Transcript
WEBVTT
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Looking for a guaranteed way to create
content that resonates with your audience? Start
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a podcast, interview your ideal clients
and let them choose the topic of the
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interview, because if your ideal clients
care about the topic, there's a good
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chance the rest of your audience will
care about it too. Learn more at
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sweet fish Mediacom. You're listening to
be tob growth, a daily podcast for
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B TOB leaders. We've interviewed names
you've probably heard before, like Gary vanner
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00:00:31.859 --> 00:00:35.659
truck and Simon Senek, but you've
probably never heard from the majority of our
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guests. That's because the bulk of
our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors.
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Most of our guests are in the
trenches leading sales and marketing teams.
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They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting with
tactics, they're building the fastest growing be
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tob companies in the world. My
name is James Carberry. I'm the founder
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of sweet fish media, a podcast
agency for B Tob Brands, and I'm
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also one of the CO hosts of
this show. When we're not interviewing sales
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and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories
from behind the scenes of our own business,
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will share the ups and downs of
our journey as we attempt to take
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over the world. Just getting well? Maybe let's get into the show.
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Welcome back to be to be growth. I'm Logan liles with sweet fish media.
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Today I'm joined by Darcy Kurtz.
She is the VP of global product
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marketing over at mail chimp. Darcy, how's it going today? It's great.
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Thanks for having me on. Absolutely
Darcy. For folks who aren't familiar
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with you, and I'm sure pretty
much everybody listening to this is at least
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heard of mail chimp. If they
haven't, maybe give them a little bit
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of context. But I would love
to kick off the conversation today with a
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little bit about your marketing background,
as well as what you and the team
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at mail champer up to these days. Sure. So, mail chimp has
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been around for almost twenty years now
and really been focused on how we empower
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small businesses to do great marketing and
really founded in the as a world class
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email is where we started and over
the last couple of years we've evolved into
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a full all in one marketing platform
to support all the needs of small businesses
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as they're trying to go to market
absolutely and yourself. Did I see that
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you have some sales and some sales
training background before really going, you know,
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all in for the rest of your
career on the marketing side and,
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as we mentioned, your now in
product marketing at mail chimp. Yes,
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that's exactly right. I actually started
in direct sales at Dell. I won't
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say how many years ago that was, but of beat or two back.
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Yeah, I actually love the fact
that I started in sales because sales and
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marketing are so interfined and to be
on the front lines and be able to
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talk to customers every day day here
with their concerns, are understand how to
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take those concerns and translate that into
a solution that we can provide them.
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It really was a core foundation that
led me into the marketing side and I
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highly recommend it to people out there
as a fur past. Yeah, I
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couldn't agree more. As a salesperson
who loves marketing or technically now a marketer
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who also does sales, I kind
of wear both hats for our team and
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to me I just love that because
I love so many things about marketing.
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I love so many things about sales
and this concept of just broken sales and
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marketing alignment, you know, is
just so baffling, frustrating and almost breaks
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my heart, like hey, we
are here. You know, as Sang
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Rombajeri over at terminus always says,
it's this one team mentality and I love
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to talk to people who have experience
on, you know, quote unquote,
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both sides of the fence, if
you will, because I think it it
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lends itself to a unique perspective.
Speaking of unique perspectives, we're going to
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be talking today about some emerging trends, especially in marketing within the small business
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sector. You know, as most
folks know, as you mentioned, Darcy
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Male Champ serves the small business sector
and has for quite some time. You
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guys had a few reports done here
recently that are going to inform a good
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part of this conversation. Can you
tell us a little bit about what those
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were, kind of the aim of
them as we get into the topic around
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some transient small business marketing, as
we're going to be talking about scaling your
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marketing, Multi Channel Automation and personalization. I don't think anything that surprises anyone,
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but for a little bit of context, tell us a little bit about
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these reports that you guys did recently. Yeah, so you know, we're
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in a very unique position with over
tweldly customers globally that we're talking to all
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the time. We're able to kind
of dig in and get a pretty broad
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view of what's going on in the
small business market and for a long time
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we used it to help us with
creating better tools and thingss like that for
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small business and it kind of dawned
on this, you know, this is
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a kind of thing that small businesses
might actually appreciate hearing about and it might
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help inspire them and and support them
and their business goals. So this year
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we published two different reports. One
was really around the small business creation journey,
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which we had been really digging into
for a while, and I think
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the response we've had so far as
been overwhelmingly positive, because people are like,
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oh my gosh, that's exactly how
I feel and that's exactly what I
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went through. So it definitely is
helping with helping people understand they're not in
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this little lone. Starting a business
is hard and there's a lot of key
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learnings there. And then the one
for those those businesses that are already kind
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of up and running and trying to
market the state of small business marketing really
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talks about what are the things that
are working, what are trends that small
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businesses should be looking to that we're
starting to see a lot of interested and
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just helping to support small businesses out
there with with more data to help them
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make better decisions. Yeah, I
love that. Just in a recent episode,
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I believe it was Greg Drobneck over
at heel. He's a cofounder.
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They're doing some interesting things in healthcare. One of the things he mentioned to
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me on the show was, you
know, a lot of companies are surprised
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by, or would be surprised if
they took a closer look at the amount
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of data they have, but the
amount of useful data to their target audience.
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So I love that you guys are
keying in on that fact that,
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mail Chim let's talk about you know
that small business creation in that scaling portion
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of marketing that you just mentioned are
so you know, the entry point for
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entrepreneurship is a lot lower, the
barriers lower than it's ever been, especially
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in our country, but scaling your
marketing and standing out in a crowded environment
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is really, really tough. So
what are some of the the trends that
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you guys point to in some of
the advice based on those trends that you
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are giving to small businesses when it
comes to okay, I've started. How
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do I start scaling? When do
I start marketing? We're their doay even
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begin? Yeah, it's such an
important question and one of the things that
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we found is, you know,
it takes somewhere in the neighborhood of six
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months. So about sixty percent,
well more than half, of our respond
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and said it took over six months
to go from I have an idea to
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actually taking action. And and another
forty percent took even longer than that.
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They took a year. So it's
one of those things where you've got a
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great idea, you know you want
to do something. How to get off
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the blocks? And what we've really
been talking to people is just do it,
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take a chance, start iterating your
way in. The second you have
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an idea, you can start marketing. So think about go get a domain,
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go do some searches and see,
you know, is the name that
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you want for Your Business. Can
you buy the domain port? Can you
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get us social handle for it and
start securing those? You can do little
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things like if you do get a
social handle, creeks and social posts that
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go to well landing page that has
a form fill on it where you can
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start to collect names and addresses.
So when you are ready to launch,
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you already have a database full of
contacts that are potentially interested in your product
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or service. We also tell people
do things like use email to do some
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testing, to say hey, here's
a product idea I have, what do
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you think you can do? Surveys, you can get feedback. A lot
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of people don't necessarily consider all of
that marketing, but it is and you
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don't have to wait until everything is
you know, all your eyes are gotted
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and teaser crossed and you're ready to
launch, to start your marketing, because
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you might as well start selling on
day one, not just launch on day
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one. Yeah, exactly. I
mean that reminds me of a couple of
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different things. You know, oftentimes
as we're talking to marketers and business owners
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about launching a podcast for their brand, they're like, well, we're not
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sure what the audience is going to
be like. I'm not sure if this
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guest persona, if they're going to
be responsive to this idea. And what
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I tell them is don't wait until
you launch a podcast and you've spent money
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with us or you've spent money on
your own launching your show and developing time
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on strategy. Just put some feelers
out there. So and fifty emails and
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see what sort of reply rate you
get to. Do you want to be
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a guest of my new podcast?
This is kind of what I'm thinking and
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you'll be surprised. You know,
like you and I were talking about a
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little bit offline are. So you
know, even if there are failures in
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putting out those feelers on your product
or your podcast or building your email list
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or trying to drive traffic to a
landing page, then all of those failures
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or wins or somewhere in between,
their data points and better to hit day
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one with with some data inhand and
not just a lot of good guesses.
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It's kind of like, you know, I think some of the best advice
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for entrepreneurs is don't spend a ton
of money on your good idea and then
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go out selling. Go and sell
it before you even have a product out,
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and pitch it like it's there and
see what sort of response you'll get,
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because you know, if you just
test with those closest to you.
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You're going to get that. Yeah, yeah, I think it's good and
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you might not be getting you know, the best feedback in the market is
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really what's going to determine your success. So go test it with the market
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as soon as you can. I
couldn't agree with you more on that point.
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Let's talk a little bit about multi
channel. Obviously, a male chimp,
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you guys have tons of information and
best practices around email. Kind of
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the state of multi channel marketing or
Omnichannel Marketing. What are some of the
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things that you guys are seeing there
and some of your advice, especially for
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small businesses? Sure, so,
you know, historically it was okay for
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you to use one or two channels. You could use social, which is
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still one of the most popular,
you can use email, which is definitely
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the number one tool people use.
But what we're finding is really a macro
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level change in how consumers are finding
information. They are in a lot more
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places than they've ever been. You
know, you talked about podcast. People
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are listen to the podcast. Now
you're starting to see the streaming wars where
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there's lots of different places where people
are consuming media content. Certainly the digital
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proliferation. So what we have been
advising customers is to really break through you
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have to try different channels of communication, you have to be in the play
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is where customers are to really to
really break through. So the good news
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is small businesses are hearing that.
We actually found we to survey and then
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in the state of small business,
the average number of tools customers are using
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today. They're using eight tools to
manage their marketing. That's more than most
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of them have employees. It's kind
of crazy. So what we're seeing now
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is this emergence of a new category
of these all in one marketing platforms where
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all those different channels are in one
place, which is going to make it
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a lot simpler for customers to actually
do what they know they should be doing,
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which is talking to people in lots
of different channels. Now you can
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put that all in one platform,
gather all the data in one place and
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make it a lot more accessible for
small business to do some of the things
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that enterprises have been doing for quite
a while. Hey, everybody logan with
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sweet fish here. You probably already
know that we think you should start a
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podcast if you haven't already. But
what if you have and you're asking these
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kinds of questions. How much has
our podcast impacted revenue this year? How's
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our sales team actually leveraging the PODCAST
content? If you can't answer these questions,
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you're actually not alone. This is
why I cast it created the very
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first content marketing platform made specifically for
be tob podcasting. Now you can more
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easily search and share your audio content
while getting rader visibility into the impact of
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your podcast. The marketing teams at
Drift Terminus and here at sweetfish have started
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using casted to get more value out
of our podcasts, and you probably can
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to. You can check out the
product in action and casted dot US growth.
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That's sea steed dot US growth.
All right, let's get back to
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the show. Yeah, absolutely,
I can remember, you know, our
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founder James Carberry, mentioning actually before
I joined the sweet fish team, I
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saw a post of his on Linkedin
and he was talking about how, in
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his early days of starting up sweet
fish, you was Sass happy. Right,
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oh, there's a tool for this. There's a tool for this,
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and I think you give some good
advice there to look for things that either
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where you can combine. What tools
do you have that can integrate and and
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integrate easily. Right. Integrate is
is a loaded word. Anything can can
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integrate, but making sure that you
you have an efficient use of your time
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in the tools and the spend for
all of those tools, because even if
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you've got several tools that are fairly
low cost, they add up quickly.
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Going off of what you just said
there, Darcy, about small businesses leveraging
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things that were typically only available for
the enterprise, let's talk a little bit
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about automation. You mentioned to me
offline that a lot of small business owners
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and mark or's leading, you know, lean teams. They are looking for
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more time and you know automation is
obviously not a new trend, but if
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you could speak to kind of the
state of that and again, some advice
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for folks out there listening to this? Yeah, you know, you're right,
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automations are not new, but the
sophistication of automations is growing by the
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day. So historically, automations or
you could do a bulk email, right,
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so you can say once a month, I'm going to send this news
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letter and it's going to go out
to all these people. What you're able
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to do now, especially if you
have a marketing crm in your in your
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system is you can do personalized automations
that happen as as customers are engaging with
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you. So you can have an
automation set up that as soon as somebody
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buys something or maybe downloads your APP, instantaneously a welcome email sent or thank
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you email is sent for first purchase. We do you know, you can
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do an automated a banding cart.
We've even got things now where you can
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connect your APP or connect your website
and any time a customer does a thing
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you can have an automatic communication go
out to them. So really you're marketing
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now is starting to work, even
when you aren't in a much more personalized
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way. So it's not just bulk
kind of communications but very personalized, real
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time communications. They can be orchestrated
for a small business fairly simply. Yeah,
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that actually is a really great segue
from automation to personalization. Darcy,
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let's let's talk a little bit there. You know, for many years personalization
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meant a first name token or a
company named token and because of big data,
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especially for small businesses, the entry
point into leveraging more data for even
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more personalization beyond kind of the those
entry points is changing quite a bit.
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Can you speak to that trend as
we look at two thousand and twenty and
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beyond here? Yeah, you know, it's interesting for me. I've been
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in the kind of a small business
world, you know, almost thirty years
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now and a lot of things in
the small business marketing reports sounded familiar.
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You know, these are things that
we've kind of been hearing. The thing
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that really resonated with me is huge
new news is while almost half of the
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survey respondence said they're not using a
data and form strategy right now, like
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forty six percent said they are likely
to in the future. So this idea
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of how do I, as a
small business, harness all this data and
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big data to do things, you
know, better and and really become more
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efficient? It's breaking through out of
the enterprise world, where there's already teams
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of data sciences that are out there
figuring out how to get all this data
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and bigger out how to market better. It's becoming much more accessible to small
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business owners and they're hearing it and
they're feeling it and they're starting to say,
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you know, I think I can
harness that too. And so when
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you have platforms like a mail chimp, we're able to get all of that
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data together for a small business so
that they can very easily see, to
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your point, not just demographics but
behavioral data that says, here are the
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kinds of things that this customer likes. You know, I see that they
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buy a lot of green stuff.
So when the next time you have green
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pants, make sure you send them
a note that says hey, we've got
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green pants in the store, and
the likelihood that they're going to buy and
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convert goes up dramatically. So being
able to harness that big data is it's
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for me, really exciting to see
that small businesses are starting to lean into
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that because it will make a huge
difference in a world where personalization is becoming
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a baseline requirement of marketing. Yeah, absolutely. I mean a couple of
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thoughts. They're you know, folks
who are regular listeners of this show know
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that we're we're big fans of Gary
v and one of the things he talks
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about regularly, as you were talking
about, you know, the changes in
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multi channel and Omni Channel is,
you know, you can't just create content
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and shove it through different channels.
You need to contextualize it and that's definitely
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going to have an impact on the
effectiveness of that marketing. I love what
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you guys are doing, Darcy,
in taking your data that specifically for small
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businesses and how they can use it. It reminds me of, you know,
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something Kevin Warner, one of our
cohosts over on one of our other
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podcasts, the BEB sales show,
was talking about be careful about, you
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know, the data that you see
about. Well, use this subject line
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or, you know, use this
email strategy, because you know, if
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that's data that's being collected on the
effectiveness in the enterprise, it's a very
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different play. It's very different context
in small business. So when you look
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at data that informs your marketing approach, whether that's which channel or down to
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you know, effectiveness of subject lines, make sure that you're looking at at
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it from your demographic and so I
think some of the resources that you guys
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are talking about. If folks listening
to this are in small businesses or early
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stage startups or boots tramp teams that
are, you know, earlier stages in
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their growth, look at that data
based on folks that are that are like
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them. So I appreciate you sharing
some some insights some advice. They're Darcie.
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If anybody listening to this would like
to stay connected with you or access
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some of the resources that you mentioned
in today's episode, What's the best way
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for them to reach out or stay
connected or take next steps from here?
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Absolutely so. Certainly. I'm on
twitter and I have a unusual handle.
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It's givescourage e as Ek you are, but can follow me there. You'll
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see a lot of this stuff it. It is where I do a lot
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of curation, specifically still personal businesses. So it's a great play is to
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go. So feel free to follow
me. I am also on Linkedin,
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which is a great place to find. Darcy Kurts on Linkedin is comes up
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pretty easily. Awesome. We will
also try to link to those reports in
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the show notes for folks that want
to take a look at some of that
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content and some of the data that
Darcy was mentioning. The other thing will
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link to in the show notes.
Darcy mentioned cost effective things you can do
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to try and test the market,
do some early marketing. James and I
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did a behind the curtains episode on
the Google Alphabet Soup approach to Seo.
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So you can figure out if you
are going to start creating some content in
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the early days, how can use
that? It's something we're doing for some
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of our podcasts. You can definitely
apply it to the content strategy for any
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sector or any marketing that you're going
to be putting out. Darcy, this
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has been a great conversation. Thank
you so much for joining us on the
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show today. Yes, this was
awesome. Thanks so much for having me.
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We totally get it. We publish
a ton of content on this podcast
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and it can be a lot to
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