Transcript
WEBVTT
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All right, welcome back to another
episode of B to be growth. My
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name is Timothy Bower and I'm once
again here with Dylan Hey, the CEO
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of hey digital. We've been having
a conversation around PPC for SASS and this
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is part two of that episode where
we'll be doing a deeper dive into keywords
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and metrics and strategy. Dylan,
welcome back. Yeah, thank you so
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much. I'm super excited to be
back for around too. I think episode
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one we went into a lot of
depth and I said to you kind of
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prerecording that that something that's really important
to me. I want to make sure
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that we're sharing information that people couldn't
just find in a two minute google search.
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Right. I want to go deep
and share as much actionable stuff as
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possible. So, yeah, very
excited looking forward to going deeper into this.
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I love that. Okay, so
let's turn our focus towards keywords.
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There are a lot of different types
of keywords. There's branded keywords, generic
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keywords, transactional keywords, locational keywords, long tailed informational. What types of
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keywords should SASS companies be focused on
and how should SASS companies figure out what
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keywords they should be spending money on. Yeah, really good question. So
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there's a few different routes to look
at this and I would say the easy
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answer is it depends on your budget
level and on, like how you decide
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to approach. You'LL PP TE strategy. What I can do is breakdown some
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of the different use cases for different
keyword match types, is what they called,
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to what you covered, like different
keyword match types. I can cover
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some examples of which ones to use
and when, and then also break down,
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like what is a branded keyword versus
a generic keyword, etc. If
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someone wants to just a big long
list of all the different types of keywords
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and match types on Google, that's
something that if you just do a quick
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Google search for you'll be able to
find fairly fairly easily. Now, with
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with SASS businesses specifically, typically when
we first jump into someone's ads account,
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if it's we're doing an audit of
it and trying to help them out or
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we're starting a new account, we
often see that the first thing people do
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is separate their campaigns by branded keywords
and then non branded keywords. So a
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branded keyword is anything related to your
brand, as you would expect, and
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typically within SASS because there's a lot
of competition within like anyone listening to this
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running as ass business, you'll know
that you have three or four, probably
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even more, competitors that do very
similar things to you guys. So we
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want to make sure that we are
covering our own brand because often it's just
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standard practice now that people will be
advertising against their competitors keywords. So let's
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say I search for BB growth show
online right now and we had ten different
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competitors. There might be another podcast
targeting that key word because they know that
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they would share the same audience and
be interesting to them. And this happens
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all of the time within sacts.
So you want to make sure you're covering
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yourself by having branded campaigns running.
These are very cost effective, they're very
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low price because it's your branded Keyter, like keyword, is something that you
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own, so you're always going to
have the best quality scores on these.
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So Google show your ads most.
So this is one thing. And then
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the second subset is m people have
non branded or unbranded campaigns and keywords,
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and those are the things like buying
inten keywords, etc. Things it aren't
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tied into your brand. So usually
that's the first split that we see within
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adds accounts. Now what we like
to do is break down our campaigns,
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as I talked about in the first
episode, by funnel, positioning and buying
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intent. So if you haven't listened
to that episode already, go back and
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check that one out. But once
you've then broken down your campaigns by intent,
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this is when you can start playing
around with what's called different match types.
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So the kind of the safest,
if you want to call it that.
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The safest match type is exact match, and this is when you're telling
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Google, I only want to hit
someone with an ad if they specifically search
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for this exact key to, like
keyword or phrase. If they search for
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anything similar to it but not exactly
this, we don't want to serve out
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add to them. So this is
when you can be very, very like
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laser focused and targeted. So let's
say you want to show an ad for
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podcast editing software. You can set
exact match around podcast editing software. Only
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that would trigger. But then you
can start to use you can start to
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use other match types, such as
broad match modified, and this is when
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you're then saying to Google, okay, this is my keyword, but if
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somebody searches something broadly within this spectrum
that's similar to this, also show them
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this Ad. Now we tend to
use broad match modified match types, often
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at the beginning of a new account
when we're trying to uncover search terms that
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we may otherwise miss. Right.
So you're not always going to know everything
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that your potential customer is searching for. You might think they're searching for one
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thing, but actually lots of people
are searching for something slightly similar that you
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would never have picked up before.
So we often use broad match modified at
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the very beginning to kind of cast
a net out there and catch these keywords
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that we may miss otherwise. Now, the risk with this is that you
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will also get lots of irrelevant search
traffic as well. So you have to
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constantly keep an eye on the campaign
and remove or add keywords your what's called
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your negative list, and this is
where you really need someone like an agency
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or someone kind of full time focus
on the account or, if you're doing
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it yourself, checking like once a
day if you're running big board match modified
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campaigns. Because, to give you
guys an example of this, we work
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with a website security software. They
help people when their websites have been hacked.
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We launched a new campaign a couple
of days ago, broad match modified
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campaign around word press hacked keywords,
right, but it starts to pull in
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lots of people searching for fit x, my roblox hack and robox is like
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a video game that's totally irrelevant to
someone, someone that's looking to fix their
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wordpress website, but it pulled it
through because it's fixed my something hack.
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So now we add that to the
negativeness. So that's one thing to bear
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in mind. And then there's also
when we're talking about keywords. You mentioned
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transactional keywords, locational keywords. Those
are fairly self explanatory, but then there's
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things like long tail keywords. So
these are the things that are going to
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have lower search volume but often higher
in tent and it's things that be very
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specific search terms. And that's why
they called long tail, because there just
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the longer right. So it's something
like how do I upload a podcast?
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That could be a long tail key
word. You're going to get less people
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searching for it, but it's fairly
high intent if you match that to an
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add and then a landing page in
a tool that can help people upload podcasts
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online. So to kind of try
and wrap it up a little bit,
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that's top, top level of some
of the different keywords and match types.
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Sat Companies, in my opinion,
should always focus on exact match campaigns when
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budget is tight, because this is
where you can be ultra specific, and
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then broad match campaigns when you're trying
to unbroadmatch, modified campaigns when you're trying
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to bring in extra people, whether
it's top of funnel or identify more search
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terms. Of course there's lots of
other kind of avenues routes that we could
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go down with that, but for
the purpose of this episode right now,
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I think that's a good place to
kind of stop with search turns and keywords,
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etc. Awesome, Dal and I
love the detailed strategy explanations that you've
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given for all this. Let's start
briefly about add groups. How should south
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companies be thinking about them and what
are the best practices? Yeah, so
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just to explain how this works,
there's lots of there's lots of different strategies
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and ways of structuring a Google ads
account right. So also, I want
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everyone to bear in mind who's listening
to this, just because I recommend to
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do things one way doesn't mean it's
the only way that it should be good
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should be done. Everyone has their
own way of doing things. Now,
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an Ad Group essentially when you think
about the campaign structure. So you have
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the campaign. This is where everything
is housed. Within the campaign you have
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add groups and within the add groups
you have keywords. So the keywords are
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for what people are specifically searching for. The add group is what you use
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to kind of define a few different
keywords and put them under one umbrella.
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And then the campaign level is what
houses the add groups and that is what
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is your let's say you have a
bottom of funnel campaign, for example.
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So we might have we're using podcast
as examples a lot here because I just
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think it makes sense for everybody listening. One of my add groups could be
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podcast software, for example, and
then anyone that's searching keywords related to podcast
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software would be in that AD group. Then I could have an ad group
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related to podcast platforms, because we
want to make sure that anyone's searching for
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podcast platform related keywords, although it's
very similar to podcast software, we want
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to have ads that are ultra specific
to what someone's searching for. So for
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each add group and for each keyword. We have different ads and if you
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were to have all of these in
one ad group, you wouldn't be able
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to separate out those ads and make
sure that their ultra relevant for the kind
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of searchers experience, so to say. So without trying to get to technical,
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because it's kind of hard to show
you guys exactly what I mean without
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having an adds account on my screen
to run through with you all. And
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that's how we look it. Add
groups, how you should be thinking about
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them. It's just making sure that
you don't want to overload and have like
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one campaign that has hundreds of odd
groups in it, because some people do
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that. They try and get very
granular, and the problem often is if
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you have, if you don't have
a high enough budget and you have hundreds
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of add groups, Google will start
optimizing towards what's performing best and then they
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can be hundreds of different add groups
in search terms, actually just aren't getting
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any traffic at all, so it
becomes pointless having them in the campaign.
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So you don't want you don't want
too many, but you also don't want
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to little where you're so broad.
So you want to do the best job
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that you can to group things together, but also keep it as specific as
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possible. So if you're running something
related to software versus something related to platform,
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or reviews versus ratings, for example, you want to try and separate
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those just to make sure you can
tail at the experience to the searchers inten
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great and dealing. Could you give
our listeners an example of like a way
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to hyper granular with add groups?
Yeah, so to granulate in my opinion.
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So some people think this is best
practice and it this is always changing.
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There's a method called skaggs. Skags, which is single keyword add groups,
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and this was like, I think
this was a term coined by another
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pretty like large one own adds agency, and basically that means that for every
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single keyword, so any search has
its own add group, right, and
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this works in some cases, like
it's definitely worked very well. But if
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you're trying to do a large campaign, doing single keyword ad groups doesn't necessarily
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make sense, because that's when you
end up in the situation where you can
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have hundreds of add groups and then
your budget is only being spent on the
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first two or three and in that
case then you don't really get to do
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any real testing and you could be
missing out on a lot of good results.
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So that would be, in my
opinion, and example of something that's
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like, just a little bit too
granular. However, in some use cases,
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if it's a small campaign with only
a couple of add groups, then
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it will make sense if you're trying
to be laser focus and ultra specific.
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So again, it kind of depends
on the funnel positioning, the intent and
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how you're how you're trying to distribute
your budget within your SIS company. Awesome,
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I love that you brought up how
this affects budget. I think this
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next question is going to be hyper
relevant for our listeners. Let's talk about
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budgets and bidding. HOW SHOULD SALES
COMPANIES DETERMINE THEIR AD budget? What do
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sales companies need to understand about PPC
bidding? Yeah, again, very good
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question, and this is something that
comes up very frequently, as you would
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imagine, with people who have either
never done ads before or are fairly new
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to this, and so, for
that exact reason you'll probably start to see
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a pattern here if you listen to
episode one and episode two. Whenever there's
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a big question like this, we
make sure we put together an in depth
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like useful blog post on our website
that covers us. So we have one
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that's called how to calculate your PPC
advertising budget. So just go ahead and
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search for that. In this blog
post we basically break down, I think
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it's like a six, six step
process or how you can calculate your budget,
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and we also have a cheat sheet
in there to for some formulas of
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how to do that. But just
to not drive everybody away, to make
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sure we keep them on this podcast, I'm going to share a few of
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the top level, top level metrics
and just check that out afterwards. Don't
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stop this and go away. Check
it out after you've listened to this.
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So it's really really important to think
about when you're calculating your budget. The
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first thing you want to do is
think about what your objectives are, because
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that that then like sets the standard
for how you're going to spend your budget.
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If your early stage and you're hyper
focused on driving conversions and nothing else,
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all you care about is people getting
onto sales calls with your team,
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your budget is going to be different
for somebody that has more to spend and
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their const they're like concentrating on awareness
campaigns as well as conversion campaigns right.
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So you have to first think about
what the purpose is, why you're actually
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why you're actually advertising. So it's
really important that you cover that. And
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but then you need to start by
defining Your Business and advertising goals. So
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we like to use the smart goal
like setting methodologies, making sure that your
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goals are specific, measurable, achievable, relevant and time bound. And that's
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why you start thinking, okay,
we focusing on customer requisition, brand awareness,
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retention, etc. Usually, most
people they're focusing on lead generation and
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customer acquisition and then, secondary to
that, brand awareness and then maybe third
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customer retention or trial retention. So
once you've done that, you then have
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to understand traffic generation requirements. So
you need to figure out, okay,
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in order to get those volume of
conversions, how many people do I need
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to come to the website? Based
on the data that we have available to
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us right now. The caveat with
this is that, of course you can
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never really figure this out until you
have ads up and running, but you
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can look into your Google analytics account
and see, okay, from our organic
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search traffic, what percentage of visitors
convert to either signing up for a trial
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booking onto a demo etc. Take
data like that and from that you can
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figure out okay, if I need
a hundred customers and, let's say or
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a hundred trial sign ups, and
my conversion rate from web traffic to trial
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sign up is usually two percent,
then on average you're going to need five
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thousand clicks to get a hundred like
sign ups. Potentially, this is fairly
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top level, right, but this
is the only way to do things before
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you're running at so you figure that
out, then you want to go ahead
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and get an estimated CPC and estimated
cost per click. You can use a
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few different ways to this. One
is historical data. If you've run campaigns
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previously this, that's the best option. But if you've never done that before,
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like a lot of people listening to
this, you can use the google
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key word planner to get some estimates
on CPCs. Now the thing to bear
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in mind here is that, to
be honest with you, the Google key
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word plan and any other keywords tools, whether it's m rush Aref something like
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that, they're often pretty pretty inaccurate
when it comes to what you'll actually be
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spending, but they give you a
benchmark. So you want to figure out
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what the estimated CPC is and then
once you have that, you can find
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another like the maximum CPC and the
average CPC. The Google key word plan
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or tell you that, and then
what you have. Okay, I need
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to get this many clicks based on
my standard conversion rates, and this is
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what the average CPC is. Then
you can start to do some calculations to
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do. Okay, traffic needed times
by average CPC. Equals are equals.
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Are Budget. But it's not.
It's not the best way, like it's
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not a concrete way to set a
budget because really you can't do that until
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you have things up running you see
what's actually happening. So what we recommend
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is that you usually do like a
low range estimate and a higher range estimate
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and an aim for something in the
middle and then over time, usually over
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the first thirty days when you're starting
to collect data, then you can really
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make informed decisions about what your budget
should be moving forward. Wow, awesome,
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dylan, what a very practical primer
on budgets and bidding and I wasn't
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expecting to do this, but I
think it's going to be important for us
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to have a part three to this, because the next things that we're going
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to talk about, targeting, copywriting, add extensions, measurement. I don't
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want to rush to any of that, so tune in for part three of
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the interview with Dylan Hay on PPC
for SASS. Thank you so much for
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joining us for this episode. No
wires. Thank you. Thanks for having
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me. I'm looking forward to going
in again. Hey, everybody, Logan
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with sweetfish here. If you're a
regular listener of BB growth, you know
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that I'm one of the cohosts of
the show, but you may not know
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that I also head up the sales
team here, is sweetfish. So for
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those of you in sales or sales
offs, I wanted to take a second
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to share something that's made us insanely
more efficient lately. Our team has been
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using lead Iq for the past few
months and what used to take us four
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00:16:29.590 --> 00:16:33.700
hours gathering contact data now takes us
only one. We're seventy five percent more
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00:16:33.740 --> 00:16:38.980
efficient. We're able to move faster
without bound prospecting and organizing our campaigns is
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so much easier than before. I'd
highly suggest you guys check out lead Iq
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00:16:44.659 --> 00:16:48.490
as well. You can check them
out at lead iqcom. That's Elle a
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d iqcom