass marketers who I really love to 365 00:23:22.779 --> 00:23:26.059 follow, people that you guys have had on the show before as well. 366 00:23:26.099 --> 00:23:30.049 I think like someone should just run through and listen to a few BEATB growth 367 00:23:30.089 --> 00:23:33.250 episodes. But yeah, that would be like kind of my my recommendation. 368 00:23:33.369 --> 00:23:37.210 It's hard to actually say okay, this person specifically SASS. PPC has very 369 00:23:37.289 --> 00:23:40.890 few of them out there. Well, it's definitely not hard for me to 370 00:23:40.970 --> 00:23:45.119 agree with you on the Dylan and also, I personally think that it only 371 00:23:45.160 --> 00:23:48.000 adds to a person's credibility when they're able to point to other experts that might 372 00:23:48.039 --> 00:23:52.039 even be, you know, competition for them. So I think that's awesome. 373 00:23:52.359 --> 00:23:55.640 Could you close things out by sharing the number one thing that you want 374 00:23:55.710 --> 00:23:59.829 listeners to walk away with after hearing this episode? Yeah, good question. 375 00:23:59.990 --> 00:24:03.549 So I want anyone listening to this to not be scared of trying PPC for 376 00:24:03.630 --> 00:24:07.390 your SASS business, but to also be aware that if you're going to do 377 00:24:07.470 --> 00:24:10.619 it, you have to dedicate time and resources to it. Too often we 378 00:24:10.819 --> 00:24:15.900 see SAS companies that will run what they think is an experiment and they'll expect 379 00:24:15.019 --> 00:24:18.980 results within the first like week or two and if they don't see results, 380 00:24:18.980 --> 00:24:22.180 and they'll cut everything and decide that PPC doesn't work for them as a channel. 381 00:24:22.940 --> 00:24:26.769 These platforms good, whether it's Google, cap terror, Linkedin, facebook, 382 00:24:26.809 --> 00:24:30.769 whatever you're advertising on. These platforms thrive off of data and you need 383 00:24:30.849 --> 00:24:34.170 to be collecting data before you can even begin to make any optimizations and you 384 00:24:34.289 --> 00:24:37.970 need to really know what you're doing. I think if you listen through to 385 00:24:37.009 --> 00:24:40.759 these three episodes will put you in good stead to actually be able to make 386 00:24:40.799 --> 00:24:42.920 a start. But yeah, my recommendation and what I want someone to take 387 00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:45.440 away from this is to really, if you are going to do it, 388 00:24:45.880 --> 00:24:51.000 like commit some time to doing it and doing it properly, and then really 389 00:24:51.119 --> 00:24:53.710 make sure that everything you're doing is trying to be as human as possible and 390 00:24:53.829 --> 00:24:59.230 really focused on that element instead of just like putting ad copy out there for 391 00:24:59.269 --> 00:25:02.470 the sake of putting a copy out there. Like you really want to tailor 392 00:25:02.509 --> 00:25:06.069 the experience, the person that's searching. I've used that term like quite a 393 00:25:06.069 --> 00:25:08.380 few times throughout this interviews, is making sure you're tailoring everything to the searchers 394 00:25:08.420 --> 00:25:12.259 intent and those are the ways that you're going to see the best performance from 395 00:25:12.259 --> 00:25:15.819 your campaign. So yeah, I would like to say to everyone try out, 396 00:25:15.980 --> 00:25:18.619 give it a go, but stick with it for some time and again, 397 00:25:18.660 --> 00:25:21.490 as I've said, if people have questions or anything like that, I'm 398 00:25:21.690 --> 00:25:23.569 more than happy to will not be to answer them for you. Well. 399 00:25:23.650 --> 00:25:27.049 Thank you, Dylan, and thank you to everyone listening to this series of 400 00:25:27.210 --> 00:25:32.089 be tob growth. Again, we've been talking to Dylan Hay CEO of hey 401 00:25:32.170 --> 00:25:36.400 digital. Dylan is really active on Linkedin, so you should definitely connect with 402 00:25:36.440 --> 00:25:40.400 him there. Just Search Dylan Hey and he'll pop right up. Awesome. 403 00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:45.960 Thank you so much. I hate it when podcasts incessantly ask their listeners for 404 00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:49.029 reviews, but I get why they do it, because reviews are enormously helpful 405 00:25:49.029 --> 00:25:52.230 when you're trying to grow podcast audience. So here's what we decided to do. 406 00:25:52.710 --> 00:25:56.789 If you leave a review for be to be growth and apple podcasts and 407 00:25:56.990 --> 00:26:00.630 email me a screenshot of the review to James at Sweet Fish Mediacom I'll send 408 00:26:00.630 --> 00:26:03.980 you a signed copy of my new book. Content based networking, how to 409 00:26:04.099 --> 00:26:07.259 instantly connect with anyone you want to know. We get a review, you 410 00:26:07.700 --> 00:26:10.460 get a free book. We both win.