1227: Why Empathy is a Key Leadership Strategy for a CMO w/ Maria Pergolino

WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.879 --> 00:00:10.710 Wouldn't it be nice to have several thought leaders in your industry know and Love 2 00:00:10.910 --> 00:00:16.149 Your brand? Start a podcast, invite your industries thought leaders to be guests 3 00:00:16.269 --> 00:00:21.350 on your show and start reaping the benefits of having a network full of industry 4 00:00:21.350 --> 00:00:29.780 influencers? Learn more at sweet phish MEDIACOM. You're listening to be tob growth, 5 00:00:30.219 --> 00:00:34.619 a daily podcast for B TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard 6 00:00:34.659 --> 00:00:38.490 before, like Gary vanner truck and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard 7 00:00:38.530 --> 00:00:42.850 from the majority of our guests. That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't 8 00:00:42.890 --> 00:00:47.409 with professional speakers and authors. Most of our guests are in the trenches leading 9 00:00:47.450 --> 00:00:52.280 sales and marketing teams. They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're 10 00:00:52.359 --> 00:00:56.880 building the fastest growing BTB companies in the world. My name is James Carberry 11 00:00:56.960 --> 00:01:00.439 on, the founder of sweet fish media, a podcast agency for bb brands, 12 00:01:00.560 --> 00:01:03.679 and I'm also one of the CO hosts of this show. When we're 13 00:01:03.719 --> 00:01:07.549 not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of 14 00:01:07.629 --> 00:01:11.269 our own business. Will share the ups and downs of our journey as we 15 00:01:11.310 --> 00:01:15.670 attempt to take over the world. Just getting well? Maybe let's get into 16 00:01:15.670 --> 00:01:25.500 the show. Hey everyone, it is Kelsey corps with sweet phish media, 17 00:01:25.659 --> 00:01:29.859 and we are so excited tore with you an episode of the marketers journey from 18 00:01:29.859 --> 00:01:34.329 our friends over at UBERFLIP. The marketers journey is a podcast dedicated to learning 19 00:01:34.370 --> 00:01:38.370 from senior marketing and executives. Each week, they speak to marketers and learn 20 00:01:38.489 --> 00:01:41.969 whether it was luck, hustle or a combination of the two which propelled them 21 00:01:42.010 --> 00:01:46.370 to their latest position. Then they explore how to engage their current and future 22 00:01:46.489 --> 00:01:51.319 customers on a path that is similarly planned yet adaptive. The marketers journey features 23 00:01:51.359 --> 00:01:56.439 amazing conversations with marketing leaders who share how to attract and convert leads, with 24 00:01:56.640 --> 00:02:00.670 personalization for their entire buyer journey. If you think you'll find the show valuable 25 00:02:00.709 --> 00:02:06.390 after you listen to this episode, just there the marketers journey and apple podcast 26 00:02:06.469 --> 00:02:10.870 or your favorite podcast player. Okay, let's get into it. Welcome to 27 00:02:10.909 --> 00:02:15.139 the marketers journey podcast. I'm ready. This week I have a guest too, 28 00:02:15.180 --> 00:02:20.900 I respect so much. It's Maria Percolino and she has had some amazing 29 00:02:20.979 --> 00:02:23.020 rules. In fact, she just accepted a role that is not even been 30 00:02:23.020 --> 00:02:27.900 announced yet, but this podcast was recorded a few weeks before it's going live. 31 00:02:28.060 --> 00:02:31.129 So she just joined a company called active campaign. Is Their CMO. 32 00:02:31.330 --> 00:02:35.770 But if you look at her resume in the pieces that she's been before, 33 00:02:35.810 --> 00:02:38.129 we've got companies like Anna plan, where she spent, you know, just 34 00:02:38.289 --> 00:02:43.689 over a year with the very specific mandate to get them through an IPO. 35 00:02:43.889 --> 00:02:49.280 Before that she had a stop as the senior VP of global marketing and sales 36 00:02:49.319 --> 00:02:53.159 development at apt as for over five years where they had huge growth. And 37 00:02:53.280 --> 00:03:00.229 of of course any marketer knows a company called Marquetto obviously that strong purple brand, 38 00:03:00.270 --> 00:03:02.789 where she led demand events operations. That's where I started to get to 39 00:03:02.909 --> 00:03:07.389 know her name early on and in her career dates back before that. She'll 40 00:03:07.430 --> 00:03:12.189 walk us through that today on the podcast. And what I really respect with 41 00:03:12.349 --> 00:03:15.900 Maria is the way she is scaled her career by, as she puts it, 42 00:03:16.060 --> 00:03:20.740 picking winners. And it's an interesting perspective because I think a lot of 43 00:03:20.939 --> 00:03:23.460 us, you know, we try and, as she put it, we 44 00:03:23.580 --> 00:03:27.409 try and find the right boss or the right opportunity for ourselves, but sometimes 45 00:03:27.409 --> 00:03:30.330 it's about finding the company where you're going to get worldly experience. You're going 46 00:03:30.330 --> 00:03:34.610 to get to see that scale. That's not always going to be the super 47 00:03:34.729 --> 00:03:38.449 early start up. Sometimes that is going with a company where you can get 48 00:03:38.490 --> 00:03:40.840 experience and you can see how they've done it right to date and where you 49 00:03:40.919 --> 00:03:44.599 can take that next, and Marie is going to tell us all about that. 50 00:03:44.639 --> 00:03:47.360 A quick little personal anecdote before we bring her in. I was so 51 00:03:47.639 --> 00:03:52.039 honored earlier this year when she called me to let me know that she had 52 00:03:52.080 --> 00:03:55.669 been passed my book by another VP of marketing, and that to me was 53 00:03:55.789 --> 00:04:00.550 just exciting that someone at Maria's level and taking the time to read the book 54 00:04:00.590 --> 00:04:03.310 had gone in from another marketer. So from someone I admire a lot, 55 00:04:03.389 --> 00:04:06.550 you're about to hear from her and a ton of great advice. Here we 56 00:04:06.629 --> 00:04:15.740 go with Maria. Welcome Maria. This is going to be fun at we 57 00:04:15.819 --> 00:04:21.259 get to explore your journey, which is truly amazing, and you you told 58 00:04:21.300 --> 00:04:26.449 me he recently that you know you picked some pretty good winners and have had 59 00:04:26.449 --> 00:04:30.810 an amazing career, but I think you're just being a little humble there. 60 00:04:30.129 --> 00:04:34.569 I think that you bring a pretty amazing recipe to these companies. Maybe you 61 00:04:34.610 --> 00:04:38.329 can just tell people what you're doing. Now. That's where we love to 62 00:04:38.370 --> 00:04:43.439 start. Like, where are you today in your professional marketing career? Yeah, 63 00:04:43.600 --> 00:04:46.680 so I have recently just joined a company, active campaign, a really 64 00:04:46.720 --> 00:04:54.189 special company. Have had tremendous growth and really trying to bring the next generation 65 00:04:54.589 --> 00:05:00.230 of customer experience marking on a nation to SMB organizations and beyond. Amazing. 66 00:05:00.430 --> 00:05:03.670 So back in the world that you love, back in a world that you 67 00:05:03.829 --> 00:05:09.300 have conquered, which is that Martech space, but back in Mortek. I 68 00:05:09.379 --> 00:05:12.500 haven't drifted far. I've only been in more tech and sales tech and I 69 00:05:12.620 --> 00:05:16.579 considerdales and marketing the same thing, those same functions. So in my head 70 00:05:16.620 --> 00:05:19.980 I haven't I haven't really gone away, but I know that it is kind 71 00:05:19.980 --> 00:05:25.050 of back to home a little amazing. So and give us to some perspective 72 00:05:25.089 --> 00:05:29.329 to the scale of active campaign. If you can't tell us revenue, that's 73 00:05:29.329 --> 00:05:33.449 okay, but maybe just team size at least, just general stage and maturity 74 00:05:33.529 --> 00:05:36.560 of that company. And you know how bigs your team going to be on 75 00:05:36.600 --> 00:05:40.279 Day One? Where do you see it getting to the next year? It's 76 00:05:40.360 --> 00:05:43.000 so funny. I've just arrived. I actually don't even know something answer that 77 00:05:43.040 --> 00:05:46.879 question, but what I do know is that they're over eightyzero customers using active 78 00:05:46.920 --> 00:05:51.829 campaign. It is a tool that is for SMB. So that number may 79 00:05:51.870 --> 00:05:56.829 sound really large to company selling to enterprise, but this company has a tremendous 80 00:05:56.829 --> 00:06:00.790 number of customers. Has had great growth and a lot of it organic, 81 00:06:00.829 --> 00:06:04.620 which is exciting, that it has been through referral and successive customers that upon 82 00:06:04.740 --> 00:06:08.620 other companies, which is kind of to your point of, like me, 83 00:06:08.779 --> 00:06:12.819 picking winners. Like I don't know about how you pick your jobs, but 84 00:06:12.939 --> 00:06:17.300 in addition to interviewing the team as they interview you, I do backdoor customer 85 00:06:17.420 --> 00:06:20.930 checks, I use the product, I went to a training class for the 86 00:06:21.050 --> 00:06:25.290 product all before I joined. I know that I'm going to you know, 87 00:06:25.290 --> 00:06:27.250 I don't want to feel like a used car sales when I want to be 88 00:06:27.250 --> 00:06:30.689 standing in front of a great company and proud to represent that, and that 89 00:06:30.810 --> 00:06:33.600 is definitely the case here at active campaign. Amazing. Well, listen I 90 00:06:34.040 --> 00:06:38.240 again. You keep saying that you pick winners, but I can tell you, 91 00:06:38.360 --> 00:06:41.079 being on the flip side, getting to hire the exact team at my 92 00:06:41.279 --> 00:06:45.399 company, my mindset is I want to pick winners too. So let's kind 93 00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:48.149 of back up and UNPACK. How how you got to a point in your 94 00:06:48.189 --> 00:06:54.029 career that the company with Eightyzero and customers wants to hire you to be their 95 00:06:54.069 --> 00:06:57.110 CMO, because I think that's what a lot of our listeners are trying to 96 00:06:57.149 --> 00:07:00.949 figure out is how did they how did they accelerate their career so that they're 97 00:07:00.990 --> 00:07:03.939 in that position? So let's take me back, even just we always do 98 00:07:04.100 --> 00:07:06.819 this for fun. Help me understand. What did you go to school for, 99 00:07:08.100 --> 00:07:12.500 even like was was marketing always a dream? I think I'm rare in 100 00:07:12.699 --> 00:07:15.170 this answer. Maybe you tell me, but yeah, I did my Grad 101 00:07:15.290 --> 00:07:19.329 and Undergrad and marketing. I want a marketing competition in high school, and 102 00:07:20.050 --> 00:07:24.329 it was my path and it has been my passion. I'm very fortunate that 103 00:07:24.449 --> 00:07:29.689 I found what I was going to love and I what I chose to do. 104 00:07:29.930 --> 00:07:31.800 I made what I love to right. Like, I think we own 105 00:07:31.839 --> 00:07:35.920 a little bit of deciding how much we enjoy what we do, and I 106 00:07:35.959 --> 00:07:40.959 choose to love every bit of it. Nice See, I saw the you 107 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:45.509 went to the same school for both Undergrad and Grad. Did your MBA and 108 00:07:45.629 --> 00:07:47.670 wreckers and and it's funny, I did the same as you. I did 109 00:07:47.790 --> 00:07:51.750 marketing and Undergrad and marketing in my MBA. The funny part for me is 110 00:07:53.110 --> 00:07:57.350 I tried to take finance courses and like a weekend I was like screw this, 111 00:07:57.829 --> 00:08:01.259 I'm going back, I'm doing more marketing courses because it's what I love. 112 00:08:01.379 --> 00:08:05.500 So it's great that you're that you continue that passion. Just curious, 113 00:08:05.540 --> 00:08:09.459 though, any bird courses that you took that you would have squeezed one more 114 00:08:09.540 --> 00:08:13.569 in of. And it's funny, I probably would say finance. I definitely 115 00:08:13.610 --> 00:08:20.250 am a marketer that that wants to understand the entire business and I believe that 116 00:08:20.009 --> 00:08:24.129 can. I talk a lot about how it's crazy the idea of sales and 117 00:08:24.250 --> 00:08:28.720 marketing alignment issues, since we're teams that are going to the exact same place, 118 00:08:28.920 --> 00:08:33.159 but I think I think a lot about marketing and finance alignman right, 119 00:08:33.240 --> 00:08:37.120 this is marketing as an investment and working with the team that makes investments is 120 00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:41.990 really, really important, and so I definitely focused on finance. The only 121 00:08:41.149 --> 00:08:45.629 dip out of marketing I did my entire career was a stint for about a 122 00:08:45.669 --> 00:08:50.870 year and a half as a financial analyst for a multinational organization and and I 123 00:08:50.029 --> 00:08:54.870 think that's still proves value to me today. It's it was a good stuff. 124 00:08:54.470 --> 00:08:58.820 Gotcha. Yeah, it's interesting. I was looking at essentially your resume, 125 00:08:58.940 --> 00:09:03.100 which I love to do for these these podcast because we're looking at people's 126 00:09:03.139 --> 00:09:07.059 marketing journey and their career, and I saw that recently in two thousand and 127 00:09:07.059 --> 00:09:11.049 seventeen you actually went back to school to Stanford and did a certificate in finance 128 00:09:11.129 --> 00:09:16.970 and accounting for the non financial executive. So I I know you had a 129 00:09:16.090 --> 00:09:20.929 big role. We're fast forwarding a bit to your time just before this at 130 00:09:20.970 --> 00:09:24.399 and a plane where they went public. Is that a big reason and and 131 00:09:24.600 --> 00:09:30.679 maybe you can speak to the need for that next level of financial understanding as 132 00:09:30.720 --> 00:09:33.639 a marketing leader? Yeah, and again I think, as I've grown in 133 00:09:33.720 --> 00:09:37.590 my career, I think the CMO roll is a role not about managing a 134 00:09:37.669 --> 00:09:41.230 marketing team. The reality is the marketers come to work to do great marketing 135 00:09:41.269 --> 00:09:48.669 every day and marketings a roll discipline that you have lots of functionally specific excellence. 136 00:09:48.750 --> 00:09:50.909 There's somebody on the team that does social and somebody who does every day. 137 00:09:52.029 --> 00:09:54.940 You know that things about email and so I'm not going to tell that 138 00:09:54.059 --> 00:09:58.139 person how to do email better. They're coming to bring email right and so 139 00:09:58.779 --> 00:10:03.019 what I think about the DMO role? It's a role to help coordinate across 140 00:10:03.059 --> 00:10:07.289 that team, but to also coordinate with other functions and I think really taking 141 00:10:07.330 --> 00:10:13.370 seriously the human part of that, which is aligning well to the HR team, 142 00:10:13.570 --> 00:10:16.330 that finance part, and aligning well to finance, the sales part, 143 00:10:16.409 --> 00:10:20.690 obviously, and then very seriously, like you know, I want to know 144 00:10:20.809 --> 00:10:24.159 the product from it. I want to be a best case example and and 145 00:10:24.279 --> 00:10:26.399 so I really think that sea level role is a role that is even though 146 00:10:26.440 --> 00:10:30.840 it's aligned to a discipline, it's one that you have to be responsible for 147 00:10:30.879 --> 00:10:33.879 all of the roles. There days that I put on a customer and customer 148 00:10:33.919 --> 00:10:37.429 success had and my I'm with customers all day because that's the right thing for 149 00:10:37.509 --> 00:10:39.870 the business and I think the CEO should be able to call on the C 150 00:10:41.029 --> 00:10:46.110 speet for that. I also think it's preparation for beyond that. When I 151 00:10:46.190 --> 00:10:50.179 took that class it was not for Aniplan, but it was to prepare myself 152 00:10:50.179 --> 00:10:52.460 in case I wanted to take a CEO role and to prepare for four roles. 153 00:10:52.539 --> 00:10:56.019 And I would challenge that anybody that can make it into that marketing chair. 154 00:10:56.620 --> 00:10:58.820 That is the best chair to sit in if you want to take a 155 00:10:58.940 --> 00:11:03.139 CEO role. It is the role in the organization that know that. It's 156 00:11:03.220 --> 00:11:07.649 the beauty of a CMO role is you have to understand all the other roles 157 00:11:07.809 --> 00:11:11.610 to share of the beautiful things that are happening in a company outside of the 158 00:11:11.649 --> 00:11:15.169 company. That's the whole role. You're telling everybody why they should they should 159 00:11:15.210 --> 00:11:18.960 know and care about an organization, and so if you do have to know 160 00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:22.000 about all parts of the business to do that, that's a great chair to 161 00:11:22.080 --> 00:11:24.840 be into. Then move into that CEO role, and so there was definitely 162 00:11:24.960 --> 00:11:28.879 some thoughts to that when I was taking that that class. I love that 163 00:11:30.039 --> 00:11:33.389 and you know, it's interesting the way you put that in terms of being 164 00:11:33.429 --> 00:11:35.909 able to work with all those different departments. Some someone once put it to 165 00:11:35.990 --> 00:11:39.870 me in a very right way, which is you is CMO. You often 166 00:11:39.950 --> 00:11:43.750 think, as you said, that are your team. Is the rest of 167 00:11:43.750 --> 00:11:46.460 the marketers? Right, they are your team, they're reporting to you and 168 00:11:46.620 --> 00:11:52.179 whatnot, but the reality is the other team you're part of is the executive 169 00:11:52.220 --> 00:11:56.779 team. They're just as much your team as your marketing team. And I 170 00:11:56.980 --> 00:12:01.330 think taking some of those extra stops or education along the way or even opportunities 171 00:12:01.370 --> 00:12:05.730 were some marketers may sway outside of marketing into other roles. To better understand 172 00:12:05.769 --> 00:12:11.730 them allows you to better sympathize, empathize and just work collaboratively with those groups. 173 00:12:11.769 --> 00:12:15.570 So couldn't agree anymore on there. I want to go back though. 174 00:12:16.080 --> 00:12:20.759 A few minutes ago you had looted to not wanting to get in the way 175 00:12:20.200 --> 00:12:24.000 of that email marketer, like they know how to send the email better than 176 00:12:24.080 --> 00:12:28.279 you probably at this point. Yeah, but but you know, one of 177 00:12:28.279 --> 00:12:31.110 the things I think I respect when I look at what you've done in your 178 00:12:31.149 --> 00:12:35.110 careers. You've been in some of those seats. You've had to get your 179 00:12:35.149 --> 00:12:37.389 hands dirty, and I'm wondering if you can maybe speak to one of the 180 00:12:37.509 --> 00:12:43.470 stops along the way where you got to do some of the nitty gritty marketing 181 00:12:43.669 --> 00:12:46.659 work. That sets you up now to be able to trust your team but 182 00:12:46.700 --> 00:12:50.980 also know whether they're cutting it or not. Yeah, and I do think 183 00:12:52.139 --> 00:12:54.820 right down you think about executives and what their strengths are. You know, 184 00:12:54.980 --> 00:12:58.730 do you like your CMO or not? I think one of the things my 185 00:12:58.889 --> 00:13:01.970 team would say is they have they appreciate that I've been in the chair and 186 00:13:01.129 --> 00:13:05.289 have been in lots of different roles and I think it's important an understanding, 187 00:13:07.090 --> 00:13:09.809 you know, the capacity of the team, helping priorities for the team. 188 00:13:09.330 --> 00:13:13.559 I just told a marketer today a story when I was it was before I 189 00:13:13.639 --> 00:13:16.759 went to Marquetto, but we were using Marquetto. I was trying to learn 190 00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:20.679 the tool and and I was trying to send an email and I didn't know 191 00:13:20.759 --> 00:13:24.320 how to do something and so was taking me, you know, the whole 192 00:13:24.320 --> 00:13:26.750 afternoon and my ceo came to me and said, Hey, I send a 193 00:13:26.789 --> 00:13:30.950 hundred emails a day. Why can't you send one? And and it was 194 00:13:30.950 --> 00:13:33.870 a bad it was a low point for me. But the realien is he 195 00:13:33.909 --> 00:13:37.389 didn't understand that I was trying to make sure that we didn't email anybody that 196 00:13:37.429 --> 00:13:41.539 we weren't supposed to and that we were really thinking about doing a customer first 197 00:13:41.580 --> 00:13:46.379 communication. And and I think it is useful to have to understand what the 198 00:13:46.460 --> 00:13:50.539 marketers days like because it may not be as easy as it may appear. 199 00:13:50.379 --> 00:13:56.450 So I do think those stops matter and I think one of the things that 200 00:13:56.129 --> 00:14:00.409 you know, when I started in marketing it wasn't organized with there. We 201 00:14:00.490 --> 00:14:05.690 weren't thinking about demand and growth and performance marketing. I essentially started in what 202 00:14:05.809 --> 00:14:11.039 you would combine as field marketing and product marketing. I was the soul marketer 203 00:14:11.519 --> 00:14:16.960 in a three hundred million dollar business unit for Chemical Company, and so you're 204 00:14:16.039 --> 00:14:20.840 working on helping their field activations, but you're also helping for together the pricing. 205 00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:24.230 You're looking at the market that opportunity and if marketers can find this type 206 00:14:24.269 --> 00:14:28.509 of opportunity, I think it really helped shape my career. I was reporting 207 00:14:28.509 --> 00:14:31.870 in right to that group president, who reported to the CEE know, of 208 00:14:31.950 --> 00:14:39.100 a massive organization, and that meant because I was the sole marketer, even 209 00:14:39.139 --> 00:14:41.620 though I was more junior than some of the other leaders in the team, 210 00:14:41.659 --> 00:14:46.299 I got invited to the meetings and I got to see how the entire business 211 00:14:46.419 --> 00:14:52.059 was running and I still today pull on some of the examples from that fifteen 212 00:14:52.299 --> 00:14:56.169 plus years ago. You see, is hard situation. In that case there's 213 00:14:56.169 --> 00:15:00.090 a plant that had a challenge, it had an incident and how the team 214 00:15:00.129 --> 00:15:05.129 responded. That was crisis communications in a way that I I am so excited 215 00:15:05.210 --> 00:15:07.480 that I had that view because I could empathize across the entire business, and 216 00:15:07.639 --> 00:15:11.960 so I do think to have a seat at the table. You have to 217 00:15:11.840 --> 00:15:16.039 get into that table and if you can find that place, I would encourage 218 00:15:16.039 --> 00:15:18.720 a marketer to try to get there. That's that's great advice. And Yeah, 219 00:15:18.720 --> 00:15:22.990 I also had the good fortune of a great first job that gave me 220 00:15:24.029 --> 00:15:28.470 a lot of perspective, you know. One last question on this segment of 221 00:15:28.549 --> 00:15:31.309 the podcast that you know again this is about thinking about how did you get 222 00:15:31.309 --> 00:15:35.629 where you are today? So you're the CMO of this large organization before that 223 00:15:35.710 --> 00:15:39.940 year, the cm of a company that went public. Making that jump from 224 00:15:39.940 --> 00:15:45.220 a director level or leadership level in the organization to being part of that sea 225 00:15:45.299 --> 00:15:48.620 suite. That's that's a big jump that not every marketer gets to make. 226 00:15:48.179 --> 00:15:52.129 What would you say was the key for you? I mean being at Marquetto 227 00:15:52.250 --> 00:15:56.529 in the ride they had can't have hurt, you know, and in terms 228 00:15:56.570 --> 00:16:00.730 of, you know, having that associated with you or experiences. But what 229 00:16:00.850 --> 00:16:04.279 would you say was the key thing that you did where you took an initiative 230 00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:07.000 where someone can sit there and say that's that's what I've got to do to 231 00:16:07.080 --> 00:16:11.159 jump into that opportunity? I think I'd love to say two things here. 232 00:16:11.320 --> 00:16:15.960 One is I I think the first thing we learn in a marketing degree is 233 00:16:15.120 --> 00:16:21.350 how to size a market and to understand the total addressable market and how to 234 00:16:21.389 --> 00:16:26.669 differentiate within it. You Mark Basic Marketing position in sizing and and I do 235 00:16:26.870 --> 00:16:30.549 think it matters to there's a lot of people maybe watching this podcast, but 236 00:16:30.789 --> 00:16:33.179 they go to work every day and it does not matter how good their marketing 237 00:16:33.259 --> 00:16:37.299 is. They could do the best marketing in the world and it's not going 238 00:16:37.340 --> 00:16:40.740 to make the market there in bigger right, somebody right now is setting marketing 239 00:16:40.779 --> 00:16:44.899 a DVD player and that's that. Markets not coming back. Right, so 240 00:16:45.259 --> 00:16:48.769 they say. Believe is the first year we're records out sold CDs. So 241 00:16:48.250 --> 00:16:52.769 so sometimes with bold again becomes new. But you have to choose your company 242 00:16:52.769 --> 00:16:56.610 as well, and it's not that some of that's on culture. I listen 243 00:16:56.649 --> 00:17:00.440 to people to say every day they choose a company by their boss and I 244 00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:04.839 think that that's maybe the wrong choice. You know, sometimes being the critical 245 00:17:04.880 --> 00:17:10.240 person because the boss isn't that great is a real opportunity, and so I 246 00:17:10.319 --> 00:17:12.319 would encourage people to think about that maybe a little bit differently. That has 247 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:17.829 served me really well. I would also say some of the high points of 248 00:17:17.910 --> 00:17:22.230 my career also the low points and it's tricky. You know. There's moments 249 00:17:22.269 --> 00:17:25.069 where I've had to be a little bit demanding and I've had to be aggressive 250 00:17:25.109 --> 00:17:27.150 and I've had to say no, I'm not going to do that work without 251 00:17:27.230 --> 00:17:33.059 this roll or I'm not going to and I don't know that I've always balanced 252 00:17:33.099 --> 00:17:36.460 that the best. Honestly, it's been a fight. It's I think for 253 00:17:36.539 --> 00:17:41.059 anybody. It's a fight to move up and to have a voice and sometimes 254 00:17:41.099 --> 00:17:45.009 you make missteps with that. And what I've relied on through that. I 255 00:17:45.170 --> 00:17:48.849 think at the end of the day, I've really treated my discipline like I 256 00:17:49.130 --> 00:17:55.769 hope a surgeon treats theirs. I study it, I listen to podcasts. 257 00:17:55.849 --> 00:18:00.000 I mean there's not a week that goes by that doesn't I'm curious about my 258 00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:02.960 field. I try to stay on top of it and ultimately, I hope, 259 00:18:03.039 --> 00:18:04.759 the good marketing work I can do. And then, paired with that, 260 00:18:06.119 --> 00:18:07.799 I've started to treat leadership that way. You know, over the last, 261 00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:11.079 you know, five seven years, where I study it, I talked 262 00:18:11.079 --> 00:18:15.069 to other people, I'm okay to say, Hey, I don't know how 263 00:18:15.109 --> 00:18:18.509 to do this. Well, how you know, I pair with HR feared 264 00:18:18.549 --> 00:18:21.549 active campaign. We have an amazing HR leader. You know how how can 265 00:18:21.589 --> 00:18:26.029 I leverage her to help me? And studying that craft and just trying to 266 00:18:26.069 --> 00:18:27.900 be better has helped. You know, when I get into tough places or 267 00:18:27.940 --> 00:18:32.660 I make the wrong move, ultimately the zeos hopefully saying, you know what, 268 00:18:32.940 --> 00:18:34.779 that could have been done differently, but we think she's going to bring 269 00:18:34.779 --> 00:18:38.779 us good value and I think that that that really matters. I love that. 270 00:18:38.900 --> 00:18:44.009 I think that demonstrates a combination is is he hid in there on being 271 00:18:44.130 --> 00:18:48.049 tough at the right times and also being very open at the right time to 272 00:18:48.089 --> 00:18:52.809 leverage those around you and help them and get help and return. So so 273 00:18:53.089 --> 00:18:57.720 only really I haven't done it perfectly and but you know, you don't have 274 00:18:57.799 --> 00:19:00.759 to do it perfectly. You can. You get to have more than one 275 00:19:00.799 --> 00:19:04.680 job in your career and you get to have different managers and and I'm going 276 00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:08.000 to jump in and say one other thing that I would recommend. We talk 277 00:19:08.079 --> 00:19:15.509 a lot about mentorship and having good mentors. I would strongly recommend to people 278 00:19:15.230 --> 00:19:18.910 that instead of mentors, they think about sponsors, somebody who they can hold 279 00:19:18.910 --> 00:19:23.500 accountable for helping them. So instead of saying to let's say a manager, 280 00:19:25.420 --> 00:19:27.220 Hey, can you mentor me say hey, if I do this work, 281 00:19:27.259 --> 00:19:30.660 if I achieve this goal, will you commit to helping me get to the 282 00:19:30.740 --> 00:19:34.779 next level? And even if it's not here, somewhere else like that's creating 283 00:19:34.819 --> 00:19:40.609 ownership for your success with other people calling people up and saying, Hey, 284 00:19:40.930 --> 00:19:42.569 you know, when your company has this type of opportunity to right for me, 285 00:19:42.730 --> 00:19:47.609 will you promised to give me a call? And people remember their commitments. 286 00:19:47.650 --> 00:19:49.650 It's not about liking or not liking your mentory, not, it's like 287 00:19:49.769 --> 00:19:52.240 when I say I'm going to do something, I'm going to do it right, 288 00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:56.960 and so getting that sponsorship where somebody says yeah, I will help you 289 00:19:56.240 --> 00:20:02.119 can be career changing and I would really encourage people to frame their questions maybe 290 00:20:02.160 --> 00:20:04.200 a little bit differently and make true asks. Absolutely. You know what, 291 00:20:04.240 --> 00:20:07.630 I love that and I'm I'm going to give you credit for not just saying 292 00:20:07.670 --> 00:20:11.630 that but being someone who exhibits that, because you know, recently I was 293 00:20:11.750 --> 00:20:15.190 looking for VPA marketing and you may or may not recall this, because I'm 294 00:20:15.190 --> 00:20:18.269 sure you did a lot, but you had a list of people who, 295 00:20:18.430 --> 00:20:22.259 I guess you are sponsoring or you're representing, and you're like these are the 296 00:20:22.380 --> 00:20:26.339 great people. You should chat with Randy, and to me, I I 297 00:20:26.619 --> 00:20:30.900 it carried so much weight, I carried so much respect for your references from 298 00:20:30.940 --> 00:20:36.089 that perspective and I think more people need those those people, and a big 299 00:20:36.170 --> 00:20:38.849 part of that comes down to the network you surround yourself with. So you 300 00:20:38.930 --> 00:20:42.450 know, I guess that's another key takeaway for people tuning in here is you 301 00:20:42.529 --> 00:20:47.410 got to get to know marketers inside the business here end and outside the business 302 00:20:47.450 --> 00:20:49.200 you're in current and I think you're right. And it's easier for me to 303 00:20:49.319 --> 00:20:52.319 sit down and do an hour mentor or somebody. How many people can I 304 00:20:52.359 --> 00:20:56.759 do that for? But I keep a list of all times of marketers that 305 00:20:56.880 --> 00:21:00.880 I know, that I think or that are considering other opportunities, and it 306 00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:03.119 takes me five, five minutes, three minutes to send to somebody, hey 307 00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:07.349 you should talk to that person, and even if that opportunity doesn't work out, 308 00:21:07.789 --> 00:21:11.950 it's now created a new network for people, and so it's like creates 309 00:21:11.990 --> 00:21:15.470 more connections and now somebody else is mentoring them because on that call you're saying, 310 00:21:15.509 --> 00:21:17.430 Hey, maybe you're not right for this role, but have you tried 311 00:21:17.470 --> 00:21:18.700 this? And if you tried this, and so I think it's I think 312 00:21:18.740 --> 00:21:23.019 I would if it's a leader on the call listening to those podcast I would 313 00:21:23.019 --> 00:21:27.019 suggest, Yay, keep that list and pass that forward. It also is 314 00:21:27.019 --> 00:21:30.579 nice because sometimes we will call and say, Hey, do you know somebody 315 00:21:30.579 --> 00:21:33.890 for this, and then I'm going late. I'm like that. So it's 316 00:21:33.970 --> 00:21:37.250 a that's a nice that's something that's that's been a good like, not trick, 317 00:21:37.450 --> 00:21:40.609 but I guess you know hack or whatever you want to call it, 318 00:21:40.690 --> 00:21:45.170 that's worked really well. Amazing, boomerie. We're not going to get rid 319 00:21:45.170 --> 00:21:47.240 of you, quite yeah, but we are going to take a bit of 320 00:21:47.279 --> 00:21:48.440 a break here. We're going to come back. We're going to to shift 321 00:21:48.839 --> 00:21:53.920 from talking about your personal journey to the journey of now eightyzero customers that you 322 00:21:55.079 --> 00:21:57.240 need to focus on and how you think about that coming in in your first 323 00:21:57.279 --> 00:22:02.789 couple weeks. Will be right back here on the marketers journey. Want to 324 00:22:02.869 --> 00:22:08.069 create high converting experiences for your demand, strategies that accelerate pipeline and drive revenue. 325 00:22:08.549 --> 00:22:12.710 Look no further than our presenting sponsor, Uberflip, named a leader in 326 00:22:12.829 --> 00:22:18.819 content experience by GTWO and a leader in content activation by forester boberflip will help 327 00:22:18.859 --> 00:22:25.779 you accelerate every buyer journey by creating bingeable experiences that will allow your prospects to 328 00:22:25.859 --> 00:22:32.089 consume more content faster. Companies like Trimble, Wiley and STANTEC are using uberflip 329 00:22:32.289 --> 00:22:36.369 to power their go to market strategies, and we created one just for you. 330 00:22:37.009 --> 00:22:41.450 Head to uberflipcom journey to see how UBERFLIP can help you leverage the power 331 00:22:41.809 --> 00:22:48.200 of personalized content experiences to drive demand. All right, Marias, so we 332 00:22:48.279 --> 00:22:52.599 could talk about your career for hours, because it's truly interesting. In some 333 00:22:52.680 --> 00:22:57.400 of the places you've been are really amazing. Amazing how much more ahead you 334 00:22:57.519 --> 00:23:02.789 probably have, but you know, you're probably at the stage of your career 335 00:23:02.950 --> 00:23:07.069 where you've obviously got the playbook, but you've got an approach that people hire 336 00:23:07.150 --> 00:23:12.019 you for, and the thing that I think a lot of CEOS are trying 337 00:23:12.059 --> 00:23:15.660 to figure out out these days is how do I create a better or customer 338 00:23:15.740 --> 00:23:21.220 experience, how do I created a better journey? And I'm wondering what your 339 00:23:21.259 --> 00:23:26.259 approach is and how you'll be rallying this new team at active campaign in the 340 00:23:26.339 --> 00:23:29.329 coming weeks. Yeah, I think it's interesting. If we were to go 341 00:23:29.690 --> 00:23:32.769 I love I know everybody loves. They are paid tools. I like a 342 00:23:32.849 --> 00:23:34.609 couple of free ones, and one would be google trends. I look at 343 00:23:34.650 --> 00:23:37.890 every every company, everything that I hear, I go and look how it's 344 00:23:37.930 --> 00:23:41.839 doing in Google friends. I compare things, but becomes a little addictive if 345 00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:45.000 you don't check it out regularly. And if you were to put the phrase 346 00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:51.240 customer success into Google Trends, they did this recently. The phrase itself has 347 00:23:51.279 --> 00:23:56.190 had a dramatic rise. I would argue it is the biggest jargon phrase that 348 00:23:56.309 --> 00:23:59.710 there is, like, of course we want to keep customers. It is 349 00:23:59.829 --> 00:24:04.029 the purpose of any business, and so I think my first thing is trying 350 00:24:04.109 --> 00:24:08.630 to think about what is customer success really mean to the company? And it 351 00:24:08.710 --> 00:24:14.740 does not mean perfect in every company. There's a different bar when I call 352 00:24:14.980 --> 00:24:18.700 for some of the food delivery services that I've maybe had some challenge with later 353 00:24:18.740 --> 00:24:22.819 lately, I call and they'll say, Hey, I can give you a 354 00:24:22.900 --> 00:24:25.289 five dollar credit and I say what can I talk to a manager and they 355 00:24:25.289 --> 00:24:27.490 say well, I am the manager, there's nothing you can do and they're 356 00:24:27.609 --> 00:24:32.089 satisfied with that outcome. That's customer success. They made me kind of happy. 357 00:24:32.170 --> 00:24:34.890 I'm going to return because maybe that's my all option and they gave me 358 00:24:34.970 --> 00:24:38.319 that five dollar credit. Somebody answered the phone and that's customer success for them. 359 00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:44.279 The company I'm at now, that would not be acceptable and ultimately the 360 00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:47.440 one of the reason I join here. I thought was amazing. I listened. 361 00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:52.359 Here's a little tip if you're considering jobs, for any opportunity I considered, 362 00:24:52.519 --> 00:24:56.869 I listened to a podcast or anything I could find by the CEO and 363 00:24:56.950 --> 00:24:59.750 if I could, I listened to one that, like, was a year 364 00:24:59.789 --> 00:25:03.309 or two ago and one that was recently to see what they still said the 365 00:25:03.349 --> 00:25:07.819 same and what has evolved. It gives you such power and an interview because 366 00:25:07.819 --> 00:25:11.380 you could speak to the things they're talking about. So that was my tip. 367 00:25:11.500 --> 00:25:15.180 But one of the things that the CEO here, Jason, an amazing 368 00:25:15.259 --> 00:25:18.059 marketer and in addition to being an amazing leader, set is every single you 369 00:25:18.140 --> 00:25:22.970 know again I mentioned over eighty thousand customers, every single customer that has an 370 00:25:23.089 --> 00:25:27.329 issue or that steps away. He reads the details of that. He's obsessed 371 00:25:27.369 --> 00:25:30.569 by it, and that was really meaning for me that I was one. 372 00:25:30.609 --> 00:25:33.089 I realized that I'm just going to have to start every day doing the same 373 00:25:33.130 --> 00:25:37.039 thing so that when he said any email saying why did the customers say this? 374 00:25:37.160 --> 00:25:40.480 That I already knew about it. So I had to decide for myself. 375 00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:42.519 Is that the executive I wanted to be? was I willing to do 376 00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:45.119 that reading? Because of not he and I weren't going to be aligned, 377 00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:49.470 but I saw the type of customer service he wanted to do that ultimately the 378 00:25:49.589 --> 00:25:52.950 CEEO was going to see this and and I liked that part. And so 379 00:25:53.029 --> 00:25:56.869 I think the first tip would be just understanding. What does customer success really 380 00:25:56.950 --> 00:26:00.390 mean in the company? And I know that it does. We think it 381 00:26:00.509 --> 00:26:03.069 means everybody happy all the time, but I know in every company that's how 382 00:26:03.109 --> 00:26:07.700 the cage you had to figure out what the tolerance is, what the important 383 00:26:07.740 --> 00:26:11.779 parts of the business are. So here in any company, there's there's customers 384 00:26:11.819 --> 00:26:15.140 you have that are less desirable, that maybe aren't profitable for you, that 385 00:26:15.220 --> 00:26:18.690 are maybe using the product in a way that is an intended or that you 386 00:26:18.809 --> 00:26:22.009 don't want to be used that way because maybe it's for you know, something 387 00:26:22.089 --> 00:26:26.569 illegal, something inappropriate, and understanding what that tolerance is, I think, 388 00:26:26.609 --> 00:26:30.289 would be the first thing, before thinking about how big is the team? 389 00:26:30.329 --> 00:26:32.650 What's the budget? Was the structure. What are you really trying to do 390 00:26:32.849 --> 00:26:36.319 as a company? And that all ends with the customer. I know that's 391 00:26:36.359 --> 00:26:41.359 not the perfect answer. I like these five steps that I think every company's 392 00:26:41.359 --> 00:26:42.960 different. I think you have to be careful that it doesn't end up a 393 00:26:42.960 --> 00:26:48.269 buzzword. Now I think that's great advice, and especially a company you know 394 00:26:48.470 --> 00:26:51.470 like yours. I you know active campaign. You told me he's been around 395 00:26:51.509 --> 00:26:53.990 for fifteen years. I believe, I'm sure, a huge evolution of those 396 00:26:55.029 --> 00:26:59.589 customers and which are the customers that you can best support today. We went 397 00:26:59.670 --> 00:27:03.180 through this recently a Duber flip and I'll give a shed out to a whim 398 00:27:03.220 --> 00:27:06.859 and the KIA poom who we brought on. Key's great if you're ever looking 399 00:27:06.900 --> 00:27:11.140 for someone to kind of her framework is about the desired path of a customer 400 00:27:11.500 --> 00:27:15.380 and you know, we thought at first it was this customer success exercise, 401 00:27:15.890 --> 00:27:18.809 but she created what we called the tiger team, and the tiger team is 402 00:27:18.890 --> 00:27:22.970 made up of members of the success or but also members of the marketing organ 403 00:27:23.049 --> 00:27:27.609 the sales or and even the finance and operations are to all align on like, 404 00:27:27.769 --> 00:27:32.160 what is that path that we want to create? So I you know, 405 00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:34.599 I love that first bit of advice you gave, which is really about 406 00:27:34.640 --> 00:27:38.839 listening. I'm wondering, other than listening, how what are you doing to 407 00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:45.470 basically manage that journey that someone takes? You know, how are you prescribing 408 00:27:45.549 --> 00:27:48.309 it? And you know you got to know this questions coming from me, 409 00:27:48.470 --> 00:27:52.470 but is content a big part of that for you? Yeah, and so 410 00:27:52.910 --> 00:27:56.190 I think the way that one you get to this is it is not customer 411 00:27:56.230 --> 00:28:00.660 journeys, even though marketing now very much touches that. It is something that's 412 00:28:00.700 --> 00:28:04.220 the entire executive team and should be done as an ex an exercise across the 413 00:28:04.299 --> 00:28:07.859 executive team and it's done in different ways. Sometimes it's informal, it's just, 414 00:28:08.299 --> 00:28:15.490 you know from conversation known and sometimes it's well documented. An amazing woman, 415 00:28:15.009 --> 00:28:19.289 not myself, who at my last company out a plan had one at 416 00:28:19.369 --> 00:28:25.130 the a serious decisions award because of how well she documented it with her team, 417 00:28:25.210 --> 00:28:29.200 her customer experience team, and I thought that was amazing. I think 418 00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:33.960 the first thing to note when you think about customers and marketing, we think 419 00:28:34.039 --> 00:28:37.400 so much, I mentioned this before, about sales and marketing. When I 420 00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:41.549 think about sales and marketing, sales is often when you have direct sales, 421 00:28:41.589 --> 00:28:45.950 when it's a Bob situation, direct sales is the frontline, it's the one 422 00:28:47.069 --> 00:28:51.150 to one, but marketing is the one too many. And that maybe one 423 00:28:51.269 --> 00:28:53.230 too few when we're talking about enterprise sales and ABM, and it may be 424 00:28:55.150 --> 00:28:59.220 one two millions if you're talking about Brandon early on, and you can decide 425 00:28:59.220 --> 00:29:03.339 what's right. When I think about marketing and customers, to me it is 426 00:29:03.460 --> 00:29:07.779 often very similar where marketing is that one too many and a CS team or 427 00:29:07.859 --> 00:29:12.410 telemarketing team or support team, however it's organized in your industry, is that 428 00:29:14.170 --> 00:29:18.609 one to one. And so I think mapping that out and really understanding what 429 00:29:18.769 --> 00:29:22.890 marketings role is is a part of that. And Building Agreement there is the 430 00:29:22.009 --> 00:29:26.599 first thing I found out here. Some of like what I would normally see 431 00:29:26.640 --> 00:29:32.480 in a customer marketing function sits in another organization here and it's really effective. 432 00:29:32.599 --> 00:29:36.519 And so don't go in with a playbook that is just this is what you 433 00:29:36.640 --> 00:29:41.269 do. Understand what you need to achieve as a company and then see where 434 00:29:41.269 --> 00:29:44.910 there's gaps and then build the team to those gaps. We're going to find 435 00:29:44.950 --> 00:29:47.950 as you're joining an organization is you're not going to create as much friction by 436 00:29:48.029 --> 00:29:49.470 saying this is the way it has to be, but you're going to start 437 00:29:49.509 --> 00:29:56.700 adding value because you're filling in where there's there's holes. And so here we 438 00:29:56.819 --> 00:29:59.660 looked at hey, how are I did it even for I came. How 439 00:29:59.700 --> 00:30:03.339 are we doing in different review sites where customers staying positive? Things worth the 440 00:30:03.420 --> 00:30:07.970 customers bringing their challenges and can we make you know, can it other places 441 00:30:07.009 --> 00:30:11.130 where the marketing team can support where there's challenges and how do we do that? 442 00:30:11.329 --> 00:30:14.329 And I know that sounds very basic, but I do believe it's that 443 00:30:14.490 --> 00:30:18.009 practical. I think a lot of US start sometimes with software to sell solve 444 00:30:18.089 --> 00:30:22.240 problems. I often thought, start with a piece of paper and pain. 445 00:30:22.319 --> 00:30:23.839 I try to map it out and I look for where there's going to be 446 00:30:23.960 --> 00:30:27.279 holes and I then may say I'm going to solve it with software. But 447 00:30:27.319 --> 00:30:30.920 I think just thinking about where you can make a difference is really important. 448 00:30:32.440 --> 00:30:34.789 Yeah, I think that's great advice and you know, it's interesting. This 449 00:30:34.869 --> 00:30:41.150 past week I had an advisory Day with forster and one of the analysts. 450 00:30:41.190 --> 00:30:44.430 They are Laura Ramos. So I love and I love Laura. She's the 451 00:30:44.509 --> 00:30:47.829 best. She's the best and Laura said to me. You know, like 452 00:30:48.150 --> 00:30:52.220 you mentioned ABM. Maybe I'm is still so early in terms of how we're 453 00:30:52.220 --> 00:30:55.579 executing on it and just said at this point, you know, and maybe 454 00:30:55.660 --> 00:31:00.420 this is a great but the biggest wind that companies can site from maybem is 455 00:31:00.619 --> 00:31:03.730 better alignment between sales and marketing. Right, and I would offer that AB 456 00:31:03.930 --> 00:31:10.809 on mindset probably is to your point, also crosses over into customers and customer 457 00:31:10.930 --> 00:31:15.009 marketing and and that alignment happening there as well. But that's such a big 458 00:31:15.130 --> 00:31:18.000 part of it is just coming to the table together to think about how we 459 00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:23.920 solve for these individual accounts. Forces us to have those conversations and tier point 460 00:31:25.319 --> 00:31:29.519 really think about get you filling those holes, which is just fantastic advice I 461 00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:33.349 need bring up at such a good point. You can literally take whether you 462 00:31:33.470 --> 00:31:37.150 use like a model or a funnel or however you document your sales process, 463 00:31:37.589 --> 00:31:42.509 you can copy that and use that almost exactly for your customer six, you 464 00:31:42.549 --> 00:31:47.980 know, for customers post acquisition, and you should have a path for both. 465 00:31:48.420 --> 00:31:51.900 And then I would, I would challenge everybody even do one step further 466 00:31:52.059 --> 00:31:56.940 and do that for employee acquisition. And how are you bringing your you know 467 00:31:56.019 --> 00:32:00.059 how you finding the great talent for your organization? It's the same things. 468 00:32:00.259 --> 00:32:05.730 It's creating awareness, it's making sure that people are finding what they need, 469 00:32:05.930 --> 00:32:08.690 creating success, and marketing has a place to help in all of those areas. 470 00:32:08.809 --> 00:32:13.490 But the important thing is not in all of those cases you're not doing 471 00:32:13.569 --> 00:32:16.759 it alone and doing it in partnership with the teams that may ultimately have that 472 00:32:16.920 --> 00:32:22.359 final piece of responsibility. Marketing is never going to own the number of people 473 00:32:22.440 --> 00:32:27.119 hired or you know, may not own that customer retention numbers. So you 474 00:32:27.240 --> 00:32:30.109 do you have to park a really well. Marketing is a team sport, 475 00:32:30.190 --> 00:32:32.630 for sure. Amazing with that. That feels like a mic job line, 476 00:32:32.750 --> 00:32:37.430 being marketing as a team sport. So we're going to finish their. Maria, 477 00:32:37.549 --> 00:32:39.950 this is really been a pleasure to have you on the podcast and to 478 00:32:40.029 --> 00:32:45.539 talk about two ends of a journey, your personal and that of your customers, 479 00:32:45.779 --> 00:32:47.539 and you know, your future customers. But I but one of the 480 00:32:47.579 --> 00:32:52.500 things I love about use is, you know, we often think about CMOS, 481 00:32:52.740 --> 00:32:57.339 is the ones to generate leads and pipeline, but ninety percent of what 482 00:32:57.380 --> 00:33:00.569 you ended up talking about is the customer, and I have some. That's 483 00:33:00.609 --> 00:33:05.009 that's, you know, the way the the CMOS got to think is the 484 00:33:05.089 --> 00:33:07.809 success of the customer at the end of the day. So I thank you 485 00:33:07.930 --> 00:33:10.049 for sharing that with everyone. If you've got a couple of minutes, if 486 00:33:10.089 --> 00:33:14.720 people listening to the PODCASTS have a couple minutes, we're going to end with 487 00:33:14.839 --> 00:33:16.920 a little bit of fun. We've covered the meat, so this is more 488 00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:21.640 of your love and Maria, stick around and we are going to talk about 489 00:33:21.640 --> 00:33:30.430 one more question after this short little pause. All right, Marias. So 490 00:33:31.190 --> 00:33:37.029 we've talked about two journeys so far, your career journey, the journey of 491 00:33:37.109 --> 00:33:40.269 your customers, as we called it. Now let's talk about a great journey 492 00:33:40.309 --> 00:33:45.420 that you've taken. You know, what's the best trip you've taken to decompress 493 00:33:45.619 --> 00:33:50.539 in the last let's give it five years? Yeah, we're not going to 494 00:33:50.579 --> 00:33:54.619 go far back. I am I earlier this year stepped away from an amazing 495 00:33:54.700 --> 00:34:00.890 company and a plan it was I had had. I'd gone. Literally the 496 00:34:00.930 --> 00:34:06.049 day that I left a brand marketto that many of you likely know, I 497 00:34:06.170 --> 00:34:08.849 walked into the door of Aptus after four years of Marquetto. I then was 498 00:34:08.929 --> 00:34:13.239 apt as for five years and then I went to an a plan to help 499 00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:16.320 them, as you mentioned, with that public offering and getting, you know, 500 00:34:16.480 --> 00:34:21.960 making some strides with their marketing, and I was looking for a break, 501 00:34:22.039 --> 00:34:23.750 but I wasn't stepping away from a great brand, like at a plan 502 00:34:23.829 --> 00:34:28.510 for a tiny break. I went and spent well over a month in Europe 503 00:34:29.030 --> 00:34:34.190 and it was incredible. I went through the Mediterranean, started in Spain, 504 00:34:34.469 --> 00:34:38.219 went into France, then Italy, all down the boot, went over to 505 00:34:39.460 --> 00:34:44.340 Threeson, up to Croatian, months Negro and then back over to Italy, 506 00:34:44.460 --> 00:34:49.219 and it was incredible. I I thought I would go crazy not working and 507 00:34:49.380 --> 00:34:52.860 I realized that I am excited for the day where I am not working. 508 00:34:52.929 --> 00:34:55.489 There's a lot to do in this world. That's amazing. I got to 509 00:34:55.570 --> 00:34:59.769 get a Croatia bout two years, a year and and a half ago. 510 00:34:59.809 --> 00:35:02.849 Now it is beautiful. Did you get to have bar? I did not. 511 00:35:04.050 --> 00:35:06.250 What is hard? Bar? I see now you got to go back. 512 00:35:06.409 --> 00:35:09.440 It's just like Queen Little Island, Montenegrol. Her I didn't get to 513 00:35:09.519 --> 00:35:14.199 Montenegro. So I got to get there, I guess, but I went 514 00:35:14.280 --> 00:35:15.880 to do broughneck. Did you get to do broughneck? Yeah, I went 515 00:35:15.960 --> 00:35:20.760 to three islands off of the Brovnick but I don't know the name of those 516 00:35:20.800 --> 00:35:24.030 three. Like we had the day like boating around and Nice, nice, 517 00:35:24.070 --> 00:35:29.989 some of those boats are wild. Huh. It's what I would say that 518 00:35:30.070 --> 00:35:34.909 I wish I had less places because we kind of like rush through some of 519 00:35:34.989 --> 00:35:37.340 them. I know a month sounds like a long time, but it went 520 00:35:37.539 --> 00:35:43.980 really fast. But it was I mean just I think as people were meant 521 00:35:44.019 --> 00:35:47.219 to be near water and it's so fun to wake up sea water, have 522 00:35:47.460 --> 00:35:52.929 sun. It's an amazing that's awesome, amazing place. All right, so 523 00:35:53.289 --> 00:35:58.210 you know, last bit of career advice. How often do you make sure 524 00:35:58.289 --> 00:36:01.250 to take some vacation time during the year when you're when you're running a marketing 525 00:36:01.289 --> 00:36:07.480 team? Okay, here is my I have definite tips here. So first 526 00:36:07.519 --> 00:36:13.480 thing. We're were towards the end of the year, go get next year's 527 00:36:13.519 --> 00:36:16.840 holiday calendar and every three day weekend, go take one extra day, make 528 00:36:16.840 --> 00:36:21.829 it a four day. A four day trip feels like a week, and 529 00:36:21.989 --> 00:36:24.750 go plan something for like every one of them. So know what you're doing. 530 00:36:25.150 --> 00:36:30.070 Normally every company has a January, February for the three day weekend. 531 00:36:30.150 --> 00:36:32.340 Make it four day. Go plan something now. I already have my plans. 532 00:36:32.820 --> 00:36:37.579 I will be heading to New Orleans with some friends. Continue that through 533 00:36:37.579 --> 00:36:39.219 the year. Make sure Memorial Day, Fourth of July. Fourth of July, 534 00:36:39.380 --> 00:36:44.900 take that week go plan something great. You'll get so many you'll get 535 00:36:44.940 --> 00:36:47.849 five or six vacations in and you won't have to you know him with very 536 00:36:47.929 --> 00:36:52.130 fast growing organizations, I can't be gone, you know, for big chunks 537 00:36:52.170 --> 00:36:54.730 of time, but I make sure that I get some time in, and 538 00:36:54.849 --> 00:37:00.559 sometimes that's with family on Thanksgiving and and and during the winter holiday. For 539 00:37:00.679 --> 00:37:04.800 me it's Christmas. I take a week or two and make sure that that's 540 00:37:04.840 --> 00:37:08.079 blocked off, and so that is definitely a big tip. And then, 541 00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:13.280 you know, I there. I maybe don't do as well taking the vacations 542 00:37:13.320 --> 00:37:15.030 I should. The other thing I try to do, you know, our 543 00:37:15.070 --> 00:37:20.469 responsibility is to make sure our teams stay healthy as well, and so I 544 00:37:20.630 --> 00:37:23.389 sit down and I suggest that to my team too. But also I try 545 00:37:23.510 --> 00:37:28.630 really hard as a leader to not send weekend emails. I don't want somebody 546 00:37:28.630 --> 00:37:31.579 to feel like on their Saturday they have to watch their phone if they are 547 00:37:31.619 --> 00:37:34.980 going to need to help on a Saturday or Sunday, let's say we have 548 00:37:35.019 --> 00:37:37.139 a board meeting coming up, I like to give advanced notice. Hey, 549 00:37:37.219 --> 00:37:40.500 this is coming up this day. Maybe you know take a day off or 550 00:37:40.539 --> 00:37:44.059 work from home earlier in the week because later on the week or over that 551 00:37:44.099 --> 00:37:46.090 weekend we may need you. But other than those situations, I really try 552 00:37:46.170 --> 00:37:50.570 hard not to send those weekend now and I think it really gives people of 553 00:37:50.650 --> 00:37:53.769 time to recharge during the year as opposed to just that one vacation. I 554 00:37:53.809 --> 00:37:58.250 think it's a really big deal. Those are some great tips right. I 555 00:37:58.449 --> 00:38:01.199 can't think it enough, I feel. I feel like we we took the 556 00:38:01.280 --> 00:38:06.920 personal one and we made it even more great marketer journey advice for for many 557 00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:09.400 people tuned in here. I thank you so much for everyone who's been tuning 558 00:38:09.480 --> 00:38:13.829 in. You'll hear the message coming up. But if you love this podcast, 559 00:38:13.909 --> 00:38:16.750 check out all the other ones with great marketing leaders today, good ones. 560 00:38:16.829 --> 00:38:21.469 Yeah, amazing. It's they're great and you've been an amazing guest to 561 00:38:21.510 --> 00:38:23.909 have always loved time with you, Maria. Thanks so much for starting you 562 00:38:25.550 --> 00:38:30.300 all right, everybody. We really hope you enjoyed the marketers journey. Again, 563 00:38:30.460 --> 00:38:34.460 just there's the marketers journey and apple podcast or wherever you do. You're 564 00:38:34.460 --> 00:38:37.300 listening, subscribe, leaver review if you like it and tell a friend if 565 00:38:37.340 --> 00:38:43.849 you think they'd enjoy it. Okay, until next time. I hate it 566 00:38:43.929 --> 00:38:47.090 when podcasts incessantly ask their listeners for reviews, but I get why they do 567 00:38:47.170 --> 00:38:52.329 it, because reviews are enormously helpful when you're trying to grow a podcast audience. 568 00:38:52.690 --> 00:38:54.409 So here's what we decided to do. If you leave a review for 569 00:38:54.530 --> 00:38:59.400 me to be growth in apple podcasts and email me a screenshot of the review 570 00:38:59.519 --> 00:39:02.400 to James at Sweet Fish Mediacom, I'll send you a signed copy of my 571 00:39:02.519 --> 00:39:07.400 new book, content based networking, how to instantly connect with anyone you want 572 00:39:07.440 --> 00:39:09.389 to know. We get a review, you get a free book. We 573 00:39:09.550 --> 00:39:09.989 both win.