March 23, 2020

1232: 3 Benefits to Content Creation "Batching" w/ Joe Sullivan

In this episode we talk to , Founder of . Check out the book Joe mentions in this episode here: Now you can more easily search & share your audio content, while getting greater visibility into the impact of your podcast. Check out...

In this episode we talk to Joe Sullivan, Founder of Gorilla 76.

Check out the book Joe mentions in this episode here:

Never Lose a Customer Again: Turn Any Sale into Lifelong Loyalty in 100 Days


Now you can more easily search & share your audio content, while getting greater visibility into the impact of your podcast.

Check out Casted in action at casted.us/growth


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Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.839 --> 00:00:09.150 Welcome back to be to be growth. I'm Logan lyles with sweet fish media. 2 00:00:09.310 --> 00:00:13.349 Today I'm joined by Joe Sullivan. He's the cofounder over at Gorilla Seventy 3 00:00:13.429 --> 00:00:15.990 six. Joe, welcome to the show. How's it going today? It's 4 00:00:15.990 --> 00:00:19.149 all good, Logan, good be here. Awesome man. You and I 5 00:00:19.350 --> 00:00:23.739 were having some great conversations over the last few weeks and we're both been thinking 6 00:00:23.780 --> 00:00:28.620 about this idea of how do we create content more efficiently for our customers. 7 00:00:28.699 --> 00:00:30.820 I think there are going to be some things, whether you work for an 8 00:00:30.820 --> 00:00:35.259 agency or you're a brand marketer, that you'll be able to take from this 9 00:00:35.340 --> 00:00:39.530 conversation. We're going to be breaking down this idea of content creation in in 10 00:00:40.049 --> 00:00:44.289 batches up front. But before we get into today's conversation, Joe, give 11 00:00:44.329 --> 00:00:47.770 us a little bit of background for folks who aren't familiar with you, like 12 00:00:47.929 --> 00:00:50.759 myself in the sweet fish team. Are Tell us a little bit about yourself 13 00:00:50.799 --> 00:00:53.679 and what you in the gorilla seventy six team or up to these days? 14 00:00:53.719 --> 00:00:57.439 Yeah, you got it. So, yeah, I'm a cofounder of Gorilla 15 00:00:57.479 --> 00:01:02.320 Seventy six, were we position ourselves as an industrial marketing agency, so we 16 00:01:02.479 --> 00:01:07.549 help essentially midsize manufactures, identify the right types of customers, creed, focus 17 00:01:07.709 --> 00:01:11.950 on them and then figure out how to attract them, engage them and start 18 00:01:12.069 --> 00:01:15.709 real sales conversations with them. So, yeah, we've been in business for, 19 00:01:17.069 --> 00:01:22.260 I guess, about fourteen years as of this coming May. And you 20 00:01:22.420 --> 00:01:26.379 I sort of slowly grown from the the my business partner John and I've founded 21 00:01:26.739 --> 00:01:30.700 business in two thousand and six to team of eighteen as of today. A 22 00:01:30.739 --> 00:01:34.370 couple new new employees just started this morning. So awesome, man, I 23 00:01:34.450 --> 00:01:38.650 don't have to start thinking about that employee count. That's a good thing. 24 00:01:38.849 --> 00:01:42.010 That's yeah, they had no kid. Fourteen years is no small feed. 25 00:01:42.609 --> 00:01:46.090 Absolutely thank you, will Joe. You and I were talking about this the 26 00:01:46.209 --> 00:01:49.079 other day offline. I was sharing some things some of the listeners of the 27 00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:53.239 show might know. You know, traditionally at Sweet Fish we've created podcast for 28 00:01:53.319 --> 00:01:57.120 other brands. We're making this shift now to where we're adding another service where 29 00:01:57.719 --> 00:02:04.230 we create podcasts for a specific functional role or a specific industry. And one 30 00:02:04.269 --> 00:02:07.829 of the big shifts we've been going through, as opposed to kind of our 31 00:02:07.989 --> 00:02:13.550 typical emo of podcast production, of coordinating guest interviews, trying to keep kind 32 00:02:13.550 --> 00:02:15.180 of a backlog of, you know, a month, month and a half 33 00:02:15.219 --> 00:02:19.539 worth of content to stay ahead of it. But it's been very much for 34 00:02:19.620 --> 00:02:23.340 us and the way we produce podcasts just kind of stay a little bit ahead 35 00:02:23.340 --> 00:02:27.379 of it and through several iterations of what we used to call media days, 36 00:02:27.460 --> 00:02:30.729 we now call forty eight hours to industry influence, we are moving towards this 37 00:02:31.050 --> 00:02:37.610 model of a two day immersive session with our customers to create about six months 38 00:02:37.650 --> 00:02:40.689 worth of content. And along the same lines, you guys have been going 39 00:02:40.849 --> 00:02:46.879 through a similar shift to at least test out this idea of doing more of 40 00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:50.719 an intensive batch creation shit of content. Can you tell us a little bit 41 00:02:50.759 --> 00:02:53.960 about some of the thinking that's gone into that and then we'll get into some 42 00:02:53.080 --> 00:02:57.680 of the maybe pros and cons of this as we break it down some yeah, 43 00:02:57.759 --> 00:03:00.789 for sure. So for us, you know that the type of work 44 00:03:00.909 --> 00:03:04.870 we do for our clients and all kind of starts with strategy and figuring out, 45 00:03:04.870 --> 00:03:06.949 you know, how are we going to get this company from Point A 46 00:03:07.110 --> 00:03:12.270 to point B via marketing and a big you know, a big piece of 47 00:03:12.430 --> 00:03:16.939 this is going to be sort of leveraging the expertise and knowledge of the subject 48 00:03:16.939 --> 00:03:21.419 matter experts within these companies. Your we work with midsize manufacturers, so it's 49 00:03:21.419 --> 00:03:25.340 a lot of times it's our team talking to the engineers on our clients team, 50 00:03:25.379 --> 00:03:29.370 who are maybe then that you know, they in turn, are interfacing 51 00:03:29.409 --> 00:03:32.370 regularly with engineers, are technical people and their customers end, and so they're 52 00:03:32.370 --> 00:03:37.610 the ones who, you know, who are constantly in contact with the customer. 53 00:03:37.689 --> 00:03:40.370 They understand their problems and what those people are trying to achieve better than 54 00:03:40.370 --> 00:03:44.840 anybody, and so it's always been a part of our process to try to 55 00:03:44.919 --> 00:03:50.879 leverage that expertise of our client to train into written or video or whatever kind 56 00:03:50.879 --> 00:03:53.039 of content that's going to speak to their audience. And so what we found 57 00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:57.710 is when we start with the new client, there's always this learning period that's 58 00:03:57.789 --> 00:04:00.830 necessary. We have to sort of really understand their customer and what those people 59 00:04:00.830 --> 00:04:04.110 care about in the triggers that lead them into the buying process and the problems 60 00:04:04.150 --> 00:04:08.389 they have and everything, and it's, you know, there's this this learning 61 00:04:08.509 --> 00:04:12.180 period that happens at the beginning of a client relationship and it's just necessary for 62 00:04:12.219 --> 00:04:15.340 us to be able to do the right work and help our clients produce the 63 00:04:15.379 --> 00:04:18.939 right content but it's also not exciting for the client. Right they've gone through 64 00:04:19.019 --> 00:04:23.579 this. They they're hyped up about getting started with this new marketing campaign and 65 00:04:23.660 --> 00:04:26.170 then they have to sit here and go to this learning process and then, 66 00:04:26.610 --> 00:04:30.449 bit by bit, we're going to start interviewing the right subject matter experts on 67 00:04:30.490 --> 00:04:34.889 their teams with our journalists, doing rec research and publishing content incrementally as we 68 00:04:35.009 --> 00:04:40.040 finish it that's going to be used for inbound and outbound purposes. And I 69 00:04:40.120 --> 00:04:43.399 guess what we have found, you know, by doing this for so many 70 00:04:43.439 --> 00:04:47.720 years, is there's always this period where, you know the clients level of 71 00:04:48.079 --> 00:04:51.480 excitement. You know, it peaks like around the time they hire us and 72 00:04:51.519 --> 00:04:55.910 then all of a sudden it dips for a couple months because we're busy at 73 00:04:55.910 --> 00:05:00.230 work learning their business and interviewing their experts and starting to incrementally produce content. 74 00:05:00.310 --> 00:05:02.310 And the reality is that stuff just takes time if you're going to do it 75 00:05:02.430 --> 00:05:05.949 well. So we kind of landed on recently as we said, well, 76 00:05:06.029 --> 00:05:12.100 what if we could condense this process, have a more intensive sort of positioning 77 00:05:12.220 --> 00:05:15.379 and content strategy workshop with the client and then come back a couple weeks later 78 00:05:15.819 --> 00:05:19.180 and get all the right people who, you know, we know what content 79 00:05:19.259 --> 00:05:23.649 needs to get produced. Can Get all the right people booked on the calendar 80 00:05:23.730 --> 00:05:27.850 for the you know, a specific time of day, bringing our journalists or 81 00:05:27.850 --> 00:05:32.490 our writers, bring a videographer with us and just do this intensive knowledge extraction 82 00:05:32.689 --> 00:05:36.079 for a full day, or maybe even more if needed, capture it all, 83 00:05:36.360 --> 00:05:40.639 you know, through these interviews that are now on camera, and now 84 00:05:40.680 --> 00:05:44.759 we've got this sort of Bank of video content, but also these interviews that 85 00:05:44.839 --> 00:05:46.959 can be transcribed, that can be, you know, turned by our writers 86 00:05:47.000 --> 00:05:50.750 into written content. And now we've got that. You know, we're starting 87 00:05:50.829 --> 00:05:56.110 on day one with all this stuff we can use and inbound and outbound and 88 00:05:56.589 --> 00:05:59.629 through paid media campaigns, etc. So that's that's really the idea. I 89 00:06:00.110 --> 00:06:02.269 love it, man. I want to dig into that first topic you mentioned 90 00:06:02.310 --> 00:06:06.540 about, you know, kind of just the way the emotions of that post 91 00:06:06.579 --> 00:06:11.699 sale typically happen. You know it, whether you work for an agency or 92 00:06:11.740 --> 00:06:15.860 a BB Tech Company, it's at the moment of closed one when we're celebrating, 93 00:06:15.300 --> 00:06:18.490 you know, on slack or in the bullpen and ringing the Sales Gong 94 00:06:18.689 --> 00:06:23.329 remotely or in person, whatever the case is, but that is the moment 95 00:06:23.529 --> 00:06:28.490 where your customer has the most potential for buyers remorse because they have just you 96 00:06:28.569 --> 00:06:31.329 know, if they're the decision maker on a BB purchased, whether that's content 97 00:06:31.410 --> 00:06:35.560 marketing service, a new podcast or, you know, a new sales enablement 98 00:06:35.639 --> 00:06:40.079 software, whatever it is, they're saying, Hey, I was the flag 99 00:06:40.199 --> 00:06:44.800 bearer for this decision and said they're most susceptible then to did I make the 100 00:06:44.839 --> 00:06:47.029 right decision? And so if just by the nature of it, like you 101 00:06:47.110 --> 00:06:50.949 said, you guys are doing content planning. In our case, sometimes it's 102 00:06:50.990 --> 00:06:55.269 the launch of a new podcast, so we've tried to figure out how do 103 00:06:55.310 --> 00:06:58.110 we help people get onto a new show where we don't have to go through 104 00:06:58.149 --> 00:07:00.620 kind of all this. Well, what episode graphic do we how do we 105 00:07:00.699 --> 00:07:03.579 want that to look and what do we want the Intro to say? We 106 00:07:03.699 --> 00:07:09.540 just jump right into the content creation with the planning that goes to it. 107 00:07:10.060 --> 00:07:12.300 Tell us a little bit about, you know, kind of what you guys 108 00:07:12.379 --> 00:07:16.850 envision as far as the customer experience by jumping into more of the fun stuff 109 00:07:16.930 --> 00:07:21.009 really isn't part of this. Will get into maybe some of the efficiency gains 110 00:07:21.290 --> 00:07:25.410 in a little bit, but I think the buyers feeling about it is just 111 00:07:25.490 --> 00:07:29.250 as important as anything else. Right, totally, totally, and that's definitely 112 00:07:29.290 --> 00:07:31.439 one of the main drivers here. So we hit we do an agency book 113 00:07:31.519 --> 00:07:36.519 club every three months here and one of them one of the books we read. 114 00:07:36.800 --> 00:07:40.839 It's an optional thing. Some people participate, some don't, but one 115 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:43.680 of the books we read last year was called never lose a customer again by 116 00:07:43.759 --> 00:07:46.629 Joey Coleman. I think Logan you're familiar with that one, but lately, 117 00:07:46.709 --> 00:07:50.110 man, it's not. Yeah, I fantastic. I think that even came 118 00:07:50.189 --> 00:07:54.110 up in our conversation recently, but I know I was talking to a few 119 00:07:54.110 --> 00:07:58.149 people about it recently. But that one of the biggest insights that sort of 120 00:07:58.189 --> 00:08:01.980 popped out in our discussion around this book was that everybody just resonated, with 121 00:08:03.060 --> 00:08:07.019 our whole team, because we see it is this buyers remorse, if you 122 00:08:07.100 --> 00:08:09.779 want to call it that. But this, as I mentioned a few minutes 123 00:08:09.819 --> 00:08:13.850 ago, this this there's this big build to launching a new marketing campaign and 124 00:08:13.970 --> 00:08:16.810 starting with, in our case, in our clients cases, a new agency 125 00:08:16.970 --> 00:08:20.089 and there are high hopes about what's going to happen and and then all that 126 00:08:20.129 --> 00:08:24.649 you get into the nitty gridian and there's this period of time where that the 127 00:08:24.730 --> 00:08:26.279 clients has at Gista. I hope I made the right choice Pas and what's 128 00:08:26.279 --> 00:08:31.240 happening in the background? I haven't heard really much this week and the reality 129 00:08:31.279 --> 00:08:35.120 is we're in the background working hard and learning and starting to produce things, 130 00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:39.759 but those things are take some time produce and even when they get published. 131 00:08:39.960 --> 00:08:43.149 You know, if you think about how search engine optimization tends to play out, 132 00:08:43.190 --> 00:08:46.669 for example, just using one example, you don't it doesn't happen overnight 133 00:08:46.830 --> 00:08:52.190 like you're building authority for a website that might might have a very low domain 134 00:08:52.230 --> 00:08:56.700 authority to begin and and to build credibility for it takes time. So not 135 00:08:56.940 --> 00:09:00.980 only are you know is do things tend to be a little slow moving early 136 00:09:01.059 --> 00:09:03.019 on, but the results tend to be a little slow moving to unless you're 137 00:09:03.019 --> 00:09:07.460 sort of proactively doing some things that direct marketing or paid media that are going 138 00:09:07.460 --> 00:09:11.889 to drive some results in the shorter term. So we've kind of looked at 139 00:09:11.970 --> 00:09:15.610 the situation holistically and said, what are the things we can do to keep 140 00:09:15.730 --> 00:09:20.570 the client engaged, excited feeling that they've made the right choice and and I 141 00:09:20.690 --> 00:09:24.200 think a big piece of that is we just got to move faster and how 142 00:09:24.240 --> 00:09:30.360 can we create efficiencies right and get things published and start to do some of 143 00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:33.639 the things that are going to get to the results more quickly, because nobody 144 00:09:33.639 --> 00:09:37.320 has patients to know. They can't sit back and wait forever and some of 145 00:09:37.399 --> 00:09:39.429 it requires that. But maybe we can balance it right some things in the 146 00:09:39.470 --> 00:09:43.029 short term. So I love that. Man, I'm a big fan of 147 00:09:43.309 --> 00:09:48.149 Joey Coleman's book. There have heard him on multiple podcasts and those just add 148 00:09:48.429 --> 00:09:50.710 sometimes, you know, you hear an author on a podcast and you're like 149 00:09:50.789 --> 00:09:54.100 us and not as good as the book. He is as good if you 150 00:09:54.299 --> 00:09:58.500 hear a podcast with him as much as the book. Definitely recommend anyone who 151 00:09:58.500 --> 00:10:01.019 hasn't checked out that book check it out. Whether you're in marketing or customer 152 00:10:01.019 --> 00:10:05.419 success or sales. I guarantee you you'll pick something up from that. So 153 00:10:05.500 --> 00:10:09.210 I appreciate you share in that job. Hey, everybody logan with sweet fish 154 00:10:09.289 --> 00:10:13.409 here. You probably already know that we think you should start a podcast if 155 00:10:13.409 --> 00:10:16.970 you haven't already. But what if you have and you're asking these kinds of 156 00:10:18.009 --> 00:10:22.600 questions? How much has our podcast impacted revenue this year? How is our 157 00:10:22.639 --> 00:10:26.559 sales team actually leveraging the podcast content. If you can't answer these questions, 158 00:10:26.679 --> 00:10:31.440 you're actually not alone. This is why cast it created the very first content 159 00:10:31.600 --> 00:10:37.389 marketing platform made specifically for be tob podcasting. Now you can more easily search 160 00:10:37.750 --> 00:10:43.269 and share your audio content while getting greater visibility into the impact of your podcast. 161 00:10:43.710 --> 00:10:48.990 The marketing teams at Drift Terminus and here at sweetfish have started using casted 162 00:10:50.100 --> 00:10:52.899 to get more value out of our podcasts, and you probably can to. 163 00:10:54.539 --> 00:10:58.779 You can check out the product in action and casted dot US growth. That's 164 00:11:00.019 --> 00:11:05.450 sea steed dot US growth. All right, let's get back to the show. 165 00:11:09.970 --> 00:11:13.889 You touched on efficiency there as it relates to kind of the buyers feeling, 166 00:11:13.009 --> 00:11:16.210 but you guys have a sneaking sy fission that it's also going to make 167 00:11:16.289 --> 00:11:20.159 your team more efficient, and so I think kind of our first point there 168 00:11:20.919 --> 00:11:26.240 is probably best taken for other agency leaders to be thinking about in their creation 169 00:11:26.399 --> 00:11:28.200 of content. But in this next one, as we talk about just the 170 00:11:28.240 --> 00:11:33.750 efficiency of your own content engine, whether it's a specific campaign or just your 171 00:11:35.029 --> 00:11:39.590 your thought leadership and brand awareness content that is always like what are we doing 172 00:11:39.750 --> 00:11:43.710 on that? This quarter sort of thing can help set up a foundation that 173 00:11:43.750 --> 00:11:46.139 if things do go awry throughout the rest of the quarter or the rest of 174 00:11:46.220 --> 00:11:50.860 the half of the year, you have some things in the work sells about, 175 00:11:50.220 --> 00:11:54.019 you know, kind of whether you're on the agency side or the brand 176 00:11:54.139 --> 00:11:58.379 side, some of the things in your mind, efficiency gains that marketing teams 177 00:11:58.419 --> 00:12:01.409 could could gain by this sort of batch creation. Yeah, yeah, okay. 178 00:12:01.490 --> 00:12:05.529 So let's let's pretend you're a, you know, custom manufacturer of some 179 00:12:07.610 --> 00:12:11.129 you know, big ticket item. It's a complex product. You know there's 180 00:12:11.409 --> 00:12:16.720 multiple people on the buyers and that tend to be involved that you know it's 181 00:12:16.759 --> 00:12:20.559 a three or six month by buying process and you've got, you know, 182 00:12:20.799 --> 00:12:26.919 this this specific market market that you're targeting with it, and you know that 183 00:12:26.080 --> 00:12:28.679 this is an you know, this is something you're going to be pursuing on 184 00:12:28.720 --> 00:12:33.909 the sales front as an organization and you need to put some marketing juice behind 185 00:12:33.990 --> 00:12:37.830 it to, you know, to generate leads there and to get some activity, 186 00:12:37.269 --> 00:12:41.110 you know, happening. And so, you know, one of the 187 00:12:41.230 --> 00:12:43.820 efficiencies I think you can create is if you say, all right, we're 188 00:12:43.820 --> 00:12:48.139 targeting this type of buyer, this type of company, these are the individual 189 00:12:48.220 --> 00:12:52.779 buying process influencers at those types of companies. These are the things they care 190 00:12:52.779 --> 00:12:54.659 about, the problems they have in the questions they have. Now, who 191 00:12:54.779 --> 00:13:00.850 on yours team, who inside of your organization, is the true expert on 192 00:13:01.049 --> 00:13:03.850 that specifically, because if you think that way now, all of a sudden 193 00:13:03.889 --> 00:13:07.409 it's like, all right, well, this, this person is our expert 194 00:13:07.450 --> 00:13:11.250 on this topic or these couple of people. Let's focus all of our content 195 00:13:11.289 --> 00:13:16.240 creation efforts here on what's in their brains and let's do some intensive knowledge extraction 196 00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:22.480 with those individual people and see how much great content we can produce by just 197 00:13:22.639 --> 00:13:28.909 getting that person on your team in a room and talking about, you know, 198 00:13:28.509 --> 00:13:33.710 answering these questions they hear all the time talking about the problems and different 199 00:13:33.750 --> 00:13:37.269 ways to approach it and, you know, long term cost of ownership of 200 00:13:37.590 --> 00:13:41.149 doing something this way versus this way. And so I think when I think 201 00:13:41.190 --> 00:13:46.139 of efficiencies, it's it's as opposed to thinking of your content strategy is we're 202 00:13:46.179 --> 00:13:48.259 going to target these ten keywords and we're going to create a piece of content 203 00:13:48.299 --> 00:13:52.419 around each of them. It's where are we trying to grow our business? 204 00:13:52.940 --> 00:13:54.850 WHO's the buyer? What do they care about, and who on our team 205 00:13:54.889 --> 00:14:00.929 is the expert, and then let's produce as much really exceptional stuff from that 206 00:14:01.129 --> 00:14:03.769 person's brain as possible in a short period of time. Yeah, I love 207 00:14:03.889 --> 00:14:09.289 the idea of matching up that research on, like you said, the keywords, 208 00:14:09.370 --> 00:14:11.919 but the questions being asked. What content out there is answering those questions 209 00:14:13.039 --> 00:14:16.000 today and then going to the expert and merging those two. You know, 210 00:14:16.080 --> 00:14:20.200 one of the things we've been doing for these what we call forty eight hours 211 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:24.070 to industry influence session is doing search analysis on those keywords that are kind of 212 00:14:24.350 --> 00:14:28.629 within that theme that our customers trying to develop their thought leadership around. And 213 00:14:28.990 --> 00:14:33.669 we might propose to them twenty different topics, but then they might call those 214 00:14:33.750 --> 00:14:37.909 down two thousand and twelve. Because again, it's about that matching process, 215 00:14:37.990 --> 00:14:41.460 right. It's about like here's where we need to create content, whichever way 216 00:14:41.500 --> 00:14:45.740 you go about identifying that and then merging that with the expertise of the person 217 00:14:45.779 --> 00:14:48.539 who really has something to say about it. And there's some, some that 218 00:14:48.620 --> 00:14:52.019 gets left on the cutting room floor in our own case, but still it's 219 00:14:52.059 --> 00:14:54.529 more efficient. And the other thing I'll say too is, like you know, 220 00:14:54.649 --> 00:14:58.009 for this knowledge extraction, sometimes we have folks that are like our CEO 221 00:14:58.090 --> 00:15:01.490 would be great as the host of the podcast. And when we have done 222 00:15:01.490 --> 00:15:05.450 it kind of the the typical way of like, all right, even if 223 00:15:05.490 --> 00:15:09.000 we're booking the guests for them and they need to be available, you know, 224 00:15:09.120 --> 00:15:11.919 four times a month. We're just talking four times a month for thirty 225 00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:15.960 minutes, because they're spread out, they tend to get pushed and then okay, 226 00:15:16.000 --> 00:15:18.759 now we don't have any mean as many episodes in the queue, all 227 00:15:18.799 --> 00:15:20.470 that sort of stuff. But we found that like, Hey, we need 228 00:15:20.549 --> 00:15:24.509 your CEO for a half day session. That's actually easier to get booked and 229 00:15:24.590 --> 00:15:28.269 keep on the calendars then those for thirty minutes sections. You. Yeah, 230 00:15:28.309 --> 00:15:31.470 it's more time. Have you guys seen that with as you've started to set 231 00:15:31.509 --> 00:15:35.299 up some of these sessions with the subject matter experts at your customers? Yeah, 232 00:15:35.379 --> 00:15:41.379 absolutely, it's you know, trying to get busy people booked multiple times 233 00:15:41.580 --> 00:15:46.620 for things is just such a challenge, it really is. And then things 234 00:15:46.659 --> 00:15:50.129 get canceled. They're just's is one more thing that could get canceled and moved 235 00:15:50.210 --> 00:15:54.169 and then it slows things down and then the client wonders or they wonder what 236 00:15:54.289 --> 00:15:56.250 will lie. Why am I not getting to results as fast as as we 237 00:15:56.450 --> 00:16:00.929 talked about. Well, it's because the things we need are we need your 238 00:16:00.970 --> 00:16:03.210 team's attention. And so yeah, sometimes when you can say hey, we're 239 00:16:03.210 --> 00:16:07.600 going to be super efficient together, we're going to carve out a day and 240 00:16:07.720 --> 00:16:11.120 we're going to get all this stuff done, it's really appealing, you know, 241 00:16:11.480 --> 00:16:15.279 on the client's end as well. So yeah, I love it, 242 00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:18.789 man. So we've kind of bounced back and forth. I think benefits if 243 00:16:18.830 --> 00:16:21.950 you're an agency, if you're you're on the brand side. We talked about 244 00:16:21.950 --> 00:16:26.590 avoiding buyers remorse, especially for agencies, efficiency, which it applies to both 245 00:16:26.590 --> 00:16:30.909 signed. The third piece here probably applies a little bit more to agencies, 246 00:16:30.950 --> 00:16:36.019 but it can also apply to your marketing team and your internal subject matter experts, 247 00:16:36.019 --> 00:16:38.340 because, unless you're a MARTECH company and you're selling to fellow marketers, 248 00:16:38.659 --> 00:16:42.419 your internal subject matter experts, whether that's someone on your executive team, like 249 00:16:42.500 --> 00:16:47.490 your CEO, or it's people on your product team or engineering team, that 250 00:16:47.690 --> 00:16:52.730 relationship between them and marketing is just as important as an agency and a client. 251 00:16:52.850 --> 00:16:55.730 And that's this idea that you and I have talked about, Joe, 252 00:16:55.889 --> 00:17:00.960 that the relationship building that can happen through this kind of intensive, upfront batch 253 00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:04.839 creation of content. There can be some good things as you build trust, 254 00:17:04.920 --> 00:17:08.319 as you build the working relationship, set off on a good foot and you 255 00:17:08.480 --> 00:17:12.279 ask more of them up front, but you're not always asking and you kind 256 00:17:12.279 --> 00:17:17.029 of from there you start just giving like hey, we got this, Oh, 257 00:17:17.150 --> 00:17:18.589 this is ready, oh, check this out right. Is that kind 258 00:17:18.589 --> 00:17:23.269 of your thinking too, in the relationship between marketing, whether that's agency or 259 00:17:23.349 --> 00:17:27.430 brand, and the subject matter experts that the contributors that you need to create 260 00:17:27.549 --> 00:17:30.019 this content? Yeah, for sure. I mean yeah, if this is 261 00:17:30.059 --> 00:17:36.619 your internal marketing person talking to one of your engineers or an outside agency. 262 00:17:37.180 --> 00:17:41.779 Regardless of the situation, I think it's a fantastic you know, just sort 263 00:17:41.819 --> 00:17:47.930 of open too way dialog to be establishing and to for the subject matter experts 264 00:17:48.009 --> 00:17:53.809 to be able to understand from the very beginning why their contribution matters and why 265 00:17:55.089 --> 00:17:56.970 it's, you know, why what's in their brains is going to be critical 266 00:17:57.089 --> 00:18:00.559 to your marketing success, because you can't make this stuff up if you're trying 267 00:18:00.599 --> 00:18:06.400 to produce exceptional content. It is kind of blows my mind how many people 268 00:18:06.640 --> 00:18:11.319 are out there trying to produce content without really interviewing the experts, because it's 269 00:18:11.799 --> 00:18:15.309 what's in the brains of the engineers, or maybe the sales people are account 270 00:18:15.309 --> 00:18:18.630 manage is the people who interface with your customers and understand them so well. 271 00:18:18.670 --> 00:18:22.990 That is so important and so for for your marketing person, again, whether 272 00:18:23.069 --> 00:18:27.299 that's somebody in house or outside, consulting or agency or whatever, to just 273 00:18:27.460 --> 00:18:33.420 have to have that open dialog with your subject matter experts to help on. 274 00:18:33.579 --> 00:18:37.700 It's a really to put the spotlight on them and say hey, you're the 275 00:18:37.779 --> 00:18:41.569 expert I need. What's in your head. Is a really it really is 276 00:18:41.569 --> 00:18:44.450 a great relationship building. We have some some companies we've been working with, 277 00:18:44.569 --> 00:18:48.529 clients that have for a number of years, and it's really cool to want 278 00:18:48.569 --> 00:18:51.609 to look at, you know, the writers on our team and the relationship 279 00:18:51.650 --> 00:18:55.049 they've built with those people and that's just like friends having a conversation at this 280 00:18:55.089 --> 00:18:59.440 point when they do interviews, because they've built that rapport together. I love 281 00:18:59.519 --> 00:19:03.200 that, Joe, what you guys are doing is really kind of falling right 282 00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:07.480 in line with what we're experimenting with, what we've kind of built our processes 283 00:19:07.559 --> 00:19:11.069 around, with our forty eight hours to industry influence, doing six months worth 284 00:19:11.109 --> 00:19:15.509 of content in into immersive days. You guys are moving towards US similar model 285 00:19:15.549 --> 00:19:19.230 you mentioned. You have some clients set up right now. Jury is out 286 00:19:19.269 --> 00:19:22.829 a little bit on is it going to yield these kind of three main benefits 287 00:19:22.869 --> 00:19:26.900 we talked about today? Maybe you and I'll do a follow up episode and 288 00:19:26.299 --> 00:19:30.579 we can talk about some more that we've done. I've heard some good feedback 289 00:19:30.619 --> 00:19:33.779 from Laurie Richardson at Women Sales Pros and Chris Carolyn, who's one of our 290 00:19:33.819 --> 00:19:38.210 cohost on the manufacturing show with metal analysis group. But we'll see. This 291 00:19:38.250 --> 00:19:42.609 is a really interesting conversation. When you mentioned you guys were moving towards something 292 00:19:42.650 --> 00:19:45.529 very similar to us, I thought and we got to kind of unpack this 293 00:19:45.690 --> 00:19:49.210 in our thinking because it could probably benefits other folks. So I really appreciate 294 00:19:49.250 --> 00:19:53.480 you sharing your thoughts and experience so far. Joe. If anybody listening to 295 00:19:53.599 --> 00:19:57.079 this would like to ask some follow up questions of you or just stay connected, 296 00:19:57.119 --> 00:20:00.640 follow along with some of your great content, which I know you guys 297 00:20:00.640 --> 00:20:03.559 put out gobs of. What's the best way for them to reach out and 298 00:20:03.599 --> 00:20:07.069 stay connected? Yeah, you're welcome to email me directly. Joe At gorilla, 299 00:20:07.190 --> 00:20:11.269 seventy Sixcom, gorilla like the animal, and then seven Sixcom, and 300 00:20:12.269 --> 00:20:17.470 I would also encourage you to go to our learning center, gorilla something sixcom 301 00:20:18.069 --> 00:20:22.819 learn. We publish insights weekly. That's really just all there to try to 302 00:20:22.900 --> 00:20:26.299 help help you figure out how to grow through marketing. So I love it. 303 00:20:26.339 --> 00:20:29.339 Man Joe, thank you so much for our great conversation and a great 304 00:20:29.339 --> 00:20:30.660 episode on the show. I appreciate it. Man. Yeah, thanks having 305 00:20:30.700 --> 00:20:37.009 to Logan. I hate it when podcasts incessantly ask their listeners for reviews, 306 00:20:37.250 --> 00:20:41.890 but I get why they do it, because reviews are enormously helpful when you're 307 00:20:41.890 --> 00:20:44.769 trying to grow a podcast audience. So here's what we decided to do. 308 00:20:45.250 --> 00:20:48.849 If you leave a review for me to be growth and apple podcasts and email 309 00:20:48.890 --> 00:20:52.160 me a screenshot of the review to James at Sweet Fish Mediacom, I'll send 310 00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:56.519 you a signed copy of my new book, content based networking, how to 311 00:20:56.640 --> 00:20:59.759 instantly connect with anyone you want to know. We get a review, you 312 00:21:00.240 --> 00:21:00.880 get a free book. We both win.